1 hour ago, MisterTee said:

@Evil Penevil

Anyone who cites Alan Dershowitz as an authority on anything has shot his load and entered the realm of farce.

Didn’t he also defend Jeffery Epstein?

8 hours ago, Evil Penevil said:

 

You are correct; I totally, absolutely, completely deny Israel is committing genocide.  But rather than clutching at straws, I have a firm hold on both historical and current facts.

 

I'll let a far more authoritative voice than my own explain why Israel isn't committing genocide.

 

Alan Dershowitz: Why The “Genocide” Claim In Gaza Is A Dangerous Distortion

Using the term 'genocide' to describe Israel’s military actions trivializes the Holocaust and other true acts of genocide, argues Alan Dershowitz.

 

What Israel is doing is in no way comparable to the genocide planned and implemented at the Wannsee Conference of 1942.

It is comparable, though not in degree, to the hundreds of thousands of civilian deaths caused by American and British military actions following D-Day — including firebombing Dresden, Berlin and Tokyo and dropping atomic bombs on Hiroshima and Nagasaki.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/alan-dershowitz-why-the-genocide-claim-in-gaza-is-a-dangerous-distortion/ar-AA1LXNWV?ocid=msedgntp&pc=W230&cvid=f0965c19b27d46d0a61345a4722bf7cb&ei=8
 

Dershowitz systematically refutes the accusation of genocide.  I don't disagree with anything he says.  

About nine months, I wrote a reply explaining why I don't believe Israel is committing genocide.  At that time, I asked a question which no one answered:  Why would the Israeli bombing of civilians in Gaza be considered genocide when the Allied bombing of German and Japanese civilians isn't?  I would really appreciate it if a pro-Palestinian member would answer it.

 

The relevant part of my post from December, 2024:

 

 

 

 

 

The U.S. did not commit genocide in WWII because the Allied bombings were aimed at defeating enemy governments, not exterminating Germans or Japanese as peoples. Genocide is defined by intent, not just by civilian deaths.

By contrast, the Nazis were committing genocide — murdering millions of Jews simply because they were Jews. The Allied victory stopped that genocide. That’s why it’s absurd for Alan Dershowitz to suggest that accusations against Israel somehow imply the Allies were guilty of genocide. How could the very forces that defeated the Nazi genocide of Jews be accused of committing it themselves? To frame it that way is an embarrassment to his fellow Jews and a distortion of history.

 

Senior members of the Israeli cabinet have said exactly what their intent is, leading to the UK sanctioning them.  Here are some quotes, google Smotrich and Ben Gvir and you can see many more. 

 

 

Israeli minister says it may be ‘moral’ to starve 2 million Gazans, but ‘no one in the world would let us’

 

 

https://edition.cnn.com/2024/08/06/middleeast/israeli-minister-smotrich-starve-gazans-intl

 

Finance Minister Bezalel Smotrich shared his vision for the Gaza Strip on Tuesday, predicting that within half a year, the population of the territory would be confined to just a narrow swath of land, with the remainder of the enclave “totally destroyed.”

https://www.timesofisrael.com/smotrich-says-gaza-to-be-totally-destroyed-population-concentrated-in-small-area/

 

Far-right Israeli government minister Ben-Gvir believes that Israeli soldiers must shoot Palestinian women and children in Gaza to stop 'another October 7'.

 

https://www.newarab.com/news/ben-gvir-says-israeli-army-can-shoot-women-children-gaza

''the Nazis were committing genocide — murdering millions of Jews simply because they were Jews''

And the world hasn't changed since then, hating them because of who they're,

even if Muhmmed and Jesus will stand up and say that the Jews are not to blame, still, there would those who will disagree, hating and blaming Jews have become the 'thing to do' and the in-thing now,

but these times shall pass too, just like they did countless of times before where Jews were blamed throughout history.

8 minutes ago, ezzra said:

''the Nazis were committing genocide — murdering millions of Jews simply because they were Jews''

And the world hasn't changed since then, hating them because of who they're,

even if Muhmmed and Jesus will stand up and say that the Jews are not to blame, still, there would those who will disagree, hating and blaming Jews have become the 'thing to do' and the in-thing now,

but these times shall pass too, just like they did countless of times before where Jews were blamed throughout history.

This thread has nothing to do with Jews as a people or Judaism as a religion. The issue being discussed here is the actions of the Israeli government today. Criticizing or condemning state policies - especially allegations of genocide - is not the same as blaming Jews or fueling antisemitism.

Drawing a parallel with the Holocaust confuses the issue. The Nazis targeted Jews simply for existing; today’s debate is about the conduct of a government in an ongoing conflict. Equating criticism of Israel with hatred of Jews risks shutting down legitimate discussion and silences those who are speaking out against human rights violations.

No one is denying the reality of antisemitism or the suffering Jews have faced throughout history. But conflating that with political criticism of Israel distracts from the urgent matter at hand: accountability for present-day actions that affect millions of people.

2 minutes ago, JimCM said:

This thread has nothing to do with Jews as a people or Judaism as a religion. The issue being discussed here is the actions of the Israeli government today. Criticizing or condemning state policies - especially allegations of genocide - is not the same as blaming Jews or fueling antisemitism.

Drawing a parallel with the Holocaust confuses the issue. The Nazis targeted Jews simply for existing; today’s debate is about the conduct of a government in an ongoing conflict. Equating criticism of Israel with hatred of Jews risks shutting down legitimate discussion and silences those who are speaking out against human rights violations.

No one is denying the reality of antisemitism or the suffering Jews have faced throughout history. But conflating that with political criticism of Israel distracts from the urgent matter at hand: accountability for present-day actions that affect millions of people.

That IS THE OINT HERE, that accusation IS fueling Anti antisemitism, so much so that almost all people in the world equate charges against Israel as : the Jews are responsible, the Jews reasonable for every ills of this world, maybe you're not exposed to it but for the Jewish people it's more than evident and it will never go away, it is already deeply imbedded in the people's DNA. 

8 minutes ago, ezzra said:

''A poll found that 82% of full citizens of Israel want to expel Palestinians from Gaza. 47% want to kill every single man, woman, and child in Gaza. Former Prime Minister Ehud Olmert wrote that Israel is waging a “war of extermination: the indiscriminate, unrestrained, cruel, and criminal killing of civilians”.

 

I would love very much for you to provide from a natural and unbiased reference to the above.

 

From Israel’s most serious newspaper- https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2025-06-03/ty-article/.premium/a-grim-poll-shows-most-jewish-israelis-support-expelling-gazans-its-brutal-and-true/00000197-3640-d9f1-abb7-7e742b300000

 

And what is a full citizen?

 

It's clear what Netanyahu thinks -

 

As the comments caused waves in Israel, Netanyahu again spoke of the issue at the start of a cabinet meeting. He called Israel a “Jewish, democratic state” with equal rights, but “the nation state not of all its citizens but only of the Jewish people”.

 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/10/benjamin-netanyahu-says-israel-is-not-a-state-of-all-its-citizens

 

 

53 minutes ago, JimCM said:

From Israel’s most serious newspaper- https://www.haaretz.com/israel-news/2025-06-03/ty-article/.premium/a-grim-poll-shows-most-jewish-israelis-support-expelling-gazans-its-brutal-and-true/00000197-3640-d9f1-abb7-7e742b300000

 

And what is a full citizen?

 

It's clear what Netanyahu thinks -

 

As the comments caused waves in Israel, Netanyahu again spoke of the issue at the start of a cabinet meeting. He called Israel a “Jewish, democratic state” with equal rights, but “the nation state not of all its citizens but only of the Jewish people”.

 

 

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/mar/10/benjamin-netanyahu-says-israel-is-not-a-state-of-all-its-citizens

 

 

If it was up to people running and behind the Haaretz newspaper, Israel would have been under Hamas control long time ago' still', it shows that Israel is a democracy, unlike many other countries around the world, some who consider themselves as liberal and free. 

1 hour ago, ezzra said:

''A poll found that 82% of full citizens of Israel want to expel Palestinians from Gaza. 47% want to kill every single man, woman, and child in Gaza. Former Prime Minister Ehud Olmert wrote that Israel is waging a “war of extermination: the indiscriminate, unrestrained, cruel, and criminal killing of civilians”.

 

I would love very much for you to provide from a natural and unbiased reference to the above.

 

The best reference would be the reality that is taking place in Gaza, the West Bank, and parts of some neighbouring countries right now - day after day, without let up.

If these well-documented atrocities against non-combatants, with the stated aim of removing them, doesn't constitute genocide, then genocide never existed.

Just now, MisterTee said:

The best reference would be the reality that is taking place in Gaza, the West Bank, and parts of some neighbouring countries right now - day after day, without let up.

If these well-documented atrocities against non-combatants, with the stated aim of removing them, don't constitute genocide, then genocide never existed.

Noncombatant? where do you think all those Hamas and Hasbullah soldiers comes from? Switzerland? Sweeden? NO, from the local population who's their families praise their sons of becoming ' martyrs' for Muhammed and the cause, and that will bring accolade and pride to the families.

4 minutes ago, ezzra said:

Noncombatant? where do you think all those Hamas and Hasbullah soldiers comes from? Switzerland? Sweeden? NO, from the local population who's their families praise their sons of becoming ' martyrs' for Muhammed and the cause, and that will bring accolade and pride to the families.

Ah, the true colors are coming out - far-right fundamentalism at its finest. Blaming civilians for the actions of armed groups doesn’t make targeting them any less wrong. Innocent people, children, women, the elderly - remain noncombatants. Collective punishment is illegal, immoral, and no amount of “pride” or “glorifying martyrs” can justify it.  

17 minutes ago, ezzra said:

If it was up to people running and behind the Haaretz newspaper, Israel would have been under Hamas control long time ago' still', it shows that Israel is a democracy, unlike many other countries around the world, some who consider themselves as liberal and free. 

Claiming that Israel is a democracy because some media outlets exist or that “it would have been under Hamas control” misses the point. True democracy isn’t just about newspapers or elections-it’s about equal rights, protection of minorities, freedom of movement, and accountability under the law.

Israel systematically discriminates against Palestinians in the occupied territories, restricts their basic rights, and controls their movement and resources. Millions of people live under military rule without voting rights. A state cannot be considered a full democracy while denying an entire population basic civil and political rights.

Having some democratic features does not make the system a true democracy; it highlights a partial, unequal democracy-one that privileges some citizens over others.

1 minute ago, ezzra said:

Noncombatant? where do you think all those Hamas and Hasbullah soldiers comes from? Switzerland? Sweeden? NO, from the local population who's their families praise their sons of becoming ' martyrs' for Muhammed and the cause, and that will bring accolade and pride to the families.

 

Obviously seeing family members killed in Gaza by Israeli forces will aid recruitment to terrorist groups, now ask yourself how long has this been going on?

 

I've no doubt some will say that Hamas/others are also killing some of their own, over food aid etc, but at the end of the day the casualties are all added together and reported to the outside World, lumped together, and the masses see it as the fault of the Israeli's from what is posted on various social media sites. As Israel is known as the home of the Jews, well advertised throughout the World by main stream media, it then puts Jews in the firing line for the majority that don't understand the problems of the Middle East, and only see the casualties, thus Jews get the blame.

 

To my mind the only way to change any of this is for there to be a change of direction by all the parties involved, sadly I don't see that happening yet, until there is a change this will go on and on, and more innocents from both sides will be injured or killed, as has gone on for thousands of years, isn't Religion a disgraceful con?

Post breaking forum rules removed.

@ChaiyaTH Rule 9. You will not post disruptive or inflammatory messages. You will respect other members and post in a civil manner. Personal attacks, insults or hate speech posted on the forum or sent by private message are not allowed.

 

19 hours ago, ezzra said:

That IS THE OINT HERE, that accusation IS fueling Anti antisemitism, so much so that almost all people in the world equate charges against Israel as : the Jews are responsible, the Jews reasonable for every ills of this world, maybe you're not exposed to it but for the Jewish people it's more than evident and it will never go away, it is already deeply imbedded in the people's DNA. 

I think what is fueling anti semitism is Jews/Israelis defending Israel’s actions.

 

By doing so you are perceived to be aligning yourselves with Israel which is already guilty of genocide in the court of public opinion.

 

My Jewish friends here in Chiang Rai don’t approve of Israel’s actions.  I was in Pattaya recently and a Jewish friend there did defend them. To be frank my opinion of him is much diminished. I have never seen so much vociferous racial hatred in a friend.

 

It's not a good look to defend Israel at this point.

@JBChiangRai

Amen bro... or Mazel Tov, if that is what turns you on.

Your post sums up a long thread where the supporters of Eretz Israel  were outnumbered, outclassed, and made to look totally defeated.

The Levant (that area) is no different to other parts of the world where us white folks have established outselves, N America, Australia, S Africa, many of the natives haven't done so well out of it. The majority of early settlers to Israel came from the former Soviet Union, white people.

Who ever thought that setting up what is ostensibly a European country in the middle east would work out well anyway?

A post threatening "outrage" and stalking other members, and a reply to it, have been removed. Please debate politely, refraining from "outrage", anger, and personal attacks. Other members have as much right to their views as you do to yours.

 

9. You will not post disruptive or inflammatory messages. You will respect other members and post in a civil manner. Personal attacks, insults or hate speech posted on the forum or sent by private message are not allowed.

 

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14 hours ago, JBChiangRai said:

I think what is fueling anti semitism is Jews/Israelis defending Israel’s actions.

 

That is very possible true.  Antisemitism has long bubbled just below the surface in many countries, but is now boiling openly.  That's exactly the reason Jews have to keep defending Israel as a means of fighting antisemitism.  It's not antisemitic to criticize the policies or actions of the Israeli government, but it is antisemitic to deny Israel's right to exist as the homeland of the world's Jews or to blame Jews collectively for what some regard as Israel's missteps.    The harsher the criticism of Israel becomes, the stronger the defense of Israel by Jews and non-Jews has to become in response.

This is what Jews in the U.K. are up against:

  

One in five Britons now anti-Semitic, study finds

More than one in five Britons now hold or agree with anti-Semitic views, a study has found. 

The study found that 21 per cent of the public affirmed four or more anti-Semitic statements, compared to 16 per cent last year. In 2021, the figure was just 11 per cent.

Researchers said the findings showed that the number of people holding what would be considered entrenched anti-Semitic views has doubled in less than five years to more than a fifth of the population.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/world/one-in-five-britons-now-anti-semitic-study-finds/ar-AA1M2fHO?ocid=msedgntp&pc=W230&cvid=68bd92a43364490696d2259d09511951&ei=66

A post insulting a country and its people has been removed.

 

15.You may not discriminate, use slurs, or post hostile or abusive comments based on personal characteristics such as race, gender, age, religion, ethnicity, nationality, disability, medical history, marital or family status, gender identity, or sexual orientation. Posts breaching this rule will be removed, and posting suspension or account closure may result.

It's getting bad in Canada as well.  A Jewish man was attacked  without provocation with his three children in a public park in Montreal.  A bystander caught some of the attack on video.  The Jewish man's kippah (skullcap) was thrown by the attacker into a pond as a final sign of contempt.  It's a scene very reminiscent of Germany in the early 1930s.  It's yet another reminder ofr why Jews need a homeland. Never again is today!

 

 

 

23-year-old charged with assaulting Jewish man at Montreal park

A 23-year-old man has appeared at the Montreal courthouse to face charges for the assault of a Jewish man at a park with the victim's children just steps away.

Sergio Yanes Preciado has been charged with one count of assault causing bodily harm. The Service de police de la Ville de Montréal (SPVM) arrested him on Monday.

The incident, which was partially captured on video, sparked public outcry and renewed calls for elected officials to do more to address antisemitism.

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/montreal/assault-bodily-harm-charges-jewish-man-1.7606709

On 9/7/2025 at 7:22 AM, JBChiangRai said:

My Jewish friends here in Chiang Rai don’t approve of Israel’s actions.

 

   Your Jewish friends in Ching Rai do not have to suffer the daily barrage of Hamas rockets raining down on them indiscriminately  , they don't have to spend much of their life in bomb shelters voiding rocket attacks .

   Your Jewish friends should live in Israel and deal with the problems caused by Hamas  before criticising Israel's response to terror attacks 

29 minutes ago, Nick Carter icp said:

daily barrage of Hamas rockets raining down on th

How many actually?

On 9/3/2025 at 8:39 AM, newbee2022 said:

innocent Palestinians.

Nice oxymoron, They are all directly or indirectly involved with the Terrorist Organisation, just let Israel do the unpleasant work and there will be less victims in the long run.

12 minutes ago, Peter Crow said:

Nice oxymoron, They are all directly or indirectly involved with the Terrorist Organisation, just let Israel do the unpleasant work and there will be less victims in the long run.

1. So, do you support the murderers?

2. Palestinians, who are not members/followers of Hamas are involved in a Terrorist Organisation?

How that?

Could it be that you never read anything substantial about Israel's and Palestine's history?

At least try Google.

Or spare us with such Gibberish.

A comment on moderation was removed. Please observe our forum rules, and stay on topic. Thank you. 

1 hour ago, newbee2022 said:

1. So, do you support the murderers?

2. Palestinians, who are not members/followers of Hamas are involved in a Terrorist Organisation?

How that?

Could it be that you never read anything substantial about Israel's and Palestine's history?

At least try Google.

Or spare us with such Gibberish.

Tell me..

On 9/3/2025 at 12:34 PM, Chomper Higgot said:

How many Palestinians must Israel slaughter per day before it reaches the point you might even consider it to be a war crime, let alone genocide?

It is up to IDF to decide at what point the war has achieved it's set objectives.

 

2 hours ago, newbee2022 said:

How many actually?

 

I don't know 

1 hour ago, Nick Carter icp said:

 

I don't know 

That's the motto of your life?😂

"I don't know" 😂