Boats with migrants will be guided away: Isoc

[Scott]

An off-topic post has been removed.

[Bluespunk]

No boats have been left at sea or pushed out of international waters. The very opposite happens.

What happens after they land is another matter, if they are economic migrants then they should be safely escorted/flown home.

Those in genuine fear for their lives, well that's another matter. They should be settled.

Boats of Libyan 'refugees' have sunk off the coast of Africa in recent weeks drowning hundreds -- no Ships of EU countries out there off the coast of Africa doing anything to prevent that... when they easily could ...

THERE ARE HUNDREDS OF EU BOATS out in the middle sea, but they can not catch all refugee boats befoe they sink;

But if they cartch a bot, they bring the refugees on land for help and support,

But Thai Boats help them fo reach the open stormy sea !

When they bring then food, they drop it in the sea !!!!

!! They drop the food in the sea !! not to damage the boat ,

have you ever read such an BS ???

Most recently in post 28

[JDGRUEN]

Thailand depends on Migrants, Take a look around who is building the sky train < who are building most of Thailand infrastructure, not the lazy Thai men

Migrant work gangs do not just stroll up to a work site and ask for a job. Agents - handlers bring in work gangs - work crews for various jobs. They are hired 20-30 or so at a time -- via the agent ... often local Thais are not allowed to apply for this work - especially as all the available jobs go to these handlers. In the past the Immigration fee that was supposed to be paid - was not paid and the work gang members were not here legally. This contributed to the Cambodian worker exit when the Junta took over - they feared an enforcement of the law. Plus some elements of the Military did in fact apply pressure to cause them to exit. But that is another story .

The story so often found in countries that let in hoards of dirt cheap labor - the net result is Wage Busting and job exclusion on the big construction jobs. The foreign workers are hardly more than indentured slaves living in worker camps with scant facilities - paid low wages and are often cheated and exploited - but have no way to complain.

Thai men and women are no different than anyone else who have had the available jobs taken and wages gutted - they often do not have any real way to work - except creative little jobs of selling stuff in curbside stalls or on a converted Tuk Tuk in some areas. There is much hidden unemployment in Thailand - existence jobs - self made jobs are all that is often available. Hidden unemployment is another Thai Government cover up.

This taking of jobs - giving them to imported indentured foreign slaves contributes to drug use and crime done by the disillusioned Thais ...

If you think this is not real - then you just do not know the score of what really goes on.

Edited May 17, 2015 by JDGRUEN

[DM07]

Try to cross the boarder from Mexico to the US and see how you go America is now better than any other country like Europe, Australia all you peple who live here in LOS love to nock everything if you don't like it here go home

Classic!

...and classy!

[pitchag]

These are Muslim refugees it is a Muslim problem and a Muslim country should accept them, they never settle properly in a non muslim country and try to change the place to what they left behind.

They find it almost impossible to intergrate into a society not Muslim, check the news most of the western world is having problems with Muslim immigrants wanting to change their host countries to their way and their Sharia law. Islam is a backward archaic cult religion.

[Bluespunk]

These are Muslim refugees it is a Muslim problem and a Muslim country should accept them, they never settle properly in a non muslim country and try to change the place to what they left behind.

They find it almost impossible to intergrate into a society not Muslim, check the news most of the western world is having problems with Muslim immigrants wanting to change their host countries to their way and their Sharia law. Islam is a backward archaic cult religion.

Nonsense.

Wrong on just about every point.

The Rohingya are as Burmese as any other cultural group in Burma. They have roots going back 1000 years. They are fleeing because of exactly the same hate, islamaphobic bigotry and prejudice you espouse.

As for integration and communal harmony, there are muslim communities just about everywhere in the world coexisting with other faiths. And non faiths.

That is until insecure bile fuelled intolerant bigots stir up hate.

Yes there are some of these in Muslim communities but as you prove they also exist outside it.

Take your hate elsewhere, preferably to a therapist who might help you resolve your issues.

Edited May 17, 2015 by Bluespunk

[rubl]

Boats of Libyan 'refugees' have sunk off the coast of Africa in recent weeks drowning hundreds -- no Ships of EU countries out there off the coast of Africa doing anything to prevent that... when they easily could ...

They weren't there, yes that is tragic.

However they would have helped and taken the migrants ashore if they could have been there.

That they were not there was not a deliberate or intentional action.

It is crass to suggest anything else.

Things in Europe seem to get a bit difficult. This will not help refugees coming to Thailand either.

From today:

"Islamic State (IS) fighters are being smuggled into Europe by gangs in the Mediterranean, a Libyan official has told the BBC."

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-32770390

[Bluespunk]

Boats of Libyan 'refugees' have sunk off the coast of Africa in recent weeks drowning hundreds -- no Ships of EU countries out there off the coast of Africa doing anything to prevent that... when they easily could ...

They weren't there, yes that is tragic.

However they would have helped and taken the migrants ashore if they could have been there.

That they were not there was not a deliberate or intentional action.

It is crass to suggest anything else.

Things in Europe seem to get a bit difficult. This will not help refugees coming to Thailand either.

From today:

"Islamic State (IS) fighters are being smuggled into Europe by gangs in the Mediterranean, a Libyan official has told the BBC."

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-32770390

From same report

"He based his claim on conversations with boat owners in parts of North Africa controlled by the militants."

Claimed, alleged, made up, seeking publicity.

It may be true, it may not.

The point is this claim/scare mongering does not justify ignoring the genuine refugees fleeing persecution and violence.

[simple1]

Boats of Libyan 'refugees' have sunk off the coast of Africa in recent weeks drowning hundreds -- no Ships of EU countries out there off the coast of Africa doing anything to prevent that... when they easily could ...

They weren't there, yes that is tragic.

However they would have helped and taken the migrants ashore if they could have been there.

That they were not there was not a deliberate or intentional action.

It is crass to suggest anything else.

Things in Europe seem to get a bit difficult. This will not help refugees coming to Thailand either.

From today:

"Islamic State (IS) fighters are being smuggled into Europe by gangs in the Mediterranean, a Libyan official has told the BBC."

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-32770390

From same report

"He based his claim on conversations with boat owners in parts of North Africa controlled by the militants."

Claimed, alleged, made up, seeking publicity.

It may be true, it may not.

The point is this claim/scare mongering does not justify ignoring the genuine refugees fleeing persecution and violence.

have a read of the analysis at URL below:

http://www.ipcs.org/article/terrorism/myanmar-why-the-islamic-state-failed-here-4748.html

[rubl]

They weren't there, yes that is tragic.

However they would have helped and taken the migrants ashore if they could have been there.

That they were not there was not a deliberate or intentional action.

It is crass to suggest anything else.

Things in Europe seem to get a bit difficult. This will not help refugees coming to Thailand either.

From today:

"Islamic State (IS) fighters are being smuggled into Europe by gangs in the Mediterranean, a Libyan official has told the BBC."

http://www.bbc.com/news/world-africa-32770390

From same report

"He based his claim on conversations with boat owners in parts of North Africa controlled by the militants."

Claimed, alleged, made up, seeking publicity.

It may be true, it may not.

The point is this claim/scare mongering does not justify ignoring the genuine refugees fleeing persecution and violence.

have a read of the analysis at URL below:

http://www.ipcs.org/article/terrorism/myanmar-why-the-islamic-state-failed-here-4748.html

The two reasons I gave the BBC link. For one it's from today and two this type of news combined with the E.C. struggling how to handle the enormous influx of refugees will put pressure on the E.C. to try to keep those refugees either away or contained. This will make it more difficult for the E.C. to make too many noises about what happens in this region with refugees.

The E.C. and it's member States have various "voluntary" return programs with which they try to 'induce' refugees to return to their home country. Also a more strict 'isolation' of refugees in camps gives a not too subtle nudge. The Greece government has no money and an enormous unemployment rate, not likely to let refugees loose in Greece and cannot get rid of them elsewhere, Italy got lots of them, France has a problem with home grown fanatics and doesn't want to import some. America is also less likely to accept refugees.

A complex problem.

Edited May 17, 2015 by rubl

[Bluespunk]

From same report

"He based his claim on conversations with boat owners in parts of North Africa controlled by the militants."

Claimed, alleged, made up, seeking publicity.

It may be true, it may not.

The point is this claim/scare mongering does not justify ignoring the genuine refugees fleeing persecution and violence.

have a read of the analysis at URL below:

http://www.ipcs.org/article/terrorism/myanmar-why-the-islamic-state-failed-here-4748.html

The two reasons I gave the BBC link. For one it's from today and two this type of news combined with the E.C. struggling how to handle the enormous influx of refugees will put pressure on the E.C. to try to keep those refugees either away or contained. This will make it more difficult for the E.C. to make too many noises about what happens in this region with refugees.

The E.C. and it's member States have various "voluntary" return programs with which they try to 'induce' refugees to return to their home country. Also a more strict 'isolation' of refugees in camps gives a not too subtle nudge. The Greece government has no money and an enormous unemployment rate, not likely to let refugees loose in Greece and cannot get rid of them elsewhere, Italy got lots of them, France has a problem with home grown fanatics and doesn't want to import some. America is also less likely to accept refugees.

A complex problem.

Yep, it is complicated.

However there are still genuine refugees who have been forced to flee because of persecution, not choice. They should be given refugee status and allowed to settle.

To do otherwise is to go against everything a civilized society is supposed to stand for.

The economic refugees? Yes I agree they shouldn't be treated the same way, but neither should they be treated like lesser humans and left to die on the seas.

[rubl]

From same report

"He based his claim on conversations with boat owners in parts of North Africa controlled by the militants."

Claimed, alleged, made up, seeking publicity.

It may be true, it may not.

The point is this claim/scare mongering does not justify ignoring the genuine refugees fleeing persecution and violence.

have a read of the analysis at URL below:

http://www.ipcs.org/article/terrorism/myanmar-why-the-islamic-state-failed-here-4748.html

The two reasons I gave the BBC link. For one it's from today and two this type of news combined with the E.C. struggling how to handle the enormous influx of refugees will put pressure on the E.C. to try to keep those refugees either away or contained. This will make it more difficult for the E.C. to make too many noises about what happens in this region with refugees.

The E.C. and it's member States have various "voluntary" return programs with which they try to 'induce' refugees to return to their home country. Also a more strict 'isolation' of refugees in camps gives a not too subtle nudge. The Greece government has no money and an enormous unemployment rate, not likely to let refugees loose in Greece and cannot get rid of them elsewhere, Italy got lots of them, France has a problem with home grown fanatics and doesn't want to import some. America is also less likely to accept refugees.

A complex problem.

Yep, it is complicated.

However there are still genuine refugees who have been forced to flee because of persecution, not choice. They should be given refugee status and allowed to settle.

To do otherwise is to go against everything a civilized society is supposed to stand for.

The economic refugees? Yes I agree they shouldn't be treated the same way, but neither should they be treated like lesser humans and left to die on the seas.

The problem lays in how to define what makes a refugee a 'genuine refugee' and how to prove someone is just that. Government will try to err on the side of over caution. 'economical refugee' can be made to cover a lot (corruption, nepotism resulting in having job and house taken would not be labelled persecution even if based on being of the 'wrong' clan, colour, belief).

Note I'm not justifying this, I'm only trying to explain part of the complexity.

PS I've not been following TVF much lately. The following link may have been presented in a topic already. Excuses if so.

2015-05-13

"About 1,100 of the migrants and asylum-seekers abandoned at sea at the weekend made it to the shores of Langkawi Island in Malaysia on Sunday night, and several hundred more came ashore in Aceh, Indonesia. Both the Malaysian and the Indonesian authorities have since made statements that they will not allow any more boats to land."

http://www.irinnews.org/report/101487/malaysia-and-thailand-leave-migrant-boats-adrift

Edited May 17, 2015 by rubl

[dbrenn]

Isoc? Sounds a bit like Ingsoc.

[seedy]

one post removed -

English is the only acceptable language anywhere on ThaiVisa including Classifieds, except within the
Thai language forum, where of course using Thai is allowed.

[Jay Sata]

Can we please stop calling these people migrants?

A migrant is someone who moves legally from one country to another country.

These people are illegal immigrants who want to short circuit the system that is in place to help genuine refugees to resettle in another country.

Basically queue jumpers who need to be discouraged by whatever means necessary.

Don't get me wrong I do feel sorry for the many people who live in poverty in many countries, but they do not qualify as refugees.

Over time they and their country folk will have the opportunity to better themselves economically as did the peasants in Europe after they separated religion from politics.

Simply jumping on a boat is not the way to do it.

I suspect many of the so called Rohingyas on the boats are really Bangladeshi...why is it there is such a high proportion of young single men on these boats?

They want to flee persecution but are quite happy to leave their wives and children back home to suffer.

Come on, some one is having a laugh at our expense.

And it needs to be stopped both in SEA and Europe.

Basically queue jumpers who need to be discouraged by whatever means necessary.

You mean pushing back out to see to die a slow death from dehydration, or killing each other for what ever supplies are remaining. that kind of discouragement?

Not exactly but this is the sort of comment I expect from people who are full of the "let them come" syndrome until it happens in their own backyard and then the reality is different.

Bit like the well to do Greenies who espouse the benefits of solar power and cover their roofs ever so smugly in PV panels but have a stand by generator for night time power while the rest of the true believers freeze in the dark..

One solution is to turn the boats back from whence they came at the earliest opportunity close to the point of departure or close to the nearest point of the country from where they departed. Little chance of starvation, drowning or dying of thirst then.

The world needs to stop allowing this uncontrolled self selection of countries for residence to continue or perhaps WW3 might be closer than we think.

Whether we agree or not each country has its own culture and they have the right to maintain that culture without bending to other peoples beliefs. They also have the right to determine who enters their country and under what circumstances they enter.

The touchy feely PC approach is good in theory and makes the twittering classes feel warm and comfortable.

The reality is somewhat different.

Italy is finding out right now.....apparently Sweden is a lost cause and is basically a Muslim country or will be within a generation.

By the way my doctor is a Muslim and a very good doctor and nice man to boot.

But all he does is recommend what medicine I should put down my throat, unlike other Muslims who desire to ram their ideology down my throat and expect me to bow to their primitive beliefs and laws.

Excellent post.

Whether it is Mexico, Latin America,Africa or the Indian sub continent the bottom line is these people are economic migrants looking for a better life.

They are escaping countries well capable of supprting them and being prosperous as the European colonists proved over a couple of centuries ago. They also have one thing in common in that they come from a warm climate where you dont have to work too hard to survive.

Sadly the work ethic seems to be missing in their genetic make up.

[philw]

Can we please stop calling these people migrants?

A migrant is someone who moves legally from one country to another country.

These people are illegal immigrants who want to short circuit the system that is in place to help genuine refugees to resettle in another country.

Basically queue jumpers who need to be discouraged by whatever means necessary.

Don't get me wrong I do feel sorry for the many people who live in poverty in many countries, but they do not qualify as refugees.

Over time they and their country folk will have the opportunity to better themselves economically as did the peasants in Europe after they separated religion from politics.

Simply jumping on a boat is not the way to do it.

I suspect many of the so called Rohingyas on the boats are really Bangladeshi...why is it there is such a high proportion of young single men on these boats?

They want to flee persecution but are quite happy to leave their wives and children back home to suffer.

Come on, some one is having a laugh at our expense.

And it needs to be stopped both in SEA and Europe.

You're having a laff mate.

Sod off.

[simple1]

Can we please stop calling these people migrants?

A migrant is someone who moves legally from one country to another country.

These people are illegal immigrants who want to short circuit the system that is in place to help genuine refugees to resettle in another country.

Basically queue jumpers who need to be discouraged by whatever means necessary.

Don't get me wrong I do feel sorry for the many people who live in poverty in many countries, but they do not qualify as refugees.

Over time they and their country folk will have the opportunity to better themselves economically as did the peasants in Europe after they separated religion from politics.

Simply jumping on a boat is not the way to do it.

I suspect many of the so called Rohingyas on the boats are really Bangladeshi...why is it there is such a high proportion of young single men on these boats?

They want to flee persecution but are quite happy to leave their wives and children back home to suffer.

Come on, some one is having a laugh at our expense.

And it needs to be stopped both in SEA and Europe.

Basically queue jumpers who need to be discouraged by whatever means necessary.

You mean pushing back out to see to die a slow death from dehydration, or killing each other for what ever supplies are remaining. that kind of discouragement?

Not exactly but this is the sort of comment I expect from people who are full of the "let them come" syndrome until it happens in their own backyard and then the reality is different.

Bit like the well to do Greenies who espouse the benefits of solar power and cover their roofs ever so smugly in PV panels but have a stand by generator for night time power while the rest of the true believers freeze in the dark..

One solution is to turn the boats back from whence they came at the earliest opportunity close to the point of departure or close to the nearest point of the country from where they departed. Little chance of starvation, drowning or dying of thirst then.

The world needs to stop allowing this uncontrolled self selection of countries for residence to continue or perhaps WW3 might be closer than we think.

Whether we agree or not each country has its own culture and they have the right to maintain that culture without bending to other peoples beliefs. They also have the right to determine who enters their country and under what circumstances they enter.

The touchy feely PC approach is good in theory and makes the twittering classes feel warm and comfortable.

The reality is somewhat different.

Italy is finding out right now.....apparently Sweden is a lost cause and is basically a Muslim country or will be within a generation.

By the way my doctor is a Muslim and a very good doctor and nice man to boot.

But all he does is recommend what medicine I should put down my throat, unlike other Muslims who desire to ram their ideology down my throat and expect me to bow to their primitive beliefs and laws.

Excellent post.

Whether it is Mexico, Latin America,Africa or the Indian sub continent the bottom line is these people are economic migrants looking for a better life.

They are escaping countries well capable of supprting them and being prosperous as the European colonists proved over a couple of centuries ago. They also have one thing in common in that they come from a warm climate where you dont have to work too hard to survive.

Sadly the work ethic seems to be missing in their genetic make up.

As this topic is primarily in regard to Rohingya, I have to assume you know nothing about the Myanmar government policies and actions of oppression and disenfranchisement of the Rohingya population

[NickJ]

They should just open the border here and let anyone who comes here and wants to stay be allowed to stay. To pay for all there care just raise the cost of Ed , Retiment and marriage visas. Also a huge surrcharge tax on cigarettes and beer......

[dcutman]

Can we please stop calling these people migrants?

A migrant is someone who moves legally from one country to another country.

These people are illegal immigrants who want to short circuit the system that is in place to help genuine refugees to resettle in another country.

Basically queue jumpers who need to be discouraged by whatever means necessary.

Don't get me wrong I do feel sorry for the many people who live in poverty in many countries, but they do not qualify as refugees.

Over time they and their country folk will have the opportunity to better themselves economically as did the peasants in Europe after they separated religion from politics.

Simply jumping on a boat is not the way to do it.

I suspect many of the so called Rohingyas on the boats are really Bangladeshi...why is it there is such a high proportion of young single men on these boats?

They want to flee persecution but are quite happy to leave their wives and children back home to suffer.

Come on, some one is having a laugh at our expense.

And it needs to be stopped both in SEA and Europe.

Basically queue jumpers who need to be discouraged by whatever means necessary.

You mean pushing back out to see to die a slow death from dehydration, or killing each other for what ever supplies are remaining. that kind of discouragement?

Not exactly but this is the sort of comment I expect from people who are full of the "let them come" syndrome until it happens in their own backyard and then the reality is different.

Bit like the well to do Greenies who espouse the benefits of solar power and cover their roofs ever so smugly in PV panels but have a stand by generator for night time power while the rest of the true believers freeze in the dark..

One solution is to turn the boats back from whence they came at the earliest opportunity close to the point of departure or close to the nearest point of the country from where they departed. Little chance of starvation, drowning or dying of thirst then.

The world needs to stop allowing this uncontrolled self selection of countries for residence to continue or perhaps WW3 might be closer than we think.

Whether we agree or not each country has its own culture and they have the right to maintain that culture without bending to other peoples beliefs. They also have the right to determine who enters their country and under what circumstances they enter.

The touchy feely PC approach is good in theory and makes the twittering classes feel warm and comfortable.

The reality is somewhat different.

Italy is finding out right now.....apparently Sweden is a lost cause and is basically a Muslim country or will be within a generation.

By the way my doctor is a Muslim and a very good doctor and nice man to boot.

But all he does is recommend what medicine I should put down my throat, unlike other Muslims who desire to ram their ideology down my throat and expect me to bow to their primitive beliefs and laws.

Excellent post.

Whether it is Mexico, Latin America,Africa or the Indian sub continent the bottom line is these people are economic migrants looking for a better life.

They are escaping countries well capable of supprting them and being prosperous as the European colonists proved over a couple of centuries ago. They also have one thing in common in that they come from a warm climate where you dont have to work too hard to survive.

Sadly the work ethic seems to be missing in their genetic make up.

Its only been a couple of weeks since the discovery of dozens of rotting corpses in Thai jungles and so many have forgot the real reason these people are here in the first place. Just a reminder. These countries govts and labor intensive industries have been exploiting these people for decades, I will also remind you there are 10's of thousands of men women and children enslaved in these countries, with the need for many thousands more every year.

[bangon04]

"Migrant vessels found outside Thai waters will be given navigational guidance in order to prevent them getting lost and entering Thai waters, he said, adding that this procedure had been applied in the case of a large boat carrying some 300 Rohingya outside Thai waters near Koh Lipe off Satun on Thursday."

First navigational guidance is a burst of machine gun fire across the bows, second navigational guidance is a hand grenade into the boat......

and hurry up with those d**n submarines.....

Edited May 18, 2015 by bangon04