Morning On The Bts

[Dubarry]

I travel every morning on the BTS and have been observing the behavors of people who are lucky to have a seat. There is a certain etiquette in the way they act. First of all they have to look angry for some reason and always have their heads pointing downwards, especially if an old person or a one legged person stands near. They inevitably keep their eyes closed as if they are asleep and only open them before alightning. It's hilarious at times to see eldery ladies standing as close as possible to these zombies without any acknowledgement. When the old ladies finally get their just desserts and are sitting they let out a quite sigh, and look around with a pained expression as if to say" I really deserved to get this seat earlier".

Then on the other hand we have the fat 12 year old boy arriving and 2 or 3 people jump up to give him their seat. He plops down without even a hint of thanks. I can slightly understand giving up a seat to a very small child but............. In other countries children are encouraged to give their seat to their elders.

As this post seems to have turned into a rant I'll pose a last question- Why can Mothers not put toddlers on their laps instead of taking up 2 seats?

[Semper]

Then on the other hand we have the fat 12 year old boy arriving and 2 or 3 people jump up to give him their seat. He plops down without even a hint of thanks. I can slightly understand giving up a seat to a very small child but............. In other countries children are encouraged to give their seat to their elders.

As this post seems to have turned into a rant I'll pose a last question- Why can Mothers not put toddlers on their laps instead of taking up 2 seats?

Well, this is the "new generation of Thais", sad really. Guess that the best thing to do is just ignore it.

[jybkk]

I agree that giving your seat to kids is pretty useless.

I've been working with young ones for a while, and one thing they don't seem to care about is being seated.

Of course, there are exceptions where they happen to be exhausted because they walked too much, but how many times does this happen? Thai parents don't like to walk at all anyway.

But thai people love kids. Western parents are sometimes being blamed for being overprotective, my impression is that here is worse.

[Dubarry]

I feel sorry for the fathers who bring young kids on to the BTS and fail to procure a seat for their offspring. The kids don't say it but the overall impression is that they've failed as a parent and cannot even provide for their basic needs..........................

[tw25rw]

I find it very annoying to offer my seat to someone I think needs and and they gesture for their kid to sit down. I just sit down again if they don't want it.

[JimmyTheMook]

Fat kid never gets my seat.

[tombkk]

I feel sorry for the fathers who bring young kids on to the BTS and fail to procure a seat for their offspring. The kids don't say it but the overall impression is that they've failed as a parent and cannot even provide for their basic needs..........................

Personally, I don't think a seat is a child's basic "need". It may be a major "want" though.

I too am surprised that grown-ups are supposed to give up their seats for children in Thailand. It appears to be the culture, and when in Rome (or Bangkok) do as the locals. Who am I to question their priorities?

[djayz]

Next time you take the BTS just read a book or magazine.

[ETatBKK]

I had exactly the same discussion with my Thai friend who brings her 6 years old boy in BTS. people offered seat ? she said people show caring to the kid.

I was in Hong Kong and in Japan. parents tend to 'train' their kids standing for a reasonable distance. parents said the kids need to learn and to behave in the metro.

just a different thought !

[LuckyLew]

I think it is disgustung when young people do not give there seats up

to an elderly person. Youth of Thailand are clueless and have no respect

or many things. They are too busy on MSN and FB to care about much else

[Gone]

They have signs on seats saying please give your seat up for the Monks who rarely take them anyways. That is nice but should also have one for the elderly. I would always give up a seat to the elderly but never to a kid.

[Nisa]

I ride a lot and have never witnessed anyone giving up their seat to a 12-year old let alone doing this but not providing a seat for the elderly. Certainly anything is possible and can happen but clearly we all know this is very very far from the norm ... extremely far from the norm.

I also believe the overwhelming vast majorities of Thais understand that giving up your seat to a child is a safety issue and applies to very small children or babies that are incapable of holding on safely or whose parent cannot hold on safely while holding the child.

Lastly, I have never once not seen an older person be offered a seat while on the subway. I've seen it take a moment to get the older person'a attention to let them know somebody is willing to provide them a seat but have NEVER seen somebody not give up their seat to an older person, pregnant women, monk or somebody with a baby.

There are rude and inconsiderate people in every city and nation but again, have never witnessed any of these folks in Bangkok not be offered a seat and it is almost always a young male who is the first to offer ... especially when it is an older person or pregnant women.

Edited February 20, 2012 by Nisa

[impulse]

Honestly, I'm pleased with the manners on the BTS and MRT. In my last Asian country, gangs of teenie boppers would virtually trample the elderly to get to the seats first.

I'm old enough that people have often offered me their seat on the BTS and MRT- something that never happened in that other country.

No need to name that country as this post isn't about the bad behavior- just that I'm quite pleased with manners on mass transit here in Bangkok.

Edited February 20, 2012 by impulse

[Tropicalevo]

I read that the reason for giving young children the seat is "protecting their investment'. The seats are deemed safer than standing. Most Thais sees children as the investment for their future (to look after the old ones in their golden years.)

It is usually the older Thais that do this - the younger ones do not give a monkeys (unless they have been tought manners).

[Nisa]

They have signs on seats saying please give your seat up for the Monks who rarely take them anyways. That is nice but should also have one for the elderly. I would always give up a seat to the elderly but never to a kid.

That same sign includes giving up your seat to "those in need"

Edited February 21, 2012 by Nisa

[bendix]

Not sure what the point of this thread is. If it's to highlight rude behaviour on a city's subway system, how is it any different in Bangkok than in pretty much every city in the world.

Has anybody ridden on the London Underground lately, with it graffiti and gratuitous violence, particularly in the evenings. Or the mass drunkeness and football hooligans at the weekend?

Or Paris with its beggars?

The BTS and MRT are a joy compared to those experiences.

[brewsterbudgen]

Not sure what the point of this thread is. If it's to highlight rude behaviour on a city's subway system, how is it any different in Bangkok than in pretty much every city in the world.

Has anybody ridden on the London Underground lately, with it graffiti and gratuitous violence, particularly in the evenings. Or the mass drunkeness and football hooligans at the weekend?

Or Paris with its beggars?

The BTS and MRT are a joy compared to those experiences.

Exactly. The politeness of Thais using the BTS is a joy to behold and makes using it generally a pleasant experience. Except at 8.30am when trying to board an overcrowded train at Phra Khanong, when western aggressiveness is required to get on!

[lomatopo]

Honestly, I'm pleased with the manners on the BTS and MRT. In my last Asian country, gangs of teenie boppers would virtually trample the elderly to get to the seats first.

I'm old enough that people have often offered me their seat on the BTS and MRT- something that never happened in that other country.

No need to name that country as this post isn't about the bad behavior- just that I'm quite pleased with manners on mass transit here in Bangkok.

I agree. I often see younger people get up to allow an older person to sit. I don't even bother sitting, I often board at Udom Suk in-bound, even though there are seats as I'm just going to end up offering to someone else, and instead opt for a "corner position".

My pet-peeves:

foreigners with immense back-packs which they keep on and then wipe out several people by turning around in a packed car.

everyone who stands on the platform right in front of the doors, instead of to the side.

And I agree it's silly to proffer a seat to all but the youngest, say 4 years or less, children

[PattayaParent]

Not sure what the point of this thread is. If it's to highlight rude behaviour on a city's subway system, how is it any different in Bangkok than in pretty much every city in the world.

Has anybody ridden on the London Underground lately, with it graffiti and gratuitous violence, particularly in the evenings. Or the mass drunkeness and football hooligans at the weekend?

Or Paris with its beggars?

The BTS and MRT are a joy compared to those experiences.

It's only rude behaviour in western eyes. It's a cultural thiing for the Thais to give up seats to the young, as opposed to the elderly, and is considered polite here.

People young, old and in between always give up their seats to my 7 year old on the skytrain or bus in Bangkok.

[tw25rw]

I read that the reason for giving young children the seat is "protecting their investment'. The seats are deemed safer than standing. Most Thais sees children as the investment for their future (to look after the old ones in their golden years.)

It is usually the older Thais that do this - the younger ones do not give a monkeys (unless they have been tought manners).

I don't see how giving a kid a seat is good manners. I'll give a seat to the mum and she can put the kid in her lap, but no way will I surrender a seat to a kid unless he/she is disabled in some way.

[montrii]

They have signs on seats saying please give your seat up for the Monks who rarely take them anyways. That is nice but should also have one for the elderly. I would always give up a seat to the elderly but never to a kid.

Actually the signs do say to give up your seat to the elderly (คนชรา). I agree about the kids, and have thought this before, but a bigger complaint is that BTS, which has space enough in the station for at least two more cars per train, isn't adding cars. At rush hour it's getting ridiculous, almost worse than NY or London, and noticeably worse each year. I wonder if they're giving any thought to this at all.

[tombkk]

I agree. I often see younger people get up to allow an older person to sit. I don't even bother sitting, I often board at Udom Suk in-bound, even though there are seats as I'm just going to end up offering to someone else, and instead opt for a "corner position".

My pet-peeves:

foreigners with immense back-packs which they keep on and then wipe out several people by turning around in a packed car.

everyone who stands on the platform right in front of the doors, instead of to the side.

And I agree it's silly to proffer a seat to all but the youngest, say 4 years or less, children

Yes, people standing in front of the doors and trying to get in before letting other get out is also one of my pet peeves. I haven't taken a subway in NY, London or Paris, but as somebody mentioned, is it any better there?

[Lakegeneve]

They have signs on seats saying please give your seat up for the Monks who rarely take them anyways. That is nice but should also have one for the elderly. I would always give up a seat to the elderly but never to a kid.

Actually the signs do say to give up your seat to the elderly (คนชรา). I agree about the kids, and have thought this before, but a bigger complaint is that BTS, which has space enough in the station for at least two more cars per train, isn't adding cars. At rush hour it's getting ridiculous, almost worse than NY or London, and noticeably worse each year. I wonder if they're giving any thought to this at all.

See post #148, http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/495699-longer-trains-desperately-needed-on-the-bts-sukhumvit-line/page__hl__bts%20carriages__st__125

Note: delivery will now be late 2012.

[Nisa]

They have signs on seats saying please give your seat up for the Monks who rarely take them anyways. That is nice but should also have one for the elderly. I would always give up a seat to the elderly but never to a kid.

Actually the signs do say to give up your seat to the elderly (คนชรา). I agree about the kids, and have thought this before, but a bigger complaint is that BTS, which has space enough in the station for at least two more cars per train, isn't adding cars. At rush hour it's getting ridiculous, almost worse than NY or London, and noticeably worse each year. I wonder if they're giving any thought to this at all.

The MRT is the same in terms of room for more trains and I wondered the same thing. But then I remember reading a story somewhere here last year that explained why they haven't. I can't recall if they had more trains on order to do this or it was something about safety and needed to upgrade the braking systems or something like that ... bottom line is there was a reason but if I recall it was an unexpected or ill planning issue.

[Lakegeneve]

They have signs on seats saying please give your seat up for the Monks who rarely take them anyways. That is nice but should also have one for the elderly. I would always give up a seat to the elderly but never to a kid.

Actually the signs do say to give up your seat to the elderly (คนชรา). I agree about the kids, and have thought this before, but a bigger complaint is that BTS, which has space enough in the station for at least two more cars per train, isn't adding cars. At rush hour it's getting ridiculous, almost worse than NY or London, and noticeably worse each year. I wonder if they're giving any thought to this at all.

The MRT is the same in terms of room for more trains and I wondered the same thing. But then I remember reading a story somewhere here last year that explained why they haven't. I can't recall if they had more trains on order to do this or it was something about safety and needed to upgrade the braking systems or something like that ... bottom line is there was a reason but if I recall it was an unexpected or ill planning issue.

Nothing to do with safety and all to do with private operators having debts and not enough funds to purchase more rolling stock. It is explained in post #121 on this thread, http://www.thaivisa....00#entry4650940

In short, if you are feeling the squeeze on the BTS, MRT or Cityline it is due to all 3 operators not having enough funds to purchase new stock. It highlights why having multiple private operators with an unintergrated ticketing system is a stupid operating model.

Edited February 22, 2012 by Lakegeneve

[brewsterbudgen]

They have signs on seats saying please give your seat up for the Monks who rarely take them anyways. That is nice but should also have one for the elderly. I would always give up a seat to the elderly but never to a kid.

Actually the signs do say to give up your seat to the elderly (คนชรา). I agree about the kids, and have thought this before, but a bigger complaint is that BTS, which has space enough in the station for at least two more cars per train, isn't adding cars. At rush hour it's getting ridiculous, almost worse than NY or London, and noticeably worse each year. I wonder if they're giving any thought to this at all.

The longer 4-car trains that run on the Silom line are occasionally used on Sundays on the Sukhumvit line. As it's the least busy day, I assume they're being tested rather than being used to relieve the overcrowdedness!

Ever the optimist, I'm hoping they will be introduced for good soon.

[KRS1]

I use to see people giving seats to elderly all the time, especially buses.

Maybe the OP doesn't usually see this in the morning because elderly people don't usually have to get up and go to the office once they're of age...much less walk up the stairs.

I have however never seen a farang give up a seat, im sure it exist but like the elderly person that cant walk up the stairs is certain to be a rarity.

[Nisa]

Actually the signs do say to give up your seat to the elderly (คนชรา). I agree about the kids, and have thought this before, but a bigger complaint is that BTS, which has space enough in the station for at least two more cars per train, isn't adding cars. At rush hour it's getting ridiculous, almost worse than NY or London, and noticeably worse each year. I wonder if they're giving any thought to this at all.

The MRT is the same in terms of room for more trains and I wondered the same thing. But then I remember reading a story somewhere here last year that explained why they haven't. I can't recall if they had more trains on order to do this or it was something about safety and needed to upgrade the braking systems or something like that ... bottom line is there was a reason but if I recall it was an unexpected or ill planning issue.

Nothing to do with safety and all to do with private operators having debts and not enough funds to purchase more rolling stock. It is explained in post #121 on this thread, http://www.thaivisa....00#entry4650940

In short, if you are feeling the squeeze on the BTS, MRT or Cityline it is due to all 3 operators not having enough funds to purchase new stock. It highlights why having multiple private operators with an unintergrated ticketing system is a stupid operating model.

BTSC is currently planning to purchase more trains and is studying the possibility of putting 6-car trains into service.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/BTS_Skytrain

Don't kid yourself about their not being money available. Just look at the ongoing expansions.

[Lakegeneve]

BTSC is currently planning to purchase more trains and is studying the possibility of putting 6-car trains into service.

http://en.wikipedia....ki/BTS_Skytrain

Don't kid yourself about their not being money available. Just look at the ongoing expansions.

With respect, you don't appear to understand anything here and you link a wiki page that is patently out of date with respect to the rolling stock issue. (Did you actually read the page??) You quote a sentence that is outdated as is should state that the BTSC HAS and IS purchasing new rolling stock, not "planning to". Did you bother to take a few mins to read through the linked thread? Apparently not.

What "expansions" do you refer to exactly, can you be specific pls??? The BTSC has nothing to do with building those extensions or any new lines. They have been funded either by the BMA or the Central govt via the MRTA depending on which extension or new line one is discussing.

As for 6 car rolling stock, that was always planned for when it opened in 1999, what is the 'news' about that? The stations and system are designed for eventual 6 car operation much as the Airport Line is designed for eventual 10 car operation from 2028 (planned). The point is that the original schedule of expanding to 4 car sets, (then 5, then 6) has not been met. In fact, the move to 4 car sets was due to occur in 2007/8. Has that happened yet, no?

With current patronage we should actually be expanding to 5 car sets. The reason for the delay in adding extra cars and rolling stock. A lack of money, pure and simple! Mainly due to debt repayments by the BTS operator limiting funds for operational expansion.

Edited February 25, 2012 by Lakegeneve

[Nisa]

BTSC is currently planning to purchase more trains and is studying the possibility of putting 6-car trains into service.

http://en.wikipedia....ki/BTS_Skytrain

Don't kid yourself about their not being money available. Just look at the ongoing expansions.

With respect, you don't appear to understand anything here and you link a wiki page that is patently out of date with respect to the rolling stock issue. (Did you actually read the page??) You quote a sentence that is outdated as is should state that the BTSC HAS and IS purchasing new rolling stock, not "planning to". Did you bother to take a few mins to read through the linked thread? Apparently not.

What "expansions" do you refer to exactly, can you be specific pls??? The BTSC has nothing to do with building those extensions or any new lines. They have been funded either by the BMA or the Central govt via the MRTA depending on which extension or new line one is discussing.

As for 6 car rolling stock, that was always planned for when it opened in 1999, what is the 'news' about that? The stations and system are designed for eventual 6 car operation much as the Airport Line is designed for eventual 10 car operation from 2028 (planned). The point is that the original schedule of expanding to 4 car sets, (then 5, then 6) has not been met. In fact, the move to 4 car sets was due to occur in 2007/8. Has that happened yet, no?

With current patronage we should actually be expanding to 5 car sets. The reason for the delay in adding extra cars and rolling stock. A lack of money, pure and simple! Mainly due to debt repayments by the BTS operator limiting funds for operational expansion.

What is your point? Who denied there was a plan to expand (as the sentence and link indicate) but as I stated before, there were unforeseen issues with adding cars to the trains which they are working on and studying. It has nothing to do with money/budget because it would be cheaper to run longer trains than running extra ones .... but they don't because there are issues to be dealt with before adding cars to the existing trains.

And more cars are set to be delivered in 2015 ... again it is not a budget issue. Regardless if they lose money or not, they are well funded when it comes to meeting the public demands for transportation.