Honda Cbr 250R 2011

[thaicbr]

it's not just a thai cbr. it's a Honda world bike. and yes the basic engine etc is . They have already stated that. That's why morawaki and mugen had them before release and provided some worked over bikes. Strange world aint it.

Edited November 1, 2010 by thaicbr

[dave_boo]

I would like to point out that T-bird (assuming he is American), is not representative of all Americans....especially considering his attitude. Once again assuming his post is accurate, I'm sure that he also probably doesn't hang around with a crowd that most of the posters here associate with either.

His lack of understanding in regards to riding smaller bikes that are LEGAL and have full warranty should be painfully obvious. His postings smack of megalomania, elitism and a certain amount of juvenile maturity.

Deconstructing his post that I linked to:

You former posts about skilled teck mech if owning an imported bike and its almost not worth commenting. Its just a statement that you dont know your way around in Thailand or anything about these bikes. I said you dont need a tech mech nearby, meaning there is very seldom need for one if your bike is rather new.

That's obviously the posting of someone who either doesn't live in LOS, has a first 'Thai' owner bike, or lives right next to a mechanic. Anybody that has bought a Thai owned bike has inevitably had issues to sort out. And anybody who is considering a bike that costs 100K probably can't float the money for a new enough bike to not be visiting the mechanic on a regular basis.

And brakes, shocks ,fluid, bearings, electrics etc is that so different on a thai made 250 vs an imported 600 or a 1000 cc that a Thai cant do it? You are hilarious.

Smacks of not knowing the actual procurement process. Shooting down to the dealership and ordering the correct part and it being there within several days sure beats ordering it overseas and then paying off the mafia in the post office....

I guess I just fail to see the reason that he needs to thread crap.....

[taichiplanet]

So the Ninja 250 is not a sports bike either? It weighs 170kgs and produces only 30HP; a far cry from 40-45HP.

Thunderbird4ever you can't "leave out Thai peoples economy or take the discussion onto that level." As someone else mentioned, bikes are made for different things. Obviously you are talking about Sports bikes, but even that is subjective. I know some people that define a sports car as not having wind-up (or electric) windows! A 26HP 250cc bike is a sports bike for someone that has been using a 8HP Wave for years. Yeah it is no scorcher, but it is faster than any other local new bike.

A quote from Honda's world press release:

"This CBR250R will have the largest engine displacement of any vehicle produced by Thai Honda Manufacturing Co., Ltd. (Thai Honda), Honda’s motorcycle production company in Thailand, and will be its first full-fledged road sports model."

Also "Thai Honda, the production base for this model, began motorcycle production in 1967 and first started to export to Japan in 1988 with the Cub 100EX. It has produced over 18 million motorcycles to date (as of the end of June 2010) and has exported motorcycles to numerous regions such as Europe as well as its natural base in Asia."

250cc is the biggest engine made by Thai Honda motorcycles in 43 years of production. So for nearly half a century the majority of people in the region has been happy pottering around on low powered bikes. This bike is not aimed at a market for a high stressed engine light-weight sports bike, it is going to also be built in India. The price and maintenance has to be kept as low as possible but it still has to negotiate the crap roads. Which is probably why it is heavy as it is not made for flat pot-hole free roads. If i had to choose between a twin front brake rotor bike without ABS over a single front brake rotor with ABS; i'm going for the later. The ABS is a huge thing for a small bike (though i would guess that a lot of people will save 15k and not get it). Even in the 'Western' world people are looking for a safe and fun bike that gets them around using as little fuel as possible.

I am disappointed it is not a more powerful twin, but unless the CBR250R is a real dog i'll probably take it over the Ninja 250 due to the ABS. As Canuckamuck said, if it can do 140 kph i'd be happy, especially if it can sit on 120 kph for long stretches without too much fuss. Hopefully there are some nice mods coming to tweak the power of the 2011 CBR250R without attracting the attention of cops.

Maybe Honda are saving the RR (as in CBR250RR) for a twin engine version. Then again, here in Thailand APe Honda makes the decisions what gets released, lets face it, they should've brought a 250 out 2 years ago.

Edited November 1, 2010 by taichiplanet

[thaicbr]

there should be some nice mods. considering.

this

Official: Moto3 to replace 125cc

At a meeting of the Grand Prix Commission during this weekend's Czech Republic Grand Prix at Brno, it was confirmed that the 125cc class - the only two-stroke category remaining - will also be replaced by four-strokes from 2012.

Unlike Moto2, the four-stroke class that replaced 250cc at the start of this year, the new Moto3 championship will not have a single engine supplier.

125cc is the last category remaining from the inaugural 1949 World Championship season.

The statement read:

"Application 2012

"The 125cc class will be replaced by the Moto3 class.

"The basic technical rules of this class are:

- single cylinder 250cc 4-stroke engines with a maximum bore of 81 mm.

- each engine should last for 3 races minimum and cost not more than 10,000 € (final cost will be announced)

- each manufacturer if required should be ready to supply a minimum of 15 riders.

"This proposal has been agreed by the majority of MSMA."

The premier grand prix class changed from 500cc (two-strokes) to MotoGP (four-strokes) in 2002.

[Thunderbird4ever]

it's not just a thai cbr. it's a Honda world bike. and yes the basic engine etc is . They have already stated that. That's why morawaki and mugen had them before release and provided some worked over bikes. Strange world aint it.

Naah.. I dont think that is very correct thaicbr. The Moriwaki GP 250 single cylinder is actually based on the CRF250X engine. This engine comes from motorcross and enduro and has been around for quite some years. Original from honda this is a high maintenance engine. Moriwaki and Mugen are both companies working very close with Honda and will be some of the first to get whatever that is new. Of course they will paint these up in their race colours as their GP250 is a single and the CBR250 is a single.

[visions]

So the Ninja 250 is not a sports bike either? It weighs 170kgs and produces only 30HP; a far cry from 40-45HP.

Thunderbird4ever you can't "leave out Thai peoples economy or take the discussion onto that level." As someone else mentioned, bikes are made for different things. Obviously you are talking about Sports bikes, but even that is subjective. I know some people that define a sports car as not having wind-up (or electric) windows! A 26HP 250cc bike is a sports bike for someone that has been using a 8HP Wave for years. Yeah it is no scorcher, but it is faster than any other local new bike.

A quote from Honda's world press release:

"This CBR250R will have the largest engine displacement of any vehicle produced by Thai Honda Manufacturing Co., Ltd. (Thai Honda), Honda’s motorcycle production company in Thailand, and will be its first full-fledged road sports model."

Also "Thai Honda, the production base for this model, began motorcycle production in 1967 and first started to export to Japan in 1988 with the Cub 100EX. It has produced over 18 million motorcycles to date (as of the end of June 2010) and has exported motorcycles to numerous regions such as Europe as well as its natural base in Asia."

250cc is the biggest engine made by Thai Honda motorcycles in 43 years of production. So for nearly half a century the majority of people in the region has been happy pottering around on low powered bikes. This bike is not aimed at a market for a high stressed engine light-weight sports bike, it is going to also be built in India. The price and maintenance has to be kept as low as possible but it still has to negotiate the crap roads. Which is probably why it is heavy as it is not made for flat pot-hole free roads. If i had to choose between a twin front brake rotor bike without ABS over a single front brake rotor with ABS; i'm going for the later. The ABS is a huge thing for a small bike (though i would guess that a lot of people will save 15k and not get it). Even in the 'Western' world people are looking for a safe and fun bike that gets them around using as little fuel as possible.

I am disappointed it is not a more powerful twin, but unless the CBR250R is a real dog i'll probably take it over the Ninja 250 due to the ABS. As Canuckamuck said, if it can do 140 kph i'd be happy, especially if it can sit on 120 kph for long stretches without too much fuss. Hopefully there are some nice mods coming to tweak the power of the 2011 CBR250R without attracting the attention of cops.

Maybe Honda are saving the RR (as in CBR250RR) for a twin engine version. Then again, here in Thailand APe Honda makes the decisions what gets released, lets face it, they should've brought a 250 out 2 years ago.

Tonight coming home from work, I was riding between a row of cars with the lights green, when I saw a tyre emerging at right angles to the traffic flow from in front of a car on the left.

I hit the brakes hard as I knew what was coming......the stupid woman then stopped between and at right angles to the rows, directly in front of me I guess the last meter I was on some fine sand dropped on the road, my front locked and skidded.....but luckily the bike stopped as my front tyre just lightly touched the womans leg. A classic case of where ABS would have stopped me sooner. At one point I could see me hitting at about 15kph and sending her and her child flying in the moving traffic.

I was very thankful that my tiny wee CBR 150 has far superior brakes and tyres than a scooter.

I will certainly be having ABS on my 250.

[Thunderbird4ever]

I would like to point out that T-bird (assuming he is American), is not representative of all Americans....especially considering his attitude.

And brakes, shocks ,fluid, bearings, electrics etc is that so different on a thai made 250 vs an imported 600 or a 1000 cc that a Thai cant do it? You are hilarious.

Smacks of not knowing the actual procurement process. Shooting down to the dealership and ordering the correct part and it being there within several days sure beats ordering it overseas and then paying off the mafia in the post office....

I guess I just fail to see the reason that he needs to thread crap.....

Yep, your assuming is not very good. Dont you think an American would have a slightly better English written language than I have.

Also it would be quite fun to see he reactions of big bikers in Thailand where you try to convince them that: Shooting down to the dealership and ordering the correct part and it being there within several days sure beats ordering it overseas and then paying off the mafia in the post office... So just forget about driving around on imported bikes. I guess you would receive quite some strange looks. You cant have much passion for bikes or other stuff that takes some effort to deal with. Reminds me of someone that is very good at some other things though.

[thaicbr]

it's not just a thai cbr. it's a Honda world bike. and yes the basic engine etc is . They have already stated that. That's why morawaki and mugen had them before release and provided some worked over bikes. Strange world aint it.

Naah.. I dont think that is very correct thaicbr. The Moriwaki GP 250 single cylinder is actually based on the CRF250X engine. This engine comes from motorcross and enduro and has been around for quite some years. Original from honda this is a high maintenance engine. Moriwaki and Mugen are both companies working very close with Honda and will be some of the first to get whatever that is new.  Of course they will paint these up in their race colours as their GP250 is a single and the CBR250 is a single.  

The Moriwaki GP 250 single cylinder WAS based on the crf. the bikes shown were the new cbr engine. which in turn is loosely based on the crf engine. as with every  manufacturer they use similar designs. the cbr uses a proper crankshell bearing the crf does not it uses the same set up as your Cbr150 which you should know about as in another thread you said it's been apart so many times .

still never mind. Obviously  THEY ARE NOT GOING TO USE THE SAME street SETUP. but the engine is the base of the new moto3 bike. dat's what Honda say. But they may be wrong and do not know what engine they are going to use in their own bikes

[dave_boo]

Yep, your assuming is not very good. Dont you think an American would have a slightly better English written language than I have.

No.....

Also it would be quite fun to see he reactions of big bikers in Thailand where you try to convince them that: Shooting down to the dealership and ordering the correct part and it being there within several days sure beats ordering it overseas and then paying off the mafia in the post office... So just forget about driving around on imported bikes. I guess you would receive quite some strange looks. You cant have much passion for bikes or other stuff that takes some effort to deal with. Reminds me of someone that is very good at some other things though.

And not all of us have time when we return from overseas to deal with sourcing parts, getting the bike to a reputable mechanic, and waiting for it to be 'repaired'.....I'm sure that you think you need to project your 'passion for bikes' and troll this thread about just a 'lowly' 250, but perhaps you can start your own thread so that people who are interested in this bike don't have to wade through the crap you are spewing?

[Thunderbird4ever]

it's not just a thai cbr. it's a Honda world bike. and yes the basic engine etc is . They have already stated that. That's why morawaki and mugen had them before release and provided some worked over bikes. Strange world aint it.

Naah.. I dont think that is very correct thaicbr. The Moriwaki GP 250 single cylinder is actually based on the CRF250X engine. This engine comes from motorcross and enduro and has been around for quite some years. Original from honda this is a high maintenance engine. Moriwaki and Mugen are both companies working very close with Honda and will be some of the first to get whatever that is new. Of course they will paint these up in their race colours as their GP250 is a single and the CBR250 is a single.

The Moriwaki GP 250 single cylinder WAS based on the crf. the bikes shown were the new cbr engine. which in turn is loosely based on the crf engine. as with every manufacturer they use similar designs. the cbr uses a proper crankshell bearing the crf does not it uses the same set up as your Cbr150 which you should know about as in another thread you said it's been apart so many times .

still never mind. Obviously THEY ARE NOT GOING TO USE THE SAME street SETUP. but the engine is the base of the new moto3 bike. dat's what Honda say. But they may be wrong and do not know what engine they are going to use in their own bikes

Seriously, are you talking about the two"GP" bikes you posted pictures of above?

Edited November 1, 2010 by Thunderbird4ever

[VocalNeal]

I know some people that define a sports car as not having wind-up (or electric) windows!

Woo Hoo My Suzuki Carry is a sports car, well OK truck and second and third gears are close ratio.

[13budgies]

You're all forgetting the golden rule of any forum:

DON'T FEED THE TROLLS

If you all just ignore him, he'll go away and annoy someone else.

[Just1Voice]

I refer back t my earlier post:

Do I like it?

Does it fit MY needs?

Can I afford it?

If "yes", ignore the "trolls", "experts", and other a_holes and go ride happy.

[taichiplanet]

Nearly yes to all three questions! Just waiting to get feed back from owners.

Yeah, we put up with the occasional troll popping their head up on the old CBR150 forum, and now we go 100cc bigger and they still have a go! I'm happy that i don't have a big bike so i don't have to ride with such disparaging bikers.

[mbox]

The new CBR's are giving us more choices and these are good news to get them actually available.

In regards of some Big/Small Bike posts in this thread -don't really matter the size of Bike most of the Riding depending on the Riders ability really.The specs are interesting to read...i tend to believe more on how i feel on the bike and ,does it deliver what i wish for .

The one line saying" it is more fun to ride a small bike fast then a big bike slow" may be right - The Kawa Vulcan 990 is a big bike and am sure it is fun to ride it slow too(although i never ridden this model actually). Guess the line was meant for sportsbikes only ? Most of my Big Bikes were fine to ride slow ...but then again what is the definition for slow???

mbox

[visions]

Actually maybe Thunderbird4ever could help here.....Himself or his contacts. Maybe even some business from guys wanting to upgrade their engines??

The CBR1000 has approx 180HP so per 250cc = 45HP

The Moto2 600cc Honda has approx 140HP so at 250cc = roughly 60HP Std road bike 100hp so at 250cc about 45hp.

In Moto3 form the 250 single will need put out roughly 60+hp to equal the 125cc 2T

The New Honda 250 single in road form is 26hp and has (apparently) the same bore and stroke as the CBR1000

So from a laymans point of view, what needs to be done to get the HP up to mid 30s - 40HP??? At that level one would think durability would still be ok?

Or am I oversimplifying things ? As Ive said I am no mechanic so excuse me if Im barking up the wrong tree.

[mbox]

Actually maybe Thunderbird4ever could help here.....Himself or his contacts. Maybe even some business from guys wanting to upgrade their engines??

The CBR1000 has approx 180HP so per 250cc = 45HP

The Moto2 600cc Honda has approx 140HP so at 250cc = roughly 60HP Std road bike 100hp so at 250cc about 45hp.

In Moto3 form the 250 single will need put out roughly 60+hp to equal the 125cc 2T

The New Honda 250 single in road form is 26hp and has (apparently) the same bore and stroke as the CBR1000

So from a laymans point of view, what needs to be done to get the HP up to mid 30s - 40HP??? At that level one would think durability would still be ok?

Or am I oversimplifying things ? As Ive said I am no mechanic so excuse me if Im barking up the wrong tree.

Not a mechanic either... i would say some change on the muffler perhaps using something like Powercommader adds up to over 30Hp's?

If it delivers 26 hp's it ain't so bad and it should deliver good torque on lower rpms too. Is it a sportsbike??? I would rather call it a sport"ish" bike

mbox

[Hili]

Let's hope it will be same easy as it was for the old cbr150 to squeeze out some more hps. Exhaust, downpipe, air filter, cdi were the easy and quite efficient mods on it.....

[visions]

Actually maybe Thunderbird4ever could help here.....Himself or his contacts. Maybe even some business from guys wanting to upgrade their engines??

The CBR1000 has approx 180HP so per 250cc = 45HP

The Moto2 600cc Honda has approx 140HP so at 250cc = roughly 60HP Std road bike 100hp so at 250cc about 45hp.

In Moto3 form the 250 single will need put out roughly 60+hp to equal the 125cc 2T

The New Honda 250 single in road form is 26hp and has (apparently) the same bore and stroke as the CBR1000

So from a laymans point of view, what needs to be done to get the HP up to mid 30s - 40HP??? At that level one would think durability would still be ok?

Or am I oversimplifying things ? As Ive said I am no mechanic so excuse me if Im barking up the wrong tree.

Not a mechanic either... i would say some change on the muffler perhaps using something like Powercommader adds up to over 30Hp's?

If it delivers 26 hp's it ain't so bad and it should deliver good torque on lower rpms too. Is it a sportsbike??? I would rather call it a sport"ish" bike

mbox

The Mugen and Moriwaki bikes at the show had after-market pipes and cans.

Apparently (I havent seen) the torque curve is very flat giving a wide range of power low to mid range up to peak HP at from memory 8500. Limiter at 10500

I understand that the torque most likely would be much more "peaky" with serious engine mods

[nikster]

Nearly yes to all three questions! Just waiting to get feed back from owners.

Yeah, we put up with the occasional troll popping their head up on the old CBR150 forum, and now we go 100cc bigger and they still have a go! I'm happy that i don't have a big bike so i don't have to ride with such disparaging bikers.

Some of them might currently have a vested interest... like a CBR1000 for sale... didn't research, just a bit of a wild guess. But why else would you compare a 1000cc bike with a 250cc bike. Discussions on Ninja 250 vs. CBR 250 would at least make sense. 1000cc - not so much

[taichiplanet]

Low/mid torque is more useful for me; especially at the traffic light drags!

Maybe can chop the catalzyer out of the original muffler; that may make it breathe easier and lose a couple of kgs, and won't attract the attention of the cops like that multi-colour Moriwaki one!

An ECU upgrade has gotta help, Thai Honda seem to target economy rather than power. Anyone know about the ECM that JR Motor have? It is in Thai and the google translation didn't reveal much. They do an electronic box for the PCX, Waves, etc so no doubt will do one for the CBRs. i am not really sure what it actually does though it does state an increase in acceleration, a 5-10% in top end speed and economy. All for THB1200! http://www.jrmotor.com/jrmotor-racing.html

Tyres have gotta help too; don't know what will be OEM on the CBR250 but good quality ones should lighter as well as stickier.

[visions]

Low/mid torque is more useful for me; especially at the traffic light drags!

Maybe can chop the catalzyer out of the original muffler; that may make it breathe easier and lose a couple of kgs, and won't attract the attention of the cops like that multi-colour Moriwaki one!

An ECU upgrade has gotta help, Thai Honda seem to target economy rather than power. Anyone know about the ECM that JR Motor have? It is in Thai and the google translation didn't reveal much. They do an electronic box for the PCX, Waves, etc so no doubt will do one for the CBRs. i am not really sure what it actually does though it does state an increase in acceleration, a 5-10% in top end speed and economy. All for THB1200! http://www.jrmotor.c...tor-racing.html

Tyres have gotta help too; don't know what will be OEM on the CBR250 but good quality ones should lighter as well as stickier.

That surprised me a little actually.....One would presume, if u buy a Moriwaki version from the Honda showroom.....with that moded pipe and can.......then all is legal 100%??

[Just1Voice]

Got 2 phone calls about 10 minutes apart. Honda dealer on Huay Kaew Rd (Chiang Mai) will have 250's available for viewing around 2:00 today. Have to order with whatever color combo you want. Dealer on Mahidol Rd next to Toyota dealer will have 150's at same time, same "stipulations".

Going to see 150's first, as it's actually the closest one on the way into CM, then go see the 250's.

[visions]

Got 2 phone calls about 10 minutes apart. Honda dealer on Huay Kaew Rd (Chiang Mai) will have 250's available for viewing around 2:00 today. Have to order with whatever color combo you want. Dealer on Mahidol Rd next to Toyota dealer will have 150's at same time, same "stipulations".

Going to see 150's first, as it's actually the closest one on the way into CM, then go see the 250's.

Like Xmas come early...... Be interested in your comments after viewing.

[dave_boo]

Actually maybe Thunderbird4ever could help here.....Himself or his contacts. Maybe even some business from guys wanting to upgrade their engines??

The CBR1000 has approx 180HP so per 250cc = 45HP

The Moto2 600cc Honda has approx 140HP so at 250cc = roughly 60HP Std road bike 100hp so at 250cc about 45hp.

In Moto3 form the 250 single will need put out roughly 60+hp to equal the 125cc 2T

The New Honda 250 single in road form is 26hp and has (apparently) the same bore and stroke as the CBR1000

So from a laymans point of view, what needs to be done to get the HP up to mid 30s - 40HP??? At that level one would think durability would still be ok?

Or am I oversimplifying things ? As Ive said I am no mechanic so excuse me if Im barking up the wrong tree.

The 140HP Moto2 bike doesn't have to deal with emissions, longevity, and IIRC pump gas (much less E20!). And that's not even discussing what RPMs it lives at.

The CBR 1000 revs higher and probably doesn't have 4x the grunt in the lower RPMs that the CBR250 has. Remember that HP=(Torque X RPM)/5252. So, purely speculating here, I'd bet that the bulk of the torque on the CBR 250 is lower down with a quick drop off after say 7-8000 RPM. Several of the reasons for this line of thinking are the presented specs (lightweight valve train, 'softer' valve springs, etc) and the video I've seen where it revs like crazy down low but redlines at something like 11K.

I don't think that mid 30s-40 HP is going to work on the engine as designed...perhaps a total rebuild with heavier bottom end, higher compression, 'better' valve train. and a port job (along with the standard silencer/ECU/etc jobbies).

[CMX]

Just1Voice,

When you return, you'll find these thanks. I too was told 2 weeks for CM showings, and I too will glance at the 150. Plus, it is full-bore riding season now (so far). Sleeping, dry, clear, cool. Whattaday.

[Just1Voice]

12:43 - leaving now, have to make a couple of stops first, and taking camera

[taichiplanet]

Just back from the main Mityon showroom in South Pattaya. They had a red, white, blue CBR150. Nice size, as slightly bigger than the old one, and seat is wide and felt comfortable. It is running IRC tyres on 2.5" front rim and 3.5" rear rim. The price i was told was 72k!

I then asked about the 250 and got blank looks (same as last week) and a rather confused "no have 250, have 150!". Eventually after i kept insisting that the 250 existed someone volunteered "December" and then on price said "130, 140". In other words,; didn't have a clue. This from the main dealer!

[taichiplanet]

That surprised me a little actually.....One would presume, if u buy a Moriwaki version from the Honda showroom.....with that moded pipe and can.......then all is legal 100%??

You reckon that the Moriwaki and the Mugen versions would be sold in Thailand through the dealers? That would be nice! I prefer the Mugen version.

[visions]

That surprised me a little actually.....One would presume, if u buy a Moriwaki version from the Honda showroom.....with that moded pipe and can.......then all is legal 100%??

You reckon that the Moriwaki and the Mugen versions would be sold in Thailand through the dealers? That would be nice! I prefer the Mugen version.

I gave a list of questions to my dealer yesterday, go back in this evening hopefully to get the answers...including if the replica colours available and pricing etc. If they were on the ball they would have sms to me or email, both of which, they have, but TiT