Removal Of Don Muang Airport Big Bag Barriers Draws Condemnation

[JSixpack]

For God's sake just let it flow.

Hangin' from a pine tree by my knees

Sun is shinin' through the shade

Nobody knows what it's all about

It's too much, man, let it all hang out.

--The Hombres, "Let It All Hang Out"

[MaxYakov]

Gyus, could someone do me a favour and point me to the map of this BigBagBarrier please? Thai maps also OK.

I want to know its exact location and shape.

I have googled a bit but found nothing good enough. Thanks.

http://maps.google.f...275272,0.527687

Thanks, ExpatOilWorker, but that Google flood map won't do it. I'm also trying to get lat/lon posits on its corners/endpoints and the breach point(s). Dr. Seree's map (dark red) does help quite a bit. I would have helped more if I had used the English-language version of the map. Believe Don Muang airport is just below the southernmost nearly-horizontal segment in the light green area.

[Moruya]

Looks like protesters now at Rama 2.

The people are revolting

[webfact]

Angry Bangkok residents damage major floodwall

BANGKOK, November 14, 2011 (AFP) - Angry residents in inundated northern Bangkok have damaged a major floodwall, officials said Monday, amid growing frustration that parts of the city are suffering badly while the centre stays dry.

Around 100 protesters gathered at a section of a 15-kilometre (nine-mile) flood barrier in the district of Don Mueang on Sunday, removing small sandbags and damaging larger ones that were too heavy to move.

A local police chief told AFP that residents created a shallow seven-metre- (23-foot-) wide opening in the wall in recent days to relieve badly-flooded neighbourhoods, and on Sunday they managed to deepen the gap to around a metre.

Bangkok authorities are expected to repair the damage later on Monday, but demonstrators have threatened to expand their protest if that happens.

"(Residents) said yesterday if the government fixes it, they will block the toll road," a major route linking Bangkok to the north, police colonel Rangsan Praditphol said, adding that the situation was calm on Monday morning.

The floodwall is seen as a key defence preventing run-off waters from the north from swamping downtown Bangkok, which is home to the city's luxury hotels, office buildings and shopping malls.

Residents behind the wall say they have been struggling to cope with waist-deep water for up to a month.

Thailand's worst floods in half a century, triggered by months of unusually heavy monsoon rains, have left at least 562 people dead around the kingdom and damaged millions of homes and livelihoods.

The waters have also swamped Bangkok's number two airport Don Mueang, which mostly serves domestic destinations, forcing its closure in late October.

The kingdom's main air gateway Suvarnabhumi, east of the city centre, is operating as normal.

-- (c) Copyright AFP 2011-11-14

[animatic]

...or these morons breaking down water barriers ...

Those 'morons' have had several weeks now living in meters of brackish disgusting water. Yingluck proclaiming victory that Bangkok stayed dry infuriated them.

Most people that are posting for the greater good have no idea what it is to be flooded. They post from their dry houses and condo's. They tell others to suffer for them without offering them compensation.

The greater good according to them is let others suffer for them and offer them a pittance to do so. If they really want to stay dry let them offer real compensation. The people over there clearly suffer extra to keep BKK dry. There is a direct relation between the two.

Not really so at all. I've been in several serious floods since moving here.

Your blanket assumption that some one is NOT flooded now means they don't understand is spurious.

I didn't like being flooded before but realized that the water can only be controlled so much, and some things MUST be protected, because they can make MY areas recover faster. The demands of the big picture is more important in extended close proximity societies, even if you don't like the little picture in your life

[animatic]

"There's no business going on now"

What a ridiculous statement.

[sparebox2]

Angry Bangkok residents damage major floodwall

BANGKOK, November 14, 2011 (AFP) - Angry residents in inundated northern Bangkok have damaged a major floodwall, officials said Monday, amid growing frustration that parts of the city are suffering badly while the centre stays dry.

...

"(Residents) said yesterday if the government fixes it, they will block the toll road," a major route linking Bangkok to the north, police colonel Rangsan Praditphol said, adding that the situation was calm on Monday morning.

...

-- (c) Copyright AFP 2011-11-14

Too late. Perhaps they (the rural poor farmers outside BKK) did not realise that there is NO toll road anymore left in BKK. All roads are now FREE.

[alexakap]

Not really so at all. I've been in several serious floods since moving here.

Your blanket assumption that some one is NOT flooded now means they don't understand is spurious.

I didn't like being flooded before but realized that the water can only be controlled so much, and some things MUST be protected, because they can make MY areas recover faster. The demands of the big picture is more important in extended close proximity societies, even if you don't like the little picture in your life

You are full of high words.

Now, let's back to business:

1. Should we all die here, protecting "the bigger image"? Those hotels/malls could be rebuilt, people's lives will be not.

2. What those autorities do to protect ME the way they protect "the image"? Any big bag barrier around my house\moobaan\province?

3. What have you (personally) done so far to protect "the bigger image"?

4. Will YOU (personally) compensate ME (personally) protecting "the bigger" image on your behalf (as you are dry now, and wanting stay dry - and I am a chest-level of this shit)? I am sorry, those 5K is NOTHING AT ALL (see p.2 above).

Im not gonna protect even a stinky klong for 150 USD by the price of my own house.

[eezergood]

I suspect this could be the, inevitable, flare for some ugly violence

[alexakap]

Angry Bangkok residents damage major floodwall

BANGKOK, November 14, 2011 (AFP) - Angry residents in inundated northern Bangkok have damaged a major floodwall, officials said Monday, amid growing frustration that parts of the city are suffering badly while the centre stays dry.

...

"(Residents) said yesterday if the government fixes it, they will block the toll road," a major route linking Bangkok to the north, police colonel Rangsan Praditphol said, adding that the situation was calm on Monday morning.

...

-- (c) Copyright AFP 2011-11-14

Too late. Perhaps they (the rural poor farmers outside BKK) did not realise that there is NO toll road anymore left in BKK. All roads are now FREE.

Is this making any difference?

Try to go to those "free" roads and notice the traffic. Those are the only roads connecting a few parts of the city - other (lower) roads just impassable.

Blocking tollways will paralize the rest of [still moving] Bangkok.

[Buchholz]

Angry Bangkok residents damage major floodwall

A local police chief told AFP that residents created a shallow seven-metre- (23-foot-) wide opening in the wall in recent days to relieve badly-flooded neighbourhoods, and on Sunday they managed to deepen the gap to around a metre.

I suspect this could be the, inevitable, flare for some ugly violence

Do police still have the Chinese-made exploding tear gas grenades they could use with these protesters?

.

[Thaifever]

Not really so at all. I've been in several serious floods since moving here.

Your blanket assumption that some one is NOT flooded now means they don't understand is spurious.

I didn't like being flooded before but realized that the water can only be controlled so much, and some things MUST be protected, because they can make MY areas recover faster. The demands of the big picture is more important in extended close proximity societies, even if you don't like the little picture in your life

You are full of high words.

Now, let's back to business:

1. Should we all die here, protecting "the bigger image"? Those hotels/malls could be rebuilt, people's lives will be not.

2. What those autorities do to protect ME the way they protect "the image"? Any big bag barrier around my house\moobaan\province?

3. Will YOU (personally) compensate ME (personally) protecting "the bigger" image on your behalf (as you are dry now, and wanting stay dry - and I am a chest-level of this shit)? I am sorry, those 5K is NOTHING AT ALL (see p.2 above).

Im not gonna protect even a stinky klong for 150 USD by the price of my own house.

I'm not in a dry zone, it's <deleted> outside my place but I don't see the wisdom in ripping out the big bags and inundating inner Bangkok infrastructure. There are dry places in Thailand to go and the if the angry people can't afford to go to them, or don't have family or friends to stay with, the government has set up temporary shelters. There is no excuse to be making problems in flood stricken areas. The government hasn't handled the floods well and has had bad communication with the people, but still, don't take matters into your own hands. Again, "The demands of the big picture is more important in extended close proximity societies, even if you don't like the little picture in your life".

[eezergood]

Angry Bangkok residents damage major floodwall

A local police chief told AFP that residents created a shallow seven-metre- (23-foot-) wide opening in the wall in recent days to relieve badly-flooded neighbourhoods, and on Sunday they managed to deepen the gap to around a metre.

I suspect this could be the, inevitable, flare for some ugly violence

Do police still have the Chinese-made exploding tear gas grenades they could use with these protesters?

.

That should do wonders to quell the, already, agitated masses

[alexakap]

Not really so at all. I've been in several serious floods since moving here.

Your blanket assumption that some one is NOT flooded now means they don't understand is spurious.

I didn't like being flooded before but realized that the water can only be controlled so much, and some things MUST be protected, because they can make MY areas recover faster. The demands of the big picture is more important in extended close proximity societies, even if you don't like the little picture in your life

You are full of high words.

Now, let's back to business:

1. Should we all die here, protecting "the bigger image"? Those hotels/malls could be rebuilt, people's lives will be not.

2. What those autorities do to protect ME the way they protect "the image"? Any big bag barrier around my house\moobaan\province?

3. Will YOU (personally) compensate ME (personally) protecting "the bigger" image on your behalf (as you are dry now, and wanting stay dry - and I am a chest-level of this shit)? I am sorry, those 5K is NOTHING AT ALL (see p.2 above).

Im not gonna protect even a stinky klong for 150 USD by the price of my own house.

I'm not in a dry zone, it's <deleted> outside my place

The questions were adressed not to you then.

but I don't see the wisdom in ripping out the big bags

It is another story.

What those guys doing out there - is just to try to ACT ANYTHING instead of those in charge who just swamped them and nothing more than just that.

I also can't say that tearing the big bags would help alot. But those are trying, just TRYING to move water out (as govt is doing NOTHING for a month).

What I can say is that I am sick of reading those high words from the dry side. No problem of being swamped a little longer, IF THIS WOULD BE COMPENSATED by something more valuable that the words or 5K/family. If nothing else is offered - then those "big picture lovers" better have their next cold beer, this will keep their hands/mouths busy for a while and not posting more s_hit here and insult those at the wet side.

[Ijustwannateach]

As far as I can tell, there is no great evidence that letting floods into inner Bangkok will actually provide much relief for other zones, except for a spiteful, childish 'now how do you like it' sense of revenge. Which will be short-lived when the number of refugees multiplies exponentially, with even less of a dry base from which any remaining helpful types can get any work done.

It is my understanding that Bangkok is like a 'dimple' even lower than surrounding lands- the pumps are there even on a normal basis to keep it dry. In other words, letting a bit of water in will flood Bangkok without providing any significant relief to anyone else (and the pumps will still be used to pump the water back out).

My home is dry, but if there's any sign of flooding creeping much further, I'll be one of the first out of the city; however, the poor don't have the choices I do. Those are the people you folks who're calling for inner Bangkok to be flooded are talking about hurting. Grow up!

[tominbkk]

I'm not in a dry zone, it's <deleted> outside my place but I don't see the wisdom in ripping out the big bags and inundating inner Bangkok infrastructure. There are dry places in Thailand to go and the if the angry people can't afford to go to them, or don't have family or friends to stay with, the government has set up temporary shelters. There is no excuse to be making problems in flood stricken areas. The government hasn't handled the floods well and has had bad communication with the people, but still, don't take matters into your own hands. Again, "The demands of the big picture is more important in extended close proximity societies, even if you don't like the little picture in your life".

These people in the North feel s_hit upon, and quite literally are made to swim in it so Gaysorn Plaza can keep on selling Gucci and YSL. They hear and see Yingluck and Sukhumbund on TV celebrating and patting themselves on their own backs for keeping the flood out of Sukhumvit and Sathorn. They rejoice that they have kept inner Bangkok dry. They offer the people who have sacrificed their homes and lives a meager 5000 Baht for their sacrifice, feeling good about themselves as they stroll through Paragon and Emporium.

And you wonder why these people forced to stew in a sea of human feces for weeks on end so hi so mamas and big so daddies can keep their toes dry are angry?

[MikeyIdea]

I wonder if those now calling to break the barriers to their South were also calling to break the barriers to their North before they were flooded. I mean, the point is letting the water flow as freely as possible, no?

I wasn't calling at all at that time because i had no idea what was coming thanks to the government. But yes barriers that cause others to flood longer should have been torn down.

Its just totally unfair to sacrifice people without real compensation.

Id say live a week in a really flooded area (1,5m) and then come back and post on the forum.

I am one of the "lucky" ones, had only 70 cm in my streets and 20 in the house.

Rob, I took my daughter on an educational trip through flooded Thailand this weekend. Here's part of the traffic report;

... Had to turn left toward Lopburi 15 km before hitting sai Asia as a bridge ahead was closed due to flood damage. No flooding yet but a right turn onto 3028 taking me out on sai Asia South of Singburi took me straight through affected areas. Lot's of people camping out on the roads, huge lakes as far as the eye could see, saw people wading in chest high water, unpleasant smell all around. The administration seem to have done something good up there because I saw drinking water tanks on the road every km or closer even

The government needs to spend money to build up again. 40% of GDP in Thailand and more than 40% of the net income the government has comes from Bangkok. I find it very selfish to sacrifice the governments ability to help building up the lives of the people in the enormous flood damaged areas to do what? Help a group of people north of the barrier? I also find it childish to think that compensation will happen to the same extent if the governments income is reduced drastically. GDP shrinking is really hurting the poor in this country more than any other group

I taught my 7 year old daughter to understand the importance of the broader picture, in fact, she probably understands it better than the people living north of the barrier now. I told her about all the schools that needed to be repaired (we past a few of them), all the new books and materials needed

It's a sad fact of live but it is still a fact, MONEY decides what must be done, hence, the big bag barrier must stay, it's height managed considering the greater good of this country, not a bunch of people living to the north of it

It's not that - I'm wet too but you are more wet than I am Rob, that's just childish reasoning. It's for the greater good for this country, especially for the poor, like it or not

[Buchholz]

R @Kang_NT: Dr Anon of FROC's drainage team urges Don Muang residents to be patient

Arrrggghhh.........Same s_hit, another day...."be patient"......

Today, it's back to Yingluck's turn

Thai PM urges those in flooded areas to be patient

Thailand's prime minister is urging people in flooded areas to be patient because the government is working as hard as it can to drain the water.

Prime Minister Yingluck Shinawatra said Monday the flooding situation that has plagued the country since late July is improving as waters recede. However, she noted that water spreading across western Bangkok could drain more slowly than in other areas of the capital.

She urged people to "tolerate the flooding situation and turn unity into power to struggle through the crisis." Yingluck made the comments on her Facebook page.

Continues:

http://www.goerie.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20111114/API/1111140518

-- (c) Associated Press 39 minutes ago

[Lite Beer]

100 police officers deployed to protect Don Mueang big-bag wall

The Metropolitan Police Bureau deployed 100 policemen to guard the big-bag floodwall in Don Mueang following a threat by local residents to demolish it later in the day.

Pol Lt Gen Winai Thongsong, acting metropolitan police chief, said 100 policemen had been deployed to guard the floodwall and 100 other officers were on standby to provide reinforcement if local residents tried to demolish the wall.

-- The Nation 2011-11-14

[eezergood]

100 police officers deployed to protect Don Mueang big-bag wall

The Metropolitan Police Bureau deployed 100 policemen to guard the big-bag floodwall in Don Mueang following a threat by local residents to demolish it later in the day.

Pol Lt Gen Winai Thongsong, acting metropolitan police chief, said 100 policemen had been deployed to guard the floodwall and 100 other officers were on standby to provide reinforcement if local residents tried to demolish the wall.

-- The Nation 2011-11-14

Its been a while since we had a coup!

[frodo]

It looks as though Hosakul is doing a Thaksin now. The other online source states that Karun is seeing yesterdays event as a political setup in that he only knew a few dozen of the people. Much like Thaksin's remark about the red shirts..."I don't know these people."

Even though the citizens state Hosakul was behind it, even though a radio station in Don Mueang stated yesterday that Hosakul obtained permission from FROC to knock the barriers down, and a TV member saw him whipping them into frenzy, it was a political setup...again, he didn't know all those people.

[ExpatOilWorker]

Would it be possible to open the BBB just enough to flood Ramkhamhaeng University, but leave Sukhumvit dry?

Then all the cute uni student could seek refuge and even a small profit at Sukhumvit.

[alexakap]

My home is dry, but if there's any sign of flooding creeping much further, I'll be one of the first out of the city; however, the poor don't have the choices I do. Those are the people you folks who're calling for inner Bangkok to be flooded are talking about hurting. Grow up!

I see noone here calling for "Let's flood Bangkok!"

I see many who's calling for move water from their own houses. Most of'em not in Bkk at all.

How to move water from ones effectively without swamping others? Ask FROC/Seri/Anon/YS, those are highly graduated professionals with loads of pumps, funds, laws, tax moneys, boats, burberries, mambas and other flood-related things. If THEY (not us, but THEY) decide to flood Bkk - it will be their professional decision. They are there for make decisions and to ACT.

Here, they already decided to swamp for 1 month. THEY, not us.

PS: how many pumps are located at the PM's house alone? I can count something about 7. And how sandbags (with BMA's stams on'em - meant, those were bought on my tax money too). And now - how many dedicated pumps and free sandbags were installed FOC at the poor Somchai's house just across my or your soi? I'll let you walk and count by yourself....

[Lite Beer]

1.36pm: BKK governor Sukhumphand inspects the Don Mueang big bags: http://t.co/7xfkqgaI by @tanatpong_nna/via@tukky_nt

Rama 2 residents end roadblock after BMA agrees to install more pumps to drain out water. bkkpost reports/TAN_Network

1:44pm office of Drainage: Big Bag dismantled resulting in higher water level in PremPrachakorn canal.~@fm91trafficpro/via@TulipOum

[alexakap]

1.36pm: BKK governor Sukhumphand inspects the Don Mueang big bags: http://t.co/7xfkqgaI by @tanatpong_nna/via@tukky_nt

Ok, they (nice white shirts!) have it well inspected.

They also inspected it a few days before. And also before, and even more before that. And a day prior to that...

WHAT'S NEXT?

Will they inspect it tomorrow? How helpful...

PS: I also want to inspect that wearing white shirt. But...I have no clean water to wash it, and I have no electricity to iron it. All I can afford is a smelly t-shirt I use daily to walk in da waters while catching some greedy boaters.

[eezergood]

Would it be possible to open the BBB just enough to flood Ramkhamhaeng University, but leave Sukhumvit dry?

Then all the cute uni student could seek refuge and even a small profit at Sukhumvit.

The best idea so far!

[Buchholz]

It looks as though Hosakul is doing a Thaksin now. The other online source states that Karun is seeing yesterdays event as a political setup in that he only knew a few dozen of the people. Much like Thaksin's remark about the red shirts..."I don't know these people."

Even though the citizens state Hosakul was behind it, even though a radio station in Don Mueang stated yesterday that Hosakul obtained permission from FROC to knock the barriers down, and a TV member saw him whipping them into frenzy, it was a political setup...again, he didn't know all those people.

Karun's ability to identify all 170,000 of his constituents is most impressive.

There are 375 constituencies in Thailand, each representing roughly 170,000 people.

http://asiapacific.anu.edu.au/newmandala/2011/05/30/thailands-electoral-rules/

[Lite Beer]

Interior Minister Yongyuth has defended Karun, saying all PT MPs have discipline./via@tulsathit

[webfact]

2pm:An aerial view of the demolish Don Mueang big bag barrier:http://t.co/67p2eWzb by @nationphoto/via@tukky_nt

[Moruya]

Interior Minister Yongyuth has defended Karun, saying all PT MPs have discipline./via@tulsathit

When clowns like Doo Yen start talking about discipline you wonder where the sanity is in this government.