'Thaksin's return home is long overdue'

[deecee10]

Good or Bad will be written in history and future generations will know the actual facts

Depends, because history is written by the victors. Look at the quasi history and indoctrination being force-fed in schools around the world with American liberal academia leading the way.

Not to mention American right wing conservatives 'versions' of history.

We don't want truth distorting propaganda now, do we?

How would Fox News survive?

[hawker9000]

Could it be that he is already back?

There are unconfirmed reports (rumors) of a war room at a luxury resort on Koh Chang with a VIP in charge.

It has also been said that an immigration police officer in Trat province and an officer at the Department of Civil Aviation reported that a private plane carrying a VIP had landed at Trat airport and then that person was taken by a speed boat to Koh Chang amid tight security.

No it isn't me that's saying that, it was reported by another media source which shall remain nameless.

But anyway it is true that he is long overdue to return.

He should have returned directly after the Olympics as was the conditions of his bail

And someone should take seriously such a story based on unconfirmed reports (rumors), and something that an unidentified immigration officer & some other unidentified official are said to have said/reported, and with no identified witnesses or sources except a "media source" which you say you know but don't even want to identify......

...why?? If you can't say anything because you can't say anything, then don't say anything LOL

But sure - he can return whenever he wants! He's got a jail cell waiting for him, and no one's keeping him from returning. No one. It's not like he was chased out of the country at gunpoint. If he WERE to fly in secretly, avoiding authorities, and was then spirited away as described, acting the fugitive who dare not even show his face, wouldn't it just be more evidence of his character, duplicity and guilt (as well as possibly yet more criminal wrong-doing)?

[gemini81]

I remember this guy.

The peacefull yellow shirts ambushed him and he had to scurry over a wall at Dusit Zoo to save himself from a lynching.

No?

Did anybody prosecute that mob or are the criminals walking free I wonder?

Yes, they are to be charged for MISSING their target.

[northernjohn]

Rametindallas

No , others do not fall short . It is said that there was more corruption during the Dems brief spell in government than in the Thaksin era .

The Coup was the biggest mistake the military could have made !!! Thaksin was and still is the hero of impoverished farmers in the north and northeast .

Thaksin's conviction was that as his wife's husband he had to sign a document , thus permitting her to buy a parcel of land that had originally failed to sell and she bought by sealed tender making the highest offer .

The crime was that he was PM and his signing the document constituted a conflict of interest .

The coup so fired up the people who support Thaksin , they being the majority of voters in Thailand ; that there is not likely to be any other than a Thaksin government for the foreseeable future .

As to those who say I support corruption ; if you don't like corruption , go back to your home countries . In Thailand corruption begins in the simplest home and stretches through every strata of society , getting bigger as it goes . You cannot live in Thailand and pretend everyone is Whiter than White and just few are corrupt , it is the way of life here , as it is in countries like Italy and now even the USA . While the Dems were in power they tried to pass a law making it illegal for farmers to make their own pesticide out of herbs and spices that people eat every day . It is said that someone close to government had big investments in "Monsanto", the government was trying to clear the way for Monsanto products to be exclusively marketed in Thailand . I'm told that MPs all take a 10% cut from the profits of major industries . The details at home as to the personal shortcomings are not important if the country has a High Profile abroad and has a flourishing economy , which Thailand did under Thaksin . Before everyone call Thaksin a convicted common criminal , they need to be conversant with the facts ; some commenters have very sketchy knowledge .

I have only been here for three years and have no memory of what Thaksin did for the poor. I was there two years ago in a village in Issan and the poverty was deplorable. I saw no improvements what so ever. No street lite No TVs just poverty. What did he do for them? I was here during the attempted coup and I did notice that Abhist treated the people very gently. He could have ended it all very quickly by just telling the army to move them out when they were breaking the law but not yet organized.I guess he could have said treat them like Thaksin did the people he suspected of drugs. Don't waste time with courts just shoot them.

The one thing that jumped out at me was that Abhist himself had no real power. He seemed to be depended on to many other parties. Cross one of them and out he would be. I am not a know it all but I do know some things Abhist agreed to what the red shirts wanted only to see Thaksin tell them no they couldn't do it they would have to stay and have a lot of people killed before he would allow it. Then a little later he abandoned them and stopped their pay checks. Maybe it is me but I see some thing wrong there.

As for corruption worse under Abhist than Thaksin. Well from what I have been able to gather Thaksin held the politicians back by taking the money himself. It was only when he let go of the reins of power that the others saw the opportunities that Thaksin had been taking for himself and really went into it. A lot of those people were still in government when Abhist became PM in fact I was told it took 30 of Thaksins men changing sides to put him in the seat of course they were going to carry on with the example Thaksin had set for them.

I was not here but I was awake during the Thaksin years he did nothing other than ride on a world wide economic boom. It had nothing to do with his leadership. If he was so good at leading the country into economic wellness why has he not done that now? Transferred one massive dept to another department so he could borrow more money and run the national debt up higher. Now I see he is trying to make one loan that by itself will put Thailand in debt for 50 years.

I am sorry but I have seen the poverty in the villages. The progress in the cities was just the natural result of the world wide economic boom nothing to do with him. What is it that he has to offer the country in reality terms. I know he told them they would all be rich in 6 months. Can't say as I have noticed that in my wife's family. I also notice that he changes his mind on a regular basis.Are you saying that would be a good thing in a leader. It is OK to change your mind maybe several times until you come to a salutation but not make a public announcement of it every time. Makes him look like a person a little bit unsure of them selves.

This is an interesting discussion too that unfortunately will just butt heads between the lovers and haters. The truth is really that Thaksin was SEEN as being for the poor and helping out - it is true that for probably the first time (remember that pretty much before his time PMs were Royals, military or high born with a few exceptions) he did at least notice they existed politically and policy wise. He created the 30 baht medical scheme (and the haters will jump in that it caused many clinics to close due to bankruptcy due to poor funding for the scheme - which is true, but the point still stands that at least it was a gesture) - he also brought in the concept of micro-loans to farmers (again poorly implemented and instead of farmers investing in equipment as expected, much was wasted on mobile phones, cars, bling and booze - which ended up making the poor poorer as they now were in debt too). The Dems actually made a working free medical system (working at least for as long as they were in power), but this was thrown away with the new government and propagandard (OK made that word up) into non-existence as far as public memory seems to go. He also (and another double edged sword) made it easier for long term land users (families that had worked the government loaned land for several years at least and still did) to convert their government land into owned land (NS2 to NS3 and then chanot) - and to reclaim unused government land for re-distribution - converting NS2 to 3/ MS3 to chanot has actually been much harder to do since 2006 - but it also (the other edge) allowed for the land parcels to be available for sale which caused his Mrs so much legal grief.

"The truth is really that Thaksin was SEEN as being for the poor and helping"

That was my point what had he really done. Do we see any evidence of it now in a positive Way?

[simple1]

Does the proposed amnesty also include the dismissal of outstanding charges against Thaksin?

I understand there are cases pending his return. One example is the Thai Supreme Court ordered a warrant for Thaksin’s arrest in a case relating to the Krung Thai bank. Thaksin faces charges that include abuse of power and the violation of banking laws.

http://www.economist.com/news/asia/21568000-former-prime-ministers-allies-concede-there-no-easy-way-get-him-home-whatever-happened

[britinthai]

I have only been here just on 8 years and in that time I have seen my attitude change from taking no notice of anything but what I wanted to do to watching and commenting on what is going on.

Whatever Thaksin did or did not do in the past is behind us now but it is clear that all the problems this country is having now are caused by his greed and lust for power.

Had he been an honest man and done things solely for the good of the people and the country when he was in power I believe this would by now be a great country and he would still be PM with huge support........................ But.

He has enough wealth, probably more than all the posters here put together, he could live a life of luxury and self indulgence that most of us could never contemplate yet he wants more.

This to me is something I just don't understand, I have enough to live a reasonable life, be nice to have a bit more then I could do a few more things.

But to have billions and spend it on trying to gain power over others regardless of the trouble it causes or even the cost in lives as in the riots he funded is, as I said beyond my understanding.

Sure there are others with huge wealth who are always trying to get more but I don't see any of them trying to take over the Government of this country.

And yes it does impact on me for there are still many places I want to go, things I want to see and do in this country and there are those who want to do these things with me.

Selfish? sure but selfishness dose not hurt others as does greed and power lust.

Loss of face come to mind.

I would also like to put my view forward: Most posters talk about Thaksin as corrupt and a criminal, as are most in politics. Having seen a dramatic drop in the use of drugs during the Thaksin years, where now Thailand is riddled with drugs. Again most posters are aware that the police/military are the drug lords of Thailand and you know very well that they will never be brought to justice because the are the law. It seems to me the posters are just skimming the surface of the problem and have little idea of the route cause of why Thailand is so corrupt.

[hawker9000]

I have only been here just on 8 years and in that time I have seen my attitude change from taking no notice of anything but what I wanted to do to watching and commenting on what is going on.

Whatever Thaksin did or did not do in the past is behind us now but it is clear that all the problems this country is having now are caused by his greed and lust for power.

Had he been an honest man and done things solely for the good of the people and the country when he was in power I believe this would by now be a great country and he would still be PM with huge support........................ But.

He has enough wealth, probably more than all the posters here put together, he could live a life of luxury and self indulgence that most of us could never contemplate yet he wants more.

This to me is something I just don't understand, I have enough to live a reasonable life, be nice to have a bit more then I could do a few more things.

But to have billions and spend it on trying to gain power over others regardless of the trouble it causes or even the cost in lives as in the riots he funded is, as I said beyond my understanding.

Sure there are others with huge wealth who are always trying to get more but I don't see any of them trying to take over the Government of this country.

And yes it does impact on me for there are still many places I want to go, things I want to see and do in this country and there are those who want to do these things with me.

Selfish? sure but selfishness dose not hurt others as does greed and power lust.

Loss of face come to mind.

I would also like to put my view forward: Most posters talk about Thaksin as corrupt and a criminal, as are most in politics. Having seen a dramatic drop in the use of drugs during the Thaksin years, where now Thailand is riddled with drugs. Again most posters are aware that the police/military are the drug lords of Thailand and you know very well that they will never be brought to justice because the are the law. It seems to me the posters are just skimming the surface of the problem and have little idea of the route cause of why Thailand is so corrupt.

LOL. Talk about just skimming the surface!

[Siripon]

Does the proposed amnesty also include the dismissal of outstanding charges against Thaksin?

I understand there are cases pending his return. One example is the Thai Supreme Court ordered a warrant for Thaksins arrest in a case relating to the Krung Thai bank. Thaksin faces charges that include abuse of power and the violation of banking laws.

http://www.economist.com/news/asia/21568000-former-prime-ministers-allies-concede-there-no-easy-way-get-him-home-whatever-happened

No,this amnesty bill will not see a dropping of those charges but a change to a clause in the constitution regarding the actions of the coup makers being legal, will.

They must remove the clause legitimising the coup leadersand subsequent actions, and then the findings of such bodies as the AEC set up to examine Thaksin's actions will be declared void and court cases already in motion against him will cease.

[simple1]

Does the proposed amnesty also include the dismissal of outstanding charges against Thaksin?

I understand there are cases pending his return. One example is the Thai Supreme Court ordered a warrant for Thaksins arrest in a case relating to the Krung Thai bank. Thaksin faces charges that include abuse of power and the violation of banking laws.

http://www.economist.com/news/asia/21568000-former-prime-ministers-allies-concede-there-no-easy-way-get-him-home-whatever-happened

No,this amnesty bill will not see a dropping of those charges but a change to a clause in the constitution regarding the actions of the coup makers being legal, will.

They must remove the clause legitimising the coup leadersand subsequent actions, and then the findings of such bodies as the AEC set up to examine Thaksin's actions will be declared void and court cases already in motion against him will cease.

Thanks...

[rjcampbe]

Good or Bad will be written in history and future generations will know the actual facts

What the hell kind of fantasy world are YOU living in???

History is written by the winner, and it frequently has little to do with "facts".

[RogueLeader]

I would also like to put my view forward: Most posters talk about Thaksin as corrupt and a criminal, as are most in politics.

Having seen a dramatic drop in the use of drugs during the Thaksin years,

Source?

where now Thailand is riddled with drugs.

Source?

Again most posters are aware that the police/military are the drug lords of Thailand and you know very well that they will never be brought to justice because the are the law. It seems to me the posters are just skimming the surface of the problem and have little idea of the route cause of why Thailand is so corrupt.

Yes, of course. But you're aware that Thaksin was only getting rid of the competition when he ordered the police to murder listed, named civilians without trial?

[Noistar]

Good or Bad will be written in history and future generations will know the actual facts

What the hell kind of fantasy world are YOU living in???

History is written by the winner, and it frequently has little to do with "facts".

Hence thailand's obsession with dwelling on the past and re-writing history.

Perhaps we should be philosophical and just accept that 'facts' are in the eye of the beholder. (An off topic reference to the 'innocence' of a relative of a former high-powered minister, springs to mind)

[h90]

I have only been here just on 8 years and in that time I have seen my attitude change from taking no notice of anything but what I wanted to do to watching and commenting on what is going on.

Whatever Thaksin did or did not do in the past is behind us now but it is clear that all the problems this country is having now are caused by his greed and lust for power.

Had he been an honest man and done things solely for the good of the people and the country when he was in power I believe this would by now be a great country and he would still be PM with huge support........................ But.

He has enough wealth, probably more than all the posters here put together, he could live a life of luxury and self indulgence that most of us could never contemplate yet he wants more.

This to me is something I just don't understand, I have enough to live a reasonable life, be nice to have a bit more then I could do a few more things.

But to have billions and spend it on trying to gain power over others regardless of the trouble it causes or even the cost in lives as in the riots he funded is, as I said beyond my understanding.

Sure there are others with huge wealth who are always trying to get more but I don't see any of them trying to take over the Government of this country.

And yes it does impact on me for there are still many places I want to go, things I want to see and do in this country and there are those who want to do these things with me.

Selfish? sure but selfishness dose not hurt others as does greed and power lust.

Loss of face come to mind.

I would also like to put my view forward: Most posters talk about Thaksin as corrupt and a criminal, as are most in politics. Having seen a dramatic drop in the use of drugs during the Thaksin years, where now Thailand is riddled with drugs. Again most posters are aware that the police/military are the drug lords of Thailand and you know very well that they will never be brought to justice because the are the law. It seems to me the posters are just skimming the surface of the problem and have little idea of the route cause of why Thailand is so corrupt.

So what are you saying. Thai politics is so corrupt because a few policemen and soldiers sell drugs?

[scorecard]

I have only been here just on 8 years and in that time I have seen my attitude change from taking no notice of anything but what I wanted to do to watching and commenting on what is going on.

Whatever Thaksin did or did not do in the past is behind us now but it is clear that all the problems this country is having now are caused by his greed and lust for power.

Had he been an honest man and done things solely for the good of the people and the country when he was in power I believe this would by now be a great country and he would still be PM with huge support........................ But.

He has enough wealth, probably more than all the posters here put together, he could live a life of luxury and self indulgence that most of us could never contemplate yet he wants more.

This to me is something I just don't understand, I have enough to live a reasonable life, be nice to have a bit more then I could do a few more things.

But to have billions and spend it on trying to gain power over others regardless of the trouble it causes or even the cost in lives as in the riots he funded is, as I said beyond my understanding.

Sure there are others with huge wealth who are always trying to get more but I don't see any of them trying to take over the Government of this country.

And yes it does impact on me for there are still many places I want to go, things I want to see and do in this country and there are those who want to do these things with me.

Selfish? sure but selfishness dose not hurt others as does greed and power lust.

Loss of face come to mind.

I would also like to put my view forward: Most posters talk about Thaksin as corrupt and a criminal, as are most in politics. Having seen a dramatic drop in the use of drugs during the Thaksin years, where now Thailand is riddled with drugs. Again most posters are aware that the police/military are the drug lords of Thailand and you know very well that they will never be brought to justice because the are the law. It seems to me the posters are just skimming the surface of the problem and have little idea of the route cause of why Thailand is so corrupt.

So please enlighten me / us, what is the rout cause of corruption in Thailand, in your opinion?

[boomerangutang]

The man not only sounds quite a bit like former E. German head honcho Honicker, ....he even looks like him also.

[boomerangutang]

Does the proposed amnesty also include the dismissal of outstanding charges against Thaksin?

I understand there are cases pending his return. One example is the Thai Supreme Court ordered a warrant for Thaksin’s arrest in a case relating to the Krung Thai bank. Thaksin faces charges that include abuse of power and the violation of banking laws.

http://www.economist.com/news/asia/21568000-former-prime-ministers-allies-concede-there-no-easy-way-get-him-home-whatever-happened

Good point. Thaksin has not even faced trial for a slew of other alleged crimes - which are more dire than enabling his then-wife to purchase gov't property. Probably the most dire offense he could face, is treason: for funding and inciting what happened in 2010, and possibly also 2009 - both in Bkk.

PT is so sure that, with this amnesty bill, T will return to a hero's welcome and no jail time, .....and later regain the PM's chair. Of course, no one within PT, nor even the Reds will admit to it. Honesty was never a constraint for those sorts, anyway.

However, if the Dems get back in power, T and his lawyers/protectors, would do well to write another line in the already-flawed pending legislation: That T will have life-long immunity from any other legal charges. If T doesn't have that, and the Dems get back in power when he's back, .....then mega poop hits fan.

[SteveBarringtonGilmartin]

I remember this guy.

The peacefully yellow shirts ambushed him and he had to scurry over a wall at Dusit Zoo to save himself from a lynching.

No?

Did anybody prosecute that mob or are the criminals walking free I wonder?

Yes, this guy was "in charge" when the international airport was commandeered and closed by the yellow shirts.

YEP! I remember that act of international terrorism.

Yeah I remember too,

I arrived at the Airport to find it eerily quiet , the Emirates staff in their hurry to leave had forgotten to leave a note for their customers letting them know they had f****d off, A cop told me to leave as quickly as i could, no flights today, last couple of taxis downstairs, wanted B3000 back to Pattaya, Had to pay!! Thanks to those morons in yellow I was stuck in Pattaya for another two weeks with no money, no help from the UK goverment. and my credit cards already maxed out!

[hawker9000]

I remember this guy.

The peacefully yellow shirts ambushed him and he had to scurry over a wall at Dusit Zoo to save himself from a lynching.

No?

Did anybody prosecute that mob or are the criminals walking free I wonder?

Yes, this guy was "in charge" when the international airport was commandeered and closed by the yellow shirts.

YEP! I remember that act of international terrorism.

Yeah I remember too,

I arrived at the Airport to find it eerily quiet , the Emirates staff in their hurry to leave had forgotten to leave a note for their customers letting them know they had f****d off, A cop told me to leave as quickly as i could, no flights today, last couple of taxis downstairs, wanted B3000 back to Pattaya, Had to pay!! Thanks to those morons in yellow I was stuck in Pattaya for another two weeks with no money, no help from the UK goverment. and my credit cards already maxed out!

Yes! Morons indeed! Can you imagine? A Thai political party not checking with YOU before staging their protest! Throwing a wrench into your Pattaya, ahhh, emm, err, religious pilgrimage, like that. Why, they should be boiled in oil simply for inconveniencing you.

Much of the discussion unfortunately often doesn't really go any deeper than this (or have any more significance).

[gerry1011]

I also think that Thaksin's return is long overdue.

I thought it would be nice to quickly drop by and give you guys my opinion

Did not have time to read the thread though...

[freedom4life]

Get Thailand back-up and standing again...Thaksin can do that.

[hawker9000]

Get Thailand back-up and standing again...Thaksin can do that.

Yeap, standing, legs apart, hands against the wall, bent over.....

Edited August 6, 2013 by hawker9000

[smutcakes]

I read that Thaksin was convicted by a court stacked with Thaksins enemies, during an illegal coup.

Is this correct?

Correct, and one of the judges recently chucked her toys out of the pram at an anti Thaksin yellow shirt march, but sure the court was impartial.

[OzMick]

Yes return in handcuffs is long overdue.

The article shows the determination to get him back no matter what.

The bill will give amnesty to those who joined protests with " honest intentions " but what about those who set fire to parts of Bkk and those who encouraged and incited them ? Of I forgot, the latter got promoted.

How so? He said the Bill does not extend to the former PM.

The committee vetting the bill will have to identify them. I cannot see how Thaksin can fall in this category. This bill has made it clear that the word 'leaders' does not include Thaksin. But this depends on how each individual interprets it.

Are you being deliberately obtuse? 'Leaders' are EXCLUDED from the amnesty bill, and Somchai is claiming that Thaksin does not fall into the category of a leader, despite having organised and financed the insurrection.

He is saying that this bill DOES NOT EXCLUDE THAKSIN.

[OzMick]

I read that Thaksin was convicted by a court stacked with Thaksins enemies, during an illegal coup.

Is this correct?

Correct, and one of the judges recently chucked her toys out of the pram at an anti Thaksin yellow shirt march, but sure the court was impartial.

Could it be that the judge believes that the conviction was the correct decision, and objects to a bill proposing to over-ride the decision of the courts?

Would an appeal not have gone to a different court? Or does your anti-Thaksin conspiracy theory extend to all the courts in the country?

[smutcakes]

I read that Thaksin was convicted by a court stacked with Thaksins enemies, during an illegal coup.

Is this correct?

Correct, and one of the judges recently chucked her toys out of the pram at an anti Thaksin yellow shirt march, but sure the court was impartial.

Could it be that the judge believes that the conviction was the correct decision, and objects to a bill proposing to over-ride the decision of the courts?

Would an appeal not have gone to a different court? Or does your anti-Thaksin conspiracy theory extend to all the courts in the country?

I think her behavior in the clip answers all your questions and more, far better than I can about the ability of judges in this country being impartial, logical and fair. It was just a couple of years ago when a clear video clip of them rigging the eligibility exam was posted.

[Noistar]

I read that Thaksin was convicted by a court stacked with Thaksins enemies, during an illegal coup.

Is this correct?

Correct, and one of the judges recently chucked her toys out of the pram at an anti Thaksin yellow shirt march, but sure the court was impartial.

Could it be that the judge believes that the conviction was the correct decision, and objects to a bill proposing to over-ride the decision of the courts?

Would an appeal not have gone to a different court? Or does your anti-Thaksin conspiracy theory extend to all the courts in the country?

I think her behavior in the clip answers all your questions and more, far better than I can about the ability of judges in this country being impartial, logical and fair. It was just a couple of years ago when a clear video clip of them rigging the eligibility exam was posted.

So this is why he refused to appeal against the sentence for a criminal act.

I was under the impression he 'promised' to return to face the verdict, after the Olympics. A man of honour indeed. Or someone with a yellow-streak - heh, Thaksin's a yellow!

[whybother]

I read that Thaksin was convicted by a court stacked with Thaksins enemies, during an illegal coup.

Is this correct?

Correct, and one of the judges recently chucked her toys out of the pram at an anti Thaksin yellow shirt march, but sure the court was impartial.

You might want to check when Thaksin was actually convicted.

[billd766]

I read that Thaksin was convicted by a court stacked with Thaksins enemies, during an illegal coup.

Is this correct?

Correct, and one of the judges recently chucked her toys out of the pram at an anti Thaksin yellow shirt march, but sure the court was impartial.

At the risk of being politically incorrect you are spouting male bovine excretia as usual.

[Noistar]

I read that Thaksin was convicted by a court stacked with Thaksins enemies, during an illegal coup.

Is this correct?

Correct, and one of the judges recently chucked her toys out of the pram at an anti Thaksin yellow shirt march, but sure the court was impartial.

Could it be that the judge believes that the conviction was the correct decision, and objects to a bill proposing to over-ride the decision of the courts?

Would an appeal not have gone to a different court? Or does your anti-Thaksin conspiracy theory extend to all the courts in the country?

I think her behavior in the clip answers all your questions and more, far better than I can about the ability of judges in this country being impartial, logical and fair. It was just a couple of years ago when a clear video clip of them rigging the eligibility exam was posted.

You ought to realise by now that the legal system, like many things in Thailand, is a suggestion, not an absolute.

[HuaHinHarold]

Does the proposed amnesty also include the dismissal of outstanding charges against Thaksin?

I understand there are cases pending his return. One example is the Thai Supreme Court ordered a warrant for Thaksin’s arrest in a case relating to the Krung Thai bank. Thaksin faces charges that include abuse of power and the violation of banking laws.

http://www.economist.com/news/asia/21568000-former-prime-ministers-allies-concede-there-no-easy-way-get-him-home-whatever-happened

Good point. Thaksin has not even faced trial for a slew of other alleged crimes - which are more dire than enabling his then-wife to purchase gov't property. Probably the most dire offense he could face, is treason: for funding and inciting what happened in 2010, and possibly also 2009 - both in Bkk.

PT is so sure that, with this amnesty bill, T will return to a hero's welcome and no jail time, .....and later regain the PM's chair. Of course, no one within PT, nor even the Reds will admit to it. Honesty was never a constraint for those sorts, anyway.

However, if the Dems get back in power, T and his lawyers/protectors, would do well to write another line in the already-flawed pending legislation: That T will have life-long immunity from any other legal charges. If T doesn't have that, and the Dems get back in power when he's back, .....then mega poop hits fan.

He was charged with terrorism with a possible death penalty sentence.