Gold , What Measurement ?

[pyros]

I' ve been a couple of times in goldshops and i know they use a measurement they only use in Thailand ( i think ) . They the term "bar" or something like that to tell how much gold is used . Going from 1 or 2 till 5 ( or higher but that ain't standard) . Buy that they say 1 "bar" is **** baht so 3 or 5 is **** . Ok , now the question ... how much is 1 "bar" of gold because in the shops the people don't seem to know . Is that 5 grams of gold , or less or more ???? Is it btw a good thing to buy in LOS , gold that is . It is all 24 carat so , that is something i like , just the colour alone ... yummie ....

[bangbuathong]

One Baht of gold is 15.16 grams. A troy ounce, internationally used to weigh gold, has 31.103 grams. A Baht weight therefore is equivalent to .487 troy ounces.

[pyros]

One Baht of gold is 15.16 grams. A troy ounce, internationally used to weigh gold, has 31.103 grams. A Baht weight therefore is equivalent to .487 troy ounces.

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Ok , thx for the fast reply ...

So a 5 baht necklace is about 75 grams ... ( that is a lot .)

[aussman]

while im told that there is some 24 k gold around it is my understanding that most of the gold in the shops is 96% pure...this info is from a chinese friend who owns such a shop

[lopburi3]

while im told that there is some 24 k gold around it is my understanding that most of the gold in the shops is 96% pure...this info is from a chinese friend who owns such a shop

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Correct. The normal standard is 22k (but often it is a little less - thus the crowds at large shops who are known to be more reliable). In any case much more pure than most gold sold elsewhere.

There is a new 24K (almost) gold sold at special department store and such outlets but this is not the standard and requires a special process (to make hard enough for jewelry use) that only a handful of companies seem to have access to.

[jayenram]

Buy that they say 1 "bar" is **** baht so 3 or 5 is **** . Ok , now the question ... how much is 1 "bar" of gold because in the shops the people don't seem to know .

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Just out of interest, how much were you quoted for 1 Baht of gold?

I've heard recently that it's up to around Bht 8,500.00.

[Jai Dee]

Buy that they say 1 "bar" is **** baht so 3 or 5 is **** . Ok , now the question ... how much is 1 "bar" of gold because in the shops the people don't seem to know .

Just out of interest, how much were you quoted for 1 Baht of gold?

I've heard recently that it's up to around Bht 8,500.00.

Yesterday in Sri Ratcha it was 8,000 THB for 1 baht gold.

[aussman]

Buy that they say 1 "bar" is **** baht so 3 or 5 is **** . Ok , now the question ... how much is 1 "bar" of gold because in the shops the people don't seem to know .

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Just out of interest, how much were you quoted for 1 Baht of gold?

I've heard recently that it's up to around Bht 8,500.00.

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Yesterday in Sri Ratcha it was 8,000 THB for 1 baht gold.

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its been bouncing up and down 100bt or so for a few weeks now. currently at 8100. this is up from 7300bt when i bought some in march 2005

[tuky]

Buy that they say 1 "bar" is **** baht so 3 or 5 is **** . Ok , now the question ... how much is 1 "bar" of gold because in the shops the people don't seem to know .

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Just out of interest, how much were you quoted for 1 Baht of gold?

I've heard recently that it's up to around Bht 8,500.00.

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Yesterday in Sri Ratcha it was 8,000 THB for 1 baht gold.

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You didn't see my missus there did you mate?

Seeing as our better halves shop at the same shop

[Laulen]

Ha ha haha ha ha!

[Jai Dee]

Buy that they say 1 "bar" is **** baht so 3 or 5 is **** . Ok , now the question ... how much is 1 "bar" of gold because in the shops the people don't seem to know .

Just out of interest, how much were you quoted for 1 Baht of gold?

I've heard recently that it's up to around Bht 8,500.00.

Yesterday in Sri Ratcha it was 8,000 THB for 1 baht gold.

You didn't see my missus there did you mate?

Seeing as our better halves shop at the same shop

Nope... you're safe for now.

And I certainly didn't tell mine how much it was either...

[pyros]

Wow , it has gone up quite a bit then ... almost twice the price a couple off months ago . . Well , i go look for the necklace and if it is still good value and i can weigh it i'll consider buying . I'll make sure it is minimum 22 carat , otherwise i'm not interested . It is good value compared to the price in europe .

[Totster]

Correct.  The normal standard is 22k (but often it is a little less - thus the crowds at large shops who are known to be more reliable).  In any case much more pure than most gold sold elsewhere.

I thought the standard was 96.5% / 23 carat, maybe it differs between areas or does it just depend on the shop...?

totster

[aughie]

22k is standard in Malaysia. So Seng Heng Goldsmiths in Bkk it's 96.5% / 23 carat.

[DaveYo]

There is another formula that people or you should know to precisely get a real good picture of what the value of your pending purchase should really be. Jewelers love to make money on people since most people do not understand the proper equation in knowing how to value that gold you hold in your hands, much less look around that particular piece of gold for proof of its being real. Many can pass this so called gold and it weighs and looks just like gold. A jeweler can find out within minutes if they got the fake gold (known as fools gold) or the real Mc Coy.

I have that formula and it definitely puts the brakes on all the jewelers I have come across upon, cause it really cuts down their huge profit margins that they like to make selling such jewelry.

In short you can really end up saving a good chunk and you can come out a bit ahead of having some extra change in your pockets if you know how to catch them off guard and slam them properly. They get so embarassed that they will negotiate with you hard and quickly in the hopes of getting you out of there with a sale and they pray so the other customers nearby don't hear how you caught them.

Works every time. You should see how their eyes grow big like golf balls and that they really do shuffle their feet and that they have a look of shock on their faces once they know obviously and are convinced you know their tricks, and they sure do hurry in calling up others from the back room and have a quickie discussion and see how fast they come back to you, and how quickly they are using their fingers on that calculator!!!!!!!! --> with a price that spirals down fast.

By the way if you were holding that gold and it was a fake, watch how fast they get it away from you and instead put in front of you the real Mc Coy gold, like a swap of chains.

Thai Gold necklaces have two link gold. In America you will find three link gold necklaces. This is well known here in Thailand.

Daveyo

[Totster]

Related thread....

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=22794

totster

[RDN]

...I have that formula and it definitely puts the brakes on all the jewelers I have come across upon...

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So, what is it?

[expatinasia]

Davy must be feeling his oats today. The formula I've used is "'no thanks' and walk away'".

[seahorse]

So can you buy gold in "blocks" or do you have to buy it in the form of a necklace or ring or bracelet? I would be interested in buying only for investment purposes - I don't like wearing jewellery. Is this what people mean when they talk about a bar?

[Kerryd]

So can you buy gold in "blocks" or do you have to buy it in the form of a necklace or ring or bracelet? I would be interested in buying only for investment purposes - I don't like wearing jewellery. Is this what people mean when they talk about a bar?

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Don't think so. I think the OP had wax in his ears when he was in the gold shop. The shopkeeper was referring to how much "baht" the item weighed (as in a 2 baht necklace). He must have heard "bar" somehow.

It can be a little confusing for new people, as gold is sold by the baht (the weight) for so much baht (the currency).

[simcity]

So can you buy gold in "blocks" or do you have to buy it in the form of a necklace or ring or bracelet? I would be interested in buying only for investment purposes - I don't like wearing jewellery. Is this what people mean when they talk about a bar?

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yes bar of 1-2-5-10 bahts is available ,bit more gold in it ! that is the gold Chinese / Thai family bye for wedding !

[dereklev]

...I have that formula and it definitely puts the brakes on all the jewelers I have come across upon...

So, what is it?

Glad you asked that RDN.....

I read and re-read DaveYo's post and thought I must have lost the plot!

[RDN]

...I have that formula and it definitely puts the brakes on all the jewelers I have come across upon...

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So, what is it?

<{POST_SNAPBACK}>

Glad you asked that RDN.....

I read and re-read DaveYo's post and thought I must have lost the plot!

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He's obviously keeping it very close to his chest. Next to his "fool's gold" 10-baht necklace.

[Eastender]

As for the question about blocks of gold;

That's what i thought my wife meant when she talked about the dowry. But no, it's almost always sold as jewelry, though the shape and form are of secondary importance.

Her mother's gold chain was broken once and so we went to a gold shop. I thought we were putting it in to get it fixed. But no, they weighed it, we paid a set fee, and they gave an equivalent weight back as a different necklace.

By the way, am I right in thinking prices are probably going to increase over say the next year?

[maerim]

So can you buy gold in "blocks"

You can in Dubai airport, they sell it in pendants up to 50 g and ingots up to a kilo.

Stamped either EG or Credit Suisse this is fine gold 99.999 pure and sold at the price of the day as it is updated twice a day 10 am and 3pm GMT.

[OxfordWill]

Daveyo, grow up and tell us this magic formula! Otherwise, dont bother!

Is it something to do with links in the chains? Curious minds!

[wolf5370]

Just a quick tip for the newbies here. If you are buyng from a "red 'n' gold" (Thai/Chinese jewlers) then make sure you get stamped gold. It is unlikely you will have a hallmark from these shops (sometimes from department store jewlers though). The reason is that you can take it back to them and they will buy it back later on. They do not always trust gold from other sources (or unstamped). The stamp will be a symbol of some sort - there is often a Gor Gai (or is it a horse shoe) stamped on necklaces too (on the end bits).

As someone said here - follow the crowds. Thais have weeded out the fraudsters and over-chanrges over time for you!

PS: You are unlikely to be ripped off by a "red 'n' gold", but if it does happen it is more likely to happen in the tourist areas like Pattaya.

PPS: There are NO GOVERNMENT SCHEMES FOR SELLING GEMS OR GOLD - Do not be taken in by uniforms, badges or official looking ID's (you can get your own down KS Road). Don't buy jewlery from roadside dealers.

PPPS: Don't mean to preach, but get fed up with hearing stories of stupid people getting ripped off over and over.

[Flysiam]

I am surprised with all of you Thai/Chinese gold experts that no one has thought to tellof the gold price posting on EVERY gold shop in the LOS. No one has to 'wonder' whatthe price of gold is when walking into a gold shop - it is posted in the front of the shop - the price that the gold costs to BUY and the price of gold to SELL to the shop (usually for trading in or up). Oner might see a gold price of 8,100 to SELL and right below that a price of 7,900 to BUY. If the price of gold is 8,100 per 'baht' weight then that is the price of 'gold '- what is negotiable thereafter is the workmanship on the particular piece you are buying. A simple 1 baht chain may come with a workmanship cost of 400 baht (I have gotten it less though) - so the cost of your chain would be 8,500. If you went to a 2 baht chain then the cost would be......about 8,100x2= 16,200 + 400x2 =17,00. Wow I hate mental gymnastics!

Beyond that there is definitely differing qualities in the gold being sold. Most all gold is stamped with a gold shops qualitiy stamp and the good shops know what is good. If you buy gold from one shop that is not up to par and take it to another gold shop to trade it up they may not give you full price for it as it is stamped with a known inferior grade. Most gold shops will have a sheet with examples of the stamps they will let you see.

I still want to know Daves SECRET FORMULA!!!! Yeah right

[wolf5370]

Yep Fly, they also usually have the "per gram" price or Gram/Baht comparison so you can work it out yourself.

Can't say I've ever been stung for 'workmanship' charges for a chain. In fact only got stung with that for rings (and only ornate ones at that), oh and once for a bracelet that was shaped like two leopards for the Mrs. They do charge this in Gem and department stores though.

I agree about the stamps - that was what I was trying to say, albeit clumsily.

[DaveYo]

Hmmm, I see there is interest in knowing my formula. Really it is no secret but some pure mathematics (a little of it) and obviously by calling the Bank for the market price of Gold that day. What you see in the shops does not reflect the actual market price of gold and or from the Banks.

There are two sets of formulas. One is used by the jewelry shop traders in their private market, and the other is used for customers who wish to buy gems of the sort.

Concerning the first formula, jewelry shop traders, this is where they buy their gold at the lowest value bought. If they didn't there would be no jewelry shop in business in the outside.

Concerning the consumers side, hmmm, what I have takes a bit of time to study and to learn and to do a few trial runs to get the hang of how to deal with the jewelry shops regarding how you can quickly figure out their profit margins on that piece of jewelry and negotiations.

I have seen jewelry shops make a secret killing on the profit side. Ex- say you see a necklace and the selling price on the tag is like 450.00. What they say then to you this is one ounce of gold. Really ask yourself quietly. Market price is 450.00 per ounce. They even weigh it to you in grams and do some flips on their calculators and announce to you they will sell it to you for 410 out the door.

First you have to know the price of that gold in jewelry trading market. Once you know (approximately 99%) then you have a base to figure out how much they paid for that gold.

Secondly all gold has impurities in it. If you got pure Gold it will be very soft and it will not stay intact for long. In fact you can squeeze your fingernail into pure Gold and it will leave a mark. You want that fine, if not continue reading.

So for pieces of jewelry, they have other metals to make it hard, thus giving you the chains and rings etc. You have to subtract the percentage of the other metals before you begin to calculate. So most of this Gold is around 96% pure. Now you know 4% has to go out as your deduction.

Now in the market 450.00 is for 1 pure ounce of Gold. Take 450.00 x 4% and you get the actual market price of gold under most items. That comes out to 18.00 . So the real price is 432 per ounce.

Now out of that figure you have to know what the jewelry shop profit margin will be. Generally speaking they ususally make around like 150.00 per item sold. So negotiate with them down to around 100 as a base start. You can get it down to 80.00 their profit depending on who they are etc.

So say the jewelry shop agrees to sell you that piece for like around 382.00 you pretty much are in the ballgame. This means the jewelry shop made roughly about 80 dollars profit on the sale. To get it lower will really take a bit of hard nose bickering with them, of which sometimes you win and sometimes you lose.

Most people flat out usually accept a price of 440 out the door thinking they beat the gold market price. If you don't believe me go to one store and watch and mosey around and keep your ears peeled to their conversations.

Anyway what I have is about two pages long so if you want to know PM me and I will send you a copy to your e-mail.

Daveyo