RickThai Posted September 7, 2011 Share Posted September 7, 2011 Forgive me if this has been covered ad nausium (sp), but is Thailand now issuing Thai citizenship to foreign men who are married to Thai women? I know in the past that only foreign women were being given Thai citizenship when they were married to Thai men. Thanks for any information. RickThai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
skippybangkok Posted September 7, 2011 Share Posted September 7, 2011 Nope Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Richard4849 Posted September 7, 2011 Share Posted September 7, 2011 It is possible to apply, but that does not mean you will receive. It is not a given, and I have not heard of anyone getting it on this basis alone so far. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mario2008 Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Yes, you can apply for Thai citizenship based on being married to a Thai national, both man and woman can now after 3 or 5 years (depening on if one has children). But there are additional requirements, such as income. More information here: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/post-a102367-Guidelines-for-Application-for-Natu.html http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/Story-Thai-Citizenship-Applicatio-t121353.html Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samran Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 you'll still need a minimum income and tax receipts from previous years, amongst other things. Having said that, if your application is accepted for processing (a good sign as they won't even accept your application if you don't meet the criteria), people married to Thai's do not need to sing the national anthem and the royal anthem, nor need to do an interview conducted in Thai. Take a stroll down to the police special branch office in Bangkok, across from Central World, and have a chat to the folk there. They are pretty helpful and will set you straight on the requirements. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoorSucker Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Take a stroll down to the police special branch office in Bangkok, across from Central World, and have a chat to the folk there. They are pretty helpful and will set you straight on the requirements. And please post them here, it's a long stroll for me..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samran Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Take a stroll down to the police special branch office in Bangkok, across from Central World, and have a chat to the folk there. They are pretty helpful and will set you straight on the requirements. And please post them here, it's a long stroll for me..... Mario has already posted them. But...as with all of these things, going down to get a clear understanding of exactly what is required is advisable. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beano2274 Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Is that the main Police Place that is next to the Skywalk? And do you know which building? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PoorSucker Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Mario has already posted them. But...as with all of these things, going down to get a clear understanding of exactly what is required is advisable. Correct, I thought the PR for five years requirement was dropped but it's still in the document Mario posted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWMcMurray Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Does anyone know if they are still advising that people must renounce their original nationality? This is the only catch for me.... I would apply in an instant if I could have dual nationality... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
beano2274 Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 For us Brits it is okay to have Thai and English, but for others am not so sure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lopburi3 Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 That is not the issue - Thailand has recently indicated it may require one nationality for those not obtaining Thai citizenship by birth and according to reports has tasked agencies to list anyone found to be in that position. I would think long and hard about any change to Thai citizenship under current flux if intending to keep former passport/citizenship. Believe there is more information in the pinned item on PR Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billd766 Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 It doesn't do me any good even though I have been married to my Thai wife for 11 years and we have a 7 year old son simply because I worked offshore for a lot of the time and paid no taxes in Thailand. Now I am retired and would love to pay tax on my pensions in Thailand but as they were earned through the UK based companies I HAVE to pay UK income tax and not income tax in Thailand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mario2008 Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Does anyone know if they are still advising that people must renounce their original nationality? This is the only catch for me.... I would apply in an instant if I could have dual nationality... The position doesn't seem to have changed recently. But currently it is more an intention that you renounce your old nationality than a requirement to actually do so. So if you want to apply, you miht want to do it now before the rules get even stricter. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mario2008 Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 It doesn't do me any good even though I have been married to my Thai wife for 11 years and we have a 7 year old son simply because I worked offshore for a lot of the time and paid no taxes in Thailand. Now I am retired and would love to pay tax on my pensions in Thailand but as they were earned through the UK based companies I HAVE to pay UK income tax and not income tax in Thailand. Paying taxes seems not to be enough. Working (with a work permit) seems also required, as part of being an asset to Thai society. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TexasRanger Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 What with Thailand being like this, and the hoops you need to jump through to get UK citizenship it is a pisser that you a couple who have been married for years can't live together easily despite having plenty of money. It makes my blood boil. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Felt 35 Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 part of being an asset to Thai society It’s funny; I mean how strong they believe in them self. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RickThai Posted September 8, 2011 Author Share Posted September 8, 2011 Thanks for all the info. I have been married to a Thai citizen for 36 years, and with my pensions, I will easily meet any income requirements. But like others, I am not willing to denounce my US citizenship for a country that appears to be so politically unstable. I wonder if Yingluck's goverment will make things better for expatriates or worse? Best regards to all, RickThai Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lazy Sod Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Take a stroll down to the police special branch office in Bangkok, across from Central World, and have a chat to the folk there. They are pretty helpful and will set you straight on the requirements. Do they speak English there or do they expect you to be fluent in Thai? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samran Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Thanks for all the info. I have been married to a Thai citizen for 36 years, and with my pensions, I will easily meet any income requirements. But like others, I am not willing to denounce my US citizenship for a country that appears to be so politically unstable. I wonder if Yingluck's goverment will make things better for expatriates or worse? Best regards to all, RickThai I think you should re-read the rules a little more closely, there is no requirement to renounce, though for some reason there is a silly rule that you must make a statement that you have the 'intention to renounce' your original citizenship. Entirely seperate things. You can still keep your original passport as there is no penalty for not following through with that intention to renounce. What the Thai side is doing is looking more closely at those who use their former nationality while in Thailand. There appears to be the expectation under the Thai Nationality Act that those who naturalise as Thai's should use their Thai citizenship. This can only really be enforced by the Thai side while the naturalised citizen is in Thailand. The practicality of this is that you use your Thai passport to enter and exit Thailand. Beyond that, Thailand has no juristiction. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
samran Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Take a stroll down to the police special branch office in Bangkok, across from Central World, and have a chat to the folk there. They are pretty helpful and will set you straight on the requirements. Do they speak English there or do they expect you to be fluent in Thai? I've only ever spoken Thai to them, but I seem to recall their English is reasonable. As for the requirements to be able to speak Thai...if married to a Thai, that isn't formally tested. My wife, who we are applying for, doesn't speak Thai particularly well but it looks like she'll eventually make it through. But in the circumstances of a foregin wife of a Thai citizen applying, it isn't the wife's bonafides who the authorities care about, it is the Thai husbands (ie mine). Even though it was an application for my wife, just about all the requirements related to me. MY income, MY profession, MY exception from military service, MY history of tax payments etc etc etc Under Thai law when it comes to spousal related immigration matters, it is always about the man. Always. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GuyDow Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Now I am retired and would love to pay tax on my pensions in Thailand but as they were earned through the UK based companies I HAVE to pay UK income tax and not income tax in Thailand. At one time I was advised that I could elect to pay taxes on my UK pensions in Thailand and then reclaim the taxes paid in the UK under the double taxation treaty between the UK and Thailand. This is possible because some jusrisdictions tax you on your worldwide income irrespective of its source. In the end I never really took this any further, it didn't make sense for me financially. But it might be worth investigating in your situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lopburi3 Posted September 8, 2011 Share Posted September 8, 2011 Actually from my reading of Thai tax law many years ago Thailand does indeed tax worldwide income (as the USA) but in practice only requires payment of tax for money brought into the country in the year earned (but that could change at any time without law change). But for many countries there are tax treaties in place that may specify how payments may (and/or must) be handled. Do not believe paying tax and not having a record of employment/work permits is going to be much of a positive (except perhaps to indicate you are desperate to obtain citizenship for some reason; which could be taken as good or bad). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CWMcMurray Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 I think you should re-read the rules a little more closely, there is no requirement to renounce, though for some reason there is a silly rule that you must make a statement that you have the 'intention to renounce' your original citizenship. Entirely seperate things. You can still keep your original passport as there is no penalty for not following through with that intention to renounce. What the Thai side is doing is looking more closely at those who use their former nationality while in Thailand. There appears to be the expectation under the Thai Nationality Act that those who naturalise as Thai's should use their Thai citizenship. This can only really be enforced by the Thai side while the naturalised citizen is in Thailand. The practicality of this is that you use your Thai passport to enter and exit Thailand. Beyond that, Thailand has no juristiction. Looks like I need to make a trip to the Special Branch... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
billd766 Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 Actually from my reading of Thai tax law many years ago Thailand does indeed tax worldwide income (as the USA) but in practice only requires payment of tax for money brought into the country in the year earned (but that could change at any time without law change). But for many countries there are tax treaties in place that may specify how payments may (and/or must) be handled. Do not believe paying tax and not having a record of employment/work permits is going to be much of a positive (except perhaps to indicate you are desperate to obtain citizenship for some reason; which could be taken as good or bad). I spoke to the UK tax people several years ago about this but they said that as my income was earned through UK based companies (plus the UK military and the state pension) that I could not transfer the payment of tax to another country (specifically Thailand) where I live. I also vaguely remember from a few years ago that Thailand and the UK have a no double taxation agreement which means that you are only taxed on your income in one country but YOU personally don't get to choose which one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Soutpeel Posted September 9, 2011 Share Posted September 9, 2011 Actually from my reading of Thai tax law many years ago Thailand does indeed tax worldwide income (as the USA) but in practice only requires payment of tax for money brought into the country in the year earned (but that could change at any time without law change). But for many countries there are tax treaties in place that may specify how payments may (and/or must) be handled. Do not believe paying tax and not having a record of employment/work permits is going to be much of a positive (except perhaps to indicate you are desperate to obtain citizenship for some reason; which could be taken as good or bad). I spoke to the UK tax people several years ago about this but they said that as my income was earned through UK based companies (plus the UK military and the state pension) that I could not transfer the payment of tax to another country (specifically Thailand) where I live. I also vaguely remember from a few years ago that Thailand and the UK have a no double taxation agreement which means that you are only taxed on your income in one country but YOU personally don't get to choose which one. If you have a UK sourced income....you are scr*wed, they will tax you in the UK, you dont have a choice and even if you did, HMRS will want to see proof that approriate tax has been paid in Thailand and if the amount was less than what you would be paying in the UK, The UK tax man will want the difference between the two amounts. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Travelish Posted September 11, 2011 Share Posted September 11, 2011 was n't double citizenship made legally about 10 years ago?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mario2008 Posted September 11, 2011 Share Posted September 11, 2011 was n't double citizenship made legally about 10 years ago?? It depends on the situation. If you have dual nationality by way of birt there is no problem. If you want to naturalize to Thai citizenship, it is a grey area if you can keep your original nationality or not. The Thai Interior Ministry's policy is that you cannot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
lopburi3 Posted September 11, 2011 Share Posted September 11, 2011 Dual citizenship is not legal by law in Thailand but, as is the case in USA, there is no law that prevents it. So you have views both ways but in effect it is allowed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djvolak Posted September 11, 2011 Share Posted September 11, 2011 Actually from my reading of Thai tax law many years ago Thailand does indeed tax worldwide income (as the USA) but in practice only requires payment of tax for money brought into the country in the year earned (but that could change at any time without law change). But for many countries there are tax treaties in place that may specify how payments may (and/or must) be handled. Do not believe paying tax and not having a record of employment/work permits is going to be much of a positive (except perhaps to indicate you are desperate to obtain citizenship for some reason; which could be taken as good or bad). I spoke to the UK tax people several years ago about this but they said that as my income was earned through UK based companies (plus the UK military and the state pension) that I could not transfer the payment of tax to another country (specifically Thailand) where I live. I also vaguely remember from a few years ago that Thailand and the UK have a no double taxation agreement which means that you are only taxed on your income in one country but YOU personally don't get to choose which one. Anyone know if the same applies to Americans? Guess I need to talk to my tax man. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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