'White Mask' Guards Seen Trying To Hit Redshirts With Iron Bars

[NongKhaiKid]

I wonder if Yingluck will finally have her voice found for her and will take the opportunity to condemn. The minders who put the key in her back, wind her up and put her in front of the media will tell her about the terrible behaviour of the white masks, she will be told to ignore questions about the red shirts and if she really has to answer to say they protest peacefully as the law permits and only respond to provocation by government opponents.

[chainarong]

What do you expect, after the way the red shirts have behaved ,with their thuggish approach to all man kind and we are in charge of the world attitude, the waving of a white feather , tit for tat diplomacy at its worse and the leaders of the PTP are totally to blame.

[Robby nz]

The sad part of it as I see it is that the leaders of those wearing masks see the need for guards.

Surely in a society where there is freedom of speech, where people are free to come out and voice their opinions guards would not be needed.

If the police could be trusted to do their job of preventing violence regardless of who are the instigators then groups would not see the need for protection by their own hired guards.

That the guards in question saw fit to go after the reds on motorbikes would mean that they were expecting trouble and that is probably not unreasonable considering what has happened in the recent past.

To put it another way, they were keeping the reds on motorbikes away from the main body of those in masks which would be what they were hired to do.

Whether they were justified in bashing (without injuring) those on the bikes I don't know as I wasn't there to see the circumstances.

[Bluespunk]

Finger pointing, Guy Fawkes mask, educated in the UK? A bit of obfuscation to muddlethe field.

Maybe more like feeling a relation to other countries springtime? Opposing non-elected elites who also happen to be criminal fugitives? People wondering about a mere 40% loss on a singles year rice pledging without any details, but assurances that some trickled down to poor farmers, are pointedly better educated that those who fell for the scam?

I'm amazed. Another member who seems to suggest the red-shirts are non-educated?

Your avarage Brit has no idea about Guy Fawkes apart from the fact they can get a bit more merry than usual, burn af fire, let off some firewokks ect.

So who the <deleted> came up with idea?? probably somebody who new a lot about British history .

More than your average brit perhaps some with a joly good education!

They're not taken from Guy Fawkes but Anonymous, the internet hacking morons, who took the idea from Alan Moore's V for Vendetta graphic novel/movie. Now seen as a symbol of revolt against tyranny, fascism and thuggish govt tactics.Perfect when dealing with the fascist reds really.

Edited June 16, 2013 by Bluespunk

[Curt1591]

I'm surprised no one has come up with the standard "mysterious dark figures in white masks" approach.

[webfact]

ANTI-GOVERNMENT MOVEMENT
White mask rallies spread
The Nation


White maskers hold their third weekly demonstration against the so-called Thaksin regime at Ratchaprasong shopping area.

1,000 condemn police in march in capital; red shirts gather to show support for govt

BANGKOK: -- Anti-government white-mask protesters gathered in many provinces yesterday despite opposition from red-shirt supporters of the government.

In Bangkok, about 1,000 people - many wearing white Guy Fawkes masks - gathered at the CentralWorld shopping complex yesterday afternoon.

It was the third weekly gathering for the white maskers in the capital.

The demonstrators walked past the Royal Thai Police headquarters, located not far from Ratchaprasong shopping district. The walk was intended to protest against police "inaction" over red shirts' acts of intimidation against white-mask people in Chiang Mai on Friday.

White maskers also gathered in other provinces to show solidarity with the Chiang Mai protesters, despite earlier physical abuse by red-shirt supporters of the government and ex-premier Thaksin Shinawatra.

In Bangkok, the demonstrators shouted "Thaksin's lackeys, get out!" when they walked past the police headquarters.

About 50 red shirts gathered at the nearby Gaysorn department centre, but there were no reports of clashes between the two groups.

Street demonstrations by the white-mask people were also held in other provinces. These included the northeastern provinces of Nakhon Ratchasima, Buri Ram and Khon Kaen, and the southern provinces of Songkhla and Nakhon Si Thammarat.

The number of mask-wearing demonstrators was estimated at a few hundred in those provincial gatherings.

According to the Facebook page of 'V for Thailand', which releases information about the white mask movement, similar gatherings were held in more than 22 provinces in all regions.

Earlier yesterday, red shirts gathered in Khon Kaen in a show of support for the Yingluck government, lambasting the anti-administration white mask group and the Democrat Party. Around 200 red shirts gathered at the city shrine opposite the Central Department store, taking to a stage to attack the white mask group and the opposition party. They also issued a letter of protest to Central for allowing the white mask group to use its compound to stage anti-government protests on June 9.

Meanwhile, Phumjai Chaiya, a red-shirt leader known as DJ Tom from Chiang Mai, has called on red shirts via a "red" community radio from Lamphun, Lampang and Chiang Mai to travel to the Three Kings monument on Phra Pokklao Road in Chiang Mai for a show of force against the white mask protesters.

Phumjai said although there was a clash between the white masks and the red shirts during the anti-government protest at Chiang Mai University's Health Park and Hillside Condominium on Friday, red shirts had been instructed not to resort to violence. They would gather peacefully so that their rally does not trouble members of the public and tourists.

Pheu Thai MP for Lamphun, Sanguan Pongmani, yesterday contested allegations that the red shirts resorted to violent suppression of the white-mask group. He said the red shirts did not start the assault as alleged, claiming that reds were enraged because "their leaders were killed during the protest at the Ratchaprasong intersection in 2010". He said the red shirts were also challenged by white mask protesters holding placards lambasting Thaksin Shinawatra.

Green Politics coordinator Suriyasai Katasila demanded that the Yingluck government rein in the red shirts to prove that it does not support violence or intend to lead the country into anarchy so that it can stage a coup against its own government.

Suriyasai said the conflict between the red shirts and the white masks was intensifying and likely to spread to many provinces. The government and police must stop the red shirts, especially those in Chiang Mai carrying out illegal acts. The government camp had been acting like a hypocrite and police had been lax, he said.

"The government has not taken any action over the clash of protesters as it wants such reports to divert public attention or overshadow reports of rice pledging losses. The government's failure in its major policies and its failed administration could trigger a repeat of 'dark power' taking control of the country as happened in 2006," he said.

"The government is creating the conditions for a coup because not only should it have prevented the clashes, it has actually been pulling the strings behind them."

Pheu Thai MP Prompong Nopparit denied the party's MPs were behind the red shirts in instigating a violent clash against the white masks.


-- The Nation 2013-06-17

[waza]

A ground swell of opposition to the governments due to their policy debacles and their control by Thaksin is growing. Elections results are going against the government further eroding their support. It time for this government to realise that their policy directions are very unpopular and they should adjust them to benefit the average Thai or call early elections to prove that they still have an electoral mandate to continue with the status quo.

Edited June 16, 2013 by waza

[Robby nz]

The problem with that Waza is that should they hold an early election and win they would take it as a mandate to enact their main policy of 'bring Thaksin back free"

And what promises would they feel they had to make to win?

[wprime]

A ground swell of opposition to the governments due to their policy debacles and their control by Thaksin is growing. Elections results are going against the government further eroding their support. It time for this government to realise that their policy directions are very unpopular and they should adjust them to benefit the average Thai or call early elections tp prove that they still have an electoral mandate to continue with the status quo.

The anti-government protests only reflect a small % of the population. The majority of the population have no idea how much damage the Shinawatra family has done to the country.

[waza]

The problem with that Waza is that should they hold an early election and win they would take it as a mandate to enact their main policy of 'bring Thaksin back free"

And what promises would they feel they had to make to win?

A ground swell of opposition to the governments due to their policy debacles and their control by Thaksin is growing. Elections results are going against the government further eroding their support. It time for this government to realise that their policy directions are very unpopular and they should adjust them to benefit the average Thai or call early elections tp prove that they still have an electoral mandate to continue with the status quo.

The anti-government protests only reflect a small % of the population. The majority of the population have no idea how much damage the Shinawatra family has done to the country.

Its more that the anti government protestors, its also the voter backlash against the PTP, they have lost 5 of the last 6 by elections. They expected to win them all.

[Bellweather]

I will be very surprised if government people, starting with Chalerm, don't use this as a great excuse of warn of the danger posed by ant-government protestors and how the have to be subjected to more controls in the interests of public order.

On the other hand the reds will use it as an excuse to be even more violent, after all they have to protect their own peaceful protestors.

[Bellweather]

IN Channel have just quoted a red shirt leader in Chiang Mai who said the reds always wanted to protest peacefully but emotions had been running high as many were angry at the death of some of their leaders in 2010 ! I suppose any excuse does.

[Robby nz]

IN Channel have just quoted a red shirt leader in Chiang Mai who said the reds always wanted to protest peacefully but emotions had been running high as many were angry at the death of some of their leaders in 2010 ! I suppose any excuse does.

But their brave leaders who were going to fight to the last drop of blood were not killed they couldn't get their hands in the air quick enough to ensure it wasn't their blood that was spilt, that is the ones that didn't run away.

Some of those brave leaders are now MP.s and cabinet ministers as a reward for sending their followers to their death.

[khunron13]

what springs to mind with me is the sayings

"do unto others as they do unto you"

or

"what goes around comes around"

Ummm...it's "do unto others, as you would have them do unto you"!

[Robby nz]

Thaiwine, on 16 Jun 2013 - 22:22, said:

what springs to mind with me is the sayings

"do unto others as they do unto you"

or

"what goes around comes around"

Ummm...it's "do unto others, as you would have them do unto you"!

In this case probably

Do unto others before they do unto you........again

[ramrod711]

Red shirts attack peaceful whitemasks - this violence is deplorable.

Whitemasks attack peaceful redshirts - this violence is understandable.

hhmm...I think I'm getting the hang of moral supremacy 101 a la TV now.

What would a peaceful red shirt look like? What would he do for entertainment? If he couldn't burn, bomb, extort, conduct illegal searches, harrass other parties rallies and threaten, what would be the point of being a red shirt.

[waza]

Red shirts attack peaceful whitemasks - this violence is deplorable.

Whitemasks attack peaceful redshirts - this violence is understandable.

hhmm...I think I'm getting the hang of moral supremacy 101 a la TV now.

What would a peaceful red shirt look like? What would he do for entertainment? If he couldn't burn, bomb, extort, conduct illegal searches, harrass other parties rallies and threaten, what would be the point of being a red shirt.

[winstonc]

Finger pointing, Guy Fawkes mask, educated in the UK? A bit of obfuscation to muddlethe field.

Maybe more like feeling a relation to other countries springtime? Opposing non-elected elites who also happen to be criminal fugitives? People wondering about a mere 40% loss on a singles year rice pledging without any details, but assurances that some trickled down to poor farmers, are pointedly better educated that those who fell for the scam?

I'm amazed. Another member who seems to suggest the red-shirts are non-educated?

Your avarage Brit has no idea about Guy Fawkes apart from the fact they can get a bit more merry than usual, burn af fire, let off some firewokks ect.

So who the <deleted> came up with idea?? probably somebody who new a lot about British history .

More than your average brit perhaps some with a joly good education!

im guessing your a jealous uneducated american ,whose sad he has to history worthy of a view,,,,,

[chiang mai]

Action is reaction comes to mind and it seems that we are in for a rocky ride in Thailand. A Red versus the rest conflict could easily escalate.

Again, it's a seasonal thing.

[scorecard]

It's not really a matter of who is worse, it's a matter who provoked possible violence. With 'provoking' I do not mean the mere fact of protesting peacefully. That's within normal bounds.

In CM a small group of white masks was set upon by a large, 200 red-shirt crowd which had formed elsewhere and marched purposefully towards the white masks.

In Bangkok we have a white mask protest and protesting that we have a red-shirt protest right opposite on the same street. That I would call provocative. The precise info on the red-short motorcycles is lacking, unclear if they 'just happened to join up' or were just driving on the wrong side of the road.

BTW before I'm accused of double standards, see my post #5 here.

Fair enough. the only thing I would question is that 200 reds 'set upon' a small group. If this had happened - without police intervention as reports suggest - how come no one went to hospital? 200 reds may well have been there, but I would only say a much smaller number were involved in the violence, just like the few metal-rod bearing whitemasks didn't equate to an entire group of bloodthirsty idiots.

And as to the question of provocation, that's so difficult to prove as it becomes a chicken-and-egg proposition. Of more interest is to consider what the likely outcomes would be if one group was seen as the trouble-maker and the other the innocent and wronged party. This though is mainly significant on a wider scale - its impact on public perception.

One should also remember though that at street level there is the element of tribal breastbeating we also see in violence between groups such as rivals schools and other gangs. When these folks get all carried away they contribute to the broader outcome, possibly to the detriment of their own broader group (they exist in smaller groups with whom they identify more readily then with the umbrella 'red shirt movement') without even really thinking about it hence the redshirts apparent ability to throw reason out of the window - together with public endorsement - each time a few of their nuttier members goes mad in response to a banner or somesuch, as happened yesterday in Chiang Mai.

I can't believe you really mean this

"And as to the question of provocation, that's so difficult to prove as it becomes a chicken-and-egg proposition. Of more interest is to consider what the likely outcomes would be if one group was seen as the trouble-maker and the other the innocent and wronged party. This though is mainly significant on a wider scale - its impact on public perception."

It is an almost guaranteed thing to have the red shirts set up a rally opposite the Dems or any other anti government rally after the anti Government rally has been announced. In Chiang Mai they formed their rally and then marched to where the white mask rally was.

The question of provocation, is an automatic yes. The red shirts are forming up to cause disruption in a group of people who are smarter than them and can see that money is flowing out of their wallet not into it.

I agree with you in as much as being in close proximity with a rival group is to court danger. Whether or not it constitutes sufficient provocation for the other group to turn violent is debatable though. At the end of the day, it was the red shirts that were guilty of violent disorder yesterday, and the whitemasks guilty of it today. I guess in the west the police would ensure that the two groups didn't come near each other.

Plus the CM51 Reds do have a past history of: actual violence, severe harassment, severe intimidation, and the reds attempting to control the activities of society at large, which would make many fear that more violence from the reds is on the brink.

[Ricardo]

Wonder who came up with the Guy Fawkes mask idea??

Could it be someone educated in the UK?

Advise Mr Abhisi stays well clear to avoid finger pointing and such.

Ooops maybe tooooo late!!

Somehow I doubt that former-PM Abhisit would claim to have started this world-wide movement, as you suggest he did. Perhaps some slight exaggeration there ? Former-PM Thaksin is often credited by his true-believers with having engineered a boom in the Thai-economy, which merely coincided with a global boom, but surely most of us understand that we're watching a play on a very small stage, here ?

Interesting also that the Nation doesn't mention the clash which the OP reports, indeed they say "there were no reports of clashes between the two groups", one can only hope that the Reds will permit the peaceful democratic protests by people who think their government is crap, and reign-in any rage about what happened three years ago, when their leaders had won a notable victory which they then proceeded to give away.

Only an idiot, or a PTP-MP, would try to claim that events in Bangkok involving a former Democrat-led coalition-government years ago, justify in any way his party's followers recent violence (nothing 'alleged' about it in those video-clips) against a totally different group. Or is it now somehow illegal to be anti-Thaksin ? Yay for the Red Thought-Police !

[OzMick]

Red shirts attack peaceful whitemasks - this violence is deplorable.

Whitemasks attack peaceful redshirts - this violence is understandable.

hhmm...I think I'm getting the hang of moral supremacy 101 a la TV now.

Well now try to grasp some advanced concepts like "quantity" and "intensity".

Okay, I'll give it a go.

Violent red shirts pictured yesterday - 6-ish?

Violent whitemasks pictured today - 2-3?

Verdict - red shirts are worse.

Red shirt intensity pictured yesterday - very angry with sticks, fists and boots

Whitemasks intensity pictured today - calm with metal rods

Verdict - whitemasks are worse due to deadlier weapons, although possibly a tie since the reds looked so angry

Feel free to pass judgement if you wish.

That's great Peter, you will soon pass kindergarten at this rate. In first class you will learn that history extends beyond 2 days.

[OzMick]

Red shirts run only second to a certain religion in the number of things they find "offensive" and "provocative". They similarly fail to notice that they themselves are both.

[aussieinthailand]

Violence be-gets violence,

we call can have our say but to bash, intimidate, force your will upon other people will only hurt Thailand and the people

STOP IT...

[FarangTalk]

Finger pointing, Guy Fawkes mask, educated in the UK? A bit of obfuscation to muddlethe field.

Maybe more like feeling a relation to other countries springtime? Opposing non-elected elites who also happen to be criminal fugitives? People wondering about a mere 40% loss on a singles year rice pledging without any details, but assurances that some trickled down to poor farmers, are pointedly better educated that those who fell for the scam?

I'm amazed. Another member who seems to suggest the red-shirts are non-educated?

Your avarage Brit has no idea about Guy Fawkes apart from the fact they can get a bit more merry than usual, burn af fire, let off some firewokks ect.

So who the <deleted> came up with idea?? probably somebody who new a lot about British history .

More than your average brit perhaps some with a joly good education!

They're not taken from Guy Fawkes but Anonymous, the internet hacking morons, who took the idea from Alan Moore's V for Vendetta graphic novel/movie. Now seen as a symbol of revolt against tyranny, fascism and thuggish govt tactics.Perfect when dealing with the fascist reds really.

Except that the mask represents Guy Fawkes who planned to commit regicide and the plot was religiously motivated to kill a protestant monarch and put a catholic back on the throne. Fair stupidity for an ultra-Royalist group you have to admit.

If the red shirts are fascist what are the coup supporting, military backed ultra-royalists? Liberals?

Get a grip.

[rametindallas]

I truly wish these anti-Thaksin forces would take a lesson from Ghandi and contrast themselves, drastically, from the Red Shirts by allowing themselves to be attacked thus showing up the Police for the PTP a(( suckers that they are and give no ammunition to their critics/rivals to say "they are the same as the Red Shirts". It took a long time for Ghandi to succeed but he accomplished the seemingly impossible and got independence for India. The Reverend Martin Luther King used the same tactics very effectively in the racist Deep South of the U.S. and there are drastic changes in my own lifetime. No one wins with violence; even if you win, you lose.

[FarangTalk]

I truly wish these anti-Thaksin forces would take a lesson from Ghandi and contrast themselves, drastically, from the Red Shirts by allowing themselves to be attacked thus showing up the Police for the PTP a(( suckers that they are and give no ammunition to their critics/rivals to say "they are the same as the Red Shirts". It took a long time for Ghandi to succeed but he accomplished the seemingly impossible and got independence for India. The Reverend Martin Luther King used the same tactics very effectively in the racist Deep South of the U.S. and there are drastic changes in my own lifetime. No one wins with violence; even if you win, you lose.

The anti-democracy, ultra-Royalist movement in Thailand has always and traditionally used violence against its opponents, not to mention smear campaigns and lies to discredit forward thinkers like Pridi Banamyong.

Long, long before Thaksin came along using their tactics against them.

Their time is almost at an end and it's time for them to come to terms that it truly is the end of an era for Thailand, however some of them are so blinkered and nationalistic it will be impossible to accept the inevitable.

[Jasun]

Was this action a 'tit', or a 'tat'? I've lost track.

[rametindallas]

Your avarage Brit has no idea about Guy Fawkes apart from the fact they can get a bit more merry than usual, burn af fire, let off some firewokks ect.

So who the <deleted> came up with idea?? probably somebody who new a lot about British history .

More than your average brit perhaps some with a joly good education!They're not taken from Guy Fawkes but Anonymous, the internet hacking morons, who took the idea from Alan Moore's V for Vendetta graphic novel/movie. Now seen as a symbol of revolt against tyranny, fascism and thuggish govt tactics.Perfect when dealing with the fascist reds really.

You are 100% correct, sir. That is the definition of the origin and meaning of these masks today.

[OzMick]

Finger pointing, Guy Fawkes mask, educated in the UK? A bit of obfuscation to muddlethe field.

Maybe more like feeling a relation to other countries springtime? Opposing non-elected elites who also happen to be criminal fugitives? People wondering about a mere 40% loss on a singles year rice pledging without any details, but assurances that some trickled down to poor farmers, are pointedly better educated that those who fell for the scam?

I'm amazed. Another member who seems to suggest the red-shirts are non-educated?

Your avarage Brit has no idea about Guy Fawkes apart from the fact they can get a bit more merry than usual, burn af fire, let off some firewokks ect.

So who the <deleted> came up with idea?? probably somebody who new a lot about British history .

More than your average brit perhaps some with a joly good education!

They're not taken from Guy Fawkes but Anonymous, the internet hacking morons, who took the idea from Alan Moore's V for Vendetta graphic novel/movie. Now seen as a symbol of revolt against tyranny, fascism and thuggish govt tactics.Perfect when dealing with the fascist reds really.

Except that the mask represents Guy Fawkes who planned to commit regicide and the plot was religiously motivated to kill a protestant monarch and put a catholic back on the throne. Fair stupidity for an ultra-Royalist group you have to admit.

If the red shirts are fascist what are the coup supporting, military backed ultra-royalists? Liberals?

Get a grip.

How many Germans of the 1930s were familiar with the religious connections of the swastika, for that how many who did know gave a monkey's?

You tell others to get a grip as you grasp for something to denigrate.