Holocaust survivors condemn Israel's Gaza 'genocide'

[nidieunimaitre]

to be clear only 40 hollcaust survivors signed this

Most of whom have dementia by now or were pressured into it. Pretty meaningless but jumped on by people desperate for anything to demonise Israel with. If Israel were interested in genocide there would be nobody left alive in Gaza.

Dement?

Pressured - by who?

Do you realise you sound very anti semetic?

[nidieunimaitre]

One simple question - why does the USA support the terrorists activities of Israel?

Strange thing: USA supports Israel when Israel has socialist governments, center governments, extreme right governments.

By the way, the first kiboetsim were settled by russian communists.....

And before posters will accuse me of whatever, may I say that reality is slightly more complex then what the average TV poster thinks. And yes of course, all reasonable people will prefer Israel over the average muslim state, but unfortunately, the difference is getting smaller and smaller. Reasonable people are concerned with the difference getting smaller and smaller. That is not anti semitism!

[Seastallion]

Wow, so many TV's here who in their arm chairs are greater than those who really suffered un-imaginable acts, yet have the bravery to denounce others who do the same,

I don't care if it's one holocaust survivor or 40, they have the guts to speak out against inhumanity, good for them.

Shame on those who deny them,

The petition is representative of 300 Jews, survivors and the children and grandchildren. Brave people.

I made comment yesterday or the day before that I thought it apt for holocaust survivors to abhor what's happening in Palestine. I'm glad that 300 Jews agree with me.

[Seastallion]

Self defence is not terrorism is it.

Invasion is not self defence.

Occupation is not self defence.

[Ulysses G.]

Self defence is not terrorism is it.

Invasion is not self defence.

Occupation is not self defence.

It is when you are stopping terrorists from attacking you with rockets or suicide bombers.

[pkspeaker]

The logic behind zionism is you fight fascism with fascism, nazi ideology was ethnic cleansing and segregation and ghettos, zionism is has been ethic cleansing segregation, and bantustans.. Hamas is so 'extreme' because they want to 'destroy' israel.. i can't imagine why they would want something abolished that keeps nearly 2 million of them sealed up in the gaza strip, cut off from the rest of israel/palestine.. the right wing israeli governments position is that gaza must remain separated from any other part of that country, especially the west bank forever and a similar position on the west bank bantustans..

Israel's apologists rationalize this by saying 20 years ago israel made this 'generous offer' but the palestinians turned it down.. yea right-either fetch this vague generous offer like a bone, or another 20 years of murder, oppression, house demolitions .. ne negotiations the palestinians are just supposed to take whatever they are offered..of cource there was no generous offer and the whole thing was a sham.

[Jingthing]

Self defence is not terrorism is it.

Invasion is not self defence.

Occupation is not self defence.

Invasion with the intention of taking out military targets (rockets, launchers, tunnels, Hamas operatives) used to attack your civilians is indeed self defense.

Gaza is NOT occupied.

The current Israeli intentions are not occupation of Gaza.

Israel clearly would rather not want to be in the position of administering Gaza.

However, how this current mess in Gaza is eventually going to shake out can't be determined right now.

Gaza was actually returned to the Arabs by Israel to promote peace.

It didn't work.

Edited August 24, 2014 by Jingthing

[7by7]

“I cannot and I do not want to forgive the killers of children; I ask God not to forgive.”
—Elie Wiesel

Does he include the Israeli government and the IDF in that?

From How many Palestinian civilians is a single militant worth? on haaretz.com

The concern for civilians is justified. The Gazan human rights organization Mizan reported that 952 people have been killed in their bombarded homes, including 307 children and 204 women, including two disabled women who were in a bombarded rehabilitation center......

.....The UN team, Palestinian human rights organizations and B’Tselem are examining every fatality, seeing every body in the hospital, checking every death report and talking to eyewitnesses, family members and survivors.

It's enormous, difficult work – emotionally, and physically. Despite their experience, no one is trained to witness 10, 50, 100 corpses, among them dismembered children, day after day.

[car720]

I would like to put a few questions to these 300 survivors:

1) How did you survive?

2) How did you fight the extermination?

3) Do you believe in self-defence?

4) How did you turn up in Israel?

5) Which country did you or your parents came from?

6) Which country are you going to live in after Israel stops fighting?

7) How will you survive again?

8) How will you fight the extermination again?

9) Do you prefer extermination or self-defence?

To cut through this crap if any man of any religion believes that God made us in His image -

- how do you know he was working in a Realistic manner?

Extermination again????

What did the jews do that makes people want to keep exterminating them?

What do they do in society that keeps pissing everyone off?

Just interested to know.

[Jingthing]

I would like to put a few questions to these 300 survivors:

1) How did you survive?

2) How did you fight the extermination?

3) Do you believe in self-defence?

4) How did you turn up in Israel?

5) Which country did you or your parents came from?

6) Which country are you going to live in after Israel stops fighting?

7) How will you survive again?

8) How will you fight the extermination again?

9) Do you prefer extermination or self-defence?

To cut through this crap if any man of any religion believes that God made us in His image -

- how do you know he was working in a Realistic manner?

Extermination again????

What did the jews do that makes people want to keep exterminating them?

What do they do in society that keeps pissing everyone off?

Just interested to know.

The implication of such a snarky question is that the Jews (or any racial, religious, ethnic, ethno-religious, etc. group) "deserves" to be the target of genocide. That, sir, is DISGUSTING.

Antisemitism (against Jews) is an irrational form of hatred.

http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10005175

There is never any "reason" for genocide.

Edited August 24, 2014 by Jingthing

[pkspeaker]

Well how about "not occupying" an area more than 1% of contiguous area in the country known as israel to some and palestine to other's..the notion that 1.7 million people are supposed to be satisfied that the Government of that country turned over such a tiny area and then said "ok there you go, the occupation has ended you can be happy now while we have the other 90% and some other palestinians in the west bank have a few other disconnected 'non-occupied' area's that may be 8%..ok you can all get on with your lives now, we have found the fair solution.

Self defence is not terrorism is it.

Invasion is not self defence.

Occupation is not self defence.

Invasion with the intention of taking out military targets (rockets, launchers, tunnels, Hamas operatives) used to attack your civilians is indeed self defense.

Gaza is NOT occupied.

The current Israeli intentions are not occupation of Gaza.

Israel clearly would rather not want to be in the position of administering Gaza.

However, how this current mess in Gaza is eventually going to shake out can't be determined right now.

Gaza was actually returned to the Arabs by Israel to promote peace.

It didn't work.

[car720]

Good to see Jewish people coming out in opposition to the bloodthirsty Netanyahu regime. Follows on from the reports of the 50 Israelis a few weeks ago who refused to participate in the unjust and inhumane invasion of Gaza. Incidents such as these are great ammunition for undermining the anti-semitism that Israel's warmongering is feeding.

I hope these signatories do not suffer the same fate as do "peaceniks" in Israel, with the abuse and threats to which they are regularly subjected.

Jews have no more moral authority than I do, or you. Whether genocide survivors or generation X'ers, their position only has legitimacy insofar as it's valid. I grant to none, because of their personal or collective history, exclusive claim to be arbiters of right and wrong. Exceptions to any rule deserve to be considered in context. Because they posses the title "Jew" their indicting other Jews reveals independent thinking, but not necessarily meaningful points or truth.

It's correct: Ba'alists stopped child sacrifice in the valley of the children of hinnom long ago. The current contrast is not subtle- it's striking. Hamas and local Arabs continue policies and impulses that indoctrinate the sacrifice of others, and children. How utterly appalling any human can rationalize or equivocate this point. The selective ethical relativity says volumes about the Jews, or others, who ignore this point in pursuit of their arguments sterilizing Hamas slaughter of Jews, their citizens, children, society...

Lotta big words in there.........we be nothin but humble pirates.

[BlackJack]

If you skip to page 16 of this PDF you will see and understand what the fighting is all about.

http://ep.yimg.com/ty/cdn/realityzone/Gaza2014.pdf

[pkspeaker]

Jews havn't done anything , Jewish and Christian backed extreme zionists are the ones that have that job.

Extermination again????

What did the jews do that makes people want to keep exterminating them?

What do they do in society that keeps pissing everyone off?

Just interested to know.

[car720]

to be clear only 40 hollcaust survivors signed this

Most of whom have dementia by now or were pressured into it. Pretty meaningless but jumped on by people desperate for anything to demonise Israel with. If Israel were interested in genocide there would be nobody left alive in Gaza.

And it appears more and more each day that they are only waiting for an excuse to do just that. Just lucky it is the arabs that they are doing it to and not the Chinese. Different metal.

[car720]

I would like to put a few questions to these 300 survivors:

1) How did you survive?

2) How did you fight the extermination?

3) Do you believe in self-defence?

4) How did you turn up in Israel?

5) Which country did you or your parents came from?

6) Which country are you going to live in after Israel stops fighting?

7) How will you survive again?

8) How will you fight the extermination again?

9) Do you prefer extermination or self-defence?

To cut through this crap if any man of any religion believes that God made us in His image -

- how do you know he was working in a Realistic manner?

Extermination again????

What did the jews do that makes people want to keep exterminating them?

What do they do in society that keeps pissing everyone off?

Just interested to know.

The implication of such a snarky question is that the Jews (or any racial, religious, ethnic, ethno-religious, etc. group) "deserves" to be the target of genocide. That, sir, is DISGUSTING.

Antisemitism (against Jews) is an irrational form of hatred.

http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10005175

There is never any "reason" for genocide.

I didn't realise that asking a simple question was antisemitism. It does seem though that they best form of defence is a good offence.

As for irrational hatred, I have no problem as I hate everybody equally.

[rethaier]

But we do believe that Palestine has a right to a homeland and it should be, at the very least, the lands they owned after the 1947 giveaway by GB and The UN.

They turned that deal down. They have never "owned" the land that they were offered and refused.

Turned what land down? A small portion of what was taken. If someone stole $1,000,000 from you and offered to give back $100,000 to let bygones be bygone, would you accept it. Britain and The UN gave Israel over half of the palestinians land and Isreal has continued to take more and more ever since. I will state it one more time. Israel needs to forced to move back into their original allotted land. Your views are all biased towards Israel and just put aside what is right and what is wrong. I'm surprised you're not living in a Kibbutz because I think you would feel right at home.

[Jingthing]

But we do believe that Palestine has a right to a homeland and it should be, at the very least, the lands they owned after the 1947 giveaway by GB and The UN.

They turned that deal down. They have never "owned" the land that they were offered and refused.

Turned what land down? A small portion of what was taken. If someone stole $1,000,000 from you and offered to give back $100,000 to let bygones be bygone, would you accept it. Britain and The UN gave Israel over half of the palestinians land and Isreal has continued to take more and more ever since. I will state it one more time. Israel needs to forced to move back into their original allotted land. Your views are all biased towards Israel and just put aside what is right and what is wrong. I'm surprised you're not living in a Kibbutz because I think you would feel right at home.

It wasn't the Palestinians land or the Jews land! It was British mandate Palestine created after the Ottoman empire was split after WW1. DUH!

Your million bucks analogy is meaningless.

After the U.N. created Israel numerous Arab countries ATTACKED Israel and miraculously Israel won.

After that, Israel had no reason to respect their original U.N. borders.

If they had, they wouldn't exist today.

Which I know would please many demonizers of Israel, but sorry, too late, the Arabs should have NEVER attacked.

Edited August 24, 2014 by Jingthing

[ABCer]

I would like to put a few questions to these 300 survivors:

1) How did you survive?

2) How did you fight the extermination?

3) Do you believe in self-defence?

4) How did you turn up in Israel?

5) Which country did you or your parents came from?

6) Which country are you going to live in after Israel stops fighting?

7) How will you survive again?

8) How will you fight the extermination again?

9) Do you prefer extermination or self-defence?

To cut through this crap if any man of any religion believes that God made us in His image -

- how do you know he was working in a Realistic manner?

Extermination again????

What did the jews do that makes people want to keep exterminating them?

What do they do in society that keeps pissing everyone off?

Just interested to know.

The implication of such a snarky question is that the Jews (or any racial, religious, ethnic, ethno-religious, etc. group) "deserves" to be the target of genocide. That, sir, is DISGUSTING.

Antisemitism (against Jews) is an irrational form of hatred.

http://www.ushmm.org/wlc/en/article.php?ModuleId=10005175

There is never any "reason" for genocide.

I didn't realise that asking a simple question was antisemitism. It does seem though that they best form of defence is a good offence.

As for irrational hatred, I have no problem as I hate everybody equally.

The 9 questions I asked clearly indicate (imply) the answers: No more extermination! No more passive submission! Nowhere to go except staying home! God will not protect you if you don't do it yourself!

Any misinterpretation is a wilful act.

Antisemitism was, is and always will be quite rational. Politically - scapegoat minority. Economically - kill to get their possessions. Religiously - infidels, wrong preaching to wrong God. Ethnically - different in every respect.

Rational does not mean correct! There is always some reason given for genocide! Whether we agree with it is a different question.

And finally the question "Why? What did they do?..."

Basically three things. 1) Different. 2) Refuse to assimilate. 3) Smart.

None of these three things people are prepared to 'forgive', to tolerate or take for granted.

Edited August 24, 2014 by ABCer

[rebeli]

Self defence is not terrorism is it.

Invasion is not self defence.

Occupation is not self defence.

Invasion with the intention of taking out military targets (rockets, launchers, tunnels, Hamas operatives) used to attack your civilians is indeed self defense.

Gaza is NOT occupied.

The current Israeli intentions are not occupation of Gaza.

Israel clearly would rather not want to be in the position of administering Gaza.

However, how this current mess in Gaza is eventually going to shake out can't be determined right now.

Gaza was actually returned to the Arabs by Israel to promote peace.

It didn't work.

Gaza is not occupied by Israel. That's true. They turned it into the biggest concentration camp of the world. In the last 100 years.

[Jingthing]

Self defence is not terrorism is it.

Invasion is not self defence.

Occupation is not self defence.

Invasion with the intention of taking out military targets (rockets, launchers, tunnels, Hamas operatives) used to attack your civilians is indeed self defense.

Gaza is NOT occupied.

The current Israeli intentions are not occupation of Gaza.

Israel clearly would rather not want to be in the position of administering Gaza.

However, how this current mess in Gaza is eventually going to shake out can't be determined right now.

Gaza was actually returned to the Arabs by Israel to promote peace.

It didn't work.

Gaza is not occupied by Israel. That's true. They turned it into the biggest concentration camp of the world. In the last 100 years.

Concentration camp is a loaded term. If you mean a place where a population is concentrated, correct. If you mean a camp, well I think they still have lots of buildings. If you mean like NAZI concentration camps with mass industrialized genocide ... WRONG!

Nobody rational is saying the Gazans don't have legit grievances. The issue is what is the path out from that. Hamas is a force openly in favor of mass genocide of the Jews. Gazans want blockades knocked down. But Israel knows for a fact such a liberalization will be used by Hamas to rearm and rearm stronger. How could Israel agree to that? Suicide doesn't appeal.

Edited August 24, 2014 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

...

Not industrial genocide. Just air plane attacks on civilian houses, schools and hospitals.

Israel goes after military targets and I'm sure you know that.

It's not Israel's fault that Hamas operates from such places.

It is intentional by Hamas obviously ... makes great propaganda when the inevitable civilian deaths occur.

Hamas needs to stop the rockets and yes the terror tunnels need to be destroyed.

Edited August 24, 2014 by Jingthing

[rebeli]

...

Not industrial genocide. Just air plane attacks on civilian houses, schools and hospitals.

Israel goes after military targets and I'm sure you know that.

It's not Israel's fault that Hamas operates from such places.

It is intentional by Hamas obviously ... makes great propaganda when the inevitable civilian deaths occur.

Hamas needs to stop the rockets and yes the terror tunnels need to be destroyed.

Rubbish all those talks about rockets launched from civilian places and civilians used as human shields. Israel just wants to kill as much palestinians as they can. And tunnels that go into israel you can also destroy from israel without entering gaza.

[Thorgal]

But we do believe that Palestine has a right to a homeland and it should be, at the very least, the lands they owned after the 1947 giveaway by GB and The UN.

They turned that deal down. They have never "owned" the land that they were offered and refused.

Turned what land down? A small portion of what was taken. If someone stole $1,000,000 from you and offered to give back $100,000 to let bygones be bygone, would you accept it. Britain and The UN gave Israel over half of the palestinians land and Isreal has continued to take more and more ever since. I will state it one more time. Israel needs to forced to move back into their original allotted land. Your views are all biased towards Israel and just put aside what is right and what is wrong. I'm surprised you're not living in a Kibbutz because I think you would feel right at home.

It wasn't the Palestinians land or the Jews land! It was British mandate Palestine created after the Ottoman empire was split after WW1. DUH!

Your million bucks analogy is meaningless.

After the U.N. created Israel numerous Arab countries ATTACKED Israel and miraculously Israel won.

After that, Israel had no reason to respect their original U.N. borders.

If they had, they wouldn't exist today.

Which I know would please many demonizers of Israel, but sorry, too late, the Arabs should have NEVER attacked.

Something's wrong with your perpective of occupation of Palestina.

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/timeline/6f223e41695ac56ea658691bd256b029.png

Edited August 24, 2014 by Thorgal

[Jingthing]

...

Not industrial genocide. Just air plane attacks on civilian houses, schools and hospitals.

Israel goes after military targets and I'm sure you know that.

It's not Israel's fault that Hamas operates from such places.

It is intentional by Hamas obviously ... makes great propaganda when the inevitable civilian deaths occur.

Hamas needs to stop the rockets and yes the terror tunnels need to be destroyed.

Rubbish all those talks about rockets launched from civilian places and civilians used as human shields. Israel just wants to kill as much palestinians as they can. And tunnels that go into israel you can also destroy from israel without entering gaza.

That's daft. If Israel wanted to actually wipe out the population of Gaza they could have done that years ago in a few days. Please stop spreading hate inducing BIG LIES about the intentions of Israel.

[rethaier]

...

Not industrial genocide. Just air plane attacks on civilian houses, schools and hospitals.

Israel goes after military targets and I'm sure you know that.

It's not Israel's fault that Hamas operates from such places.

It is intentional by Hamas obviously ... makes great propaganda when the inevitable civilian deaths occur.

Hamas needs to stop the rockets and yes the terror tunnels need to be destroyed.

We don't know what targets Israel goes after. You assume they are telling the truth.

How do you know Hamas operates from schools much less UN shelters?

Intentional. You believe everything the Zionist publish.

The land needs to be given back.

[Jingthing]

...

The land needs to be given back.

Israel DID give the land of Gaza back already!

Years ago.

[Scott]

Inflammatory and off-topic posts and replies removed.

[Thorgal]

Your first post indicates that Israel had no reason to respect their original UN borders.

Your second post tells that Israel gived the land back to Gaza...???

What is it now precisely ?

Edited August 24, 2014 by Thorgal

[Jingthing]

Your first post indicates that Israel had no reason to respect their original UN borders.

Your second post tells that Israel gived the land back to Gaza...???

What is it now precisely ?

There is a long history since 1947-8.

Maybe read about it before asking such silly basic questions.

There is no contradiction in my posts.

The original multiple Arab state attack on the original Israel set the stage for things to come.

Who knows what the history would have been if they had not done that?

But it is way too late for that.

I will always be amazed that Israel won that original war. The world didn't think they would, that's for sure.

Edited August 24, 2014 by Jingthing