Thai PM Yingluck Shinawatra offers to cancel election

[saltandpepper]

‘‘It would be better if you do not go out because you will find we have taken over the polling stations,’’ Mr Suthep told voters.

Once again Suthep is trying to intimidate voters.

I certainly clearly remember the intimidation your friends used to perform while they were storming Bangkok back in 2010, and I can confirm that what you call intimidation from Suthep is just next to nothing.

[Melyn]

What a sad day for Thailand!!

The powers behind the scene pulling the strings and getting their way again!!

All to keep an outdated feudal system in place!!

And I see the Shins for, what they are. A corrupt family feeding their cronies!

If all this ends with a "peoples council", the clock has just been turned back another 50 years!!

What is wrong with a Peoples Council if it is a council of the people....if that occurred then the clock would be starting to move to the next 50 years with a better opportunity for Democracy. Suthep may only be the way and not the solution.

Before you post next time, please do your homework!!

The "people" in Sutheps council are going to be appointed from the top-layers of Thai society, to save the Thai voters the inconvenience of going to the ballot-box for the next year, decade or century!

Believe me, Sutheps way is not leading to a future democratic Thailand!

That's not what he said and you know that full well.

People who come on here to lie should be banned. You just disrupt sensible discussion

Sent from my Nexus 7 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[Bluespunk]

"Thailands embattled government has offered to call off an election set for February 2 if protesters end their rallies and promise not to obstruct or boycott a new one within months."

Do they really think this is what the protestors want? How will this meet their demands for reform? Clueless.

What Suthep wants, is not what the country wants, kindly refer to the poll on this forum, that state 79% of Thai's polled plan to vote!

Finally, the elitist lapdogs on the Court realize they have no authority to make such a ruling on postponing an election under the constitution. And referred to the Army cancelling the 2006 election,in their decision that it had been done before! (very thin legal grounds)

It places the Government back in control of the situation, Yingluck offered reasonable conditions that all parties must agree to prior to such an agreement. If they refuse to agree on the reasonable offer.

Then is by there refusal, to end the protest, that the election was not postponed.

Ball back in your court, Suthep!

Classic!

How does calling an election without agreeing to discuss the protesters calls for change change anything? All this "offer" does is change the date, nothing else.

suthep's fascist council isn't the solution but the protesters feel there does need to be change and some sort of framework created to bring it about.

Changing the date won't do this.

As for polls, a poll gives the answers the pollsters want it to.

What part of the "Majority Rule" in a democratic system, do you not understand, A democracy is ruled by the vote of the majority, not the illegal acts of the minority.

Yes I know a common tactic is to question the validity of a poll that does not favor, your opinion.

Cheers

I support democracy. However winning an election means you rule for the benefit of the country not your cliques. It means you rule in a manner that brings a country forward and aims for conciliation and consensus. PT has done none of that. Yes if they win they have the right to govern but they also have a duty to rule in a legitimate, beneficial manner. Unless PT and other political groupings change their nepotistic, decisive, corrupt practices then this cycle of protests, occupations and political violence will never end. Clear enough.

P.S. the poll supported my position, its still BS. All polls carried out with a preconceived view are.

Edited January 25, 2014 by Bluespunk

[binjalin]

Nope. I've never supported suthep's fascist council or their loony plans. I also support elections and have made that clear. However the protesters have legitimate complaints. Govts once in power can do whatever they want with impunity. PT pushed this behaviour too far and now change and an end to corruption in govt is being called for.

My question is how will simply changing the date of an election bring this about? There is nothing in the OP about a dialogue being opened between the two sides to find a middle ground free of the likes of suthep and chalerm and their ilk.

Or did I miss something?

yes, to be fair, you have never supported Suthep

my point is - if there is a 3 month delay both sides have that time to put their arguments to the populace - then let the people decide do they want a PTP government or the Un-Dems/elites in power OR a Suthep led People's Fascist Council Party

lay it all out - debate and argue - then vote

Edited January 25, 2014 by binjalin

[sweatalot]

What a sad day for Thailand!!

The powers behind the scene pulling the strings and getting their way again!!

All to keep an outdated feudal system in place!!

And I see the Shins for, what they are. A corrupt family feeding their cronies!

If all this ends with a "peoples council", the clock has just been turned back another 50 years!!

What is wrong with a Peoples Council if it is a council of the people....if that occurred then the clock would be starting to move to the next 50 years with a better opportunity for Democracy. Suthep may only be the way and not the solution.

When I read all the people condmening the people's council that Suthep suggests in order to end the antidemocracy that resulted from the present constitution (or its abuse) . And to act before election in this corrupt system would perpetuate the bug - I wonder if the constitution makers who gave Germany the constitution after the war were democratically elected. And if not - was it a mistake?

Why should it be wrong to have independent people fixing the conditions to allow clean democratic elections and a cleaner democracy in Thailand?

Notabene Suthep said he will nor be member of the council nor of the next government!

[inutil]

Because they wont be independent. For heavens sake...

[potters]

"Thailands embattled government has offered to call off an election set for February 2 if protesters end their rallies and promise not to obstruct or boycott a new one within months."

Do they really think this is what the protestors want? How will this meet their demands for reform? Clueless.

What Suthep wants, is not what the country wants, kindly refer to the poll on this forum, that state 79% of Thai's polled plan to vote!

Finally, the elitist lapdogs on the Court realize they have no authority to make such a ruling on postponing an election under the constitution. And referred to the Army cancelling the 2006 election,in their decision that it had been done before! (very thin legal grounds)

It places the Government back in control of the situation, Yingluck offered reasonable conditions that all parties must agree to prior to such an agreement. If they refuse to agree on the reasonable offer.

Then is by there refusal, to end the protest, that the election was not postponed.

Ball back in your court, Suthep!

Classic!

How does calling an election without agreeing to discuss the protesters calls for change change anything? All this "offer" does is change the date, nothing else.

suthep's fascist council isn't the solution but the protesters feel there does need to be change and some sort of framework created to bring it about.

Changing the date won't do this.

As for polls, a poll gives the answers the pollsters want it to.

What part of the "Majority Rule" in a democratic system, do you not understand, A democracy is ruled by the vote of the majority, not the illegal acts of the minority.

Yes I know a common tactic is to question the validity of a poll that does not favor, your opinion.

Cheers

Great point.

Had the Dems decided to stand would they not have had a great chance

to win over the Rice Farmers right now,and thus breach the North East.

No they decline and continue to pamper to the whims of the minority.

Come up with clear policies that the people can believe in and go and win hearts and minds.

Then and only then will you remove the Shins.

Thaksin to Suthep my god talk about jumping out of the frying pan into the fire.

[puanddavid]

In some way this is to save the DP and help it survive...There is a constitution provision that states boycotting an election twice, will eliminate any given political Party.....Now the EC and PAD-Dem user-friendly courts are trying to save the Party...

Great message. I was wondering why Yingluck was offering this, On the surface it appears to weaken their stance. But if what you say about boycotting an election twice is true, it really puts the PAD-DEMs against the wall, and they have to play ball. Or, pull the country into more chaos, which I do not want to see.

[Crushdepth]

a noble offer to try and end the crisis... she could not do it before the Court said it was legal. If the fascists and the Un-Democratic Party agree to stop the attempted coup and support a delayed election in a few months there will be time in the interregnum to discuss the complaints of the yellows in public - their proposals for reform - what people would get if they vote for them

THEN the people can vote on it at the election

'Noble' would be putting the interests of country she swore to serve before that of her family and their corrupt depredations.

At this stage noble would probably entail buggering off before anyone else gets killed.

[binjalin]

In some way this is to save the DP and help it survive...There is a constitution provision that states boycotting an election twice, will eliminate any given political Party.....Now the EC and PAD-Dem user-friendly courts are trying to save the Party...To their surprise, the street stuff has been unable to dislodge Ms. Y....so they need to do something....It is my understanding though, that the PTP is advising its' candidates, "Full speed ahead"....It is all a game, and who knows the reality at this point.....I don't think the coup-mongers will accept this anyway...It just emasculates them for the inevitable election a short time from now, and Suthep with his co-leaders will be under immediate law enforcement pressure.

I had not known about that provision. Which is why the word used is "cancel" not "postpone"? if that is the case cancel and force the Un-Democratic Party to take part or disappear

[inutil]

Government continues to crumble. They're just delaying the inevitable now - the Shins are going to have to go.

Read careful what is report here:

"Thailands embattled government has offered to call off an election set for February 2 if protesters end their rallies and promise not to obstruct or boycott a new one within months."

They have no intention to delay.

Finally, a brain at last!

We will definitely delay! but only if you all go home and dont complain.

Whats that? This would undermine the whole point of your protests?

Well, thats the offer. Take it or leave it.

People arguing that shes been backed into a corner really have no idea what theyre up against. . At every step she keeps outplaying her opponents. Just like most people on this board who cant read between the lines, this will be spun in the mainstream media as a genuine offer and will play into the whole narrative of Yingluck as a moderate looking for compromise. Her brother will play the role of villain of the peace and the protesters will play the role of die hard nutjobs looking to overthrow democracy. Honestly, even Malcolm Tucker would get a run for his money here.

[geriatrickid]

Ok, so let's recap;

- A "court" that is not actually a court since it is not fully comprised of actual judges (yes it's true, not all members are qualified judges) the majority of whom were appointed by the former junta and successor Democrat party administration asks the incumbent government to postpone an election because there is a concern for violence. The "court" asks the incumbent government to work with the protestors to find a solution where an election can be held.

- The incumbent government say's ok and says to the protestors, it will postpone the election, provided the protestors cool off and let the next scheduled election proceed.

- The protestors say no, and that they will continue to block an election no matter what.

It seems to me that the conditions are set up that will allow the government to say, we tried, but the protestors are still refusing to allow an election. Both the EC and the "court" would then not have grounds to postpone the election again.

[Dogmatix]

I don't see any offer to cancel the election - just to postpone it but with pre-conditions she knows the opposition camp will not accept.

[jollyman]

‘‘It would be better if you do not go out because you will find we have taken over the polling stations,’’ Mr Suthep told voters.

"Ja Ja mien Fuhrer Seig heil"

[geriatrickid]

yes, to be fair, you have never supported Suthep

my point is - if there is a 3 month delay both sides have that time to put their arguments to the populace - then let the people decide do they want a PTP government or the Un-Dems/elites in power OR a Suthep led People's Fascist Council Party

lay it all out - debate and argue - then vote

In respect to your comment about a 3 month delay, such a lengthy delay would leave the country gripped in chaos as the government would be unable to govern, and the financial markets would start to panic. I there is a lengthy delay, we may see the business community rally to the PTP. Given a choice of losing their money or having the PTP around, wealthy Thais will choose their money.

[culicine]

So lets say Yingluck decides to quit. What then? Has Suthep outlined ANY of his so-called political reforms? I'm firmly of the opinion she should go. Thai politics has terminal cancer and that part needs to be cut out. The problem is ALL of the rest of PT and their allies are afraid to step up the the base. They think Thaksin is PT. Have they lost all sense of reason? Are they as useless as his sister? They can't go on their own, think independently, and run the country? They I wonder why Suthep has so much support, yet, his supporters really do not know what is agenda is. This is too much....I need to take a bex and lie down

[GeorgeO]

Once again we see the lop-sided reporting of the foreign press.

"sometimes violent protests that have crippled ministries and shut down parts of Bangkok"...

No, they are largely peaceful protests which have sometimes come under shooting and bomb attacks from violent outsiders...!!

[jollyman]

In Mongolia we have a saying, " a duck in a bottle is a very unhappy duck"

[Dogmatix]

Ok, so let's recap;

- A "court" that is not actually a court since it is not fully comprised of actual judges (yes it's true, not all members are qualified judges) the majority of whom were appointed by the former junta and successor Democrat party administration asks the incumbent government to postpone an election because there is a concern for violence. The "court" asks the incumbent government to work with the protestors to find a solution where an election can be held.

- The incumbent government say's ok and says to the protestors, it will postpone the election, provided the protestors cool off and let the next scheduled election proceed.

- The protestors say no, and that they will continue to block an election no matter what.

It seems to me that the conditions are set up that will allow the government to say, we tried, but the protestors are still refusing to allow an election. Both the EC and the "court" would then not have grounds to postpone the election again.

Was it a bona fide court when it acquitted Thaksin of assets concealment in 2001 and had a judge that he had manipulated in there at the last minute?

The court did not ask the caretaker (not incumbent) government to work with protestors. It ruled that the responsibility to decide whether or not to postpone elections rests jointly with the caretaker government and the Electoral Commission.

The court ruling is hardly likely to change the protestors' reasonable demand that Yingluck should resign before elections to show her responsibility for the chaos she plunged the country into through her government's underhand efforts to whitewash her brother's criminal conviction and its fraudulent handling of the dubious rice pledging scheme. In all Western liberal democracies she would have been forced to go by her own party long ago.

Edited January 25, 2014 by Dogmatix

[scorecard]

"Thailands embattled government has offered to call off an election set for February 2 if protesters end their rallies and promise not to obstruct or boycott a new one within months."

Do they really think this is what the protestors want? How will this meet their demands for reform? Clueless.

Note what newspaper this comes from.

[mrtoad]

I somehow do not think she is in a position to name conditions. At least with all the airline cancelations there will be free airspace for her brother's plane to pick her up.

Yingluck is really starting to look desperate to cling on anyhow to power

[Dogmatix]

In Mongolia we have a saying, " a duck in a bottle is a very unhappy duck"

Now we have a crab in a bottle who is not allowed by a cat overseas to get out.

[mrtoad]

yes, to be fair, you have never supported Suthep

my point is - if there is a 3 month delay both sides have that time to put their arguments to the populace - then let the people decide do they want a PTP government or the Un-Dems/elites in power OR a Suthep led People's Fascist Council Party

lay it all out - debate and argue - then vote

In respect to your comment about a 3 month delay, such a lengthy delay would leave the country gripped in chaos as the government would be unable to govern, and the financial markets would start to panic. I there is a lengthy delay, we may see the business community rally to the PTP. Given a choice of losing their money or having the PTP around, wealthy Thais will choose their money.

What you have describe is what we have had for the past 2 years of Yingluck.

[jollyman]

"Now we have a crab in a bottle who is not allowed by a cat overseas to get out."

All this is a fine upsetting really I think she really is fines woman

[Old Man River]

Interesting. I'm surprised at this offer to say the least.

I am surprised as well, but I guess it is just a goodwill offer that they knew would not be accepted. PTP looks good and gives up nothing.

There will be a lot of "no votes," but the real issue is if Suthep's people can disrupt some of the voting areas, Poll-watch will have to report it to the EC which have to then rule if any of those votes are valid. It all comes down to what kind of problems Suthep's people create.

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

[takkatan in the land]

‘‘It would be better if you do not go out because you will find we have taken over the polling stations,’’ Mr Suthep told voters.

very democratic, yes sir

[Dogmatix]

Interesting. I'm surprised at this offer to say the least.

Why are you surprised? She has to make a show of responding positively to the court's ruling but she is trying her best to set conditions precedent that she knows will not be accepted. Then she can go ahead with the elections on Feb 2 as instructed by big bro who is still playing his chess game and fully prepared to sacrifice his queen.

But the EC holds a wild card. If three commissioners resign, elections cannot be held and the 3-5 procedure for the Senate to replace them has to go ahead first. The EC now has joint responsibility with the government to postpone the elections and can play the same game as Poo. She refuses to accept their advice to postpone the elections due to the oppositions refusal to accept the conditions precedent. The EC views this as imprudent for the country due to the threat of widespread violence and the massive cost involved in holding elections that are guaranteed not to result in a new government, not the mention the sizeable risk of prosecutions of individual commissioners by parties unhappy about the election arrangements. So they pull the plug on the elections by 3 of them resigning. Poo and her cronies are them left as a hangover government faces daily protests by farmers etc with end in sight.

Meanwhile, the NACC has time to pick them off one by one with indictments that force them to resign. Better to compromise. Agree to a 90 day without pre-conditions. Poo, Chalerm, Suraphong, Plodprasop and other ministers who are considered abhorrent by any civilised standards resign and announce lengthy breaks from politics. A more level headed minister who is not perceived as a total puppet of Thaksin, e.g. Chaturon, is installed as caretaker PM. He initiates bi-partisan talks to come up with a set of mutally agreeable reforms that both sides agree to implement, whoever wins the next election. Unfortunately no form of compromise is acceptable to the criminal over the water, so the chaos is likely to continue.

Edited January 25, 2014 by Dogmatix

[inutil]

People will be counting on it. If Suthep is seen intimidating voters going to the polling station then more support will be drained from the moderates in his group.

But he has to, because short of massive civil disobedience, his protest is done.

Civil disobedience will help legitimise the intervention by the army to restore order and bring an end to the disruption.

But when he does this, he helps portray Yingluck as the voice of moderation.

Which brings more people to support her calls for unification and compromise.

Which totally undermines the popular legitimacy claims of the protest.

Which in turn totally undermines any attempt by the army to intervene on behalf of the thai people.

[Bkk Cruiser]

A delay in the Election date however would work in PT's favour, following the dissolution of parliament the EC were required to put in place a preregistration process for early / postal voting. The date they selected for registration of early / postal votes to occur was 2Jan and this had to be done in person where you intended to lodge your postal vote from - the date was never published widely btw. (Now looking at the significance of the date: it was the time provincial folks were returning back to Bangkok after the New Year's holiday (could TV experts put a more accurate number of provincial workers returning to Bangkok over that time period?.... 1, 2, 3 million?) - many knew nothing of the pre-registration window (why would the EC want to tell them anyway) and if they did know they would not have been able to make back to preregister anyway)..Those (1, 2,3 milllion? ) who were unable to preregister in person for early voting on that date must return to their villages to cast their vote on 2Feb (I somehow dont think that it realisti). Delaying the election could in fact help PT bag an extra 3 - 4 million votes that the currently scheduled election estranges them from.

[LarryBird]

Once again we see the lop-sided reporting of the foreign press.

"sometimes violent protests that have crippled ministries and shut down parts of Bangkok"...

No, they are largely peaceful protests which have sometimes come under shooting and bomb attacks from violent outsiders...!!

Oh, those silly blokes from the foreign press!! If only they had the deep understanding of the complexity Thai culture that we ThaiVisa posters all know so well and appreciate. Too bad they are wrapped up in perpetuating their own agenda and casting dark images on this Paradise.

Just curious, are you aware the protesters took over government offices and set up road blocks? That's not exactly standing in a park, and holding a rally you got a proper permit for etc. We're talking about severely disrupting the daily lives of a city, and the only reason there wasn't further violence is because no one stood up to them. Look at what happened to the fellow at the bank who refused to play ball.

Just curious, if I prevent your business from doing business, is that non-violent? Not that this was done, but if I destroy your hard drive, is that non-violent?

Non-violent and peaceful really aren't the same thing.