New rules for extensions of stay with expiring passport

[mahjongguy]

Please stop talking about this rule raising Immigration's income from fees. In a 5 or 10 year period it might cause you to pay 0 to 1900 baht more to Immigration if you extend with less than a year left on your passport. If you do extend with more than a year remaining, you will get less than 5 or 10 years out of your passport but Immigration will get nothing additional at all.

Consider instead that their previous method of handling this was causing some problems.

[fittobethaied]

THat's what I am wondering how illogical would it be for me to re apply, just got my yearly extension last april so good till april 2014, passport is valid till december 2014, yet october 2013 I'm getting a new one. It would make no sense at all for me to have to re apply since extension is valid till april 2014, in November 2013 when I wil get my new passport I expect a transfer, and not having to re apply !!

Someone just said a few posts back that they were down at Immigration and was told that there would no longer be any transfers allowed.

[Mario2008]

It is not known how they will react to new passports before the expiry date of the old passport. I presume you don't have to go to immigraiton immidiately when you have a new passport. (As was ever the case).

Extensions of stay have always started from the date the current extension ends. So if your extension and passport are valid till September 1 and you visit immigraiton with the new paspsort and paperwork on 15 August, you should get a new 1 year permisison to stay dated from Sept.1.

But again, that is my guess.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

All of this is just another reason to look carefully at your extension of stay expiry date each year, and see how that falls in relation to any upcoming passport expiry date. And make sure you're going to have a least one year remaining on your passport, including getting a new one beforehand if necessary, when you go for any new extension of stay request.

Another reason to not wait until the very end for getting a new passport is many countries require you to have at least six months remaining validity on your passport when traveling on international air flights. Thailand used to have that requirement, but no longer does. However many/most other countries still do.

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/505152-passport-validity-dates/?hl=+6#8208month%20%20passport%20%20validity%20%20requirement=

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Good to know... So guess will need to apply for new passport so that will get the new one within the 30 day window of when planning to do your extension...

So if passport expires Jan of 2017 and extensions are normally done in June... Then would need to get new passport beginning of June 2016 ... So apply for new passport around mid May 2016

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

If I am understanding this all correctly, even if you renew your passport way before its expiry date, that effectively cancels the old passport which makes the existing extension invalid. Unless you can time the renewal of the passport to close to the exact date that you go for an extension of your visa, then there's going to be some time frame during which you are actually here illegally...unless of course you re-apply for the extension, pay the 1900 baht and jump through all the hoops when you receive your new passport. Is it worth the risk that someone in authority might ask to see your passport during that time and realize that you are not in compliance with the law?

No, getting a new passport doesn't automatically cancel an otherwise valid extension of stay in the "old" passport, so long as the old passport and its extension of have not yet reached their expiry dates.

A valid extension in an "old' but still unexpired passport remains valid -- even if a new passport has been issued early -- until the expiry of the extension itself and/or the "old" passport.

However, someone in that situation would need to keep that old passport that's yet to reach its expiry date, and the extension of stay stamp in it, until the stamp's either been transferred over to a new passport or a new stamp's been issued for the new passport.

Edited August 27, 2013 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Pib]

Sure glad I made the decision to renew my passport 9 months early last month before getting my extension on the 14th of this month.

The time lost on passport equals in cost (about $6) to a lot less than 1900 baht and $50 for a new income affidavit.

If this new regulation policy is still in effect 9 years from now when my current U.S. passport is due renewal again, and assuming I'm still alive and living in Thailand then, I guess I will renew my passport about 8 months early, say Aug XX, before its current Apr XX expiration date in order to line it up better with my yearly retirement extension of stay renewal which is early Oct (although I always do it 3-4 weeks early in early Sep). Although I'll lose time on my current passport I would prefer to have it aligned better with my yearly extension in order to avoid two extensions and two 1900 baht fees over a 12 month period.

But then another 10 years later, if still alive and living in Thailand, I would be in the situation of only getting 10 months for my extension since my passport would only have 10 months left on it...so, do I avoid this my renewing my passport say 11 months early in order to get a full 12 month extension or just taking the 10 month extension. Look like come passport renewal (every 5 to 10 years depending on how often your passport must be renewed...10 years for U.S. folks) I'll probably just have to suck-up some lost time on my passport or the extension of stay.

Durn shame they implementing this new policy as it only takes them 5 minutes to transfer the extension of stay info from you old passport to your new/renewed passport....I did this a few months ago in Mar I think it was....easy and fast process.

The new policy puts more costs and paperwork on the customers whenever your passport requires renewal and makes immigration more money---sounds like the bureaucratic thing to do.

If they just have to make more money, why don't they just charge something to transfer the extension of say info from the old to new passport without requiring a person to reapply for an extension of stay which also involves other costs like the embassy income letter, bank letter...and of course extra paperwork?

[fittobethaied]

Good to know... So guess will need to apply for new passport so that will get the new one within the 30 day window of when planning to do your extension...

So if passport expires Jan of 2017 and extensions are normally done in June... Then would need to get new passport beginning of June 2016 ... So apply for new passport around mid May 2016

Sent from my iPhone using ThaiVisa app

If I am understanding this all correctly, even if you renew your passport way before its expiry date, that effectively cancels the old passport which makes the existing extension invalid. Unless you can time the renewal of the passport to close to the exact date that you go for an extension of your visa, then there's going to be some time frame during which you are actually here illegally...unless of course you re-apply for the extension, pay the 1900 baht and jump through all the hoops when you receive your new passport. Is it worth the risk that someone in authority might ask to see your passport during that time and realize that you are not in compliance with the law?

No, getting a new passport doesn't automatically cancel an otherwise valid extension of stay in the "old" passport, so long as the old passport and its extension of have not yet reached their expiry dates.

A valid extension in an "old' but still unexpired passport remains valid -- even if a new passport has been issued early -- until the expiry of the extension itself and/or the "old" passport.

However, someone in that situation would need to keep that old passport that's yet to reach its expiry date, and the extension of stay stamp in it, until the stamp's either been transferred over to a new passport or a new stamp's been issued for the new passport.

I think this might be a question to ask of our Embassy. From my experience there is no such thing as an "old" passport that is still valid for use after a new one has been issued. The "old" passport if effectively invalidated and is clipped on the corner...which prevents it from being accepted for use. This is not something that I'd like to guess on, so we'd better get some confirmation from the Embassies.

Edited August 27, 2013 by fittobethaied

[zaZa9]

Hopefully Mario or Lite Beer is reading this.

On my visit to Phuket Immigration last week on a seperate matter ( A Certificate of Residency to go for a bike license) I was told I needed to transfer my Retirement Visa Extension stamp to my new passport.

My stamp was issued Jan 23 , 2013 (and expires 6 Feb 2014)in my old passport ( exp March 2014 ) and that passport was full , so the stamp needed to go into my new passport ( issued April 2013).

But after all the photocopies and application was done , ( no talk of a 'fee') I was asked for A LETTER FROM MY EMBASSY requesting the transfer of the stamp!

As much as I dont like to challenge anyone there , I inadvertantly did so by being puzzled , and was sent to the female 'boss' at the back , who verified that this was a new requirement , and showed me one from a Russian Embassy.

The Farang 'Tourist Police' helpers also had just heard of this , and said in passing , "We will have to let Larry Cunningham ( the local Australian Consul) know about this one.."

Back home I called him.

He was in disbelief.

He told me to call back this week , but so far his phone is not on.

Tomorrow I will revisit the TP there and see if I can find out more details..

My question is , "Has anybody heard about the requirement of a letter from your Embassy requesting 'a transfer of Stamp' ?

( Please note , my old passport isnt expired. It was just full of stamps and I carry the old and new together)

[jrtmedic]

The "letter" relating to a new passport has been an issue for some time.

I believe the USA issue the letter as routine now but others are still playing "catch up".

[XJSJohn]

maybe the option here is to apply for a duplicate passport, then when the old one expires / chops expire you just get them transferred to teh duplicate one.

Visa application time windows are a perfectly valid reason for having duplicate (UK) passports, as i do for China and India business requests.

[Lite Beer]

Hopefully Mario or Lite Beer is reading this.

On my visit to Phuket Immigration last week on a seperate matter ( A Certificate of Residency to go for a bike license) I was told I needed to transfer my Retirement Visa Extension stamp to my new passport.

My stamp was issued Jan 23 , 2013 (and expires 6 Feb 2014)in my old passport ( exp March 2014 ) and that passport was full , so the stamp needed to go into my new passport ( issued April 2013).

But after all the photocopies and application was done , ( no talk of a 'fee') I was asked for A LETTER FROM MY EMBASSY requesting the transfer of the stamp!

As much as I dont like to challenge anyone there , I inadvertantly did so by being puzzled , and was sent to the female 'boss' at the back , who verified that this was a new requirement , and showed me one from a Russian Embassy.

The Farang 'Tourist Police' helpers also had just heard of this , and said in passing , "We will have to let Larry Cunningham ( the local Australian Consul) know about this one.."

Back home I called him.

He was in disbelief.

He told me to call back this week , but so far his phone is not on.

Tomorrow I will revisit the TP there and see if I can find out more details..

My question is , "Has anybody heard about the requirement of a letter from your Embassy requesting 'a transfer of Stamp' ?

( Please note , my old passport isnt expired. It was just full of stamps and I carry the old and new together)

Yes there is a requirement to provide a letter from the Embassy when transferring Immigration stamps.

Something to do with proof that the Passport is not forged I think.

[Mario2008]

Hopefully Mario or Lite Beer is reading this.

On my visit to Phuket Immigration last week on a seperate matter ( A Certificate of Residency to go for a bike license) I was told I needed to transfer my Retirement Visa Extension stamp to my new passport.

My stamp was issued Jan 23 , 2013 (and expires 6 Feb 2014)in my old passport ( exp March 2014 ) and that passport was full , so the stamp needed to go into my new passport ( issued April 2013).

But after all the photocopies and application was done , ( no talk of a 'fee') I was asked for A LETTER FROM MY EMBASSY requesting the transfer of the stamp!

As much as I dont like to challenge anyone there , I inadvertantly did so by being puzzled , and was sent to the female 'boss' at the back , who verified that this was a new requirement , and showed me one from a Russian Embassy.

The Farang 'Tourist Police' helpers also had just heard of this , and said in passing , "We will have to let Larry Cunningham ( the local Australian Consul) know about this one.."

Back home I called him.

He was in disbelief.

He told me to call back this week , but so far his phone is not on.

Tomorrow I will revisit the TP there and see if I can find out more details..

My question is , "Has anybody heard about the requirement of a letter from your Embassy requesting 'a transfer of Stamp' ?

( Please note , my old passport isnt expired. It was just full of stamps and I carry the old and new together)

Inded off topic, but in short yes it is normal to ask for it. (Although many immigration offices do not ask for the letter). I have never been asked for the letter myself, but my new paspsort mentions that it is a replacement of my old passport and gives the number of my old passport.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

If I am understanding this all correctly, even if you renew your passport way before its expiry date, that effectively cancels the old passport which makes the existing extension invalid. Unless you can time the renewal of the passport to close to the exact date that you go for an extension of your visa, then there's going to be some time frame during which you are actually here illegally...unless of course you re-apply for the extension, pay the 1900 baht and jump through all the hoops when you receive your new passport. Is it worth the risk that someone in authority might ask to see your passport during that time and realize that you are not in compliance with the law?

No, getting a new passport doesn't automatically cancel an otherwise valid extension of stay in the "old" passport, so long as the old passport and its extension of have not yet reached their expiry dates.

A valid extension in an "old' but still unexpired passport remains valid -- even if a new passport has been issued early -- until the expiry of the extension itself and/or the "old" passport.

However, someone in that situation would need to keep that old passport that's yet to reach its expiry date, and the extension of stay stamp in it, until the stamp's either been transferred over to a new passport or a new stamp's been issued for the new passport.

I think this might be a question to ask of our Embassy. From my experience there is no such thing as an "old" passport that is still valid for use after a new one has been issued. The "old" passport if effectively invalidated and is clipped on the corner...which prevents it from being accepted for use. This is not something that I'd like to guess on, so we'd better get some confirmation from the Embassies.

W/e're not talking here about what the Embassies think or don't think, or whether an "old" (not yet expired date) passport can be used for other purposes such as international travel.

We're talking about what Thai Immigration will accept and their policy. And it's their policy that a still valid extension of stay in a still valid (meaning not yet reached its expiry date) passport -- even once a new passport already has been issued -- is considered valid for Thai Immigration purposes.

A few months ago, I obtained a new passport to replace my old passport that was to expire late this year, ahead of an upcoming retirement extension renewal. And when I was down at Bangkok Immigration, I discussed this very point at some length with one of the Immigration supervisors there.

Yes, my old passport had been hole punched by my Embassy here when they issued the new passport book to me. But as long as that "old" passport had not reached its expiration date as yet, Thai Immigration will accept any valid stamps in it as remaining valid.

Edited August 27, 2013 by TallGuyJohninBKK

[Tywais]

No, getting a new passport doesn't automatically cancel an otherwise valid extension of stay in the "old" passport, so long as the old passport and its extension of have not yet reached their expiry dates.

A valid extension in an "old' but still unexpired passport remains valid -- even if a new passport has been issued early -- until the expiry of the extension itself and/or the "old" passport.

However, someone in that situation would need to keep that old passport that's yet to reach its expiry date, and the extension of stay stamp in it, until the stamp's either been transferred over to a new passport or a new stamp's been issued for the new passport.

The caveat here is after you receive your new passport your old passport is cancelled (holes in it for US) and believe kept by the embassy/consulate for some countries. So you have an invalid passport (cancelled) with your permission of stay in it and a new passport with no permission of stay. As such it seems one would have to transfer the extension to the new passport to stay legal.

[rhino533]

My usual year extension is in mid December. My passport expires Aug 2014. So does that mean I need to get a new passport mid November this year to avoid re applying for my extension twice in a year?? Once I get my new passport in November will they transfer the old visa to my new passport without having to re apply? I would still have 8 months before my old passport expired and a month before my visa expired. They should transfer my visa without issue because my old passport didn't expire yet right? What a pain in the A**.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

The caveat here is after you receive your new passport your old passport is cancelled (holes in it for US) and believe kept by the embassy/consulate for some countries. So you have an invalid passport (cancelled) with your permission of stay in it and a new passport with no permission of stay. As such it seems one would have to transfer the extension to the new passport to stay legal.

Tywais, I can only speak directly for the situation with the U.S., which gives back the old passports to its citizens, with two holes punched through them, when the new passport is issued.

But, as Thai Immigration told me, not specific to being an American, as long as the holder still has that "old" passport in their possession with the still valid stamps in it, they're fine until they reach their expiry date... Even if that same person is already holding their new passport.

If what you say is correct and some embassies/consulates keep the old passports when new ones are issued, how would citizens of those countries ever be able to have their Immigration stamps transferred over to the new book?

[oldsailor35]

Does the Immigration dept., of any other country have so many changes and updates as the Thai Immigration ?

[tinhead]

Old Canadian passport returned to me and says that the new passport is a continuation of old passport and that all visas within are still valid.

China accepted old and new passport on recent visit and Hong Kong just awarded me eChannel using old and new passport.

Presume other countries do the same upon renewal of passport?

[ubonjoe]

My usual year extension is in mid December. My passport expires Aug 2014. So does that mean I need to get a new passport mid November this year to avoid re applying for my extension twice in a year?? Once I get my new passport in November will they transfer the old visa to my new passport without having to re apply? I would still have 8 months before my old passport expired and a month before my visa expired. They should transfer my visa without issue because my old passport didn't expire yet right? What a pain in the A**.

Get new passport in November and do extension giving them both passports. They transfer info from old passport to new one and do new extension in it.

[jrtmedic]

TallGuyJohninBKK

Some are naive travellers.

Whilst working I travelled for several years using two passports.

One valid and one expired but containing a valid visa !

-Never a problem !

[mosan]

Just for the record, when I got my new passport, the American Embassy automatically gave me a letter addressed to Immigrations requesting the transfer of information to my new passport. In the mean time, I'll look around and see if I have a copy of that letter in my files somewhere. Mind you, this was a back in 2006 when I last renewed my passport.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

My usual year extension is in mid December. My passport expires Aug 2014. So does that mean I need to get a new passport mid November this year to avoid re applying for my extension twice in a year?? Once I get my new passport in November will they transfer the old visa to my new passport without having to re apply? I would still have 8 months before my old passport expired and a month before my visa expired. They should transfer my visa without issue because my old passport didn't expire yet right? What a pain in the A**.

You can apply for a new retirement extension up to 45 days prior to the expiry of your existing one.

So if you got a new passport by the start of November 2013, you'd then be able to use that new passport at that point (from early Nov. to mid-December) to apply for a regular new extension for the normal Dec. 2013-Dec. 2014 cycle.

You shouldn't have to transfer your old extension of stay (the one expiring mid-Dec. 2013). Just apply for a new one with a new passport once you have the new passport in hand.

[merijn]

I was well aware of this fact that it will happen sooner or the later. I have been lucky to have my passport extended before this rule came out. Being informative is always rewarding indeed.

Thanks for sharing your expertise in time!

I could have mentioned this on this forum as a early warning. But then its against the rules and policies of Immigration as well as this forum. Secondly in case of non-existence of the said rule would have back fire my credibility on this forum. I hope you can understand my point.

That's way i stopped providing new information as it shot down straight away.

[Tywais]

But, as Thai Immigration told me, not specific to being an American, as long as the holder still has that "old" passport in their possession with the still valid stamps in it, they're fine until they reach their expiry date... Even if that same person is already holding their new passport.

If what you say is correct and some embassies/consulates keep the old passports when new ones are issued, how would citizens of those countries ever be able to have their Immigration stamps transferred over to the new book?

Thanks for the info just looked like a catch-22. I read it in a topic at some point in time about passport not being returned but don't know what country. I see Canada and Australia you have to request the old one to be returned by checking it on the application form or they will destroy it. The US does return it but at the discretion of the State Department, such as if it appears damaged. Suspect the vast majority here though it is not an issue.

[Pib]

Yea, the U.S. still gives you the letter automatically. I renewed my passport at the US Bangkok Embassy earlier this year a few months before it was to expire and approx. 10 days later I got an email I could come pickup my new passport. Went and picked the new passport up, they automatically give you the letter, and you get your old/cancelled with holes punched in it passport back. A week or so later I went to Bangkok Immigration and they transferred the retirement extension of stay info from the old to new passport and extend the extension of stay out to the full 12 months since they had only given me 6 months extension earlier since my passport was expiring in 6 month. Piece of cake...took one simple form and about 10 minutes...no fee then.

[mosan]

I'd like to reiterate that it's been made almost clear that no new transfers will be issued, only new extensions. If you joined late and started reading in the middle of the thread, then I suggest you go back and start reading from the beginning.

[mca]

My British passport expires in March 2015. In my ignorance what is the earliest I can apply for a new one?

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Just for the record, when I got my new passport, the American Embassy automatically gave me a letter addressed to Immigrations requesting the transfer of information to my new passport. In the mean time, I'll look around and see if I have a copy of that letter in my files somewhere. Mind you, this was a back in 2006 when I last renewed my passport.

I got the same letter from the U.S. consulate a couple months ago when I applied for and received my new passport.

That makes sense because, they're issuing new passports year round. And they're not concerning themselves with how individual people's passport expiry dates fall relative to their Thai Immigration extension of stay expiry dates.

In general, once someone has a new passport, the general wisdom has been to go to Immigration and get one's stamps transferred over to the new book. That way, if nothing else, you don't have to be keeping two different passports.

But what I wanted to know, when I was down at Immigration for that purpose, was HOW SOON after you get a new passport do you need/want to have that transferring done, because I couldn't find any clear answer about that here on ThaiVisa.

And that was what led to the conversation with the Immigration supervisor at Chaeng Wattana, who advised that as long as you're still holding the old, not yet expired passport, any extension stamps in it remain valid as long as the old passport has not yet reached its expiry date -- even once the new passport has already been issued.

[jrtmedic]

My British passport expires in March 2015. In my ignorance what is the earliest I can apply for a new one?

I would apply 7-8 months prior to expiry. The unused months will be credited to the new passport.

https://www.gov.uk/renew-adult-passport

Edited August 27, 2013 by jrtmedic

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

Old Canadian passport returned to me and says that the new passport is a continuation of old passport and that all visas within are still valid.

China accepted old and new passport on recent visit and Hong Kong just awarded me eChannel using old and new passport.

Presume other countries do the same upon renewal of passport?

Yes... For example, Thai Immigration advised me that if I had waited and not transferred my then current, still valid extension of stay stamp into my new passport, I would have needed to have carried BOTH passports when traveling outside of Thailand.

The new passport with its new passport number because that would be my valid travel document. And the old passport, because that is where Thai Immigration, upon my return, would find my re-entry permit and permission to stay date.