Koh Tao suspects to be indicted by end of month

[greenchair]

Tic toc tic toc still no indictment.

What will the news bring?

Keep on posting.

[jabis]

Less than two weeks time to prosecute, last extensions of detainment given by the court. Come 28th the case must be in prosecutors desk, and start proceedings. And seems my prediction is now shared with the lawyers too. (Source: Thai Tribune)
“The Thai police have encountered severe difficulties because they have no eyewitnesses. When the prosecutor’s office allows the case go to court, it will be heard. And then, if there is not enough evidence at that time, [the two Myanmar workers] may be acquitted,” said lawyer U Aung Myo Thant.

[heyexile]

Less than two weeks time to prosecute, last extensions of detainment given by the court. Come 28th the case must be in prosecutors desk, and start proceedings. And seems my prediction is now shared with the lawyers too. (Source: Thai Tribune)

“The Thai police have encountered severe difficulties because they have no eyewitnesses. When the prosecutor’s office allows the case go to court, it will be heard. And then, if there is not enough evidence at that time, [the two Myanmar workers] may be acquitted,” said lawyer U Aung Myo Thant.

Police file will probably be on prosecutors` desk by 28th, unless they can get emergency extensions from court to pursue new evidence or some delay tactic.

If on their desk, will prosecutors accept it, send it back to police again or ask court for more time to study, prepare, indict and prosecute?

Will prosecutors finally be pressured by `higher powers` to proceed at all costs whatever the case merits?

Will court be pressured to hear case at all costs and do anything excluding outright acquittal? Will they be pressured for a guilty verdict which could be later subject to clemency?

Who knows, many variables and only the junta can really decide on how to proceed. Everything subservient to martial law.

[MaxLee]

Less than two weeks time to prosecute, last extensions of detainment given by the court. Come 28th the case must be in prosecutors desk, and start proceedings. And seems my prediction is now shared with the lawyers too. (Source: Thai Tribune)

“The Thai police have encountered severe difficulties because they have no eyewitnesses. When the prosecutor’s office allows the case go to court, it will be heard. And then, if there is not enough evidence at that time, [the two Myanmar workers] may be acquitted,” said lawyer U Aung Myo Thant.

In this case, in an extreme case.... in a Thai prison, where there is obviously equal corruption between prisons guards, wardens and key jail personal,.... with the two Burmese victims there,..... if someone in power gives a "specific order"......

.... you know what I mean, do you???

... or should I explain any further...

[meand]

The reenactment was farce personified. The Burmese didn't have a clue. Police brass handlers were literally handling the boys by grabbing their arms and showing them what they needed to do. They could have had two crash test dummies out there, and it would have been as convincing.

Plus, the whole thing about not being able to figure out high tide was not the best time to do it was just too thai.

[jabis]

Less than two weeks time to prosecute, last extensions of detainment given by the court. Come 28th the case must be in prosecutors desk, and start proceedings. And seems my prediction is now shared with the lawyers too. (Source: Thai Tribune)

“The Thai police have encountered severe difficulties because they have no eyewitnesses. When the prosecutor’s office allows the case go to court, it will be heard. And then, if there is not enough evidence at that time, [the two Myanmar workers] may be acquitted,” said lawyer U Aung Myo Thant.

Police file will probably be on prosecutors` desk by 28th, unless they can get emergency extensions from court to pursue new evidence or some delay tactic.

If on their desk, will prosecutors accept it, send it back to police again or ask court for more time to study, prepare, indict and prosecute?

Will prosecutors finally be pressured by `higher powers` to proceed at all costs whatever the case merits?

Will court be pressured to hear case at all costs and do anything excluding outright acquittal? Will they be pressured for a guilty verdict which could be later subject to clemency?

Who knows, many variables and only the junta can really decide on how to proceed. Everything subservient to martial law.

I'd remember there is no 'emergency extension' in the books, but there is the 84 days maximum detaining period without indicting a suspect, which is due on 28th. (Somewhere in these topics was the transliteration of the criminal code of justice, can't seem to find it anymore, to quote it directly)

True that martial law trumps regular proceedings, but I don't see the head of state taking an image loss, over this whole play between the police and the prosecutor, which indeed will absolve the loss face on all accounts (BiB say 100% complete case, not their fault the laws are written this way, and it must be honored, while prosecutor having his illegal entry charges pressed -> B2 deported = problem solved, nothing more needs to be done and 'justice' served).

So as earlier, we will just have to wait and see how the case evolves, it's long been a waiting game, but now there is the final deadline set, according to standing law at least, and soon the cards will unfold.

@MaxLee

In this case, in an extreme case.... in a Thai prison, where there is obviously equal corruption between prisons guards, wardens and key jail personal,.... with the two Burmese victims there,..... if someone in power gives a "specific order"......

.... you know what I mean, do you???

... or should I explain any further...

Were it the case, I'd suggest it would've happened already - if you remember the head of the prison "getting worried" about the detainees being "suicidal", before they got their own Myanmar law reps on their side.

That's all my take of course - 28th is still a long way ahead, and anything can happen, surely, but giving the "specific order" would make the general public cry out justice even more, and I'm sure the BiB know this as much as the prosecutors handling the case. Even TiT, it would be a media suicide, easier to let some heads roll, figuratively, for possibly botching the case, than trying to get away with yet another two lost lives regarding the whole case, no?

[Krenjai]

Things have become a bit quiet lately, nothing new to report I guess. Stalemate? Impossible to make a move without losing face? What now? Indite? Acquit? Where is the CCTV of the AC bar of the night? Helllooo? Anybody out there? Did we find out who was number 9 already? The person with the unmistakable walk, haircut & arm-swing? Hellloooo? What about the speedboat Lucky Duck? Where is it? Will the UK_autopsy report on David show his wounds were from the hoe or conclude with a 99.99% certainty it was a push-knife? Hellooo? How does the RTP avoid losing face? No wonder it has gone quiet. Silence before the Storm!

Edited November 15, 2014 by Krenjai

[heyexile]

Less than two weeks time to prosecute, last extensions of detainment given by the court. Come 28th the case must be in prosecutors desk, and start proceedings. And seems my prediction is now shared with the lawyers too. (Source: Thai Tribune)

“The Thai police have encountered severe difficulties because they have no eyewitnesses. When the prosecutor’s office allows the case go to court, it will be heard. And then, if there is not enough evidence at that time, [the two Myanmar workers] may be acquitted,” said lawyer U Aung Myo Thant.

In this case, in an extreme case.... in a Thai prison, where there is obviously equal corruption between prisons guards, wardens and key jail personal,.... with the two Burmese victims there,..... if someone in power gives a "specific order"......

.... you know what I mean, do you???

... or should I explain any further...

Well the B2 no longer shackled 24/7 which is good but are being kept in one cell 24/7. I believe they are the only 2 in that cell but not exactly clear. Good for their safety if kept in isolation.

They seem to be getting daily visits but Andy Hall will soon be bogged down in defamation case defense. Handy for authorities but prob still has one from MWRN team looking in plus Myanmar lawyers on daily basis it seems, although prison authorities can always deny access at their discretion.

They are probably safe until court appearance. Unfortunate MVA or drive by shooting seems unlikely now with all the likely cameras. I don`t expect suicide type accidents, food poisoning or the like now. Too late.

Do fear of anything like a proper fair trial given the terrible state of Thai Criminal Injustice System. Hope MWRN, Myanmar Embassy and lawyers, NCHR et al can prevent/preempt usual rail- roading. On the whole their situation is much improved from before and they can be hopeful as can we..

Edit add link.http://twitter.com/Atomicalandy you can see how people are helping with visits.

Edited November 15, 2014 by heyexile

[jabis]

Things have become a bit quiet lately, nothing new to report I guess. Stalemate? Impossible to make a move without losing face? What now? Indite? Acquit? Where is the CCTV of the AC bar of the night? Helllooo? Anybody out there? Did we find out who was number 9 already? The person with the unmistakable walk, haircut & arm-swing? Hellloooo? What about the speedboat Lucky Duck? Where is it? Will the UK_autopsy report on David show his wounds were from the hoe but with a 99.99% certainty of a push-knife? Hellooo? How does the RTP avoid losing face? No wonder it has gone quiet. Silence before the Storm!

That's why keeping the topics up is important. BiB have decided there is nothing more to examine, and stated it, as well told there'd be no reports as the case is finalized. On the other hand now, they've been handed the case again and again to be completed, but if they cannot produce anything it will have to be either tried or aquitted, at discretion of the prosecutors, and if the latter, they'll just roll with the illegal entry (and possibly Labor laws as to working without a WP on top of that). And to your q about impossibility to make a move without losing face = 100% correct - the BiB can't back down on their statement that the case is complete - they can only push the papers back to prosecutors desk with tweaking the wording now. UK inquiry will be disclosed not earlier than in January, if my memory serves right. By that time the case will most definitely be over in way or the other, as it poses a risk of further loss of face, should it contradict with the case findings.

[heyexile]

Things have become a bit quiet lately, nothing new to report I guess. Stalemate? Impossible to make a move without losing face? What now? Indite? Acquit? Where is the CCTV of the AC bar of the night? Helllooo? Anybody out there? Did we find out who was number 9 already? The person with the unmistakable walk, haircut & arm-swing? Hellloooo? What about the speedboat Lucky Duck? Where is it? Will the UK_autopsy report on David show his wounds were from the hoe or conclude with a 99.99% certainty it was a push-knife? Hellooo? How does the RTP avoid losing face? No wonder it has gone quiet. Silence before the Storm!

Active in other related topics like sudden removal of the two top CIB and two top CSD cops in BKK.

Don`t expect to see any further investigation of your influentials who have been cleared. They have so much support in high places and are loyal allies. Can`t hound these respectable citizens. It is defamatory and rightly so. Only regime change could alter that but unlikely as they are clearly above suspicion and beyond reproach which is as it should be.

Koh Tao does seem somehow to have slipped to the bottom of my bucket list. Now below playing with king cobras. Maybe the grandchildren will go instead?

[MJP]

A post concerning the present government has been removed. Please be a bit careful when posting about the present government and its policies.

[HansIsaan]

BTW the phrase used in the autopsy report and by the deputy commander of the police Institute of Forensic Medicine for a blunt instrument is "song kheng mi khom", literally "a hard, blunt instrument."

I'm sorry, but I think "mi khom" means sharp, "mai mi khom" or "mai khom" means blunt...

[HansIsaan]

To make it more interesting:

I was not shure about the Thai words, so I asked my wife. She doesn't read English, so she didn't know I was reading about Koh Tao. I asked her what a song khaeng mi kom was. She replied: Oh, I can show you. And she came back with this little beauty. Yes, she said, this is a song khaeng mi kom, and you can buy one everywhere!

Edited November 16, 2014 by HansIsaan

[AGareth2]

BTW the phrase used in the autopsy report and by the deputy commander of the police Institute of Forensic Medicine for a blunt instrument is "song kheng mi khom", literally "a hard, blunt instrument."

I'm sorry, but I think "mi khom" means sharp, "mai mi khom" or "mai khom" means blunt...

that would make more sense given the injuries

[BritTim]

Things have become a bit quiet lately, nothing new to report I guess. Stalemate? Impossible to make a move without losing face? What now? Indite? Acquit? Where is the CCTV of the AC bar of the night? Helllooo? Anybody out there? Did we find out who was number 9 already? The person with the unmistakable walk, haircut & arm-swing? Hellloooo? What about the speedboat Lucky Duck? Where is it? Will the UK_autopsy report on David show his wounds were from the hoe but with a 99.99% certainty of a push-knife? Hellooo? How does the RTP avoid losing face? No wonder it has gone quiet. Silence before the Storm!

That's why keeping the topics up is important. BiB have decided there is nothing more to examine, and stated it, as well told there'd be no reports as the case is finalized. On the other hand now, they've been handed the case again and again to be completed, but if they cannot produce anything it will have to be either tried or aquitted, at discretion of the prosecutors, and if the latter, they'll just roll with the illegal entry (and possibly Labor laws as to working without a WP on top of that). And to your q about impossibility to make a move without losing face = 100% correct - the BiB can't back down on their statement that the case is complete - they can only push the papers back to prosecutors desk with tweaking the wording now. UK inquiry will be disclosed not earlier than in January, if my memory serves right. By that time the case will most definitely be over in way or the other, as it poses a risk of further loss of face, should it contradict with the case findings.

I am inclined to agree. However, they may still try to manufacture eye witnesses if a conviction is considered essential. Obviously, this could be risky if the witnesses withdraw their testimony citing bribery, threats and/or torture. It would need to be done carefully, but the right financial incentives (combined with threats) to the right people would likely work.

[AGareth2]

if the B2 walk

social media will not go away

SM wants the real killers

[Briggsy]

Since this is not a national security issue for Thailand and bearing in mind the National Police Commissioner has nailed his colours to the mast, there will be no credible investigation under this regime. Should the Surat Thani Democratic Party patronage network find itself a lot further from the corridors of power than they are now, say in 2 or 3 years' time, there is a 1% chance of reopening the case. Failing that, this will just be another Kirsty Jones case of appalling corruption and injustice, where Thailand's unaccountable give the finger to the victiims' families.

The 2 Burmese will be released from Thai jails at some point, probably not for some time yet.

The only thing left is to boycott Koh Tao.

[tingtongtourist]

To make it more interesting:

I was not shure about the Thai words, so I asked my wife. She doesn't reahttp://twitter.com/Atomicalandyd English, so she didn't know I was reading about Koh Tao. I asked her what a song khaeng mi kom was. She replied: Oh, I can show you. And she came back with this little beauty. Yes, she said, this is a song khaeng mi kom, and you can buy one everywhere!

surprised the TV experts havent come in here.

are you sure the "mi" wasnt mid or meet.

hard to write in english, but

mid..meaning knife.

keang..solid, strong as in heavy metal ect

khom..sharp

if that be right, its a sharp,solid metal knife

leaves it quite open

maybe like others have mention but even something like an oyster shucker could do that

[Krenjai]

Things have become a bit quiet lately, nothing new to report I guess. Stalemate? Impossible to make a move without losing face? What now? Indite? Acquit? Where is the CCTV of the AC bar of the night? Helllooo? Anybody out there? Did we find out who was number 9 already? The person with the unmistakable walk, haircut & arm-swing? Hellloooo? What about the speedboat Lucky Duck? Where is it? Will the UK_autopsy report on David show his wounds were from the hoe but with a 99.99% certainty of a push-knife? Hellooo? How does the RTP avoid losing face? No wonder it has gone quiet. Silence before the Storm!

That's why keeping the topics up is important. BiB have decided there is nothing more to examine, and stated it, as well told there'd be no reports as the case is finalized. On the other hand now, they've been handed the case again and again to be completed, but if they cannot produce anything it will have to be either tried or aquitted, at discretion of the prosecutors, and if the latter, they'll just roll with the illegal entry (and possibly Labor laws as to working without a WP on top of that). And to your q about impossibility to make a move without losing face = 100% correct - the BiB can't back down on their statement that the case is complete - they can only push the papers back to prosecutors desk with tweaking the wording now. UK inquiry will be disclosed not earlier than in January, if my memory serves right. By that time the case will most definitely be over in way or the other, as it poses a risk of further loss of face, should it contradict with the case findings.

I am inclined to agree. However, they may still try to manufacture eye witnesses if a conviction is considered essential. Obviously, this could be risky if the witnesses withdraw their testimony citing bribery, threats and/or torture. It would need to be done carefully, but the right financial incentives (combined with threats) to the right people would likely work.

Too late now to come up with an eye-witness IMO, also too risky as this person will go under the microscope of Social Media and who knows what this will show!

[thailandchilli]

Keep posting, never give up. Never give in. We can do very little as individuals but every little helps. Don't give up the alternative theories, the only conspiracy here is that perpetrated by the RTP.

One of the many traits of a well cultivated critical thinker:

"thinks openmindedly within alternative systems of thought, recognizing and assessing, as need be, their assumptions, implications, and practical consequences;"

[metisdead]

Trolling posts and replies have been removed.

[catsanddogs]

There was a couple of minutes interesting listening on Radio 4 today (available to listen again) about the 'CSI effect' - forensics and crime scenes - blood spatter patterns. The programme is called Pick of the Day (aired at 6.15pm) and it's around 2 mins 15 secs into the programme that the issue is discussed.

Edited November 16, 2014 by catsanddogs

[StealthEnergiser]

Years ago Australia had big problems with police corruption and a Royal Commission was called to sort it out , can the same be done in thailand ?

[HansIsaan]

In another case for the Samui prosecutor:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/777033-suspects-in-the-murder-of-a-46-year-old-german-man-in-samui-could-walk-free-on-tuesday/

[ttthailand]

In another case for the Samui prosecutor:

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/777033-suspects-in-the-murder-of-a-46-year-old-german-man-in-samui-could-walk-free-on-tuesday/

Not a very healthy environment for farang.

[Dogmatix]

I spotted an interesting article in Thai Rath over the week end, the gist of which I summarize below for the benefit of those who cannot read Thai.

"After the Koh Tao murders a crazy conspiracy developed with a view to making Thai people bitterly hate Thai police. They have repeatedly incited their friends to believe that Thai police looked for Burmese scapegoats to get forced confessions. After the dust had settled and the social media idiots all returned to America, it turned out after 3 DNA tests that the police were right.

Scotland Yard and the British Ambassador, who spent a long time engrossed in the case, asked to see all the details of the DNA tests of 300 people on Koh Tao and the taking of samples. All the Scotland Yard aunties and the British ambassador were so impressed that they asked the Thai police to come to the UK to train their own police. Even more important than the praise heaped on Thai police by the Brits was their admission that the Thai police used more advanced equipment and techniques in the investigation than their own.

Once the imaginative fantasies are over, hopefully people will stop criticizing Thai police."

[newcomer71]

I spotted an interesting article in Thai Rath over the week end, the gist of which I summarize below for the benefit of those who cannot read Thai.

"After the Koh Tao murders a crazy conspiracy developed with a view to making Thai people bitterly hate Thai police. They have repeatedly incited their friends to believe that Thai police looked for Burmese scapegoats to get forced confessions. After the dust had settled and the social media idiots all returned to America, it turned out after 3 DNA tests that the police were right.

Scotland Yard and the British Ambassador, who spent a long time engrossed in the case, asked to see all the details of the DNA tests of 300 people on Koh Tao and the taking of samples. All the Scotland Yard aunties and the British ambassador were so impressed that they asked the Thai police to come to the UK to train their own police. Even more important than the praise heaped on Thai police by the Brits was their admission that the Thai police used more advanced equipment and techniques in the investigation than their own.

Once the imaginative fantasies are over, hopefully people will stop criticizing Thai police."

"All the Scotland Yard aunties and the British ambassador were so impressed that they asked the Thai police to come to the UK to train their own police. Even more important than the praise heaped on Thai police by the Brits was their admission that the Thai police used more advanced equipment and techniques in the investigation than their own."

[BritTim]

I spotted an interesting article in Thai Rath over the week end, the gist of which I summarize below for the benefit of those who cannot read Thai.

"After the Koh Tao murders a crazy conspiracy developed with a view to making Thai people bitterly hate Thai police. They have repeatedly incited their friends to believe that Thai police looked for Burmese scapegoats to get forced confessions. After the dust had settled and the social media idiots all returned to America, it turned out after 3 DNA tests that the police were right.

Scotland Yard and the British Ambassador, who spent a long time engrossed in the case, asked to see all the details of the DNA tests of 300 people on Koh Tao and the taking of samples. All the Scotland Yard aunties and the British ambassador were so impressed that they asked the Thai police to come to the UK to train their own police. Even more important than the praise heaped on Thai police by the Brits was their admission that the Thai police used more advanced equipment and techniques in the investigation than their own.

Once the imaginative fantasies are over, hopefully people will stop criticizing Thai police."

When,and if, the fantasies are set aside and the correct people arrested, there will be no remaining reason to continue criticizing the Thai police (at least with respect to this case).

[newcomer71]

I spotted an interesting article in Thai Rath over the week end, the gist of which I summarize below for the benefit of those who cannot read Thai.

"After the Koh Tao murders a crazy conspiracy developed with a view to making Thai people bitterly hate Thai police. They have repeatedly incited their friends to believe that Thai police looked for Burmese scapegoats to get forced confessions. After the dust had settled and the social media idiots all returned to America, it turned out after 3 DNA tests that the police were right.

Scotland Yard and the British Ambassador, who spent a long time engrossed in the case, asked to see all the details of the DNA tests of 300 people on Koh Tao and the taking of samples. All the Scotland Yard aunties and the British ambassador were so impressed that they asked the Thai police to come to the UK to train their own police. Even more important than the praise heaped on Thai police by the Brits was their admission that the Thai police used more advanced equipment and techniques in the investigation than their own.

Once the imaginative fantasies are over, hopefully people will stop criticizing Thai police."

...and I am John Belushi.

Dear Lord, how I would love to hear Scotland Yard opinion about these words.

Edit: Sorry for the second post but somehow text was cut out of the first...

Edited November 17, 2014 by newcomer71

[heyexile]

Years ago Australia had big problems with police corruption and a Royal Commission was called to sort it out , can the same be done in thailand ?

What a great idea. Unfortunately not poss as said institution is not constituted to act so.