Motor Cyclists Beware.

[NoshowJones]

This morning around 8am heading south on Highway 117, I was riding on the hard shoulder, about 15 Ks from Phitsanulok,

on a three lane highway.

The road was very quiet, no traffic around, there was an obstruction ahead of me (I can't remember what it was) I slowed down to about 40 Ks speed.

There is a rut about 1 ins wide between the hard shoulder and the first lane, as I moved out, my front wheel caught the rut, and forced me sprawling

across the three lanes, my bike ended up on the third lane, and I ended up on the fence on the central reservation.

My bike is only slightly damaged, and I have a few bruises, if there were other traffic on the road, I would have been dead.

The rut between the hard shoulder, and the first lane lasts for more than thirty Ks, it makes you wonder what brainless idiots are in charge of the roads

in that area.

You guys on the big bikes won't come up against this, but if you are riding a small bike, be very careful when changing between the hard shoulder and

the first lane in this third world country.

I have been through a lot of Provinces, but never seen anything like this. The people in charge of the roads in the Phitsanulok area, must surely have a few deaths on their conscience.

[RubberSideDown]

That sucks- glad you made out as well as you did. Hitting that kind of a rut can be (obviously) a real disaster- the effect is instantaneous and you have very little chance to escape it once you find yourself in it. What was it- quick monster head-shake and then down?

[watcharacters]

Good for you that you came out of it relatively unharmed.

Motor bikes are motorbikes and I always recommend to the Missus to not take hers ever, even for short trips. I prefer a car or such. We all do what feels best for us as individuals.

I'd only disagree with this in your post. "The people in charge of the roads in the Phitsanulok area, must surely have a few deaths on their conscience."

I think you can sleep comfortably knowing the people in charge of that road don't care in the least what your issue with it may be. Or how many people died on they road over which they were in charge.

Responsibility or feelings thereof, for such a thing would be pretty rare here I believe.

Good you came out on top.

[NoshowJones]

Good for you that you came out of it relatively unharmed.

Motor bikes are motorbikes and I always recommend to the Missus to not take hers ever, even for short trips. I prefer a car or such. We all do what feels best for us as individuals.

I'd only disagree with this in your post. "The people in charge of the roads in the Phitsanulok area, must surely have a few deaths on their conscience."

I think you can sleep comfortably knowing the people in charge of that road don't care in the least what your issue with it may be. Or how many people died on they road over which they were in charge.

Responsibility or feelings thereof, for such a thing would be pretty rare here I believe.

Good you came out on top.

That road has been like that for as long as I can remember. I have often changed into the first lane, I looked at the road, and the rut was about an inch wide. There are more than sixty motorbike riders killed on Thailands roads every day, we only read about the odd one or two, so I think it's reasonable to assume some have died over the years on this road. probably because of the rut between the hard shoulder and first lane. at some points the first lane is raised about 2ins above the hard shoulder.

Thanks for your last paragraph.

[NoshowJones]

That sucks- glad you made out as well as you did. Hitting that kind of a rut can be (obviously) a real disaster- the effect is instantaneous and you have very little chance to escape it once you find yourself in it. What was it- quick monster head-shake and then down?

Yes, I had to but the saddlebags back on, also the big bag tied in front of my topbox.

This was the last stage of my road trip to Maesot for visa, then to Phitsanulok.

I am seriously thinking about giving up those road trips, only because of Thailands roads.

In the road trips I have done so far, I have seen many idiot drivers and riders, but never

had any altercations with anyone, and no near misses.

Only problem being the roads. I doubt if any (DELETED) would allow roads like that

for years and do nothing about it.

Edited March 15, 2015 by seedy
bashing

[watcharacters]

That sucks- glad you made out as well as you did. Hitting that kind of a rut can be (obviously) a real disaster- the effect is instantaneous and you have very little chance to escape it once you find yourself in it. What was it- quick monster head-shake and then down?

Yes, I had to but the saddlebags back on, also the big bag tied in front of my topbox.

This was the last stage of my road trip to Maesot for visa, then to Phitsanulok.

I am seriously thinking about giving up those road trips, only because of Thailands roads.

In the road trips I have done so far, I have seen many idiot drivers and riders, but never

had any altercations with anyone, and no near misses.

Only problem being the roads. I doubt if any country would allow roads like that

for years and do nothing about it.

Agreed.

I doubt if any country would allow roads like that

for years and do nothing about it.

[Brit_Doggie]

Confused that you ride a bike on the hard shoulder and not on the first lane which is meant for slower traffic, if at all slower traffic does exist within thailand.

Sorry for the pun but glad to hear you came out of it relatively unscathed.

[NoshowJones]

Confused that you ride a bike on the hard shoulder and not on the first lane which is meant for slower traffic, if at all slower traffic does exist within thailand.

Sorry for the pun but glad to hear you came out of it relatively unscathed.

Thanks mate, but smaller bikes are meant to use the hard shoulder, they are even allowed to go up them the wrong way, it says so in part of the motor cycle test.

Besides, using the first lane will just get you tailgated by all the big trucks, how dangerous would that be?

[wantan]

Glad nothing very bad happened. Forcing scooters to ride on the hard shoulder is sure a thing that should be changed. But hey TiT, and it will not change. Same as the dangerous road conditions. This is why i prefer a "bigger bike" like my CBR150 for longer rides. If i go over 100kmh cars/trucks accept me as a road user and dont force me to go out of their way. Of course i have to wear proper gear for going faster than 100kmh. Hard shoulder is pretty dangerous. Everything can happen there. I saw holes 2 meter deep without a warning sign, i saw all kinds of stones and crap laying around, cars coming the opposite way without looking at small bikes is their way, dogs sleeping, whatever.

What does it mean "small bikes are meant to use the hard shoulder"? What exactly is a "small bike"? And who is responsible for accidents that happen because the hard shoulder is dangerous? I do not believe this. As soon as you go faster than 50kmh you should use the normal lanes. Everything else is much too dangerous. It cannot depend on "small or big", it must depend on how fast you go. And 70kmh should be enough to use the left lane of the road.

Edited March 15, 2015 by wantan

[NoshowJones]

Glad nothing very bad happened. Forcing scooters to ride on the hard shoulder is sure a thing that should be changed. But hey TiT, and it will not change. Same as the dangerous road conditions. This is why i prefer a "bigger bike" like my CBR150 for longer rides. If i go over 100kmh cars/trucks accept me as a road user and dont force me to go out of their way. Of course i have to wear proper gear for going faster than 100kmh. Hard shoulder is pretty dangerous. Everything can happen there. I saw holes 2 meter deep without a warning sign, i saw all kinds of stones and crap laying around, cars coming the opposite way without looking at small bikes is their way, dogs sleeping, whatever.

What does it mean "small bikes are meant to use the hard shoulder"? What exactly is a "small bike"? And who is responsible for accidents that happen because the hard shoulder is dangerous? I do not believe this. As soon as you go faster than 50kmh you should use the normal lanes. Everything else is much too dangerous. It cannot depend on "small or big", it must depend on how fast you go. And 70kmh should be enough to use the left lane of the road.

A small bike is anything up to 150 cc. mines is a PCX 150. Do you travel at 70 kmh on the first lane of the Highway? I am not going to say it's wrong, but I think it's dangerous.

What about traffic that travel slower than that on the outside lane? There are plenty of them, then when somebody wants to undertake, and they will, you may well be sitting there at a steady 70kmh.

Even traveling over 100kmk on a 100 cc bike. Only a personal opnion, I would think your bike would be a bit unstable at that speed. Be careful mate, and keep safe.

[wantan]

^

> A small bike is anything up to 150 cc.

But my CBR is 149cc and i never had a problem riding on the roads. I never use the hard shoulder

> Do you travel at 70 kmh on the first lane of the Highway? I am not going to say it's wrong, but I think it's dangerous.

No, as i said i ride faster than 100kmh if possible. Of course going 70kmh with a bike on the highway is dangerous. But it shouldnt be dangerous, thats the point i tried to make. Bikes should be accepted on the roads as soon as they go faster than - lets say 70kmh.

> Even traveling over 100kmk on a 100 cc bike. Only a personal opnion, I would think your bike would be a bit unstable at that speed.

No a CBR150 isnt unstable over 100kmh, at least my FI model isnt. I can go up to 130-140kmh without feeling unsafe. Usually i try to keep a speed of 110-120 on multi lane streets. And if the road is empty i often use the right lanes, so less danger of dogs/kids/whatever running into me. I always keep an eye on my rear mirrors, so no racing pick-up can run over me from behind.

Edited March 15, 2015 by wantan

[macknife]

Sorry to hear of your accident and I'm glad you're ok but..

You knew of this rut for a long time and yet it''s not your fault at all? Yes it shouldn't be there but you are partly to blame for knowingly riding on an unsafe part of the road . Hard shoulders are commonly filled with rutts and potholes. It is perfectly legal for bikes to use the left lane.

You get tail-gaited by trucks and doing over 70kph is dangerous? Come on a PCX150 will easily outpace any truck and is super comfy at speeds over 70.

You should be in the left lane not on the hard shoulder. If you need to move onto the hard shoulder to let something pass you then do it but after move back onto the left lane.

After reading this, if you cant handle speeds over 70kph on a highway, then I think you are a danger to yourself, other road users and should stick to cars or pottering about in your village.

[NoshowJones]

I would especially like to hear other bikers opinions on Macknifes post. I don't agree that it was my fault

for crossing the rut, I did it slowly, after checking there was nothing behind me, and that is why I am still alive,

I believe the people in charge of the roads are to blame.

May I point out that I can very easily handle speeds of 70, but it's other drivers and riders I worry about.

I think it's fine to do much more than that on a big bike, but this is Thailand, and the biggest majority of

drivers and riders are not fit to be behind a wheel or handlebars.

As I have already said, riding on the hard shoulder is mentioned on the Motorbike test. I wonder the Thaivisa

lawyer would have to say about riders using the hard shoulder.

Anyway, stay safe when you are riding on the first lane.

[guzzi850m2]

A pcx150 outpace a truck, what? I have done over 170km/h in my truck on the toll ways sometimes, so I don't think so. I have a 100% standard Ranger 2.2 so nothing fancy.

I also has a pcx150 and it's very good for city riding but I don't like riding it out on the highways at it's app max cruising speed 80km/h, you are getting overtaken by most 4 wheelers. Sure you can ride at about 100km/h (full whack) but it's not very stable at those speeds and the engine will not last long if 100% loaded all the time, fuel cons. will also suffer quite a lot when you push it like that.

OP good to hear that nothing serious happened to you and you could complete your trip.

Get a cbr250/300cc and you can follow normal traffic without problems but it might not be comfortable for you?

[NoshowJones]

A pcx150 outpace a truck, what? I have done over 170km/h in my truck on the toll ways sometimes, so I don't think so. I have a 100% standard Ranger 2.2 so nothing fancy.

I also has a pcx150 and it's very good for city riding but I don't like riding it out on the highways at it's app max cruising speed 80km/h, you are getting overtaken by most 4 wheelers. Sure you can ride at about 100km/h (full whack) but it's not very stable at those speeds and the engine will not last long if 100% loaded all the time, fuel cons. will also suffer quite a lot when you push it like that.

OP good to hear that nothing serious happened to you and you could complete your trip.

Get a cbr250/300cc and you can follow normal traffic without problems but it might not be comfortable for you?

I agree that a 150 cc bike will be unstable at 100kmh, the top speed I ride at is 60kmh, I think I am safer on the hardshoulder when I ride on the highway, but what do I do when there is an obstruction, ie a parked vehicle? I saw the rut on the road, I have used that road often, and that rut has always being there.

I slowed down to about 40kmh, no faster, and I never expected that to happen. I keep wondering what more I could have done apart from stopping and edging my way on to the first lane.

[AllanB]

I only ride on the hard shoulder if it is clear ahead and then give myself plenty of time to move out when I see something that looks anything like a problem. There are lumps and bumps in the road too, so it don't make much odds.

The "keep left" law here doesn't get enforced so as far as I am concern it doesn't exists, I ride where I think it is safest at all times.

200baht fine is in no way a sanction worth anything at all.

Anyway glad you are Okay mate.

[NoshowJones]

I only ride on the hard shoulder if it is clear ahead and then give myself plenty of time to move out when I see something that looks anything like a problem. There are lumps and bumps in the road too, so it don't make much odds.

The "keep left" law here doesn't get enforced so as far as I am concern it doesn't exists, I ride where I think it is safest at all times.

200baht fine is in no way a sanction worth anything at all.

Anyway glad you are Okay mate.

That's what I did. I was the only one on the road, if I did anything wrong it was not stopping at the obstruction, and coaxing my bike on the the first lane before I arrived at the obstruction. That's what I did the rest of my journey home.

[Rhys]

Thanks for the heads up.. .years ago down in the south.. at a main road, there were a series of grated drain squares.. the third square drain has a nice little drop.. A car got stuck and wrecked part of the front end.. The locals took matters into their own hands before the city came a fixed it.. they put a tree branch in the box so it was sticking up like a tree.

Took the city about 2 weeks to come and cover the draining square so it was not a safety hazard.

Good on you that your fine... sorry about the bike.

[NoshowJones]

Thanks for the heads up.. .years ago down in the south.. at a main road, there were a series of grated drain squares.. the third square drain has a nice little drop.. A car got stuck and wrecked part of the front end.. The locals took matters into their own hands before the city came a fixed it.. they put a tree branch in the box so it was sticking up like a tree.

Took the city about 2 weeks to come and cover the draining square so it was not a safety hazard.

Good on you that your fine... sorry about the bike.

Thanks mate, the bikes not too bad only cosmetic.

[English_M_in_Bkk]

I hate it when they put huge slabs of metal on the road, usually when doing some work on the BTS. These things are like blocks of ice when it rains.

[wantan]

Possum, i really do all i can to keep myself safe. And after testing things out i decided that i need a bike that can do at least 120kmh to be safe. A bike doing only 100kmh doesnt fit for me, as i think its dangerously slow. Too many cars coming from behind pushing you on the hard shoulder. And once you are on the hard shoulder you often have to slow down to 50-60kmh. So if you have a bike that can do 100 you can only do 50-60, if you have a bike that can do 120 you can do 120. Maybe you should upgrade to a Forza for riding highways. Imo safer and more fun than pottering on the hard shoulder.

I agree with you, there should be someone who is reponsible for such dangerous road conditions. But TiT, we should be thankful that there is now tarmac on most streets, even in remote areas. Thinking a country like Thailand can do it like a western country or even better is expecting too much. Even a country like germany is hardly able to keep all streets in good shape. Its a matter of having the money or not. For perfect streets you need much much more money.

[NoshowJones]

Possum, i really do all i can to keep myself safe. And after testing things out i decided that i need a bike that can do at least 120kmh to be safe. A bike doing only 100kmh doesnt fit for me, as i think its dangerously slow. Too many cars coming from behind pushing you on the hard shoulder. And once you are on the hard shoulder you often have to slow down to 50-60kmh. So if you have a bike that can do 100 you can only do 50-60, if you have a bike that can do 120 you can do 120. Maybe you should upgrade to a Forza for riding highways. Imo safer and more fun than pottering on the hard shoulder.

I agree with you, there should be someone who is reponsible for such dangerous road conditions. But TiT, we should be thankful that there is now tarmac on most streets, even in remote areas. Thinking a country like Thailand can do it like a western country or even better is expecting too much. Even a country like germany is hardly able to keep all streets in good shape. Its a matter of having the money or not. For perfect streets you need much much more money.

How right you are Wantan, excellent post, but to be honest, I would rather give up on these road trips than have to go too fast, that's why I will not get a big bike in Thailand. I did have a Honda Dream 250 back in Scotland.

Far too many nutters on the road here.

[wantan]

Possum, i go something like 80-110 on single lane rural roads and 100-130 on multi lane big roads in good condition. This is sometimes a bit faster than i want but i got used to it. I wouldnt call this "dangerously fast". Often some guy on a Wave passes me or guys on a Sonic want to race with me and i let them go. Imo you can only call this fast, if you are not wearing proper gear. Do you? I feel pretty unsafe going over 80kmh without having my gear on. Riding in Thailand isnt that bad once you got used to it. But you have to flow with the traffic. Try it, its fun.

[macknife]

A pcx150 outpace a truck, what? I have done over 170km/h in my truck on the toll ways sometimes, so I don't think so. I have a 100% standard Ranger 2.2 so nothing fancy.

I also has a pcx150 and it's very good for city riding but I don't like riding it out on the highways at it's app max cruising speed 80km/h, you are getting overtaken by most 4 wheelers. Sure you can ride at about 100km/h (full whack) but it's not very stable at those speeds and the engine will not last long if 100% loaded all the time, fuel cons. will also suffer quite a lot when you push it like that.

OP good to hear that nothing serious happened to you and you could complete your trip.

Get a cbr250/300cc and you can follow normal traffic without problems but it might not be comfortable for you?

I agree that a 150 cc bike will be unstable at 100kmh, the top speed I ride at is 60kmh, I think I am safer on the hardshoulder when I ride on the highway, but what do I do when there is an obstruction, ie a parked vehicle? I saw the rut on the road, I have used that road often, and that rut has always being there.

I slowed down to about 40kmh, no faster, and I never expected that to happen. I keep wondering what more I could have done apart from stopping and edging my way on to the first lane.

When i said truck I meant the multi-wheeled heavy trucks not a Ford Ranger or Toyota Hilux.

To me 60kph is too slow to be safe. Keeping up to the speed of the traffic or faster is safer IMO very few vehicles will pass you. Yes maybe a PCX150 isn't completely stable at 100kph but surely 80-90 is fine and big trucks wont be passing you. I have ridden my 110cc scooter long distances and it's fine doing 80kph, it could reach 100kph but I wouldn't cruise at that pace. I don't recall any heavy trucks overtaking me.

What could you have done better? From what I have read and experienced is that when you brake it adds weight to the front of your bike, so when you went over the rutt it threw your front wheel out and you lost control. It would have been better to accelerate as you went over the rutt, as then your front wheel becomes lighter and will go over the rutt more easily giving you more control.

[andrewrooney]

Personally I avoid the shoulder like the plague; just too many unknown factors there, whether it's gravel, sand, stray dogs, giant holes in the road, or what have you. Honestly I think a pcx should be fine on the main road; I've ridden my Wave 125 on the highway plenty of times. At the end of the day though if you don't feel safe going at faster speeds that's your decision. Just glad you came out of it ok! Stay safe.

[jonnyscot]

If im on the PCX going into town I normally drive on the side hard shoulder unless i come to some uneven parts i pull out into the first lane of the 2 lane highway into town, I try to put myself into the mid part of the lane, my thinking is any passing vehicles would be forced to the outside lane to overtake,, normally drive the pcx on the highway around 100kmh + depending on conditions obviously... glad you came out of it ok possum

Edited March 15, 2015 by jonnyscot

[AllanB]

I only ride on the hard shoulder if it is clear ahead and then give myself plenty of time to move out when I see something that looks anything like a problem. There are lumps and bumps in the road too, so it don't make much odds.

The "keep left" law here doesn't get enforced so as far as I am concern it doesn't exists, I ride where I think it is safest at all times.

200baht fine is in no way a sanction worth anything at all.

Anyway glad you are Okay mate.

That's what I did. I was the only one on the road, if I did anything wrong it was not stopping at the obstruction, and coaxing my bike on the the first lane before I arrived at the obstruction. That's what I did the rest of my journey home.

Listen mate, I am not and would not criticise anyone's driving in this situation, we are all doing our best out there. The point I am making is about the law and that if it isn't enforced it doesn't count and even if it were enforced I would still do things my own way in order to stay safe. The fuzz here don't always have my own personal safety in mind.

One day I will get stopped and fined for going through the underpass, so what, I will still continue until they make the alternative safer.

Thanks for sharing your experience, I for one will store it in my memory bank for another day hence.

[Gweiloman]

Sorry to hear about your fall but glad that you are ok.

You mentioned previously that you think riding on the hard shoulder of the highway at 60 Kmh on a PCX is much safer than doing 130 Kmh on a big bike on the first or second lane in average traffic.

Do you still feel the same?

[jdinasia]

I don't ride on the shoulder. I tend to stay in the left lane unless passing. I am just about to ride back home from BKK. It's a lovely ride.

[NoshowJones]

Possum, i go something like 80-110 on single lane rural roads and 100-130 on multi lane big roads in good condition. This is sometimes a bit faster than i want but i got used to it. I wouldnt call this "dangerously fast". Often some guy on a Wave passes me or guys on a Sonic want to race with me and i let them go. Imo you can only call this fast, if you are not wearing proper gear. Do you? I feel pretty unsafe going over 80kmh without having my gear on. Riding in Thailand isnt that bad once you got used to it. But you have to flow with the traffic. Try it, its fun.

Living up country in Phichit, I have ridden to Pattaya and back, ridden to Mukdahan and back, done a round trip to Maesot, then to Phitsanulok and back, ridden in Thailand regularly over the past nine years, and only one near miss, and as you know that was because of dreadful roads.

Some posters have said I should have stayed in the first lane, other posters have said they would stay on the hard shoulder to avoid getting tailgated, only talking about small bikes here. one poster even blames me for not accelerating over the rut to avoid losing control of the bike. Accelerating to pass a stationary object?? Seeing the rut for over 30 Ks outside of Phitsanulok, I though nothing of it, it seemed normal to me.

Yes Wantan, I am highly experienced riding motorbikes in Thailand, and IMO Thailands roads are full of nutters, but the biggest danger to a motorcyclist is the state of the roads, I see no reason to deliberately put a rut on the road between the hard shoulder and the first lane, and not riding fast at that point probably saved my life.

You talk a lot of sense about wearing proper gear, I was wearing a bright yellow top, thick trousers, thick trainer type shoes, not the kind for running in. If I had a big bike, I would certainly wear the proper gear.

As for your last sentence, I don't think so any more, for the reason well documented on this topic.

Happy riding and keep safe.