More rice missing from Thai warehouses

[webfact]

More rice missing from warehouses



BANGKOK: -- Rice stock checking continued in several provinces as authorities reported more rice have gone missing from warehouses joining the rice-pledging scheme.

In Pathum Thani province, officials rechecked the warehouses of Phoenix Agritech Wednesday and initially found almost 100,000 sacks of rice went missing.

Besides of the missing of the rice, officials also found scaffolding structure inside piles of thousands of rice sacks.

Officials will finish checking all rice in the warehouses by July 28 to find out it meets the amount the warehouse operator and officials involved earlier declared in the book or not.

In the book, they declared 147,389 sacks of rice were kept in the warehouses of the company.

But renewed checking found 98,435 sacks were missing.

The Marketing Organisation for Farmers has earlier filed complaint with the police and has charged warehouse operator and contractor of theft.

Earlier Wednesday the permanent secretary of PM’s Office ML Panadda Dissakul has said rice checking at all provinces so far showed more than 5% of rice went missing from warehouses.

Source: http://englishnews.thaipbs.or.th/rice-missing-warehouses/


-- Thai PBS 2014-07-24

[Tatsujin]

"In Pathum Thani province, officials rechecked the warehouses of Phoenix Agritech Wednesday and initially found almost 100,000 sacks of rice went missing. Besides of the missing of the rice, officials also found scaffolding structure inside piles of thousands of rice sacks."

So is she gonna come back to face the music for this blatant scam?

[Thai at Heart]

They went back to recheck the sane place.

But I thought there would be such richer pickings to find all over the place.

Shouldn't this be, more rice missing from warehouse they already checked?

[jaidam]

They went back to recheck the sane place.

But I thought there would be such richer pickings to find all over the place.

Shouldn't this be, more rice missing from warehouse they already checked?

No. They mean re-checked because the first check organized by the chairwoman of the rice scheme was only a PR plot to cover up the mounting losses until the PTP won another election. This time, they actually opened the doors, looked inside, and found what every warm blooded creature knew they would. Evidence of a scam of biblical proportions.

[Thai at Heart]

They went back to recheck the sane place.

But I thought there would be such richer pickings to find all over the place.

Shouldn't this be, more rice missing from warehouse they already checked?

No. They mean re-checked because the first check organized by the chairwoman of the rice scheme was only a PR plot to cover up the mounting losses until the PTP won another election. This time, they actually opened the doors, looked inside, and found what every warm blooded creature knew they would. Evidence of a scam of biblical proportions.

In Pathum Thani province, officials rechecked the warehouses of Phoenix Agritech Wednesday and initially found almost 100,000 sacks of rice went missing.

That's not what I read, and let's be a little realistic here. Its not of biblical proportions. If only that were so.

There are still 18mn tonnes of rice in the warehouse and no one knows of how good a quality it all is.

It may say grade A on the bag, but only when it gets reopened and packaged with anyone really know.

[gemini81]

"In Pathum Thani province, officials rechecked the warehouses of Phoenix Agritech Wednesday and initially found almost 100,000 sacks of rice went missing. Besides of the missing of the rice, officials also found scaffolding structure inside piles of thousands of rice sacks."

So is she gonna come back to face the music for this blatant scam?

Of course not, she has never known responsibility nor consequences. Like the graffiti '< Thai language removed>' spray painted on her election campaign signs, she is shameless and careless & only thinks of her own & family's well-being.

Edited July 24, 2014 by metisdead
Thai language edited out of post. This is an English language forum, English is the only acceptable language, except in the Thai language forum where Thai language is allowed.

[robblok]

Yingluck.. no there is no rice missing we checked it.. Dereliction of duty at the least corruption at the worst. She should go to jail for sure just to set an example.

It will be hard to prove of course but who knows payments could be made to friends of the PTP for this and that could moved up to higher echelons of PTP. They are not stupid they wont make it too obvious but maybe we are lucky and some warehouse owners will crack and finger people higher up.

[billd766]

They went back to recheck the sane place.

But I thought there would be such richer pickings to find all over the place.

Shouldn't this be, more rice missing from warehouse they already checked?

No. They mean re-checked because the first check organized by the chairwoman of the rice scheme was only a PR plot to cover up the mounting losses until the PTP won another election. This time, they actually opened the doors, looked inside, and found what every warm blooded creature knew they would. Evidence of a scam of biblical proportions.

In Pathum Thani province, officials rechecked the warehouses of Phoenix Agritech Wednesday and initially found almost 100,000 sacks of rice went missing.

That's not what I read, and let's be a little realistic here. Its not of biblical proportions. If only that were so.

There are still 18mn tonnes of rice in the warehouse and no one knows of how good a quality it all is.

It may say grade A on the bag, but only when it gets reopened and packaged with anyone really know.

How do you KNOW there are still 18 Mn tons of rice in storage?

Have you been to all the warehouses and personally counted each sack?

Is your information from the previous PTP government who did an audit and found that there NO missing or mouldy rice?

Alternatively can you post the links that actually quote this figure.

I tend to believe the military auditing teams rather than any information from the previous PTP government.

[Thai at Heart]

They went back to recheck the sane place.

But I thought there would be such richer pickings to find all over the place.

Shouldn't this be, more rice missing from warehouse they already checked?

No. They mean re-checked because the first check organized by the chairwoman of the rice scheme was only a PR plot to cover up the mounting losses until the PTP won another election. This time, they actually opened the doors, looked inside, and found what every warm blooded creature knew they would. Evidence of a scam of biblical proportions.

In Pathum Thani province, officials rechecked the warehouses of Phoenix Agritech Wednesday and initially found almost 100,000 sacks of rice went missing.

That's not what I read, and let's be a little realistic here. Its not of biblical proportions. If only that were so.

There are still 18mn tonnes of rice in the warehouse and no one knows of how good a quality it all is.

It may say grade A on the bag, but only when it gets reopened and packaged with anyone really know.

How do you KNOW there are still 18 Mn tons of rice in storage?

Have you been to all the warehouses and personally counted each sack?

Is your information from the previous PTP government who did an audit and found that there NO missing or mouldy rice?

Alternatively can you post the links that actually quote this figure.

I tend to believe the military auditing teams rather than any information from the previous PTP government.

Read the papers. How many tonnes of missing rice have they declared so far?

50k? 100k.

Around 100k. I think if they had found 1mn missing they would be trumpeting it from the highest mountains. I am amazed they even went back to check this place

So this is 50,000 sacks missing. 5,000 tonnes. Phew. I await them not finding this so called missing 3mn. Keep counting.

Its irrelevant anyway if 30% of what they count is mouldy .

[ramrod711]

The Marketing Organisation for Farmers has earlier filed complaint with the police and has charged warehouse operator and contractor of theft.

They may want to aim a little higher if they want the real culprit.

[Thai at Heart]

The Marketing Organisation for Farmers has earlier filed complaint with the police and has charged warehouse operator and contractor of theft.

They may want to aim a little higher if they want the real culprit.

What u think the warehouse owner has Yingluck on his speedial or something? Or her bank account details in his SCB phone app?

[koolbreez]

<script type='text/javascript'>window.mod_pagespeed_start = Number(new Date());</script>

Yingluck.. no there is no rice missing we checked it.. Dereliction of duty at the least corruption at the worst. She should go to jail for sure just to set an example.

It will be hard to prove of course but who knows payments could be made to friends of the PTP for this and that could moved up to higher echelons of PTP. They are not stupid they wont make it too obvious but maybe we are lucky and some warehouse owners will crack and finger people higher up.

With the military greatly reducing the fear of death for those people coming forward with damning information about persons with influence, there might be some implications, and allegations made to avoid jail time, but getting to the actual top of the heap is almost impossible without the needed paper trail. With cash the favored medium with corruption, there is almost never a paper trail to follow that would implicate a higher-up. The he said, she said verbal battles don't send people to prison in Thailand. They need that proverbial hard evidence of a paper trail, except in criminal code 112 cases.

It is good that the military has made people less afraid of being killed for coming forward with information about corrupt practices. That wasn't the case before they took over. The biggest deterrent in the past was knowing they would be killed if they implicated the wrong highly influential people, and there were enough publicized cases to back up those fears. There was no protected witness program.

[robblok]

No. They mean re-checked because the first check organized by the chairwoman of the rice scheme was only a PR plot to cover up the mounting losses until the PTP won another election. This time, they actually opened the doors, looked inside, and found what every warm blooded creature knew they would. Evidence of a scam of biblical proportions.

In Pathum Thani province, officials rechecked the warehouses of Phoenix Agritech Wednesday and initially found almost 100,000 sacks of rice went missing.

That's not what I read, and let's be a little realistic here. Its not of biblical proportions. If only that were so.

There are still 18mn tonnes of rice in the warehouse and no one knows of how good a quality it all is.

It may say grade A on the bag, but only when it gets reopened and packaged with anyone really know.

How do you KNOW there are still 18 Mn tons of rice in storage?

Have you been to all the warehouses and personally counted each sack?

Is your information from the previous PTP government who did an audit and found that there NO missing or mouldy rice?

Alternatively can you post the links that actually quote this figure.

I tend to believe the military auditing teams rather than any information from the previous PTP government.

Read the papers. How many tonnes of missing rice have they declared so far?

50k? 100k.

Around 100k. I think if they had found 1mn missing they would be trumpeting it from the highest mountains. I am amazed they even went back to check this place

So this is 50,000 sacks missing. 5,000 tonnes. Phew. I await them not finding this so called missing 3mn. Keep counting.

Its irrelevant anyway if 30% of what they count is mouldy .

You are forgetting something that will be far more damming / damaging. Good rice can be replaced with bad grade rice. Thent he quantity is the same but the value is not.

I will make it simple so you can understand. Suppose i write i have 6 bars of gold in stock and they check it and find i only got 6 bars of silver. The amount is the same.. the value just a tiny bit different. They are also checking this and it will take longer. If I were a crook id replace the rice with bad quality as its far harder to check. The crooks are not that stupid.

Just wait and see what the numbers will be and remember YL and PTP said the rice was stored good and the quality was still great no moldy rice or substandard rice. So far we have seen different.

[KarenBravo]

The reason the rice is "missing" is because it was never there in the first place.........

[koolbreez]

The DNA tests on all the rice they've inspected hasn't come back yet either. That will be real interesting when they release those results. With Cambodia's rice sales plunging 70% in the last 5 months compared to last year, I can only guess where some of those DNA test results will show as the rice originating country.

[robblok]

Mate, I have worked in agribusiness export before.

I dont think it is particularly practical to start replacing crops like this. They are exporting 6 to 9 mn tonnes anyway. You can't just magic up 9 mn tonnes of processed rice from across the border.

Bearing in mind, 9mn tonnes of finished rice needs 15 mn rice in. So unless you are gojng to keep moving in everything across crop years eventually you run out of bad rice to replace good rice.

The standard yield on quality is fairly repetitive. Doing this on a massivr scale would lead to it being uncovered quickly.

So which is it, missing or misgraded rice. Coz so far, there isn't reported a massive volume missing despite their best efforts to find it.

You are not thinking clearly... who said the high quality rice was there in the first place..... You can administrate bad quality rice as good quality rice. It would indeed not be practical to move rice in and out and replacing it.

[WitawatWatawit]

According to the other paper on 27 June:

The 2nd Infantry Regiment the King's Own Bodyguard raided the warehouse of Phoenix Agritech (Thailand) Co Ltd after being tipped that rice had been moved from the site. The warehouse was supposed to contain 130,000 sacks of rice but contained only 39,000. The rice in the warehouse was broken rice and 5% white rice and some had been damaged by insects.

I'm confused - same warehouse, but now 140k bags of which 98k missing, so an additional 7,000 bags found missing since that inspection on 27 June?

[kratiam]

Thaiatheart said:

So this is 50,000 sacks missing. 5,000 tonnes. Phew. I await them not finding this so called missing 3mn. Keep counting.

Its irrelevant anyway if 30% of what they count is mouldy .

I say:

Even if (EVEN IF) the total was ONLY 5,000 tonnes stolen by people who are richer by FAR than 99.9% of Thais.....you think it's be OK? You have amazing values!

PS: And the reason that some is mouldy is the total mismanagement whilst concentrating on the fraud!

[KhunAussie52]

"Farmers from neighboring rice-growing countries, including Vietnam and Cambodia, were illegally shipping their rice to Thailand to be sold at the higher prices. Rice millers are also under investigation for overstating rice stocks.

The NACC is investigating losses of up to $16 billion, with almost 3 million tons of rice missing from warehouses."

Source- http://www.voanews.com/content/thailand-ends-controversial-rice-subsidy-scheme/1937693.html

[Thai at Heart]

Mate, I have worked in agribusiness export before.

I dont think it is particularly practical to start replacing crops like this. They are exporting 6 to 9 mn tonnes anyway. You can't just magic up 9 mn tonnes of processed rice from across the border.

Bearing in mind, 9mn tonnes of finished rice needs 15 mn rice in. So unless you are gojng to keep moving in everything across crop years eventually you run out of bad rice to replace good rice.

The standard yield on quality is fairly repetitive. Doing this on a massivr scale would lead to it being uncovered quickly.

So which is it, missing or misgraded rice. Coz so far, there isn't reported a massive volume missing despite their best efforts to find it.

You are not thinking clearly... who said the high quality rice was there in the first place..... You can administrate bad quality rice as good quality rice. It would indeed not be practical to move rice in and out and replacing it.

Well, then that would mean that they either had millions of fake farmers to pay, or farmers were being paid for rice that didn't exist.

How would that get paid out of the agricultural bank without a receipt from a mill? This con only works if you don't involve farmers. The farmers would blab.

[slapout]

This program reminds me of the attempt by several military groups to cover up their handling of prisioners during their attempt to rule the world while proclaiming they are here to help the general population.

they were, are attempting to cover up a series of actions by individuals which are on equal to the cover up exposed in nazie germany, eastern block treatment of their peers. etc

A pathatic state of affairs for which the only real positive outcome will require the retreave of lost monies., jail time, and the excoummication of those invol;ved from Thailand society and the rest of the worlds countries who have respect for law and order

[Soutpeel]

The NACC is investigating losses of up to $16 billion

Do you think you could get $16 billion in 11 suit cases ?.....if yes than dear Yingie has just walked out the country with it, and going to do a spot of shopping in Paris...

[dru2]

This program reminds me of the attempt by several military groups to cover up their handling of prisioners during their attempt to rule the world while proclaiming they are here to help the general population.

they were, are attempting to cover up a series of actions by individuals which are on equal to the cover up exposed in nazie germany, eastern block treatment of their peers. etc

A pathatic state of affairs for which the only real positive outcome will require the retreave of lost monies., jail time, and the excoummication of those invol;ved from Thailand society and the rest of the worlds countries who have respect for law and order

Are you by any chance slapped out?

[moe666]

YL may not have made a dime off this but with every missing bag or bag of lower grade rice she will be held responsible for the management of the scam as the PM the bucks stops with her. Then again we will have to wait and see how hard they will want to come down on her for incompetence, remember she is being charged with lack of over sight of the program and not fixing it or stopping it when she was informed of problems.

[robblok]

Mate, I have worked in agribusiness export before.

I dont think it is particularly practical to start replacing crops like this. They are exporting 6 to 9 mn tonnes anyway. You can't just magic up 9 mn tonnes of processed rice from across the border.

Bearing in mind, 9mn tonnes of finished rice needs 15 mn rice in. So unless you are gojng to keep moving in everything across crop years eventually you run out of bad rice to replace good rice.

The standard yield on quality is fairly repetitive. Doing this on a massivr scale would lead to it being uncovered quickly.

So which is it, missing or misgraded rice. Coz so far, there isn't reported a massive volume missing despite their best efforts to find it.

You are not thinking clearly... who said the high quality rice was there in the first place..... You can administrate bad quality rice as good quality rice. It would indeed not be practical to move rice in and out and replacing it.

Well, then that would mean that they either had millions of fake farmers to pay, or farmers were being paid for rice that didn't exist.

How would that get paid out of the agricultural bank without a receipt from a mill? This con only works if you don't involve farmers. The farmers would blab.

This con could work.. but yes it would require people to work together to break the system (most systems are designed that you need the help of someone else if you want to cheat it). Not so far fetched in a country like Thailand. Just wait for the results you will see.

[GentlemanJim]

No. They mean re-checked because the first check organized by the chairwoman of the rice scheme was only a PR plot to cover up the mounting losses until the PTP won another election. This time, they actually opened the doors, looked inside, and found what every warm blooded creature knew they would. Evidence of a scam of biblical proportions.

In Pathum Thani province, officials rechecked the warehouses of Phoenix Agritech Wednesday and initially found almost 100,000 sacks of rice went missing.

That's not what I read, and let's be a little realistic here. Its not of biblical proportions. If only that were so.

There are still 18mn tonnes of rice in the warehouse and no one knows of how good a quality it all is.

It may say grade A on the bag, but only when it gets reopened and packaged with anyone really know.

How do you KNOW there are still 18 Mn tons of rice in storage?

Have you been to all the warehouses and personally counted each sack?

Is your information from the previous PTP government who did an audit and found that there NO missing or mouldy rice?

Alternatively can you post the links that actually quote this figure.

I tend to believe the military auditing teams rather than any information from the previous PTP government.

Read the papers. How many tonnes of missing rice have they declared so far?

50k? 100k.

Around 100k. I think if they had found 1mn missing they would be trumpeting it from the highest mountains. I am amazed they even went back to check this place

So this is 50,000 sacks missing. 5,000 tonnes. Phew. I await them not finding this so called missing 3mn. Keep counting.

Its irrelevant anyway if 30% of what they count is mouldy .

You say in a later post that you have worked in the Agri business for years and you dismiss the loss of this 50 000 tons as if it is nothing.

This is just ONE warehouse that has 30% of it's declared stock, not only not there, but fraudulently concealed by using scaffolding poles. Seems you would have been perfect to have been employed in the PTP Ministry of Agriculture. Only 5000 tons! Even if for maths sake we just take a nice number such as $400 per ton, that is $2 M USD from ONE warehouse. And they have also been claiming storage for that non-existent rice for God knows how long. How bad does crime have to be before you will stop waxing lyrical about clan Shiniwatra? This is a warehouse declared 100% legitimate by the Yingluck Administration. I would say that your forum name is one of the most appropriate on this board but that would be a dreadfully unfair slur to many Thais. How can you even try to support such criminal activity? I guess like all Shinclans dogs, loyalty knows no bounds.

Edited July 24, 2014 by GentlemanJim

[Thai at Heart]

Mate, I have worked in agribusiness export before.

I dont think it is particularly practical to start replacing crops like this. They are exporting 6 to 9 mn tonnes anyway. You can't just magic up 9 mn tonnes of processed rice from across the border.

Bearing in mind, 9mn tonnes of finished rice needs 15 mn rice in. So unless you are gojng to keep moving in everything across crop years eventually you run out of bad rice to replace good rice.

The standard yield on quality is fairly repetitive. Doing this on a massivr scale would lead to it being uncovered quickly.

So which is it, missing or misgraded rice. Coz so far, there isn't reported a massive volume missing despite their best efforts to find it.

You are not thinking clearly... who said the high quality rice was there in the first place..... You can administrate bad quality rice as good quality rice. It would indeed not be practical to move rice in and out and replacing it.

Well, then that would mean that they either had millions of fake farmers to pay, or farmers were being paid for rice that didn't exist.

How would that get paid out of the agricultural bank without a receipt from a mill? This con only works if you don't involve farmers. The farmers would blab.

This con could work.. but yes it would require people to work together to break the system (most systems are designed that you need the help of someone else if you want to cheat it). Not so far fetched in a country like Thailand. Just wait for the results you will see.

Of course its feasible, but not likely. Someone in the bank would blab. That's why, issuing invoices for millions.of tonnes of rice would be extremely difficult.

If each farmer grows 50tonnes, you need an awful lot of names and id cards to get to 1mn

[Ricardo]

And the evidence of further deliberate fraud, within the rice-scheme, mounts.

And the evidence of negligence of the committee, headed (but rarely if ever attended) by the former-PM, mounts.

Just waiting for "But, but, Suthep ..."

[monty1412]

Oh dear oh dear , who would have thought ?? Love the scaffolding bridges

[attrayant]

The asset manager should be on the hook for this. Asset management isn't a terribly complex process, but for some reason it's just not done in Thailand (major businesses excepted).