New Work Permit Requirements From The Labor Department

[Britannia]

"New applicants for work permits will now be required to provide proof of their Education Certificate (BA, BS, MA, MS, PhD) and a reference letter from the previous employer confirming employment."

As far as I know a degree has always been a requirement. At my old company there was a guy from NZ applying and being hired (this was about 3 years ago). He had to show a degree in order to get he work permit. He didnt have one so didnt get a work permit and couldnt take the job.

All jobs I have been working in in Thailand (3 different companies already) have required me to show my degree to get he work permit.

And finally, last time I got my work permit was the first time they didn't even accept my university transcript (which they have always accepted in the past), this was a couple months back (this year). They wanted to see the original degree (the real graduation paper document). This was a problem because I never picked this up when I finished university So I had to call to my university right inside the immigration and had somebody talk to the person at immigration to proof I have studied there. It worked out in the end but was quite scary. I was afraid it will not work. In the meantime I went back to my university and had the degree issued to me again. They were all laughing at me when they saw it took me over 7 years to pick it up since graduation

Anyway, just o share mu experience as I don't think the degree requirement is anything new.

I take it, it wasn't a degree in English

[pinball]

It has always been the case that if you say you have a degree then you must show it but, if you don't have a Degree or lost it,edu-form.pdf or you cannot obtain a copy the you fill in the attached form and all is well.

Hope this helps

Pinball

[robsamui]

From Sunbelt:

The Labor Department has instructed Sunbelt Asia lawyers that starting from today there are new requirements for all new applicants for work permits and also new criteria for existing work permit holders for renewals. They have issued new forms for work permit applications in several classes.

Could you point the way to the 'new criteria for WP renewals'? I have to go off for a new 12 month visa in 2 weeks.

Thanks

Rob

Edited June 22, 2011 by Maestro
Fixed quote tags.

[mitrapaap]

It's pretty obvious that they want us here if we can 'prove our worth' so to speak but don't want us here if we can't!! Also, maybe fewer people will bother to get a work permit and this will lead to extra 'revenue' to the usual suspects when finding Aliens working without said permit!!!

Thailand, still proving to be ultra Nationalistic, inward looking and backwards, just what one should expect from a 3rd world mentality with an old elite in control.

Before you lament over what you call the 3rd world mentality - spend a few thoughts on how it works in any of the 1st worlds. Can anybody just come and get a work permit without proving by any means that he is qualified for the job? If you apply for a job in your home country, do you mention your degree in your resume and attach some documents to it?

Some people bash on Thailand as a 3rd world country every and each time it makes a step closer to the first world.

[stacker10]

ok can any one from sunbelt explain more?its crazy to start a thread and not explain all. we all now dont know?i dont have any dergrees, but run business for 20years and planning to open business here in LOS but i getting more and more fed up with all this crackdown on this and that, what a f x ck going on?

[LivinLOS]

It's pretty obvious that they want us here if we can 'prove our worth' so to speak but don't want us here if we can't!! Also, maybe fewer people will bother to get a work permit and this will lead to extra 'revenue' to the usual suspects when finding Aliens working without said permit!!!

Thailand, still proving to be ultra Nationalistic, inward looking and backwards, just what one should expect from a 3rd world mentality with an old elite in control.

Before you lament over what you call the 3rd world mentality - spend a few thoughts on how it works in any of the 1st worlds. Can anybody just come and get a work permit without proving by any means that he is qualified for the job? If you apply for a job in your home country, do you mention your degree in your resume and attach some documents to it?

Some people bash on Thailand as a 3rd world country every and each time it makes a step closer to the first world.

The essential difference is the opportunities provided in the west.. Not only work, but medical, housing, benefits, pensions, care.. Etc..

Please explain what drain a westerner can be on the thai social systems ??

[bedouin1990]

You know-I am a Board Certified American Orthopedic Surgeon. A member of the American Academy of Orthopedic Surgeons. A former Associate Professor of my specialty at Texas A&M College of Medicine. I came here not just to retire but to work as a volunteer-no salary-with Thai surgeons. I wrote the Royal College Of Thai Orthopedic Surgeons twice, asking the proper way to apply. They did not write me back. I wrote the biggest hospital in Rayong, where I live, asking if there was any interest in my helping Thai doctors. That, too, went unanswered. Then I learn I must acquire a "Work Visa" just to work as a volunteer-for NO pay.

\

I did not come here to live just to drink, party, and screw the lovely ladies. But to be a contributing part of Thai life. I'll gladly try to learn the language, and respect the culture. To my mind, if you live in a country, you try to give some. But I have had nothing but trouble and resistance since I came just 3 months ago. I am strongly considering leaving and going to Mexico-where I speak the language. And at least when a Mexican f**ks you, he gives you the courtesy of a reach around!

[tingtongfarang]

It's pretty obvious that they want us here if we can 'prove our worth' so to speak but don't want us here if we can't!! Also, maybe fewer people will bother to get a work permit and this will lead to extra 'revenue' to the usual suspects when finding Aliens working without said permit!!!

Thailand, still proving to be ultra Nationalistic, inward looking and backwards, just what one should expect from a 3rd world mentality with an old elite in control.

Before you lament over what you call the 3rd world mentality - spend a few thoughts on how it works in any of the 1st worlds. Can anybody just come and get a work permit without proving by any means that he is qualified for the job? If you apply for a job in your home country, do you mention your degree in your resume and attach some documents to it?

Some people bash on Thailand as a 3rd world country every and each time it makes a step closer to the first world.

As a uk citizen i have had work permits in france, germany, switzerland, austria, I dont recall being asked for a degree in any of these countrys.

[HKTMAN]

So, now who will feed my thai wife and daughter because of I don't have a degree and if not allow to have work permit anymore?

[Footloose1949]

Not too sure what all the fuss is about, seems very reasonable to me; unless you are one of the people who suspect their cover is now going to be 'blown'.

I do wonder how many of those retiring here have done so because their pension 'buys' more in Thailand whilst in their own country, they would be visiting the nearest soup kitchen! Why after all should Thailand and other countries like it, should suffer the insult of multinationals who just want businesses here because their 1st-world companies & shareholders can make fatter profits here?

Maybe I'm just too cynical about the the whole situation?

[mitrapaap]

It's pretty obvious that they want us here if we can 'prove our worth' so to speak but don't want us here if we can't!! Also, maybe fewer people will bother to get a work permit and this will lead to extra 'revenue' to the usual suspects when finding Aliens working without said permit!!!

Thailand, still proving to be ultra Nationalistic, inward looking and backwards, just what one should expect from a 3rd world mentality with an old elite in control.

Before you lament over what you call the 3rd world mentality - spend a few thoughts on how it works in any of the 1st worlds. Can anybody just come and get a work permit without proving by any means that he is qualified for the job? If you apply for a job in your home country, do you mention your degree in your resume and attach some documents to it?

Some people bash on Thailand as a 3rd world country every and each time it makes a step closer to the first world.

The essential difference is the opportunities provided in the west.. Not only work, but medical, housing, benefits, pensions, care.. Etc..

Please explain what drain a westerner can be on the thai social systems ??

Two things: first, the "West" consists of a rich number of countries which handle the points you mention in very different ways. So there is no such thing as "in the West you get in the West you have...". Second, Thailand is not surrounded by the West or western countries, and not all rules and regulations primarily target westerners. But of course, the term foreigners includes all and therefore any rule valid for foreigners is valid for westerners and non-westerners.

Why should Thailand not have the right to ask for the qualification of people who will work in their country? After all every foreigner takes a job opportunity from a Thai. And for jobs unqualified people can do, there is really no need to hire foreigners - especially not westerners.

On the bottom line the equation is very simple. If you have a degree, you can get a job that requires a degree. If the job doesn't require a degree, Thais, even Thais with a degree, can do it for less than the westerner, or Thais without a degree can do it as well as somebody from a neighbouring country without a degree.

[TechnikaIII]

This whole thing is only valid for teachers, because there are too many Johnny Nobrains coming to Thailand because they can get a job here as an English teacher.

If you have the right qualifications, you won't have any problems.

Where in the report does it say that this only valid for teachers?

[Morse]

Well to me scaring the people of like this is a nice marketing way. It all depends a lot on the location where you are applying for your WP. I never had any problems and do not expect any problems.

If you want to know how it works, you must go there and find out by yourself. Just confront them. And yes sometimes you must pay but that is the way things are done here.

Same like when you want to marry in Thailand. I was advised by a legal firm in Bangkok that this is a huge procedure and very complicated and expensive and very this and very that.

I have done it myself and you know what ? It took me a 2 hours in Thailand and 30 minutes in my home country. Price of the procedure ? 250 bht. and in my home country 17.5 euro.

It all depends on where you go to apply for your documents. In Bangkok they are difficult because they just scare of the foreigners to get indeed pocket money. Have it done somewhere else outside Bangkok but go there yourself.

I am very sure that this new requirements are not even known by half of them. The guy that is doing my papers, always needs a manual beside him.

And another thing, when i was employing people at the time in Europe, you always had to give a copy of your degree and references and so on. What is the difference here ? Maybe because in the past too many applicants

have applied for something they were actually not qualified for. Some even had assistance of school principals to make false documents. Do you think that this would work in your home country ?

[MaiChai]

A degree doesn't prove anything other than you spent 3/5 years at college. It certainly doesn't make you qualified for any job. That you need experience, and possibly post graduate certifications in your area of expertise.

I would say anyone can get a degree, including the Rasta I used to live next to, who had rotted his brain away with weed (an Open University Degree at that). Backs up my argument. In all fairness the Rasta guy is a very nice person.

[ToffeEFCpower]

I've been looking for a job here for 10 years, still ain't found a company that can pay me enough lol

[atyclb]

I would imagine "New applicants for work permits will now be required to provide proof of their Education Certificate (BA, BS, MA, MS, PhD) and a reference letter from the previous employer confirming employment." is going to be a big problem for bar and restaurant owners who don't have a university education.

No true, they all have degrees of Nana, Pattaya and Patpong Universities; with honours may I add...

[LivinLOS]

Why should Thailand not have the right to ask for the qualification of people who will work in their country? After all every foreigner takes a job opportunity from a Thai. And for jobs unqualified people can do, there is really no need to hire foreigners - especially not westerners.

On the bottom line the equation is very simple. If you have a degree, you can get a job that requires a degree. If the job doesn't require a degree, Thais, even Thais with a degree, can do it for less than the westerner, or Thais without a degree can do it as well as somebody from a neighbouring country without a degree.

However your missing the foreign direct investment, and jobs for Thais created by owner operator setups. Your talking about 'jobs' as tho its all multinational salaried workers and seem to conveniently miss the (majority) of expats who create value by starting companies and employ Thais.. Many of which neither have nor need a degree to do what they do.

That investment now cannot be legally made.

[starguard69]

This whole thing is only valid for teachers, because there are too many Johnny Nobrains coming to Thailand because they can get a job here as an English teacher.

If you have the right qualifications, you won't have any problems.

Well, Let's see.. I'm a certified Band Director from the States... got an BM in Music, a Master's in Music Theory, and another Masters in Music/Multimedia Technology. I teach English.... at a Thai university . Does that make me a Johnny Nobrains????

While I'm at it, my previous employer was a Farang tirade that ran off all the qualified Farang teachers from one of the international schools ( including me). Why ON EARTH would I WANT to go back to him and ask for a reference letter?

[mitrapaap]

It's pretty obvious that they want us here if we can 'prove our worth' so to speak but don't want us here if we can't!! Also, maybe fewer people will bother to get a work permit and this will lead to extra 'revenue' to the usual suspects when finding Aliens working without said permit!!!

Thailand, still proving to be ultra Nationalistic, inward looking and backwards, just what one should expect from a 3rd world mentality with an old elite in control.

Before you lament over what you call the 3rd world mentality - spend a few thoughts on how it works in any of the 1st worlds. Can anybody just come and get a work permit without proving by any means that he is qualified for the job? If you apply for a job in your home country, do you mention your degree in your resume and attach some documents to it?

Some people bash on Thailand as a 3rd world country every and each time it makes a step closer to the first world.

As a uk citizen i have had work permits in france, germany, switzerland, austria, I dont recall being asked for a degree in any of these countrys.

The way you write it it sounds as if in those countries work permits can be obtained like bus tickets. But as citizen of the countries you mention I can guarantee it is not. I'm tempted to mention that the fact you don't recall... is not any proof that you or your employer did not have had to submit any documents showing that you had a degree. But I don't want to get in an argument with you about this.

[sfm]

I remember reading somewhere that the new Syphilis test that's going to be introduced is really a veiled test for HIV. I can't remember where I read it, maybe it was on here somewhere.

Could maybe make more sense.

While testing is Always Good [TM], why test coming employees for a disease that is very rare among people who'd apply for working permits, only transmits by very close contact and is easily curable, in primary stages with a single shot?

Keeping the DNA for a future register, maybe?

[Soutpeel]

It's pretty obvious that they want us here if we can 'prove our worth' so to speak but don't want us here if we can't!! Also, maybe fewer people will bother to get a work permit and this will lead to extra 'revenue' to the usual suspects when finding Aliens working without said permit!!!

Thailand, still proving to be ultra Nationalistic, inward looking and backwards, just what one should expect from a 3rd world mentality with an old elite in control.

Before you lament over what you call the 3rd world mentality - spend a few thoughts on how it works in any of the 1st worlds. Can anybody just come and get a work permit without proving by any means that he is qualified for the job? If you apply for a job in your home country, do you mention your degree in your resume and attach some documents to it?

Some people bash on Thailand as a 3rd world country every and each time it makes a step closer to the first world.

As a uk citizen i have had work permits in france, germany, switzerland, austria, I dont recall being asked for a degree in any of these countrys.

I really wish people would read what is written, there is no specific requirement for needing a degree to be issued a work permit, even the application forms attached to the original post do not talk about a degree, the only requirement is to state their highest educational level attained...

If a certain position requires a degree/references from previous employers, then of course the deptartment of immigration/labour have the right to ask for it., as they want to see if people applying for WP's have the qualifications and experience for the job, I suspect the foundation for these new requirements is targeted at the "English teachers" who are so prevelant in Thailand..

To quote the bard.....much ado about nothing.

[Ulysses G.]

Where in the report does it say that this only valid for teachers?

It doesn't, but that would be the most logical thing - of course logic is in short supply around these parts.

[ukrules]

I remember reading somewhere that the new Syphilis test that's going to be introduced is really a veiled test for HIV. I can't remember where I read it, maybe it was on here somewhere.

Could maybe make more sense.

While testing is Always Good [TM], why test coming employees for a disease that is very rare among people who'd apply for working permits, only transmits by very close contact and is easily curable, in primary stages with a single shot?

Keeping the DNA for a future register, maybe?

It's more sinister than that, people who are HIV+ can show up as a false positive for certain types of Syphilis.

[Morse]

ok can any one from sunbelt explain more?its crazy to start a thread and not explain all. we all now dont know?i dont have any dergrees, but run business for 20years and planning to open business here in LOS but i getting more and more fed up with all this crackdown on this and that, what a f x ck going on?

well I am glad that i am not the only one thinking like this. To me it is just a way to create stress on nonsens. The real message is :" to get your WP you must go to Sunbelt as the Labor Department told us in person how it all has to go from now on, and..... only to us he".

My advice, is that if you are applying for a job and you are qualified for it, than you can prove it and that doesn't change a thing. Indeed, when there is no qualification needed than there is no need to show. The PDF file that was given by one of the members is indeed most of the time the document to fill up. And with a little talk and a smile, a lot can still be obtained. That is at least my experience in the 15 years i am here.

Thailand is as good or bad as you make it yourself. We should get ridd of the idea that here in Thailand everything is possible as that is not also possible in your own country. The good people have to pay for the bad. One should attack those bad and bad only

[Soutpeel]

I remember reading somewhere that the new Syphilis test that's going to be introduced is really a veiled test for HIV. I can't remember where I read it, maybe it was on here somewhere.

Could maybe make more sense.

While testing is Always Good [TM], why test coming employees for a disease that is very rare among people who'd apply for working permits, only transmits by very close contact and is easily curable, in primary stages with a single shot?

Keeping the DNA for a future register, maybe?

If remeber correctly many years ago when I got my first WP, you were required to undergo both a syphilis and HIV test, so it would appear these are not "new "requirements, maybe have fallen by the wayside over the years and being reintroduced.

@ UKrules....how can a syphilis test be a "veiled" HIV test...its a different testing regime completely....

[Fishface]

If you have Syphilis you cant work?

Or do you have to leave the country, ---or you can not work but still stay in the country. Whats the difference?

They dropped the medical on the retirement visa because of this, you can come to Thailand if your sick,-- or well and can stay so whats the medical for?

We all know why,--its so they can find a problem that you can pay your way out of,--- you know,-- you've heard it before --- they look at you and shake thier head and say " I can help you"

PS --im not sick or anything.

[Geekfreaklover]

Nice bit of free publicity for sunbelt.

The size of the photograph required has changed.

You have always had to show your educational certificates to obtain a work permit. Even if you are the managing director in a Thai company. It's part of the paperwork. History of past employment has always been asked about. Nothing has changed as far as I can see - Apart from the size of the photo.

[angsta]

I remember reading somewhere that the new Syphilis test that's going to be introduced is really a veiled test for HIV. I can't remember where I read it, maybe it was on here somewhere.

Well why don't they just make it an aids test like the do in Korea for example? Why the veil?

[TechnikaIII]

Where in the report does it say that this only valid for teachers?

It doesn't, but that would be the most logical thing - of course logic is in short supply around these parts.

If it were in fact "the most logical thing" why is not mentioned in the report?

I am not the only one who would appreciate an answer to this. Have you noticed?

[Sateev]

Why should Thailand not have the right to ask for the qualification of people who will work in their country? After all every foreigner takes a job opportunity from a Thai. And for jobs unqualified people can do, there is really no need to hire foreigners - especially not westerners.

On the bottom line the equation is very simple. If you have a degree, you can get a job that requires a degree. If the job doesn't require a degree, Thais, even Thais with a degree, can do it for less than the westerner, or Thais without a degree can do it as well as somebody from a neighbouring country without a degree.

You obviously haven't hired, or even worked with many Thais, if you think you can make those assertions and comparisons.

I have managed Thais with Master's degrees, who couldn't find their asses with both hands AND their ass. Could they do my job? Not in this life.

Degreeism is rampant here, and like the above mentioned body part, everybody seems to have one and they all stink.

Asserting that they (Ministry of Labor) have the right to verify the foreigner's qualifications is saying that the business owner or the institution is not qualified to make that assessment. Give me a break...

Anyway, you can bet that the folie-a-deux of TV and the lawyers who spawned this thread are cashing in, at least until it is 'clarified' that this applies to teachers only, or people who only claim to be degrees.

Feh.