Making up in Thailand

[aTomsLife]

Thai-Western relationships require a lot of compromise, to be sure. There's a steep learning curve. Our cultures vary greatly, so it's necessary to make efforts to understand and accept Thai culture. However, it's also necessary that we insist our Thai partners make efforts to understand and accept ours, too. After all, no one is forcing Thais to enter into relationships with westerners; they do so of their own free will.

In the process of trying to understand one another, there's bound to be some turbulence. But in making up with one another time and again, hopefully said turbulence will lead to a greater appreciation of each other's cultures. Otherwise, it's just airing discontent, and what's the point of staying together if only to despise one another?

In the last week, I've learned a great deal more about Thai culture, in no small thanks to the "Breaking up in Thailand" thread. Many posters, some more tactful than others, shed light on the courting process I was engaged in much of the last year. While of course I knew I was being sized up for the next stage of the relationship, I didn't realize how big a step up the next stage might be. My girlfriend echoed many of the sentiments expressed by some of the members on this forum. In essence, what to a westerner may seem becoming officially boyfriend and girlfriend, is perceived by many Thais as a quasi engagement.

I told my girlfriend this was unfair, in the sense that I didn't realize the gravity of the situation. More importantly, she knew I didn't know, and didn't bother to convey her expectations. Withholding the truth was negligent on her part, tantamount to trivializing my culture and the expectations therein.

I've been having a lot of honest, forthright discussions with my girlfriend. And we seem to have established a middle ground. Despite some posters assertions that attempting to rationalize with Thais is futile.

She is an educated, ambitious woman, and can't continually bounce back and forth between being modern and traditional when it suites her best. It's dizzying. I have my own needs, as do we all. While I aim to further my education in order to become a better teacher, I've also offered to stay and work at our relationship. There are many options that allow such a compromise, and I'm adamantly researching them.

And thus the point of this thread -- making up in Thailand. So then, what stories and advice do you have to share about reaching cultural compromises in your relationships here?

[soi41]

After a period of time you stop seeing your partner as "Thai"

She is your friend, lover, compagnion and the colour of her skin and country of origin takes second place.

Ofcourse, like in any relationship, compromises are made, but not based on big cultural differences, but on the fact that we all are different!

So don't make it more complicated, than it is.

[benalibina]

After a period of time you stop seeing your partner as "Thai"She is your friend, lover, compagnion and the colour of her skin and country of origin takes second place.Ofcourse, like in any relationship, compromises are made, but not based on big cultural differences, but on the fact that we all are different!So don't make it more complicated, than it is.

Stop seeing her as a thai ??? That can be the beginning of the end in case the partner has alterior motives. I have done that the last many years but now i know where i made the big mistake. I saw her the way you described this as well of children involved. As well=especially ! Never forget she is thai !! Sorry to write this but it hss been, is, my experience. Again sorry !

[villagefarang]

It makes things easier if one starts off in a relationship which doesn’t need so much work or effort to make it viable. It also helps if there is at least one adult present. No doubt your endeavor to educate yourself will pay dividends somewhere down the road, so I applaud your efforts.

[iancnx]

Nice one Tom, you won't regret this. If it doesn't work out at least you will be able to look back and say you did everything possible to keep the relationship going. If it works your relationship will I am sure be richer and stronger than ever.

[chrisartist]

I've had a few of those conciliatory chats with Thai women in my time. Give it three or four weeks, then please report back and tell us what beneficial changes in your relationship have occurred as a result of your chat.

[andrew]

@ OP

Listen to your GF. She's probably right and you're probably stupid.

The question is this -- is she actually worth it?

1. is she the right one for you?

2. do you really love her?

3. is she incredibly sexy?

4. is she worth the sin-sod and the house you may have to buy and the money you may have to pay the mother?

If she is, do it. And be happy. And have a great marriage. And make lots of beautiful babies.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Yesterday I asked my GF to get married. Inevitably the conversation turned to money. It's just how things work here in Asia.

I'm gonna pay. And I'm gonna make it work. I'm older and wiser, now.

Forget the opinions of the schoolboys who claim that everything here in Thailand in plain sailing.

Edited June 26, 2013 by andrew

[Bart123]

Yes either marry her or cut her loose, you aren't the right thing by her or yourself just continuing to muddle along.

And you should not compromise your career path.

[krisb]

You men are all the same.

[benalibina]

Tom, whatever i wrote a couple of posts before is how it is now. I am for sure not faultless in it all. In taking the full blame the last couple of years i forgot to balance it. I can however, eventhough i made mistakes, look myself in the mirror. 1 has to learn 1self and stay close to it. The mirror will never crack then. Good luck and lots of happiness wished for the future.

[theblether]

@ OP

Listen to your GF. She's probably right and you're probably stupid.

The question is this -- is she actually worth it?

1. is she the right one for you?

2. do you really love her?

3. is she incredibly sexy?

4. is she worth the sin-sod and the house you may have to buy and the money you may have to pay the mother?

If she is, do it. And be happy. And have a great marriage. And make lots of beautiful babies.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Yesterday I asked my GF to get married. Inevitably the conversation turned to money. It's just how things work here in Asia.

I'm gonna pay. And I'm gonna make it work. I'm older and wiser, now.

Forget the opinions of the schoolboys who claim that everything here in Thailand in plain sailing.

Congratulations on your engagement Andrew,

[aTomsLife]

@ OP

Listen to your GF. She's probably right and you're probably stupid.

The question is this -- is she actually worth it?

1. is she the right one for you?

2. do you really love her?

3. is she incredibly sexy?

4. is she worth the sin-sod and the house you may have to buy and the money you may have to pay the mother?

If she is, do it. And be happy. And have a great marriage. And make lots of beautiful babies.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Yesterday I asked my GF to get married. Inevitably the conversation turned to money. It's just how things work here in Asia.

I'm gonna pay. And I'm gonna make it work. I'm older and wiser, now.

Forget the opinions of the schoolboys who claim that everything here in Thailand in plain sailing.

1) She's right for me on a number of levels. We have similar interests, and work histories. She writes, and has even won poetry contests. She has a job similar to the one I held in New York prior to moving here, so I understand her. And since she has a decent position, she's privy to a lot of interesting stories, e.g., corruption.

2) Faced with having to leave her and not wanting to, yes, I can say that I love her.

3) Yes, she's sexy.

4) Don't know how much they'll ask, so I'll have to get back to you if and when. I figure this next year will tell all.

Congratulations and good luck to you both! How long were you together before proposing?

[aTomsLife]

Tom, whatever i wrote a couple of posts before is how it is now. I am for sure not faultless in it all. In taking the full blame the last couple of years i forgot to balance it. I can however, eventhough i made mistakes, look myself in the mirror. 1 has to learn 1self and stay close to it. The mirror will never crack then. Good luck and lots of happiness wished for the future.

It's not my nature to accept blame where it isn't warranted, for better or worse. Sorry to be so direct, but you seem awfully disgruntled with your marriage. How long have you been together?

[aTomsLife]

It makes things easier if one starts off in a relationship which doesn’t need so much work or effort to make it viable. It also helps if there is at least one adult present. No doubt your endeavor to educate yourself will pay dividends somewhere down the road, so I applaud your efforts.

I'm hoping it's smoother sailing from here. Apparently I've passed her litmus tests, and she's no longer inclined to show me a "cool heart." We'll see. I'm adamant about the relationship, but I refuse to be forced into marriage. I have a litmus test, too... and, yes, it's to see if there's an adult present. I figure if one is good, two adults present might just make things peachy. Thanks for your advice, VF.

[norrona]

@ OP

Listen to your GF. She's probably right and you're probably stupid.

The question is this -- is she actually worth it?

1. is she the right one for you?

2. do you really love her?

3. is she incredibly sexy?

4. is she worth the sin-sod and the house you may have to buy and the money you may have to pay the mother?

If she is, do it. And be happy. And have a great marriage. And make lots of beautiful babies.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Yesterday I asked my GF to get married. Inevitably the conversation turned to money. It's just how things work here in Asia.

I'm gonna pay. And I'm gonna make it work. I'm older and wiser, now.

Forget the opinions of the schoolboys who claim that everything here in Thailand in plain sailing.

Utter hogwash I have to say....why would you have to give her mother any money if SHE/your gf and wife to be is working and has her own career?

build a house......build your own house first!!!

your reply reads as if you are an old man with a maid/gf or wife of at least 40 years your junior and you know you shouldn't be with her so are happy to pay.....

as the OP said she cannot pick and choose when she wants to be modern or traditional Thai person....same goes with all this sin sod <deleted>...

Maybe I am wrong and my marriage has been a sham thus far

[aTomsLife]

@ OP

Listen to your GF. She's probably right and you're probably stupid.

The question is this -- is she actually worth it?

1. is she the right one for you?

2. do you really love her?

3. is she incredibly sexy?

4. is she worth the sin-sod and the house you may have to buy and the money you may have to pay the mother?

If she is, do it. And be happy. And have a great marriage. And make lots of beautiful babies.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Yesterday I asked my GF to get married. Inevitably the conversation turned to money. It's just how things work here in Asia.

I'm gonna pay. And I'm gonna make it work. I'm older and wiser, now.

Forget the opinions of the schoolboys who claim that everything here in Thailand in plain sailing.

Utter hogwash I have to say....why would you have to give her mother any money if SHE/your gf and wife to be is working and has her own career?

build a house......build your own house first!!!

your reply reads as if you are an old man with a maid/gf or wife of at least 40 years your junior and you know you shouldn't be with her so are happy to pay.....

as the OP said she cannot pick and choose when she wants to be modern or traditional Thai person....same goes with all this sin sod <deleted>...

Maybe I am wrong and my marriage has been a sham thus far

I'm inclined to see the sin-sot as another litmus test for compromise, to see what one's getting himself into. There are many options to consider, especially if one isn't rich.

Without getting too much into the sin-sot debate, my point is that in the spirit of compromise, there's no reason to thumb one's nose entirely at a tradition many Thais still value as a show of the man's intention. Of course if an excessive amount is sought, alarm bells should ring.

Edited June 26, 2013 by aTomsLife

[norrona]

@ OP

Listen to your GF. She's probably right and you're probably stupid.

The question is this -- is she actually worth it?

1. is she the right one for you?

2. do you really love her?

3. is she incredibly sexy?

4. is she worth the sin-sod and the house you may have to buy and the money you may have to pay the mother?

If she is, do it. And be happy. And have a great marriage. And make lots of beautiful babies.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Yesterday I asked my GF to get married. Inevitably the conversation turned to money. It's just how things work here in Asia.

I'm gonna pay. And I'm gonna make it work. I'm older and wiser, now.

Forget the opinions of the schoolboys who claim that everything here in Thailand in plain sailing.

Utter hogwash I have to say....why would you have to give her mother any money if SHE/your gf and wife to be is working and has her own career?

build a house......build your own house first!!!

your reply reads as if you are an old man with a maid/gf or wife of at least 40 years your junior and you know you shouldn't be with her so are happy to pay.....

as the OP said she cannot pick and choose when she wants to be modern or traditional Thai person....same goes with all this sin sod <deleted>...

Maybe I am wrong and my marriage has been a sham thus far

I'm inclined to see the sin-sot as another litmus test for compromise, to see what one's getting himself into. There are many options to consider, especially if one isn't rich.

Without getting too much into the sin-sot debate, my point is that in the spirit of compromise, there's no reason to thumb one's nose entirely at a tradition many Thais still value as a show of the man's intention. Of course if an excessive amount is sought, alarm bells should ring.

I agree....but to blatantly put your hands up and surrender that this is they way it is done so I won't make any fuss really doesn't sit right with me personally....

with people prepared to give in as quick as I have just read and say ok honey have it your way it is of no wonder why the majority of thai people think us silly farangs are really silly...

[Scully]

@ OP

Listen to your GF. She's probably right and you're probably stupid.

The question is this -- is she actually worth it?

1. is she the right one for you?

2. do you really love her?

3. is she incredibly sexy?

4. is she worth the sin-sod and the house you may have to buy and the money you may have to pay the mother?

If she is, do it. And be happy. And have a great marriage. And make lots of beautiful babies.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Yesterday I asked my GF to get married. Inevitably the conversation turned to money. It's just how things work here in Asia.

I'm gonna pay. And I'm gonna make it work. I'm older and wiser, now.

Forget the opinions of the schoolboys who claim that everything here in Thailand in plain sailing.

Utter hogwash I have to say....why would you have to give her mother any money if SHE/your gf and wife to be is working and has her own career?

build a house......build your own house first!!!

your reply reads as if you are an old man with a maid/gf or wife of at least 40 years your junior and you know you shouldn't be with her so are happy to pay.....

as the OP said she cannot pick and choose when she wants to be modern or traditional Thai person....same goes with all this sin sod <deleted>...

Maybe I am wrong and my marriage has been a sham thus far

The young couple who live next door to me are both at school, both about 20. They have been together since they were 15, the rent and schooling is paid for by her parents.

There was no sin-sod, just a relationship based on them being unseparable, so this schoolboy must think it's pretty much plain sailing.

There is no way I would marry a woman who discussed money as soon as i had proposed, but we are all different so I suppose I must congratulate you.

[GrantSmith]

Also be mindful, that as the male, you'll also be required to pay for the wedding reception.

Which as a farang, you might find unusual, but then again TiT so nothing should really surprise

[norrona]

Also be mindful, that as the male, you'll also be required to pay for the wedding reception.

Which as a farang, you might find unusual, but then again TiT so nothing should really surprise

Personally I got no problem paying for things....but being dictated to on it by a mother in law or even the missus even worse both would have me heading for the hills....

no way would I let myself be used for some old hag to have a bit of face in her village.....seen plenty of fellas buckle and let them get away with it which is akin to letting your puppy pee on the kitchen floor.....it won't be long till it is crapping in your bed!

[Bart123]

Special price for you - double! Actually should be triple I think, poor girl. . .

[nattydread]

another poor sod that thinks hes in love because he couldn't get a girl so young and beautiful and attentive back home

wake up and smell the coffee Thailand is all round sunshine and cheap tail and when you scrape away all the BS you will find that you are seen as lower than the fleas on a soi dog

of course my girl is different and she really loves me..honest

[Beetlejuice]

After a period of time you stop seeing your partner as "Thai"

She is your friend, lover, compagnion and the colour of her skin and country of origin takes second place.

Ofcourse, like in any relationship, compromises are made, but not based on big cultural differences, but on the fact that we all are different!

So don't make it more complicated, than it is.

you obviously have never met my wife.

[Beetlejuice]

another poor sod that thinks hes in love because he couldn't get a girl so young and beautiful and attentive back home

wake up and smell the coffee Thailand is all round sunshine and cheap tail and when you scrape away all the BS you will find that you are seen as lower than the fleas on a soi dog

of course my girl is different and she really loves me..honest

Rubbish.

My wife describes me as a cockroach and all the experts agree, that a cockroach is a higher form of life than a flea.

So you see, it`s not as bad a picture as you make out.

[benalibina]

Tom, whatever i wrote a couple of posts before is how it is now. I am for sure not faultless in it all. In taking the full blame the last couple of years i forgot to balance it. I can however, eventhough i made mistakes, look myself in the mirror. 1 has to learn 1self and stay close to it. The mirror will never crack then. Good luck and lots of happiness wished for the future.

It's not my nature to accept blame where it isn't warranted, for better or worse. Sorry to be so direct, but you seem awfully disgruntled with your marriage. How long have you been together?

More than 8 years. As indicated i have not been faultless. You are correct about blame and ...... warranted. But thats how i felt it. Now i take the approach as you indicate it. Remember as well there are 3 children involved and i have witnessed and heard things i never could have thought about. This because i did see her as a woman and not a, so called, thai woman. The culture differences and the , part of, true/hidden character one sees only when problems arise. Than you notice difference of culture and backgrounds. That is why i wrote it on here for you. Not to elaborate on my situation.

[Cambodger]

Sounds like the relationship is already a stressful one.

Few other things to consider if your going to take this girl on long term or as a wife.

No matter how beautiful and smart she is, the majority of folks back home,friends and family in particular will secretly always view her as some gold digger Thai prostitute who's just after the easy life and a US passport or a mail order bride type.

You'll have zero respect from your friends and work colleges. plus if they ever found out you'd paid a sin-sot you'd really be the biggest loser in town in their eyes. (loss of face farang style)

Harsh i know but its the reality of the country been known as "The biggest brothel in the world". Other countries have this reputation too but with Thailand unfortunately its ten times worse.

I always hated waiting at the boarding gates in airports and feeling your being scrutinised by the other passengers even though there wasn't that much off a age gap or looks gap. Even worse is when its full of old farangs with young good looking Thai girls on their arms, just amplifies the cringe factor.

Some people don't care what others think and if you're one of them congratulations, but to me its just another annoying niggle to add to all the other ones discussed in the previous thread that puts me off anything serious.

Edited June 26, 2013 by RogueTrader999

[Beetlejuice]

Sounds like the relationship is already a stressful one.

Few other things to consider if your going to take this girl on long term or as a wife.

No matter how beautiful and smart she is, the majority of folks back home,friends and family in particular will secretly always view her as some gold digger Thai prostitute who's just after the easy life and a US passport or a mail order bride type.

You'll have zero respect from your friends and work colleges. plus if they ever found out you'd paid a sin-sot you'd really be the biggest loser in town in their eyes. (loss of face farang style)

Harsh i know but its the reality of the country been known as "The biggest brothel in the world". Other countries have this reputation too but with Thailand unfortunately its ten times worse.

I always hated waiting at the boarding gates in airports and feeling your being scrutinised by the other passengers even though there wasn't that much off a age gap or looks gap. Even worse is when its full of old farangs with young good looking Thai girls on their arms, just amplifies the cringe factor.

Some people don't care what others think and if you're one of them congratulations, but to me its just another annoying niggle to add to all the other ones discussed in the previous thread that puts me off anything serious.

Total and utter tripe.

To be honest I think you had better start choosing some different friends who have a higher regard for you and whoever you choose as a wife, and it appears you have some kind of persecution complex.

I met my Thai wife in the States and both sides of my family in the States and the UK, plus all my friends accepted her immediately as a part of the family.

She was often invited to be a bridesmaid at family and friends weddings, many of my cousins took her out with them on shopping trips, she is a God mother to one of my nieces and was highly respected within the company where I worked. I have several cousins married to Thai girls and all the wives are held in high esteem by the families and friends.

As for those people you may know who regard Thailand as the world`s biggest brothel, than it seems you are mixing within the wrong circles and suggest that you disassociate yourself from them.

Obviously the guys who become involved with the females of the under classes of Thai society, those who would not look out of place working in a Pattaya beerbar, are going to attract some comments and disapproving stares, but I can assure you that any nice, decent class of young Thai lady will be treated with high esteem and respect within Western society.

Edited June 27, 2013 by metisdead
30) Do not modify someone else's post in your quoted reply, either with font or color changes, added emoticons, or altered wording.

[MAJIC]

@ OP

Listen to your GF. She's probably right and you're probably stupid.

The question is this -- is she actually worth it?

1. is she the right one for you?

2. do you really love her?

3. is she incredibly sexy?

4. is she worth the sin-sod and the house you may have to buy and the money you may have to pay the mother?

If she is, do it. And be happy. And have a great marriage. And make lots of beautiful babies.

-------------------------------------------------------------------

Yesterday I asked my GF to get married. Inevitably the conversation turned to money. It's just how things work here in Asia.

I'm gonna pay. And I'm gonna make it work. I'm older and wiser, now.

Forget the opinions of the schoolboys who claim that everything here in Thailand in plain sailing.

Utter hogwash I have to say....why would you have to give her mother any money if SHE/your gf and wife to be is working and has her own career?

build a house......build your own house first!!!

your reply reads as if you are an old man with a maid/gf or wife of at least 40 years your junior and you know you shouldn't be with her so are happy to pay.....

as the OP said she cannot pick and choose when she wants to be modern or traditional Thai person....same goes with all this sin sod <deleted>...

Maybe I am wrong and my marriage has been a sham thus far

I'm inclined to see the sin-sot as another litmus test for compromise, to see what one's getting himself into. There are many options to consider, especially if one isn't rich.

Without getting too much into the sin-sot debate, my point is that in the spirit of compromise, there's no reason to thumb one's nose entirely at a tradition many Thais still value as a show of the man's intention. Of course if an excessive amount is sought, alarm bells should ring.

I agree....but to blatantly put your hands up and surrender that this is they way it is done so I won't make any fuss really doesn't sit right with me personally....

with people prepared to give in as quick as I have just read and say ok honey have it your way it is of no wonder why the majority of thai people think us silly farangs are really silly...

And because Culture dictates,they do even more silly things,and Farangs are quite happy denying their own Culture too,it's almost like we don't have one,who ever heard of Sin Sod in Western Countries? tell them back home,and straight away they would say,"I wouldn't buy a women however beautiful and perfect she was"

[David48]

Yesterday I asked my GF to get married. Inevitably the conversation turned to money. It's just how things work here in Asia.

I'm available for both the Bucks night and the actual wedding ...

I'll PM you with the address for the invite.

Assuming I can bring the Prawn Peeler with me?

.

[Beetlejuice]

And because Culture dictates,they do even more silly things,and Farangs are quite happy denying their own Culture too,it's almost like we don't have one,who ever heard of Sin Sod in Western Countries? tell them back home,and straight away they would say,"I wouldn't buy a women however beautiful and perfect she was"

A sin sod only pertains to those guys stupid and desperate enough to pay it.

I never paid any such thing when I got married to my Thai wife, nor did the many of my friends who have married Thais over the years. If there would have been any demands for money from me at the time, my in-laws would have had their daughter returned to them, pronto. Plenty more fish in the sea.

Farangs can still maintain their own culture in Thailand, but of course keeping in mind that we are guests in a country of another culture, the majority being Thais. So we still have to adapt to the majority around us and for those not able to adapt or compromise, than they will never be happy here.

Personally I love it and enjoy mixing in with the Thais and at the same time being proud of what I am and who I am.