Visas: Why Do We Have To Leave The Country For That?

[pepi2005]

I have yet to understand the logic of 'visa run' trips ... especially the ones where people don't need to 'workaround' the tourist visa limitation, but just simply need, change or extend a legitimate visa!!

Especially if someone wants to apply for a 3 month or especially a business (Non-Imm), Education or spouse visa: why can't we do that right within the country?!

Even if it would be at the same cost - it would be more convenient and save a lot of money that tourists/expats/business owners could use in Thailand instead of the 'visa run' destination country. Apart from that, I would expect the local immigration office to be much more 'familiar' with one's case, business activities etc. than any embassy abroad.

Maybe someone who knows about the higher logic behind the current system can shed some light on this?

thanks,

p.

[rogercw]

It made sense to someone in authority years ago for some reason. Since then Immigration just keeps on keeping on.

[LivinLOS]

The logic is that its 2 different fiefdoms..

Dept of immigration control your right to stay in the country.. So extensions..

Dept of interior (I think) control your right to come to the country.. Hence visas..

Each one probably fights for their own power and revenue streams.

[Just1Voice]

You are trying to make sense out of something in Thailand, where "sense" is a word and concept completely unknown to them.

[gotlost]

BECAUSE THEY SAY SO!!!

[lopburi3]

1. Immigration is the authority on who enters Thailand. MFA acts as there agent for visa issue. No visa allows access. Only if the Immigration officer approves is entry allowed.

2. If there are normal reasons for the person to stay in Thailand, such as work, marriage and such there are extensions of stay available from Immigration so no travel or visas required.

3. As for all sets of rules there are those that are not accommodated for one reason or another. Thailand has allowed repeated visa entry for most of these exceptions but it requires exit of country every 90 days or less.

4. Suspect it is much better for most of these in para 3 position to be able to do this than the hard line no entry that some other countries take.

Some do not know there are extensions available and some can not meet the requirements but it appears most wanting to stay have found some way to do so.

[beechguy]

I realize this is a Thai related forum so people are going to complain about Thailand, but this situation is fairly common around the world. As Lopburi mentions there is a solution, apply for an "Extension of Stay".

[NHJ]

I realize this is a Thai related forum so people are going to complain about Thailand, but this situation is fairly common around the world. As Lopburi mentions there is a solution, apply for an "Extension of Stay".

i would be glad to do it if i could, i have a three years visa non-B however i don't qualify as, i don't have any thai employee, don't have a salary of 50k/month, doesn't have a company income of a million baht per year and pay tax on this.

the problem is those extension rules are good for mister toyota and mister ibm, but not for mister john...

[beechguy]

I realize this is a Thai related forum so people are going to complain about Thailand, but this situation is fairly common around the world. As Lopburi mentions there is a solution, apply for an "Extension of Stay".

i would be glad to do it if i could, i have a three years visa non-B however i don't qualify as, i don't have any thai employee, don't have a salary of 50k/month, doesn't have a company income of a million baht per year and pay tax on this.

the problem is those extension rules are good for mister toyota and mister ibm, but not for mister john...

But weren't you aware of those requirements before you decided to start a business here? Anyway, my point I suppose is, Cambodia, Phillipines, or similar countries may be more relaxed, but overall I don't consider Thailand to be particularily strict compared to most other countries.

[NanLaew]

^ With thousands of regular visa overstayers, I consider Thailand's immigration requirements to be very relaxed.

[delboy]

The question raised by the OP was not whether Thailand's rules and regulations were too strict compared to other countries, but why one can't extend or renew certain legitimate visas from within the country, at the same cost and under the same regulations, rather than having to leave the country.

It does seem strange to force people to spend time and money in a neighbouring country when they could be spending that money in Thailand. There is also the chance that when on a visa trip, the person could decide that the neighbouring country is better and move there permanently.

[beechguy]

The question raised by the OP was not whether Thailand's rules and regulations were too strict compared to other countries, but why one can't extend or renew certain legitimate visas from within the country, at the same cost and under the same regulations, rather than having to leave the country.

It does seem strange to force people to spend time and money in a neighbouring country when they could be spending that money in Thailand. There is also the chance that when on a visa trip, the person could decide that the neighbouring country is better and move there permanently.

And the answer to the Op's question is, there is a procedure, meet the requirements to apply for an extension, and pay 1900 Baht. The Thais aren't forcing anyone to do anything, they issued the regulations, people should take them under consideration, just as they should before moving to any other foreign country.

The only problem I have with some of these types of complaints, is that some seem to infer that Thailand is the only country with such policies, they are not. Try doing something similar in another country and see how easy it is.

Edited October 14, 2010 by beechguy

[Paul888]

The thing I don't really understand about it is that you have to pay to go to Cambodia, Laos or Myanmar but you don't have to pay to re-enter Thailand, so Thailand has the admin but not the income.

[Rama]

hmmmm, so the USA an other countries who have the same requirement for getting a visa are just as illogical and stupid. It's not unique to Thailand.

[NanLaew]

Seems like a lot of 'experienced' travelers basing their judgement of Thailand's visa regulations on... Thailand's visa regulations.

It's all been explained but some people aren't taking it in; the MFA administers visa applications ie. those stamps and permissions that are required before one gets on the plane to come here. Visa extensions are handled by the Immigration ie. extensions, change of status, registration and revalidation once you have already clocked in. They do NOT have the remit to issue new visas despite appearing to be a 'no brainer' for those having issues with the rules and laws or being too lazy, cheap or dodgy to go and get a new visa.

There's not a lot of countries if any that issue a new visa without you having to leave the country so quit bashing the Thai system.

[nong38]

I am at aloss also as to why I cannot present myelf at the local immigration office and say hello here I am like another 90 days hers my non-0 multi entry visa, heres 500bts OK? As I said to a local Senator who came with me to clarify situation because Mae Sot was closed the thai office would be 500 bts up on the deal and save me going to Cambodia! Its the law apparently, ok then change the law and put some more cash into the local coffers, its a win win situation.

[Maestro]

Lopburi3 said it already and I repeat:

1. A visa is a permit to travel to Thailand. (This is the same for all countries in the world that have visa requirements)

2. The arrival stamp that the immigration officer puts in your passport when you arrive in Thailand is your permission to stay for the period indicated in the arrival stamp. This period of permission to stay can be extended if you meet the requirements for any of the multitude of reasons listed in Police Order 777/2551.

pepi2005, who started this topic, after reading the above-mentioned extension rules could you post specific information about the nature of your problem?

[moe666]

Its the usual carping, I am special I should not have to follow the rules, why am I inconvienced. Get over it boys or get out and go find that paradise on earth that allows you to stay forever without a visa.

[balo]

It's the same rules anywhere in the world , in most countries you can stay for 90 days .

[JimGant]

Especially if someone wants to apply for a 3 month or especially a business (Non-Imm), Education or spouse visa: why can't we do that right within the country?!

If you're otherwise qualified for a one-year extension of stay, you certainly can get a Non Imm visa in-country from Immigration, without the need to leave the country. And at 2000 baht, it's the same cost as a single entry Non Imm visa obtained in the States ($65). And, since some extensions require money in the bank for 3-months, Immigration has even reduced this to two months for first-time applicants to accommodate establishing and funding a bank account during the 3-month window provided by the in-country Non Imm visa.

Certainly doesn't preclude many situations requiring visa runs out of the country. But, it does show Immigration has been willing to implement policies to eliminate some unnecessary journeys out of Thailand, at least for those in long-stay situations.

[smiling mantis]

It isn't just the hassle we go through.

A visa run is basically about conveying a likely overweight expat the distance required to cross an international border, and back. Multiplied times the number of expats who stay long-term in Thailand on short-term visas and you're talking about a substantial carbon footprint.

Then there's the public health to consider. Every trip across the border is a potential vector for communicable disease. Is it wise to have policies that create unnecessary travel and thus increase the risk for contagion?

So what should the Thais do? Remember the Star Trek episode "A Taste of Armageddon"? This is the one where one side would launch a virtual attack against the other side, computers would tally what the probable body counts were, and randomly selected citizens are then asked to report to suicide booths in order so that the war remains virtual, the society and its infrastructure intact.

I propose virtual visa runs. You don't put the possibly overweight expats in a plane or a bus, you put them in a room. You have different rooms to virtualize different visa runs; say you do bus from BKK to Trat and then Koh Kong, well, there's a room for that that you have to stay in for however long that bus trip is. The visitor pays to Thailand the amount he'd otherwise pay for fare. Don't want to spend fourteen hours in a room? Then pay for a virtual plane trip to Singapore and cut it down to four or whatever. The Kingdom wins with better revenues, the environment wins with less fuel being used, public health is assisted by keeping the introductions to a bare minimum, and I think expats win because virtual buses and planes are never late, never crash, and you never have to deal with the crazy shit that goes on at the borders.

[lopburi3]

And, for the most part, that is all taken care of by immigration extensions of stay.

[jazzbo]

#11 There is also the chance that when on a visa trip, the person could decide that the neighboring country is better and move there permanently... and you are suggesting that the MoFA / Bureau of IMM has never considered this? ... as with tax laws, these regs are designed to encourage and/or discourage certain types of activity even if legal.

[gk10002000]

The question raised by the OP was not whether Thailand's rules and regulations were too strict compared to other countries, but why one can't extend or renew certain legitimate visas from within the country, at the same cost and under the same regulations, rather than having to leave the country.

It does seem strange to force people to spend time and money in a neighbouring country when they could be spending that money in Thailand. There is also the chance that when on a visa trip, the person could decide that the neighbouring country is better and move there permanently.

Yes. Leave the country and come back. Pay for an airline ticket. Pay for a bus ticket. Shop at the stations while waiting, buy food from the vendors etc. Somewhat similar to the logic of 15 days only for routine visa runs if doing by land or 30 days if doing via an airport. Curiously those happend in 2008 right about the time they shut down BKK airport. So now they induce you to do things to fix their problems.

[pepi2005]

To repeat it: it's not about the REQUIREMENT of having a valid visa!!! :jap: :jap: :jap:

In my case, I have a 1 year Non-Imm-B visa and a work permit, but still have to leave the country every 3 months.

As if this weren't enough, I have to leave the country for another time when the 1yr visa expires to apply (and hope for) a new one in a Thai embassy abroad.

It feels very stupid and annoying having to leave on a regalar basis, basically just to get a new stamp. Maybe I'm not intelligent enough, but why don't they allow a way to do that right within the country. They could still throw me out if they see a need to do so. They could still charge me their visa fees - but at least I and thousands of people in a similar situation would save valuable time of their lives, money, there would be a reduction in traffic, scams and many other negative impacts....

[lopburi3]

If you have a valid reason to stay there are extensions of stay available for most. You should only be on a visa entry temporarily and use extensions of stay if working here. The rules for extensions sometimes do not accommodate all, but that is another story and not a visa issue.

[digitalchromakey]

To repeat it: it's not about the REQUIREMENT of having a valid visa!!! :jap: :jap: :jap:

In my case, I have a 1 year Non-Imm-B visa and a work permit, but still have to leave the country every 3 months.

As if this weren't enough, I have to leave the country for another time when the 1yr visa expires to apply (and hope for) a new one in a Thai embassy abroad.

It feels very stupid and annoying having to leave on a regalar basis, basically just to get a new stamp. Maybe I'm not intelligent enough, but why don't they allow a way to do that right within the country. They could still throw me out if they see a need to do so. They could still charge me their visa fees - but at least I and thousands of people in a similar situation would save valuable time of their lives, money, there would be a reduction in traffic, scams and many other negative impacts....

If the company that employs you meets the criteria, then you can apply for a temporary extension of permission to stay at your local Immigration Dept under Royal Thai Police Headquarters no. 777/2551 dated on 25 November B.E.2551 Case 2.1 In the case of business such as employment with a company or partnership, etc.

Permission can be granted for a period of not more than 1 year at a time; then you only need to do 90 day reports at your local immigration office - no more border/visa runs.

[Soutpeel]

To repeat it: it's not about the REQUIREMENT of having a valid visa!!! :jap: :jap: :jap:

In my case, I have a 1 year Non-Imm-B visa and a work permit, but still have to leave the country every 3 months.

As if this weren't enough, I have to leave the country for another time when the 1yr visa expires to apply (and hope for) a new one in a Thai embassy abroad.

It feels very stupid and annoying having to leave on a regalar basis, basically just to get a new stamp. Maybe I'm not intelligent enough, but why don't they allow a way to do that right within the country. They could still throw me out if they see a need to do so. They could still charge me their visa fees - but at least I and thousands of people in a similar situation would save valuable time of their lives, money, there would be a reduction in traffic, scams and many other negative impacts....

If the company that employs you meets the criteria, then you can apply for a temporary extension of permission to stay at your local Immigration Dept under Royal Thai Police Headquarters no. 777/2551 dated on 25 November B.E.2551 Case 2.1 In the case of business such as employment with a company or partnership, etc.

Permission can be granted for a period of not more than 1 year at a time; then you only need to do 90 day reports at your local immigration office - no more border/visa runs.

Exactly.....based on other countries I have worked in, the process in Thailand is pretty simple and IMHO fair

[Boon Mee]

hmmmm, so the USA an other countries who have the same requirement for getting a visa are just as illogical and stupid. It's not unique to Thailand.

Got that right Don't know of any country on the planet (at least the ones I've lived in and worked) that don't require you to leave their shores once a year to get a work / residence visa. At least that's been the case with my 'Merkin Passport...

Edited October 18, 2010 by Boon Mee

[justcruisin]

A U.S friend of mine, applied for and recieved a 1 year non -o visa extension yesterday(18th) and with a 3 month extension all in one day.

The reason being that he will fly out prior to the expiration of the current 1 year visa(NON_O ).

I cannot undersatnd how they enabled an extension of 15 months,meaning a 1 year extension +a 3 month extension all in one day.

Oh and I nearly forgot, this was his first Retirement Visa extension.

Correct me if I am wrong but I have never heard of this before?