Thailand's English Skills Lowest In S E A

[Noistar]

I have taught for quite a number of years. Thais don't have any more trouble learning English than does any other nationality. Many of the problems with young learners are structural problems in the education system and have nothing really to do with the fundamental ability of Thai children to learn.

Adults are about the same the world over. The most important variable is motivation. The motivation can because they need to learn English to advance their career or for other reasons. There are some cultural variations, but these are normal for any group.

There is also the differences between English and Thai, which is known as linguistic distance. The two languages are very different from one another with different sounds, different writing systems, and other significant differences. This makes English a little more challenging for Thais (and some other languages which are very distant).

The final factor is that most Thais just do not get much of an opportunity to use English and this means it's difficult to reinforce and retain the language. In spite of what we may think, the majority of Thai people simply do not come into contact with farangs on a regular basis nor do they run into English being used.

Thailand now is moving toward universal education for children which generally means that the scores will trend downward. Some years back, education was for the elite and the very bright. The average child from a poor family would simply not be accorded a full high school education unless he showed exceptional ability. With universal schooling, poorer students will stay in school longer, thus bringing down test scores somewhat.

Your points are valid.

I would put emphasis on 'motivation'. I'm sure many people would find it difficult to understand why a city like CM, with so many English-speaking Farang, has a population which doesn't appear to want to speak English.

English is not difficult to communicate in at a reasonably basic level, and many Thais I know, of a broad age-group, can hold a decent conversation.

But there are a vast majority of Thais here who run a mile if a Farang tries to speak to them.

The tools are here. The Thais are intelligent. Just needs a major "kick up the backside" to get it sorted.

Any ideas what Thais do excel at? Not a sarcastic question, I was just wondering what you'd put success at learning English on a par with.

[Scott]

In my experience, which is limited to several schools and observations of a few others here in Thailand, the students are limited in a number of ways. First the tendency of classes to be taught by rote or lecture method means that there is little chance for students to use the language. The Thai curriculum emphasis on grammar does not help with using the language.

The no-fail policy (which I am not totally against in all instances) does not help students either. They need to have a realistic understanding of how competent they are in speaking English. Because I passed in school, doesn't mean I can pass in real-life.

Finally, they need to have more exposure and use of the language on a daily basis (at least in school) to reinforce the use of the language.

[jpinx]

I have taught for quite a number of years. Thais don't have any more trouble learning English than does any other nationality. Many of the problems with young learners are structural problems in the education system and have nothing really to do with the fundamental ability of Thai children to learn.

Adults are about the same the world over. The most important variable is motivation. The motivation can because they need to learn English to advance their career or for other reasons. There are some cultural variations, but these are normal for any group.

There is also the differences between English and Thai, which is known as linguistic distance. The two languages are very different from one another with different sounds, different writing systems, and other significant differences. This makes English a little more challenging for Thais (and some other languages which are very distant).

The final factor is that most Thais just do not get much of an opportunity to use English and this means it's difficult to reinforce and retain the language. In spite of what we may think, the majority of Thai people simply do not come into contact with farangs on a regular basis nor do they run into English being used.

Thailand now is moving toward universal education for children which generally means that the scores will trend downward. Some years back, education was for the elite and the very bright. The average child from a poor family would simply not be accorded a full high school education unless he showed exceptional ability. With universal schooling, poorer students will stay in school longer, thus bringing down test scores somewhat.

Your points are valid.

I would put emphasis on 'motivation'. I'm sure many people would find it difficult to understand why a city like CM, with so many English-speaking Farang, has a population which doesn't appear to want to speak English.

English is not difficult to communicate in at a reasonably basic level, and many Thais I know, of a broad age-group, can hold a decent conversation.

But there are a vast majority of Thais here who run a mile if a Farang tries to speak to them.

The tools are here. The Thais are intelligent. Just needs a major "kick up the backside" to get it sorted.

Any ideas what Thais do excel at? Not a sarcastic question, I was just wondering what you'd put success at learning English on a par with.

A reasonable question and easily answered. I know many Thais who have 3 languages, Thai, Lao and Khymer, or maybe Mung or another local language, or Malay if in the south. There's no lack of ability to speak languages - just that English is too "foreign" for them. Has to be said that in my experience Thais react to German or French in the same way as they react to English. Staying within their own language group makes it easier, in the same way a Brit can learn German, French or even Greek without too much trouble. I reckon that tonal and non-tonal languages are very separate things to a student.

[Noistar]

I have taught for quite a number of years. Thais don't have any more trouble learning English than does any other nationality. Many of the problems with young learners are structural problems in the education system and have nothing really to do with the fundamental ability of Thai children to learn.

Adults are about the same the world over. The most important variable is motivation. The motivation can because they need to learn English to advance their career or for other reasons. There are some cultural variations, but these are normal for any group.

There is also the differences between English and Thai, which is known as linguistic distance. The two languages are very different from one another with different sounds, different writing systems, and other significant differences. This makes English a little more challenging for Thais (and some other languages which are very distant).

The final factor is that most Thais just do not get much of an opportunity to use English and this means it's difficult to reinforce and retain the language. In spite of what we may think, the majority of Thai people simply do not come into contact with farangs on a regular basis nor do they run into English being used.

Thailand now is moving toward universal education for children which generally means that the scores will trend downward. Some years back, education was for the elite and the very bright. The average child from a poor family would simply not be accorded a full high school education unless he showed exceptional ability. With universal schooling, poorer students will stay in school longer, thus bringing down test scores somewhat.

I'd agree and I have seen the same happen in other countries like Peru where I lived and casually taught English for a few years.

The real nub of the problem - form the educational point of view - is the number of English teachers in Thailand who can not speak English at all. Students are taught by rote and there is no example to copy.

There are many other problems associated with the administration and politics of education, but enough already

It's the problem of teachers being 'qualified' to teach English.

As you point out, Thai nationals cannot teach English effectively. When you're repeatedly having to say 'final consonant' and 'v' is not 'wee', it makes you wonder what a teaching qualification actually is. Presumably the Filipino English teacher isn't as strict either.

So, if my step-daughter doesn't have the benefit of me pointing out the fundamental mistakes Thais make, it still wouldn't stop her getting a degree and be ready for the next round of 'blind leading the blind'.

I imagine a first-world degree in Thai means someone is fluent and can teach it. Any idea what a degree in English, 'achieved' in Thailand, actually represents?

Is it better than my Grade 2 CSE in woodwork?

[hanno]

Shock, horror, surprise.

What makes me laugh is that here in Cambodia the level of English is excellent, way above Thailand and from people I know who work in Burma there is widespread use of English, largely due to the historical connection from British rule.

The level of Engrish in Thailand is an absolute joke and see no reason whatsoever, why it should improve in the near future.

You must work in a different part of Cambodia from me.

The title is misleading as they have left out Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia, and Myanmar, all part of SE Asia.

I have no proof, but I think Thailand comes ahead of any of those countries. Yes, English in say Myanmar is widely spoken in Yangon and Bagan. I traveled quite a bit in Myanmar and outside those cities English is non-existent. Laos is even worse whereas Vietnam has made some real gains since I first got there in 1995. Here in Cambodia the biggest challenge I have is finding staff with at least some notion of English. Cambodia probably has the worst educational standards of any country in SE Asia, I have an MBA graduate working for me that cannot write a basic sentence without errors.

Just saying....

[Noistar]

In my experience, which is limited to several schools and observations of a few others here in Thailand, the students are limited in a number of ways. First the tendency of classes to be taught by rote or lecture method means that there is little chance for students to use the language. The Thai curriculum emphasis on grammar does not help with using the language.

The no-fail policy (which I am not totally against in all instances) does not help students either. They need to have a realistic understanding of how competent they are in speaking English. Because I passed in school, doesn't mean I can pass in real-life.

Finally, they need to have more exposure and use of the language on a daily basis (at least in school) to reinforce the use of the language.

I would err almost on the 'all fail' policy for mid-term tests. I want my step-daughter to be aware of what she doesn't know and why, and therefore make some effort to improve. The Thai culture obsession with not failing is holding students back. A 'I've got 100%' helps no-one.

Your posts validly point out that communicating in English would be beneficial. My step-daughter, having achieved confidence in her spoken English, spends time speaking with her friends at school in English

[SteeleJoe]

The title is misleading as they have left out Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia, and Myanmar, all part of SE Asia.

I have no proof, but I think Thailand comes ahead of any of those countries.

Why do you think that? I don't know that you are wrong but AI wonder what you base that on...

I do recall at least one study had Thailand at second from the bottom in the world but Vietnam about 20 places higher.

[jpinx]

Here's a few survey reports that might be of interest.

Interestingly Malaysia is rated as "excellent". China and India are on a par despite massive British influence in India.

Thailand is nowhere on the world map of English speaking nations - 53 out of 54 major non-native-English speaking nations, they are so nationalistic and introspective that they just don't care. Maybe ASEAN will change that eventually, but I'm not holding my breath. Meantime I willingly help any Thai who wants even a simple few words of English just for fun - - every little bit helps

http://www.ef.co.uk/epi/downloads/

http://www.ef.co.uk/__/~/media/efcom/epi/2012/full_reports/ef-epi-2012-report-master-lr-2.pdf

...see page 4

http://www.universityworldnews.com/article.php?story=20110408183436105

http://www.euractiv.com/culture/workforces-eu-countries-basic-en-news-516071

[Scott]

In my experience, which is limited to several schools and observations of a few others here in Thailand, the students are limited in a number of ways. First the tendency of classes to be taught by rote or lecture method means that there is little chance for students to use the language. The Thai curriculum emphasis on grammar does not help with using the language.

The no-fail policy (which I am not totally against in all instances) does not help students either. They need to have a realistic understanding of how competent they are in speaking English. Because I passed in school, doesn't mean I can pass in real-life.

Finally, they need to have more exposure and use of the language on a daily basis (at least in school) to reinforce the use of the language.

I would err almost on the 'all fail' policy for mid-term tests. I want my step-daughter to be aware of what she doesn't know and why, and therefore make some effort to improve. The Thai culture obsession with not failing is holding students back. A 'I've got 100%' helps no-one.

Your posts validly point out that communicating in English would be beneficial. My step-daughter, having achieved confidence in her spoken English, spends time speaking with her friends at school in English

I think the 'no-fail' policy is outside the topic of this thread. It is, however, important for students to use the language and to learn from their mistakes and mistakes are how we learn. It requires a lot of encouragement. Negativity is counterproductive. In my experience, the Thai teachers teach English grammar, but do so in the Thai language. The students seldom, if ever, repeat anything in English in those classes. They do write it down, but there is very little English speaking.

I taught a group of adults for many years--absolutely wonderful students--and when we started they couldn't really carry on a conversation, but they knew every rule of grammar and every part of speech. We engaged in a short conversation lesson which they had to practice, and the remainder of the time was spent with them talking about everyday things. Tons of mistakes --which I overlooked to a large degree, because they were communicating. As they progressed and they got proficient, mistakes were corrected and discussed.

A big motivation for them was music. They liked English songs and some liked Karoke, so they sang and we talked about and explained songs. We talked about most anything that struck their interest.

More and more factories and companies are having in-house teachers. I was lucky in that I had a really, really good class of students. They were great fun. I have a friend who works for a company and the students are a royal PIA. They don't want to learn, come late, etc. The problem is they have to take a TOEIC exam each year to measure their progress. His continued working depends on their TOEIC score, so he now is simply teaching to the test.

[Noistar]

In my experience, which is limited to several schools and observations of a few others here in Thailand, the students are limited in a number of ways. First the tendency of classes to be taught by rote or lecture method means that there is little chance for students to use the language. The Thai curriculum emphasis on grammar does not help with using the language.

The no-fail policy (which I am not totally against in all instances) does not help students either. They need to have a realistic understanding of how competent they are in speaking English. Because I passed in school, doesn't mean I can pass in real-life.

Finally, they need to have more exposure and use of the language on a daily basis (at least in school) to reinforce the use of the language.

I would err almost on the 'all fail' policy for mid-term tests. I want my step-daughter to be aware of what she doesn't know and why, and therefore make some effort to improve. The Thai culture obsession with not failing is holding students back. A 'I've got 100%' helps no-one.

Your posts validly point out that communicating in English would be beneficial. My step-daughter, having achieved confidence in her spoken English, spends time speaking with her friends at school in English

I think the 'no-fail' policy is outside the topic of this thread. It is, however, important for students to use the language and to learn from their mistakes and mistakes are how we learn. It requires a lot of encouragement. Negativity is counterproductive. In my experience, the Thai teachers teach English grammar, but do so in the Thai language. The students seldom, if ever, repeat anything in English in those classes. They do write it down, but there is very little English speaking.

I taught a group of adults for many years--absolutely wonderful students--and when we started they couldn't really carry on a conversation, but they knew every rule of grammar and every part of speech. We engaged in a short conversation lesson which they had to practice, and the remainder of the time was spent with them talking about everyday things. Tons of mistakes --which I overlooked to a large degree, because they were communicating. As they progressed and they got proficient, mistakes were corrected and discussed.

A big motivation for them was music. They liked English songs and some liked Karoke, so they sang and we talked about and explained songs. We talked about most anything that struck their interest.

More and more factories and companies are having in-house teachers. I was lucky in that I had a really, really good class of students. They were great fun. I have a friend who works for a company and the students are a royal PIA. They don't want to learn, come late, etc. The problem is they have to take a TOEIC exam each year to measure their progress. His continued working depends on their TOEIC score, so he now is simply teaching to the test.

Point taken - I was just comparing 'all fail' and 'all pass'. As you point out, negativity is self-defeating, even more so in Thailand! I've told my step-daughter to wear her 'I've got 80%' badge (or whatever) with pride, but concentrate on the 20%.

Back on topic before I get my knuckles rapped (again!).

I have found that Thais tend to translate Thai to English word-for-word. Once you realise that, it helps with our understanding of the Thai language, but displays the poor teaching methods which must be continuing day-after-day, year-after-year in the Thai education system.

Wonder what next year's glut of Thai English 'degree' wavers will be like. Then again, I don't. More of the same. This year's Kindergarten starters are likely to be of the same standard when they 'graduate'.

The tools are there Thailand - please take a leap into the unknown and use them!!

[Shagz]

When I had a job interview with a Thai guy from a university I said to him "Good morning, how are you?"

His responce "Slowly, slowly please....."

That is exactly what I tell the Thai's to do when speaking Thai to me because when they speak quickly it's much harder to grasp and I have to keep asking them to repeat themselves.

English is the business language of the world and the best English speaking Thai's I have come across here in Thailand are the ones with an English language university degree, English speaking partners, been to or lived in English speaking countries and their careers involve every day reading, writing and speaking English, I find the average Thai just enjoys a simple and fun life and even if they can speak some English it's not really fun for them because they don't understand all of the English slang and humor therefore they don't really enjoy learning it properly, also our different accents obviously throw them.

[Noistar]

I was interested when I met a Chinese lady on a songtaow, to find out she was a teacher at a government school. We held a good conversation in English. She teaches Chinese, speaks no Thai, and communicates in English with her classes.and the other teachers.

The Government's obsession with teaching a language which is probably of little benefit, is probably part of the reason why emphasis isn't placed on an international language.

Sorry cann you explain that - your English doesn't make sense - WHICH language is of little benefit and WHICH language is an "international" one?

Yes, I cann, sorry can, explain that.

Your opinion re my English making sense is much appreciated, as are all your other negative contributions.

The topic relates to the perceived poor relative standard of English in Thailand. While spending time learning Chinese, Thai students are not learning English.

In my humblest opinion, English IS an international language, (as opposed to an "international" language). Chinese is not.

Fluency in Chinese - if I may stray from the topic - will not provide as much benefit as fluency in English. If Thailand wants to acknowledge that the world is bigger than Thailand and has grown to be ASEAN, they appear to be mistaken if they believe Chinese is the answer to their future prosperity.

Chinese people learn English to communicate internationally. I don't know how fluent Thais become when they learn Chinese. If they bastardise it like thaiglish, they may find it of little 'benefit' anyway.

Until the Americans start to speak Chinese this situation is unlikely to change.

Humblest etc.

[boomerangutang]

If Thailand is worse English skills in SE Asia, then northernmost Thailand, where I reside, is worse still.

My 2 satang worth: Native English speakers, particularly backpackers, should be encouraged (by gov't, schools, etc) to teach and/or tutor or lecture a.s.a. possible in Thailand. Instead, official policy dictates that only those with BA or MA degrees can legally do so. Thai students need as much exposure as possible to English, particularly conversational. Gov't edicts are strangling that. The OP article is a result.

[Thai at Heart]

If Thailand is worse English skills in SE Asia, then northernmost Thailand, where I reside, is worse still.

My 2 satang worth: Native English speakers, particularly backpackers, should be encouraged (by gov't, schools, etc) to teach and/or tutor or lecture a.s.a. possible in Thailand. Instead, official policy dictates that only those with BA or MA degrees can legally do so. Thai students need as much exposure as possible to English, particularly conversational. Gov't edicts are strangling that. The OP article is a result.

I would start even more basically than that and make it illegal to translate spoken English into spoken Thai in movies and cartoons.

Soundtrack in English, written subtitles in Thai. That's it, nothing wise allowed.

[Noistar]

If Thailand is worse English skills in SE Asia, then northernmost Thailand, where I reside, is worse still.

My 2 satang worth: Native English speakers, particularly backpackers, should be encouraged (by gov't, schools, etc) to teach and/or tutor or lecture a.s.a. possible in Thailand. Instead, official policy dictates that only those with BA or MA degrees can legally do so. Thai students need as much exposure as possible to English, particularly conversational. Gov't edicts are strangling that. The OP article is a result.

Presumably the requirement for a degree is to ensure that Thai graduates are treated the same as foreigners. The lettering 'MA', 'BA' may be the same, but we're talking massively different achievements.

As you point out, it's the government causing the problems. A sceptic might think the people of Thailand were not at the fore-front of their intentions.

[Noistar]

When I had a job interview with a Thai guy from a university I said to him "Good morning, how are you?"

His responce "Slowly, slowly please....."

That is exactly what I tell the Thai's to do when speaking Thai to me because when they speak quickly it's much harder to grasp and I have to keep asking them to repeat themselves.

English is the business language of the world and the best English speaking Thai's I have come across here in Thailand are the ones with an English language university degree, English speaking partners, been to or lived in English speaking countries and their careers involve every day reading, writing and speaking English, I find the average Thai just enjoys a simple and fun life and even if they can speak some English it's not really fun for them because they don't understand all of the English slang and humor therefore they don't really enjoy learning it properly, also our different accents obviously throw them.

Give them a Geordie or Glaswegian. Best of luck!!

[tubby johnson]

The rot starts at the top. The complacent and corrupt Ministry of Education and greedy diploma factories are mainly to blame. Parents too, whose allergy to books retards slows down their children's development.

Thailand's TOEFL test scores are consistently the lowest in the whole of Asia. English majors graduate from private universities unable to write or converse in English.

This country's only recourse is to remain in its low-cost manufacturing hole. Service jobs are impossible to outsource to better-educated countries. That's Thailand's saving grace, so there will always be jobs as security guards and prostitutes for the masses of men and women who quit high school each year. But the people deserve better from this smug and kleptocratic government (... unless they voted these crooks into office, of course).

[brewsterbudgen]

The rot starts at the top. The complacent and corrupt Ministry of Education and greedy diploma factories are mainly to blame. Parents too, whose allergy to books retards slows down their children's development.

Thailand's TOEFL test scores are consistently the lowest in the whole of Asia. English majors graduate from private universities unable to write or converse in English.

This country's only recourse is to remain in its low-cost manufacturing hole. Service jobs are impossible to outsource to better-educated countries. That's Thailand's saving grace, so there will always be jobs as security guards and prostitutes for the masses of men and women who quit high school each year. But the people deserve better from this smug and kleptocratic government (... unless they voted these crooks into office, of course).

TOEFL is very much out of fashion these days. IELTS is far more popular and is accepted by most US universities. As an IELTS examiner, I see plenty of Thai students achieving 6.5 and above and being able to take a Master's degree at an English speaking university. The situation is certainly not as bad as you've suggested.

[jpinx]

The rot starts at the top. The complacent and corrupt Ministry of Education and greedy diploma factories are mainly to blame. Parents too, whose allergy to books retards slows down their children's development.

Thailand's TOEFL test scores are consistently the lowest in the whole of Asia. English majors graduate from private universities unable to write or converse in English.

This country's only recourse is to remain in its low-cost manufacturing hole. Service jobs are impossible to outsource to better-educated countries. That's Thailand's saving grace, so there will always be jobs as security guards and prostitutes for the masses of men and women who quit high school each year. But the people deserve better from this smug and kleptocratic government (... unless they voted these crooks into office, of course).

If it's any consolation (probably not) - Degrees in Accountancy do not give the student the ability to do mental arithmetic and degrees in geography do not confer an ability to make a sketchmap of the world -- both of which I have encountered several times.

Welcome to ThaiVisa Nothing like making an entrance with guns blazing

[jpinx]

The rot starts at the top. The complacent and corrupt Ministry of Education and greedy diploma factories are mainly to blame. Parents too, whose allergy to books retards slows down their children's development.

Thailand's TOEFL test scores are consistently the lowest in the whole of Asia. English majors graduate from private universities unable to write or converse in English.

This country's only recourse is to remain in its low-cost manufacturing hole. Service jobs are impossible to outsource to better-educated countries. That's Thailand's saving grace, so there will always be jobs as security guards and prostitutes for the masses of men and women who quit high school each year. But the people deserve better from this smug and kleptocratic government (... unless they voted these crooks into office, of course).

TOEFL is very much out of fashion these days. IELTS is far more popular and is accepted by most US universities. As an IELTS examiner, I see plenty of Thai students achieving 6.5 and above and being able to take a Master's degree at an English speaking university. The situation is certainly not as bad as you've suggested.

Without wishing to be a Devil's Advocate - does what you're suggesting not reflect a lowering of standards for acceptance into university rather than a raising of achievement ?

I'd be interested to see an IELTS exam paper

[Noistar]

The rot starts at the top. The complacent and corrupt Ministry of Education and greedy diploma factories are mainly to blame. Parents too, whose allergy to books retards slows down their children's development.

Thailand's TOEFL test scores are consistently the lowest in the whole of Asia. English majors graduate from private universities unable to write or converse in English.

This country's only recourse is to remain in its low-cost manufacturing hole. Service jobs are impossible to outsource to better-educated countries. That's Thailand's saving grace, so there will always be jobs as security guards and prostitutes for the masses of men and women who quit high school each year. But the people deserve better from this smug and kleptocratic government (... unless they voted these crooks into office, of course).

If it's any consolation (probably not) - Degrees in Accountancy do not give the student the ability to do mental arithmetic and degrees in geography do not confer an ability to make a sketchmap of the world -- both of which I have encountered several times.

Welcome to ThaiVisa Nothing like making an entrance with guns blazing

As you say, the qualification is the start, not the end.

The impression the lemming lines give to me, is that the piece of paper means you have arrived.

Having spent 14 years (k2+ P6+M6) at school and 4-6 years at Uni, not learning much, their 'education' has concluded.

I will continue my call for Thai culture to give way to a new Thailand. IMHO, the 2 cannot co-exist.

[Scott]

A link to a commercial site has been deleted.

[Noistar]

The rot starts at the top. The complacent and corrupt Ministry of Education and greedy diploma factories are mainly to blame. Parents too, whose allergy to books retards slows down their children's development.

Thailand's TOEFL test scores are consistently the lowest in the whole of Asia. English majors graduate from private universities unable to write or converse in English.

This country's only recourse is to remain in its low-cost manufacturing hole. Service jobs are impossible to outsource to better-educated countries. That's Thailand's saving grace, so there will always be jobs as security guards and prostitutes for the masses of men and women who quit high school each year. But the people deserve better from this smug and kleptocratic government (... unless they voted these crooks into office, of course).

I can't disagree with the points you make about this country's government and its apparent contempt of the people who elected it.

Thai parents (my wife being one) seem to have an unshakeable faith that completing university is the answer to future success. She jumps from 'get her daughter to university - get money to look after the family - get married - start a family - etc'. The term 'rote' crops up frequently in this topic. I would also use 'Thai culture'.

So, university = future prosperity. Can't remember the figures around how many graduates work at 7-11.

[Bcgardener]

I have had pretty much the same experience with English as most other TV members when dealing with educated Thais. I recently paid to have a bank document translated into English by a reputable certified translation service. I was able to comprehend the results but the grammar and sentence structure was appalling. I then gave asked my 15 year old daughter (Thai mother) to translate the same document into English. She started school in Australia but has been learning Thai, along with her normal English classes, for about 5 years at an international school here. The result was a far better translation with good grammar and sentence structure. My point being, it is the education system here that causes the poor English, not the ability to of the people to learn it.

For the students that travel overseas to learn, a lot of them come from a pampered wealthy home life and do not have the work ethic or the interest required to become proficient in English. I have seen this first hand in Australia with friends who have hosted '' homestay'' Thai students in their homes.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[jpinx]

I have had pretty much the same experience with English as most other TV members when dealing with educated Thais. I recently paid to have a bank document translated into English by a reputable certified translation service. I was able to comprehend the results but the grammar and sentence structure was appalling. I then gave asked my 15 year old daughter (Thai mother) to translate the same document into English. She started school in Australia but has been learning Thai, along with her normal English classes, for about 5 years at an international school here. The result was a far better translation with good grammar and sentence structure. My point being, it is the education system here that causes the poor English, not the ability to of the people to learn it.

For the students that travel overseas to learn, a lot of them come from a pampered wealthy home life and do not have the work ethic or the interest required to become proficient in English. I have seen this first hand in Australia with friends who have hosted '' homestay'' Thai students in their homes.

Sent from my GT-I9300 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Sounds like she has a promising career in front of her

[Bagwan]

When I had a job interview with a Thai guy from a university I said to him "Good morning, how are you?"

His responce "Slowly, slowly please....."

That is exactly what I tell the Thai's to do when speaking Thai to me because when they speak quickly it's much harder to grasp and I have to keep asking them to repeat themselves.

English is the business language of the world and the best English speaking Thai's I have come across here in Thailand are the ones with an English language university degree, English speaking partners, been to or lived in English speaking countries and their careers involve every day reading, writing and speaking English, I find the average Thai just enjoys a simple and fun life and even if they can speak some English it's not really fun for them because they don't understand all of the English slang and humor therefore they don't really enjoy learning it properly, also our different accents obviously throw them.

Give them a Geordie or Glaswegian. Best of luck!!

Especially when they've had a few!

[cardholder]

Shock, horror, surprise.

What makes me laugh is that here in Cambodia the level of English is excellent, way above Thailand and from people I know who work in Burma there is widespread use of English, largely due to the historical connection from British rule.

The level of Engrish in Thailand is an absolute joke and see no reason whatsoever, why it should improve in the near future.

You must work in a different part of Cambodia from me.

The title is misleading as they have left out Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia, and Myanmar, all part of SE Asia.

I have no proof, but I think Thailand comes ahead of any of those countries. Yes, English in say Myanmar is widely spoken in Yangon and Bagan. I traveled quite a bit in Myanmar and outside those cities English is non-existent. Laos is even worse whereas Vietnam has made some real gains since I first got there in 1995. Here in Cambodia the biggest challenge I have is finding staff with at least some notion of English. Cambodia probably has the worst educational standards of any country in SE Asia, I have an MBA graduate working for me that cannot write a basic sentence without errors.

Just saying....

My experience supports Allan's view.

I don't know how widespread the English speaking ability is as my experience only extends to Siem Reap, PP, Sihanoukville, Kep and Koh Kong.

A minibus driver insisted on practicing his English on a journey to Siem Reap and explained that he was mainly self-taught by listening to English language radio in the evenings. 11 year old girls selling postcards in Siem Reap can hold a conversation with you (and have multiple counter-arguments for your reasons not to buy!). Waitresses in Pub Street, earning $90 a month, can speak 3 languages......

it seems to me that the Cambodians have a greater motivation and desire to learn English than their Thai counterparts - I can't believe that teaching standards are that different, or are they ?

[Noistar]

Shock, horror, surprise.

What makes me laugh is that here in Cambodia the level of English is excellent, way above Thailand and from people I know who work in Burma there is widespread use of English, largely due to the historical connection from British rule.

The level of Engrish in Thailand is an absolute joke and see no reason whatsoever, why it should improve in the near future.

You must work in a different part of Cambodia from me.

The title is misleading as they have left out Vietnam, Laos, Cambodia, and Myanmar, all part of SE Asia.

I have no proof, but I think Thailand comes ahead of any of those countries. Yes, English in say Myanmar is widely spoken in Yangon and Bagan. I traveled quite a bit in Myanmar and outside those cities English is non-existent. Laos is even worse whereas Vietnam has made some real gains since I first got there in 1995. Here in Cambodia the biggest challenge I have is finding staff with at least some notion of English. Cambodia probably has the worst educational standards of any country in SE Asia, I have an MBA graduate working for me that cannot write a basic sentence without errors.

Just saying....

My experience supports Allan's view.

I don't know how widespread the English speaking ability is as my experience only extends to Siem Reap, PP, Sihanoukville, Kep and Koh Kong.

A minibus driver insisted on practicing his English on a journey to Siem Reap and explained that he was mainly self-taught by listening to English language radio in the evenings. 11 year old girls selling postcards in Siem Reap can hold a conversation with you (and have multiple counter-arguments for your reasons not to buy!). Waitresses in Pub Street, earning $90 a month, can speak 3 languages......

it seems to me that the Cambodians have a greater motivation and desire to learn English than their Thai counterparts - I can't believe that teaching standards are that different, or are they ?

Teaching methods seem to be at a disadvantage as the award of a degree is not based on ability. My step-daughter will not ask her Thai English teacher questions as she can't trust the answer. She saves them for the Filipino English teacher or brings them home.

So I believe teaching standards and my continual cry of Thai culture, are very much to blame for poor academic achievement. Hang on, let's have a 'wai kru day'. Let's worship the incompetents who can't do their job. It's either that or learn something. They are preparing the next batch of incompetent teachers.

[zydeco]

Also to find out just how well known these tests are I Googled "jela" nothing zilch nada......

Sent from my i-mobile i-STYLE Q6

So did I. Turns out, this is a company that teaches English and the "results" mentioned here come from their own student questionnaires. This is little more than a PR memorandum.

[wilcopops]

Here are some basic English phrases - What do you REALLY say?

Good Morning, how are you? - what greeting do you REALLY use??????

I can't (US or UK)

bath (US, UK, North or South ENGLAND)

I want to

I am going to

I have got to

I have got a car, I have a car, I've bought a car...

Fish and chips

bread and butter

how do you say "ate" - when do you use Ate or Eaten?

If you think you say any of these expressions ,think again and then you get an inkling of what students have to cope with from uninformed English speakers.

and an example of an idiom - "it's raining cats and dogs" - it would seem even English speakers don't recognise these at times.

Edited July 27, 2013 by wilcopops