Thai Immigration Bureau to blacklist all overstayers of more than 90 days

[Beetlejuice]

I disagree. They are harsh. Just because another country may ALSO have harsh laws does not mean THESE laws are not harsh. That is NOT logical. Again ... think for a second, a potential 5 year ban for a ONE DAY overstay. That's harsh no matter how you spin it.

Of course this is logical.

I have been saying for years on Thai visa that the negligence and selfish abuse of the system by others will have a knock on affect and the tightening up of the rules for all of us. In the end we all pay the price.

[CRUNCHER]

Generally I do not have much sympathy for people with lengthy overstays.

However, I think an amnesty period would be a good idea. Give people a period, say 30 days, to report to immigration and get themselves sorted out. Those who do not respond deserve all they get.

[zaphod reborn]

Lets be honest, who overstays? not counting medical reasons and i am sure medical does not run over a year or even 3 months

So

1. People who have no money to do visa runs

2. People who are too lazy to do visa runs

3. People who can not afford proper visa

4. People who do not qualify for visa.

Not exactly the most desirable or productive people, though on the flip side Thailand should expect shortage of English teachers

5. People who have been legally employed and paying taxes and have changed jobs to improve their opportunities. I've technically overstayed 3 times in 7 years, each time when I changed jobs. I've been fined once ( at land border instead of airport). Tired of employers who promise to work with your new HR to transfer the extension of stay, but end up screwing you by resigning your work permit and not telling you. But there are honest people just trying to do the right thing and ridiculous rules causing technical violations.

[Soutpeel]

Totally in agreement with this. Frankly thete is no excuse. What it will mean is that in time scratchers wont consider overstsying as an option. I think ED visas will be the next target

Sent from my GT-I9500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Most certainly as there is a great deal of abuse of these visa's from both the "students" and the "schools"

I think the best solution would be to only allow someone to study Thai via an accredited university type set up, proceeds go to the university for helping disadvantaged Thai students with their fees and provide grants, and it would get rid of the visa mill type schools.

[LivinLOS]

Sorry no sympathy for any over stayers for any duration unless its for medical reasons

Even then medical reasons are not an excuse, there are provisions in the immigration law in case of medical cases

The problem is immigration often ignore the medical extension refusing to give it and tell people to simply go pay their overstay at the border.

If your in a decent private hospital they usually have liason staff, but in the case of doctors notes and the rest immigration very often waive it off with a 'too hard' attitude. Seen it myself where someone came into immigration after a head injury and hospitalization.. They didnt care in the slightest he was obviously in bandages, and had only just been released and had a hospital / doctors note saying he was unfit for travel. Just told him to go pay his fines at the border.

In the above list, if he was apprehended before getting to the border he would face a 1 year blacklist. Hardly fair.

So yes, fully support the crackdown, as long as the correct systems are put in place to handle the real issues, which immigration just sweep under the 'pay your fine' rug.

No, he would have gotten an extension on medical grounds.

No.. He didnt.. He asked for one and they refused.. He tried to show them the doctors paperwork showing he was in hospital and wasnt fit to travel, they didnt care..

Go border.. Pay fine.. Next..

[squarethecircle]

I read that (in the US) a name change in the court costs $200 and a new passport costs $120. Problem solved?

[LivinLOS]

Sorry no sympathy for any over stayers for any duration unless its for medical reasons

No problem to get extension of stay from immigrations if unable to travel.

Thats factually not the case tho.. They fall back to the 'go away and pay a fine' rather than process them all too often.

Actually it is in some cases, the private hospitals actually have staff who organise this for you, so suspect your making a sweeping statement, which is not 100% true, could we say in some cases immigration tell people to go and pay the fine ?

As I said most private higher end hospitals have liaison staff.. But end up in a gov hospital for Thais and I doubt your going to find one..

And yes of course, its some not all.. But if your going to start saying a 5 year ban for one day of overstay if caught, then there needs to be some actual care about allowing people who should have these things covered, to get them covered. Instead of relying on a Thai 'easy way' which they do in 'some cases'.

[Suradit69]

Bugger ... that's going to stuff up a lot of the plans of the overstayers.

I hope there are the usual exemptions such as 'Medical' etc.

I don't think people actually plan to overstay. It's just that circumstances tend to overtake them and they get in a mess.

Best of luck to all people in that situation.

"I don't think people actually plan to overstay. "

Judging by some of the bragging posts we've all seen regarding how long some individuals stay without the "hassle" of reporting or renewing extensions, followed by a Baht 20,000 exit, only to return and repeat, I'd say some people plan, execute and revel in their circumvention of the law.

In fact you can almost predict what things will get "adjusted" by immigrations by the number of posts on TV bragging about such things (followed by advice here on how to easily solve the problem without much inconvenience).

Border runs, serial tourist visas, ed visas, overstay ... all these have figured big in the TV thread catalog.

Of course some people have gotten quite excited about the crackdown on corruption & lax law enforcement following the coup ... until they realized it might be a double-edged sword.

Lots of chickens coming home to roost.

[LivinLOS]

I disagree. They are harsh. Just because another country may ALSO have harsh laws does not mean THESE laws are not harsh. That is NOT logical. Again ... think for a second, a potential 5 year ban for a ONE DAY overstay. That's harsh no matter how you spin it.

Of course this is logical.

I have been saying for years on Thai visa that the negligence and selfish abuse of the system by others will have a knock on affect and the tightening up of the rules for all of us. In the end we all pay the price.

Yet these other harsh countries have paths to naturalization and citizenship open to the people there.. So after a few years the whole issue of visa runs, visas, overstays etc has gone.

[mrtoad]

Totally in agreement with this. Frankly thete is no excuse. What it will mean is that in time scratchers wont consider overstsying as an option. I think ED visas will be the next target

Sent from my GT-I9500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

Most certainly as there is a great deal of abuse of these visa's from both the "students" and the "schools"

I think the best solution would be to only allow someone to study Thai via an accredited university type set up, proceeds go to the university for helping disadvantaged Thai students with their fees and provide grants, and it would get rid of the visa mill type schools.

Excellent idea. Have seen some of these schools only give the reason for signing up is the ed visa. Nothing about education. You know the ones i mean.

Sent from my GT-I9500 using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[ozymandious]

I wonder about those who let their children's visa lapse, since they had expected no fine for them on exit. Irresponsible on the parents part, no doubt. But wonder if minors under 15 will be blacklisted (effectively blacklisting the parents as well).

What if your children were born here and have never had a visa?

My kids were born here but are not Thai Citizens.

They have overstayed a bunch but there is no fine until your kids turn 12.

Are they to be black listed?

If they were born here and have not yet left the country for the first time, it's not technically an overstay. In that case, they process the kids on the way out. Pretty routine.

no they have been in and out on holiday before. Just never had to get them a visa because there was no fine associated for over stay as a minor.

[p_brownstone]

Hope it doesn't affect children under 12 or whatever the age is that they let it slip....

If you don't have / need a Visa then you cannot "Overstay".

Patrick

[tingtongteesood]

I am not that bothered what the rules are going to end up being, I just wish they would be easy to find and easy to follow and not open to interpretation depending on the officer you have the misfortune to meet. Until 3 months ago it was awkward to figure out but once you did you could follow it. Now it is a complete crap shoot, even if you follow the rules they can still say no. Starting to get very irritating... I do agree with people who overstay on purpose being penalized, fair dos. But sometimes there is an overstay you can not control, happens to everyone sometimes, I had 4 days once where I had to go to a government office before I could deal with it and they were all closed for the next 4 days because of a holiday and a weekend and I had a 5 day overstay due to someone else's cock up. I would hope these would be treated with some leniency as long as the person is trying to do it the right way...

[FritsSikkink]

Generally I do not have much sympathy for people with lengthy overstays.

However, I think an amnesty period would be a good idea. Give people a period, say 30 days, to report to immigration and get themselves sorted out. Those who do not respond deserve all they get.

The long stayers had all the time of the world to sort it out. They wanted maximum stay for their 20000 baht or have no money at all.

If they had no money at all they should have gone to their embassy to sort out their problems.

[NoshowJones]

Im not sure why someone would bother trying to overstay anyway. In ANY country in the world it's illegal and courting disaster. I actually hope that all these recent shakedowns will help rid the country of some of the scurvy bilge that is found clinging to the vestiges of their sorry lives in this beautiful land.

its illegal bla bla bla,,, perhaps if countries around the world stopped being so anal about foreign visitors of independent means , there might be less friction and a greater spread of culture, understanding of social and work ethics. Why should anyone be shackled to any one country just because they were born there...

stop bleating on about the law and stand up against it for the good of change.

You do make a good point Epicstuff, but what about the UK, they have every Tom, Dick, and M------------- crowding in to the country because it is a soft touch, and now they can't even look after their own, even stealing from OAPs.

Thailand does have the right idea, although I think it should be far less hassle to get marriage extensions, and should stop this 90 day reporting nonsense for retirees. I know it's not a popular opinion, but I just call it as I see it.

[iancnx]

Thinking out loud. If the Ed visa is also successfully tightened up - and it should be - it could leave us with just a core expat population who are here within the law contributing to Thai society living here on the correct visa. The next stage surely would be easier extensions (marriage or retirement) and who knows the ridiculous 90 day report might become a thing of the past. I would gladly pay 10000 up front for a 5 year visa, where perhaps the 90 day report could be replaced with a 365 day one. Just thinking out loud and hoping this is read by the Immigration Minister / Commander.

[FritsSikkink]

The problem is immigration often ignore the medical extension refusing to give it and tell people to simply go pay their overstay at the border.

If your in a decent private hospital they usually have liason staff, but in the case of doctors notes and the rest immigration very often waive it off with a 'too hard' attitude. Seen it myself where someone came into immigration after a head injury and hospitalization.. They didnt care in the slightest he was obviously in bandages, and had only just been released and had a hospital / doctors note saying he was unfit for travel. Just told him to go pay his fines at the border.

In the above list, if he was apprehended before getting to the border he would face a 1 year blacklist. Hardly fair.

So yes, fully support the crackdown, as long as the correct systems are put in place to handle the real issues, which immigration just sweep under the 'pay your fine' rug.

No, he would have gotten an extension on medical grounds.

No.. He didnt.. He asked for one and they refused.. He tried to show them the doctors paperwork showing he was in hospital and wasnt fit to travel, they didnt care..

Go border.. Pay fine.. Next..

But they will do if the new rules are applied.

[DrTuner]

This, tightening of the 30 exemption rules and who knows what more is coming.. the condo market at tourist destinations will take a hit.

[Cuchulainn]

They'll probably start clamping down on 90 days non reporting next.

Watch this space!

[stevenl]

I hope there are the usual exemptions such as 'Medical' etc.

Sorry no sympathy for any over stayers for any duration unless its for medical reasons

No problem to get extension of stay from immigrations if unable to travel.

Thats factually not the case tho.. They fall back to the 'go away and pay a fine' rather than process them all too often.

Because that is the easiest way now, at the moment, at present.

With a big change in the system a change in that attitude is unavoidable.

[manonthemon]

Hope it doesn't affect children under 12 or whatever the age is that they let it slip....

If you don't have / need a Visa then you cannot "Overstay".

Patrick

Officially they need a visa, in practice immigration doesn't fine kids under the age of 14. Don;'t know if this is a law or an unwritten rule. Now will they become part of the "blacklisting" thing is the question.

[stevenl]

They'll probably start clamping down on 90 days non reporting next.

Watch this space!

The present measures are all aimed at preventing people from being here illegally, especially aimed at working illegally.

The 90 days report has nothing to do with that, so IMO a clampdown on that is unlikely.

[Suradit69]

Im not sure why someone would bother trying to overstay anyway. In ANY country in the world it's illegal and courting disaster. I actually hope that all these recent shakedowns will help rid the country of some of the scurvy bilge that is found clinging to the vestiges of their sorry lives in this beautiful land.

its illegal bla bla bla,,, perhaps if countries around the world stopped being so anal about foreign visitors of independent means , there might be less friction and a greater spread of culture, understanding of social and work ethics. Why should anyone be shackled to any one country just because they were born there...

stop bleating on about the law and stand up against it for the good of change.

"Why should anyone be shackled to any one country just because they were born there ..."

I've lived and worked in 5 countries over an enjoyable life ... always in compliance with the local laws. Not bragging. It was/is easy to do and loads of other people did it too and are doing it now ... even in Thailand.

There are even ways for under 55 year old non-productive parasitic layabouts people of independent means to live in many countries as well. Legally. No shackles other than the mental shackles that come with a self-indulgent sense of entitlement.

Edited July 7, 2014 by Suradit69

[nicolas18]

Gotta love the posts applauding these new rules.

I wonder if the same people will cheer as well when Immigration imposes further restrictions on marriage/retirement visas.

Edited July 7, 2014 by nicolas18

[DrTuner]

Thinking out loud. If the Ed visa is also successfully tightened up - and it should be - it could leave us with just a core expat population who are here within the law contributing to Thai society living here on the correct visa. The next stage surely would be easier extensions (marriage or retirement) and who knows the ridiculous 90 day report might become a thing of the past. I would gladly pay 10000 up front for a 5 year visa, where perhaps the 90 day report could be replaced with a 365 day one. Just thinking out loud and hoping this is read by the Immigration Minister / Commander.

I doubt any relief for those who are legit is coming. Most likely the opposite. The trend seems very clear.

[AGareth2]

next thing might be a cash incentive for turning in your mates

[Kerryd]

Lets be honest, who overstays? not counting medical reasons and i am sure medical does not run over a year or even 3 months

So

1. People who have no money to do visa runs

2. People who are too lazy to do visa runs

3. People who can not afford proper visa

4. People who do not qualify for visa.

Not exactly the most desirable or productive people, though on the flip side Thailand should expect shortage of English teachers

Ummm - people like me who get 34/35 days of holidays (or more), 3 times a year (or more) ? I used to end up on 2 days overstay almost every trip. Under these new rules, if I was stopped on the way to the airport, I could get a 5 year ban (though one may suspect that if you have a history of short overstays, and plane tickets, etc, they could let it slip. Or not. Could depend entirely on the mood of the person detaining you, your appearance, your attitude, etc.)

Fortunately I've aged sufficiently that while I still get the holidays, I don't have the overstay worries anymore.

[In Search of Space]

My wife has a 2 day over-stay in her UK passport, how do I get her to overstay for 10 years - Result !!

[Songhua]

I read that (in the US) a name change in the court costs $200 and a new passport costs $120. Problem solved?

... until they start doing fingerprinting.

[up-country_sinclair]

Gotta love the posts applauding these new rules.

I wonder if the same people will cheer as well when Immigration imposes further restrictions on marriage/retirement visas.

I make an effort to live within the law, and believe that all other foreigners should too. Of course sometimes it can be frustrating, but I'm confident that getting a visa to live in my country of birth is far more difficult and costly.

I don't "applaud" the clampdown but I do support it, and am of the mind that perhaps the current thresholds for marriage/retirement visas should be raised. From what I've seen and heard there are far too many foreigners gaming the system or brazenly living outside the law.