2012 Formula One Season

[JetsetBkk]

i think you have missed the point entirely.

if everyone thought like you many aspects of development in the sport would remain static: ie no f duct or double diffuser to name but two.

<snip>

Totally separate subjects. You know it, and so does everyone else.

Not at all ! It's all about teams manipulating the regulations to get an advantage.

totster

Unbelievable. You are so wrong, but I think you have become entrenched in your attitude and refuse to change it.

[tinfoilhat]

i think you have missed the point entirely.

if everyone thought like you many aspects of development in the sport would remain static: ie no f duct or double diffuser to name but two.

<snip>

Totally separate subjects. You know it, and so does everyone else.

Not at all ! It's all about teams manipulating the regulations to get an advantage.

totster

Unbelievable. You are so wrong, but I think you have become entrenched in your attitude and refuse to change it.

and i think that out of a sense of idealism you wish to deny a fascinating dimension of a very complex sport.

oh well to each his own.

[b19bry]

i think you have missed the point entirely.

if everyone thought like you many aspects of development in the sport would remain static: ie no f duct or double diffuser to name but two.

<snip>

Totally separate subjects. You know it, and so does everyone else.

Not at all ! It's all about teams manipulating the regulations to get an advantage.

totster

Unbelievable. You are so wrong, but I think you have become entrenched in your attitude and refuse to change it.

Pot, Kettle, Black

[JetsetBkk]

If everyone can break there gearbox seal to move there team mate up, would there be any point in watching Qualifying ?

or even broadcasting it, as on race day would be a completely diffident line up ?

So think the answer is very clear.

Indeed.

Can you imagine in football a team deliberately kicking the ball in their own net for tactical reasons because they didn't want to finish top of their group. There would be an outcry and the team most likely would be banned for contriving the result. Of course in football there would be all the gambling implications too. Not sure how much gambling there is with regards F1, perhaps not much, but imagine if someone had money on Massa qualifying in the top five and he does, but then Ferrari do what they did. A legal nightmare for the bookies.

I can. How about a badminton team "not trying hard enough" so they would get a more favourable position in the draw:

http://www.scpr.org/...ualified-lack-/

[Guest]

Can we conclude that Ferrari used to be a great team which has accomplished wins.

Now it's degraded to a lawyer company stage. It can not anymore compete with engineering skills and therefore it competes with it's lawyers.

Hopefully Ferrari will get it's act together and come back to fight on the racing track.. not on rulebook.

[Mosha]

Didn't Irvine say it was like having a team of lawyers in the cockpit, when you drove the car?

[ignis]

Well so far in Practice 1 & 2 Massa is ahead of Alonso, so wonder what they will do this week if Massa is ahead in Qualifying at his home race ?

[Mosha]

Wouldn't it be ironic if Alonso got a gear box failure prior to qualifying?

[ignis]

Wouldn't it be ironic if Alonso got a gear box failure prior to qualifying?

Yes, but more likely there would be a mystery problem for Massa......... Brazilian and his home race, would not like to be a Ferrari mechanic after qualifying or the race

[rixalex]

Interesting qualifying. McClaren's look very strong.

Strange to see both Championship contenders being out qualified by their team mates. Of all the races all season, you'd expect this one they would both really fly. Perhaps it's nerves creeping in. Hard to imagine though as both are very experienced at being in this sort of position.

Alonso is obviously praying for changeable conditions, both for how the order can change up and for the possibility of cars going out. I think that is what it is going to take for Alonso to have any chance. He needs Vettel to not finish. If Vettel does finish, i think it's over.

What will happen with Massa? Will he have a slow start and try to back some drivers up going into the first lap and thereby allow Alonso to jump up a good few places right away? Sure Alonso would love that but difficult to orchestrate and could end in tears. The other option is to allow Massa to drive flat out and hope he can in some way interfere with Vettel's race. But is Massa capable to that sort of a drive? He did well in America and has done well to out qualify Alonso here, but i have my doubts he can maintain that sort of form.

Tactically i guess it is difficult for all the teams to decide on anything, until they know what they weather is going to do.

[tinfoilhat]

Wouldn't it be ironic if Alonso got a gear box failure prior to qualifying?

no, it would be ironic if redbull and webber had a gear box issue moving vetel up to third, putting webber in 8 and bumping alonso into 9th.

[Sophon]

Wouldn't it be ironic if Alonso got a gear box failure prior to qualifying?

no, it would be ironic if redbull and webber had a gear box issue moving vetel up to third, putting webber in 8 and bumping alonso into 9th.

I think you have misunderstood something there, a penalty for one driver can never move another driver further down the grid. A gear box issue for Webber would have moved Alonso up to seventh on the grid (sixth taking Maldonado's penalty into account).

Sophon

[JetsetBkk]

<snip>

I hope that Vettel doesn't win, I like it when he doesn't win.. I can't stand it when he says "that's what I'm talking about", I like it when he is disappointed and subdued. To that end I am prepared to see Alonso win..

totster

"Yeah baby! That's what I'm talking about!"

Just for you, Tots.

[Naam]

"Yeah baby! That's what I'm talking about!"

Just for you, Tots.

[tinfoilhat]

race was mor xciting than i could have hoped and i got the result i wanted.

Every year vetel wins is a year alonso or hamilton don't.

Barring another Raikonnen WDC I really could not have asked for more.

[tinfoilhat]

Wouldn't it be ironic if Alonso got a gear box failure prior to qualifying?

no, it would be ironic if redbull and webber had a gear box issue moving vetel up to third, putting webber in 8 and bumping alonso into 9th.

I think you have misunderstood something there, a penalty for one driver can never move another driver further down the grid. A gear box issue for Webber would have moved Alonso up to seventh on the grid (sixth taking Maldonado's penalty into account).

Sophon

indeed, i misspoke, you get my meaning though.

[Mosha]

At least Vettels radio was broken, at the end of the race.

[Totster]

<snip>

I hope that Vettel doesn't win, I like it when he doesn't win.. I can't stand it when he says "that's what I'm talking about", I like it when he is disappointed and subdued. To that end I am prepared to see Alonso win..

totster

"Yeah baby! That's what I'm talking about!"

Just for you, Tots.

hahaha !

Well, after that race, I think he thoroughly deserved to win the Championship. I couldn't help but feel respect for him (much as it pained me)

totster

[JetsetBkk]

<snip>

I hope that Vettel doesn't win, I like it when he doesn't win.. I can't stand it when he says "that's what I'm talking about", I like it when he is disappointed and subdued. To that end I am prepared to see Alonso win..

totster

"Yeah baby! That's what I'm talking about!"

Just for you, Tots.

hahaha !

Well, after that race, I think he thoroughly deserved to win the Championship. I couldn't help but feel respect for him (much as it pained me)

totster

Heh, heh! I must say that, once again, in the post-race interview Alonso was very open about the team putting everything they had into the sport but maybe lacking some ideas to get the performance needed to win, and that at the beginning of the season the car was very slow but they improved it a lot to get so close to winning at the end.

I liked this quote the best from Alonso:

with a car that is a little bit slower than the others we can win the championship,

with a car that is the same as the others probably we can win the championship a few races before the end,

and with a car that is a lot slower than the others we fight until the last race.

Not sure Domenicali appreciated that!

[jpinx]

Great climax to the season and it didn't matter who won - they both deserved it What a drive by the Hulk! Button serene on slippery slicks. Too many to mention.

Bring on 2013 - let's see if Hamilton can do for Mercedes what Alonso does for Ferrari, and how MacLaren get the driving performance they need from their new boy.

[Guest]

It was a really eventful race and I'm happy for the results.

One thing I like the Lotus team is their sense of humor. This was on their FB feed.

Maybe next year in Interlagos there will be a new official 'Kimi's U-Turn'.

[rixalex]

Despite my reservations about whether it is the right sort of track for the title decider, with weather conditions like that, it does make things very exciting and unpredictable.

Have to take my hat of to Vettel. With what happened on the first lap, when it looked like it was going to be all over, he showed great maturity and restraint to slowly get himself back into the race. Would have been very easy to do something rash or impatient in a state of panic. But he remained calm, and drove superbly.

Button and Hulk also had great races. Where did Hulk's drive come from? He looked for most of the race as being quite easily the fastest man on the track. Felt sorry for both him and Button at the way that massive lead they had earned was whittled away to nothing. The whole business with safety cars still bothers me. Can't say that i have a solution to it though. I guess the fairest thing to do would be for everyone to have time added at the end of the race dependant on how far they were behind the leader at the time, but that would make things confusing, especially of course if there was more than one safety car period. Could mean the person who comes over the finish line in fifth would be the winner. As a spectacle, a terrible idea. It would be fair though. What we have now clearly is not.

And speaking of unfair, another example for me of unnecessary steward interference with that way Hulk was given a drive through penalty for his collision with Hamilton. Yes it was harsh on Hamilton getting put out of the race, but Hulk didn't do anything reckless, he just lost the back end a little in the corner, and with how slippery things were, that wasn't a difficult thing to have done. For me penalties are being given simply for racing accidents, when they should be for reckless / dangerous driving. Had Hamilton not had his race ended but been able to continue on, would a penalty have been given? I don't think it would. If the driving was reckless, surely regardless the outcome for Hamilton, there should be a penalty. It's as if stewards use penalties to exact some revenge on behalf of other drivers. That's not what penalties should be about.

[rixalex]

Maybe next year in Interlagos there will be a new official 'Kimi's U-Turn'.

I assumed he was pulling in to retire. What on earth was he thinking? Utterly bizarre to have driven through that gap in the barrier.

[rixalex]

I liked this quote the best from Alonso:

with a car that is a little bit slower than the others we can win the championship,

with a car that is the same as the others probably we can win the championship a few races before the end,

and with a car that is a lot slower than the others we fight until the last race.

Not sure Domenicali appreciated that!

Did Alonso really say all that?

[tinfoilhat]

Maybe next year in Interlagos there will be a new official 'Kimi's U-Turn'.

I assumed he was pulling in to retire. What on earth was he thinking? Utterly bizarre to have driven through that gap in the barrier.

it led back on track, but there was a gate that had been shut.

http://planetf1.com/...hat-I-was-doing

Edited November 28, 2012 by tinfoilhat

[Totster]

.....but Hulk didn't do anything reckless, he just lost the back end a little in the corner...

Debateable..

and with how slippery things were, that wasn't a difficult thing to have done.

Exactly ! Some may argue that charging down the inside into that corner (that he knew was going to be wet and slippy) was indeed reckless.

The sad thing is that if he hadn't done that the chances are he would have finished on the podium which would have been a great result for Force India, he may have even got the pass later in the race, there was still a long race ahead. I was really hoping he was going to win, would have been a great end to the season.

totster

[Mosha]

The fat lady hasn't finished singing yet.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/formulaone/article-2240062/Sebastian-Vettel-lose-title.html

[tinfoilhat]

The fat lady hasn't finished singing yet.

http://www.dailymail...lose-title.html

daily mail. i dont see anyone else covering the story.

cant imagine Alonso would want to win that way, but it is all about the money

[Mosha]

I googled it as it was mentioned on BBC sport news.

[ignis]

Also here yesterday and today the Video was added http://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/0/formula1/20531638