Christianity Or The Bar ?

[Padrino]

I have been seeing a fair few of these missionary types around BKK of late. It would seem there is an extra drive for recruitment on. Whilst I personally do not approve of forcing religion on anyone, I came across a very interesting article which explores the possibility of a woman using the help offered by Christian missionaries as a platform to get out of the game as it were.

Praise the Lord... ' I go with you ?'

http://www.ctrlaltshift.co.uk/article/post...on-choice-yours

[yabaaaa]

Religion is forced in many countries I remember standing at school aged 8 for a God I didnt believe in, in the UK

It was never explained to me in any way that "God" was a fictional character.

[wamberal]

Religion is forced in many countries]

Thailand is a country where religion is not forced upon anybody.

Christians of all denominations do a lot of good work in rescuing girls from prostitution in Thailand. If you don't know that, you need to get out a bit more.

Just for starters, check out Rahab Ministry in Pat Pong. They offer ex-prostitutes vocational training, to help them earn a living. We know a happily married couple (now in Australia) - he is an Australian schoolteacher and his wife is a former bargirl who was rescued by Rahab. She is a practising Christian in Australia, and raises money for Rahab there. There are Catholic priests working in Bangkok and upcountry in similar ministries, including with children.

Would your home country be better off if the Salvation Army did not exist?

[GuestHouse]

Adding to what Wamberal has said, Christian Missions are also right at the front of providing orphanages for the children the sex industry dumps on the streets, homes, education, health care and advocating for the rights of Thailand's stateless people (both recent migrants and those from communities that have been living in Thailand for hundreds of years)

HIV Hospices, Drug Rehabilitation centers, women and children hospices and let's not forget the work done by Father Joe Maier and the Human Development Foundation he's set up and runs in Klong Toey.

Added to which, getting your child into a Christian School in Thailand is the aspiration for more than a few of Thailand's growing middle class - Thai people who can afford to choose - choosing, not being forced, to send their children to the Christian school where they know they'll get a better education than the Rote Learning Forced on Children in the State Schools.

Edited January 16, 2010 by GuestHouse

[PattayaParent]

Thailand is a country where religion is not forced upon anybody.

Religion relies on brainwashing from a young age and that certainly is practiced here.

Would your home country be better off if the Salvation Army did not exist?

YES

[NADTATIDA1]

Thailand is a country where religion is not forced upon anybody.

Christians of all denominations do a lot of good work in rescuing girls from prostitution in Thailand. If you don't know that, you need to get out a bit more.

Just for starters, check out Rahab Ministry in Pat Pong. They offer ex-prostitutes vocational training, to help them earn a living. We know a happily married couple (now in Australia) - he is an Australian schoolteacher and his wife is a former bargirl who was rescued by Rahab. She is a practising Christian in Australia, and raises money for Rahab there. There are Catholic priests working in Bangkok and upcountry in similar ministries, including with children.

Would your home country be better off if the Salvation Army did not exist?

Totally disagree with you about your first sentence and do the salvation army still exist?

[robblok]

Religion is forced in many countries]

Thailand is a country where religion is not forced upon anybody.

Christians of all denominations do a lot of good work in rescuing girls from prostitution in Thailand. If you don't know that, you need to get out a bit more.

Just for starters, check out Rahab Ministry in Pat Pong. They offer ex-prostitutes vocational training, to help them earn a living. We know a happily married couple (now in Australia) - he is an Australian schoolteacher and his wife is a former bargirl who was rescued by Rahab. She is a practising Christian in Australia, and raises money for Rahab there. There are Catholic priests working in Bangkok and upcountry in similar ministries, including with children.

Would your home country be better off if the Salvation Army did not exist?

Religion is always forced on people, they start brainwashing small children at a young age they leave you no choice but to believe. I am happy i went to a public school and was never forced to believe in a fictional character whos existence has never been proven.

Can Christians do good.. sure they can just as easily as priests are known to do bad things with boys and scandals being covered up by the pope. But yes Christians can do good things but normal non religious people can do those things too.

Being a christian does not make you a better person, you are how you are because how you act not what you believe in.

I doubt the missionary here would help people who don't want to listen to their sermons or want to convert to their beliefs.

[DP25]

I read a blog of one of these missionary doo-gooders trying to 'save' girls in Nana. He basically got fleeced and ended up as angry and bitter as any of the posters you see here that get scammed by them.

[ManilaLover]

Religion is forced in many countries I remember standing at school aged 8 for a God I didnt believe in, in the UK

It was never explained to me in any way that "God" was a fictional character.

nice avatar you have, you know what's actually the longest animated .gif ? it's this one

totally off topic btw i know

the christian thais i know are the thais i like most of all, they are much more 'aware'

[sharecropper]

Charities, schools, good works, all superb. Nobody would argue with that.

But when it comes to peddling improbable and unprovable supernatural stores around those good works, to gullible, largely uneducate and now "saved" punters, then I have a problem with religion.

[bonobo]

Charities, schools, good works, all superb. Nobody would argue with that.

But when it comes to peddling improbable and unprovable supernatural stores around those good works, to gullible, largely uneducate and now "saved" punters, then I have a problem with religion.

I am not intending to start a religious debate (that is a hole different issue, one I try to avoid at all costs), but why would you care about what "saved punter" believe, or what some people who receive charitable assistance believe?  If it works for them, what should it matter to you?

People who use religion, be that Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism,  or the Church of the Mighty Sasquatch, to force or coerce members into violence against others, OK, then I have a problem with that, too.  But simple religious beliefs, that is up to the individual and makes no difference to me one way or the other.

And while this doesn't indicate any valid demographical trends, the only Buddhists I know who have converted to Christianity have all been university-educated, so it is not only the uneducated masses, as you seem to attest. 

[simon43]

Christians of all denominations do a lot of good work in rescuing girls from prostitution in Thailand.

That statement reflects your bias. Many of these women do not wish to be 'rescued'. They willingly enter the trade and enjoy the money and lifestyle that it can give to them.

A clearer statement would be:

'Christians of all denominations do a lot of good work in helping those women who have been unwillingly trafficked into prostitution, or offering alternatives to those who wish to seek a different vocation'

However, assistance should be unconditional, and not require the person to attend church or Bible classes etc. It is the 'we will help you if...' that I do not agree with.

Simon

[gotlost]

I wonder if they have work permits??????

Edited January 16, 2010 by gotlost

[ballpoint]

34796.bmp

[elkangorito]

"Choice" is my prefered word in this matter.

At my place of work (a Thai government institution), 3 songs are sung each & every morning. One is the National Anthem, the 2nd one is the Kings Anthem & the 3rd song is something about "Thai Buddhism" (not real Buddhism). This institution teaches people who are mostly adults in the eyes of Thai law (18+ years old), although there are some students who are under 18 years of age. Some students are Muslim.

This is nothing short of "programming".

Edited January 16, 2010 by elkangorito

[sharecropper]

Charities, schools, good works, all superb. Nobody would argue with that.

But when it comes to peddling improbable and unprovable supernatural stores around those good works, to gullible, largely uneducate and now "saved" punters, then I have a problem with religion.

I am not intending to start a religious debate (that is a hole different issue, one I try to avoid at all costs), but why would you care about what "saved punter" believe, or what some people who receive charitable assistance believe?  If it works for them, what should it matter to you?

People who use religion, be that Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism,  or the Church of the Mighty Sasquatch, to force or coerce members into violence against others, OK, then I have a problem with that, too.  But simple religious beliefs, that is up to the individual and makes no difference to me one way or the other.

And while this doesn't indicate any valid demographical trends, the only Buddhists I know who have converted to Christianity have all been university-educated, so it is not only the uneducated masses, as you seem to attest. 

I am not intending to start a religious debate (that is a hole different issue, one I try to avoid at all costs), but why would you care about what "saved punter" believe, or what some people who receive charitable assistance believe? If it works for them, what should it matter to you?

I think it disingenuous, and slightly cynical if not sinister, to try to brainwash people with supernatural rubbish as a quid pro quo of saving them from whatever peril they may have been in - or worse, to try to supplant their previous beliefs system.

Save them for the good of the deed. What's wrong with that?

[robblok]

Charities, schools, good works, all superb. Nobody would argue with that.

But when it comes to peddling improbable and unprovable supernatural stores around those good works, to gullible, largely uneducate and now "saved" punters, then I have a problem with religion.

I am not intending to start a religious debate (that is a hole different issue, one I try to avoid at all costs), but why would you care about what "saved punter" believe, or what some people who receive charitable assistance believe?  If it works for them, what should it matter to you?

People who use religion, be that Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Hinduism, Buddhism,  or the Church of the Mighty Sasquatch, to force or coerce members into violence against others, OK, then I have a problem with that, too.  But simple religious beliefs, that is up to the individual and makes no difference to me one way or the other.

And while this doesn't indicate any valid demographical trends, the only Buddhists I know who have converted to Christianity have all been university-educated, so it is not only the uneducated masses, as you seem to attest. 

Religion always a touchy subject and people can overheat in debates about it.

[IanForbes]

Although I've seen a lot of harm caused by religious zealots of all denominations, I have to admit I was impressed with the work the original missionaries did who converted a valley of hill tribe people to Christianity in a mountainous area near Mae Sariang. I've never seen a lovelier group of people who kept their valley clean, and didn't pollute the way I've seen other places in Thailand pollute.

[dumbnewbie]

I read a blog of one of these missionary doo-gooders trying to 'save' girls in Nana. He basically got fleeced and ended up as angry and bitter as any of the posters you see here that get scammed by them.

God that's too funny!

[siggie2]

Religion is forced in many countries]

Thailand is a country where religion is not forced upon anybody.

Christians of all denominations do a lot of good work in rescuing girls from prostitution in Thailand. If you don't know that, you need to get out a bit more.

Just for starters, check out Rahab Ministry in Pat Pong. They offer ex-prostitutes vocational training, to help them earn a living. We know a happily married couple (now in Australia) - he is an Australian schoolteacher and his wife is a former bargirl who was rescued by Rahab. She is a practising Christian in Australia, and raises money for Rahab there. There are Catholic priests working in Bangkok and upcountry in similar ministries, including with children.

Would your home country be better off if the Salvation Army did not exist?

Religion is always forced on people, they start brainwashing small children at a young age they leave you no choice but to believe. I am happy i went to a public school and was never forced to believe in a fictional character whos existence has never been proven.

Can Christians do good.. sure they can just as easily as priests are known to do bad things with boys and scandals being covered up by the pope. But yes Christians can do good things but normal non religious people can do those things too.

Being a christian does not make you a better person, you are how you are because how you act not what you believe in.

I doubt the missionary here would help people who don't want to listen to their sermons or want to convert to their beliefs.

EXCELLENT POST

I am an athiest but does that make me a bad person,I hate Man Poo but does that make me a bad person,I hate Bangkok but does that make me a bad person.I have even turned my cheek many times but that does get a bit painful and retribution is sweet too.

[mccw]

"Choice" is my prefered word in this matter.

At my place of work (a Thai government institution), 3 songs are sung each & every morning. One is the National Anthem, the 2nd one is the Kings Anthem & the 3rd song is something about "Thai Buddhism" (not real Buddhism). This institution teaches people who are mostly adults in the eyes of Thai law (18+ years old), although there are some students who are under 18 years of age. Some students are Muslim.

This is nothing short of "programming".

Not unlike pledging allegance to the flag start of everyday in the USofA

[dumbnewbie]

I'm guessing that the main problem most of us have with Christianity in particular is the way it obsesses over sexuality and tries to repress it and give everyone a huge guilt trip over it (unless it involves a priest and a little boy - that's OK apparently).

Why do Christians have to equate nearly every form of sex with abuse and "sin"? Why can't they focus their disapproval and moral crusades on something else, like... oh, I don't know... how 'bout VIOLENCE? Or drug/alcohol abuse? Or poor hygiene and disease? Why is it always about sex with these people? Why can't they just accept that sex is one of the greatest joys in life and not in-and-of-itself harmful and evil?

It should go without saying that nobody should be forced or even coerced into sex, much less into prostitution. But aside from that criminal aspect, and the STD problem... well, aside from those two things, what the hel_l is the problem really? If Christians would just stop demonizing sex I think they'd find a lot fewer people stridently opposed to them.

[mccw]

Good works are great but why does religion have to be brought in to it? Surely the point should be to help people, not use the help as a means to convert people. Offerring your opinion on the nature of life, the existence or not of one or many gods is a right of any individual but it would be dispicable to only offer help on the condition of conversion or stustained indoctrination.

I think everyone should be educated in school about all the worlds religions and allowed to make up thier own minds.

[geriatrickid]

"Choice" is my prefered word in this matter.

At my place of work (a Thai government institution), 3 songs are sung each & every morning. One is the National Anthem, the 2nd one is the Kings Anthem & the 3rd song is something about "Thai Buddhism" (not real Buddhism). This institution teaches people who are mostly adults in the eyes of Thai law (18+ years old), although there are some students who are under 18 years of age. Some students are Muslim.

This is nothing short of "programming".

Not unlike pledging allegance to the flag start of everyday in the USofA

The difference is that you do not get arrested or prosecuted for refusing to pledge allegiance. You do recall a certain court case in Thailand involving someone that did not wish to stand and sing along, right? There are a few subjects in Thailand where dissent is not allowed. Need a hint? Look at the TV forum rules on subjects and institutions not to be discussed.

[siggie2]

Good works are great but why does religion have to be brought in to it? Surely the point should be to help people, not use the help as a means to convert people. Offerring your opinion on the nature of life, the existence or not of one or many gods is a right of any individual but it would be dispicable to only offer help on the condition of conversion or stustained indoctrination.

I think everyone should be educated in school about all the worlds religions and allowed to make up thier own minds.

Some might even suggest that these gods people have a great life,free food,free accomodation,see the world,and maybe earn some money too.

[tomahawk]

The existence of God is proven mathematically as there is no possibility that the universe could exist coincidentally without intelligent design. There are many experiments carried out in the field of quantum physics which demonstrate that consciousness and reality are interconnected, and that God is at least probable. In my experience, the people I have met who are most upset by the concept of religion or God are people who have the most to lose in the end if they are wrong. It is no use arguing about it anyway, as everyone will find out one way or another in the end.

As far as missionaries and Christianity, the Christians do perhaps more good works in this country than the Buddhists do. Nothing against Buddhism as I think it is a beautiful religion and is much like Christianity in many ways anyhow. But as a whole I believe the Christian church has done more charity-wise that Buddhists, but to be fair they also have more money.

[manarak]

Let them religious nut of any sort recruit and rescue as much as they want/can.

Who cares anyway as long as they don't disturb normal life?

[dmax]

the bar !!

[IanForbes]

I'm guessing that the main problem most of us have with Christianity in particular is the way it obsesses over sexuality and tries to repress it and give everyone a huge guilt trip over it (unless it involves a priest and a little boy - that's OK apparently).

Why do Christians have to equate nearly every form of sex with abuse and "sin"? Why can't they focus their disapproval and moral crusades on something else, like... oh, I don't know... how 'bout VIOLENCE? Or drug/alcohol abuse? Or poor hygiene and disease? Why is it always about sex with these people? Why can't they just accept that sex is one of the greatest joys in life and not in-and-of-itself harmful and evil?

It should go without saying that nobody should be forced or even coerced into sex, much less into prostitution. But aside from that criminal aspect, and the STD problem... well, aside from those two things, what the hel_l is the problem really? If Christians would just stop demonizing sex I think they'd find a lot fewer people stridently opposed to them.

Good post, Dumbnewbie, I agree entirely. I started a thread in "Bedlam" using the same theme... narrow minded, self righteous, Prudes. And you are bang on with the priests and the little choir boys. Even the Pope basically endorsed it. Instead of getting rid of the priests that were pedophiles they moved them to a different parrish when the stink got too bad.

[canuckamuck]

In my experience, the people I have met who are most upset by the concept of religion or God are people who have the most to lose in the end if they are wrong. It is no use arguing about it anyway, as everyone will find out one way or another in the end.

True