Democracy in Thailand 'a work in progress'

[Lite Beer]

Democracy in Thailand 'a work in progress'
WIRAJ SRIPONG
THE NATION

BANGKOK: -- DEMOCRACY in Thailand is a work in progress like it is in the United States, US charge d'affaires W Patrick Murphy said while expressing his wish for Thailand's reform process to succeed.

"This is the truth. We are not perfect. We make mistakes. We make missteps. We are a work in progress," he said.

Murphy said a prosperous and stable democracy in Thailand would contribute to enduring relationships between the two nations.

"We believe Thailand can find reconciliation, establish democracy and fulfil her historic destiny as a great and free nation. We wish the very best for Thailand, our friend now and forever," the American diplomat said in his speech during the US Independence Day celebration on Thursday night at the Grand Hyatt Erawan Hotel.

The event marked the 239th anniversary of US independence. In his speech, Murphy also underlined the importance of the 182-years of bilateral ties.

"Soon after the creation of [the United States], the US and Thailand became friends and have remained friends and partners for 182 years," he said. "We have stood side by side as allies during time of conflicts. We have promoted shared principles and values. The US and Thailand cooperate to achieve prosperity and stability around the world."

About 1,000 guests attended the Independence Day reception. The event was organised under a state fair theme, and included a jazz band.

Among the guests were key government figures, including PM's Office Minister Panadda Diskul, Energy Minister Narongchai Akrasanee, Justice Minister Paiboon Koomchaya, Deputy Foreign Minister Don Pramudwinai, and Science and Technology Minister Pichet Durongkaveroj.

Also present were former foreign ministers Surakiat Sathirathai and Kantathi Suphamongkhon, and politicians such as Sudarat Keyuraphan and Chaturon Chaisang.

Red-shirt leaders Thida Thavornseth, Weng Tojirakarn and Veerakarn Musikapong were also there.

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/politics/Democracy-in-Thailand-a-work-in-progress-30263726.html

-- The Nation 2015-07-04

[HiSoLowSoNoSo]

"a work in progress" what progress? Seems more like an evil circle to me.

[Johpa]

Not sure what this US diplomat is observing, but all I see is democracy in regress.

[Bannum opinions]

"Red-shirt leaders Thida Thavornseth, Weng Tojirakarn and Veerakarn Musikapong were also there"

Good on the USA to invite those from the side of the Political Divide, advocating Democracy and Democratic elections.

Too bad this author is still hung up on hiding the political context of these people behind non-political terminology, such as affinity clothing colors.

[halloween]

"Red-shirt leaders Thida Thavornseth, Weng Tojirakarn and Veerakarn Musikapong were also there"

Good on the USA to invite those from the side of the Political Divide, advocating Democracy and Democratic elections.

Too bad this author is still hung up on hiding the political context of these people behind non-political terminology, such as affinity clothing colors.

I suppose calling them communists might be a bit too McCarthy.

[mojorison]

TLDR.

It is a pointless waste of time discussing an obtuse, and obscure concept, such as democracy in Thailand. The triumvirate rule, and that is that. (For the time being).

[h90]

Not sure what this US diplomat is observing, but all I see is democracy in regress.

I can't see much that could regress.....

From fake elections to no elections....

[TomJoad]

"The US and Thailand cooperate to achieve prosperity and stability around the world."

I guess somebody forgot to tell him that ISIS is now only 50 miles from Baghdad..

[reggaebkk]

Democracy in europe, a work in regress...

[quandow]

Typical Thai reporting, they left out a word:

Democracy in Thailand 'a work in blocking progress'

[oneday]

"...DEMOCRACY in Thailand is a work in progress like it is in the United States, US charge d'affaires W Patrick Murphy said while expressing his wish for Thailand's reform process to succeed..."

What a bunch of dog doo. Democracy in the US is only being fine tuned, but the work is 95-98% done. The work consists mostly of closing loop-holes in the law to thwart corrupt politicians, but the guiding document, the US Constitution, was finished over 200 years ago and has stood the test of time pretty well up to now. Thailand hasn't even begun, mostly because they have no idea what Democracy is. They want to say it should look like something else because the Thai people are unique and that is nothing, buy more dog doo or maybe "kee kwai".

[pmarlowe]

no matter how you define democracy, you can't homogenize political thought. the concept is best on exchange of different views. the PM, junta and coup apologists don't get this. so if they want to dictate that everyone thinks the same way, so be it. but call it something other than democracy.

[soalbundy]

Not sure what this US diplomat is observing, but all I see is democracy in regress.

He is observing the Chinese encroachment and he doesn't like it.

[joebrown]

W Patrick Murphy says " we have stood side by side as allies during time of conflict". Well yes, if you conveniently forget the Thai declaration of war on the US and England, when Thailand rolled over and played 'dead' to allow the japanese armed forces to invade in the 1940s. What he said removes the need to guess what the 'W' in Mr murphy's name means?

[fred Kubasa]

Ah, lads/lassies, Murphy is indeed a Word Master cuz Americans know what he said could be translated : " Thailand and the US are STILL great buddies but......... if you don't put all your ducks in a row and get your asses in gear, we will become but distant

cousins " !

[chainarong]

At the risk of repeating myself , whilst Thailand has the Military continuing interfering with the administration in government you will never has two things , Peace nor Democracy, until the Military is neutralized only dreamers would talk of Democracy in Thailand and unfortunately only dreamers would believe that the Military would ever be neutralized.

[heybruce]

Democracy in Thailand is a work on indefinite hold.

[pattjock]

When the red shirts were running the country the government approval rating was below 50%

When the yellow shirts was running the country the government approval rating was below 50%

Most western governments have a government approval rating below 50%

The current "non democratic" government have an approval rating of over 80%

The goal of democracy is to have as much of the population as possible approve of the government,

Everything else, like elections, are just additional bits that can be added to the definition of democracy or ways of reaching the goal of democracy.

[Bannum opinions]

When the red shirts were running the country the government approval rating was below 50%

When the yellow shirts was running the country the government approval rating was below 50%

Most western governments have a government approval rating below 50%

The current "non democratic" government have an approval rating of over 80%

The goal of democracy is to have as much of the population as possible approve of the government,

Everything else, like elections, are just additional bits that can be added to the definition of democracy or ways of reaching the goal of democracy.

"The current "non democratic" government have an approval rating of over 80%"

Say's who?

The only measure of a Govt. popularity is its' re-electability. Or in this instance, its' elect-ability should it ever come to that.

It is why the anti-democrats prevented the last election...They know about this. This in spite of their best efforts to demonize the Govt., Yingluck, the rice-subsidy program, amnesty and any other issue they could seize on to advance their non-electoral circumstances...... There were many issues the Lumpini PDRC cycled through with great self-righteous indignation, trying to get traction for themselves and their well-known true objectives. But trying to make those objectives appear to be issue-based.

But when it came to an election, they did everything in their power to obstruct it. Like I said, they know about this stuff.

Re-electability is the measure of a Govt's popularity. Not public opinion Polls conducted under their auspices, by their own acolytes, pretending to be otherwise and independent.

Edited July 4, 2015 by Bannum opinions

[ramrod711]

In 2006 the Thaksin government was reeling, the sale of Shincorp shares, exempt from taxes, as a result of a law that the party passed, had rioting citizens in the street. Political experts stated that there was no way the party would be reelected. The army intervened in the form of a coup. What it accomplished was a bailout, if they had let democracy run it's course, we may not have had the riots in 2010. Along came Yingluck and the unmitigated rice disaster, almost everyone in the country was dissatisfied with PTT, they had accrued a massive debt. If they had had to face election, based on their record, they would have certainly been defeated. Once again the army executes a coup, once again it bails out the government. Democracy can not thrive unless it allowed to deal with it's failures. Thailand is a more peaceful place than it was, there are not armed conflicts in the streets, children are safe from grenade attacks. It will probably only last as long as the army rules.....because nobody has learned anything, they didn't have to.

[ramrod711]

When the red shirts were running the country the government approval rating was below 50%

When the yellow shirts was running the country the government approval rating was below 50%

Most western governments have a government approval rating below 50%

The current "non democratic" government have an approval rating of over 80%

The goal of democracy is to have as much of the population as possible approve of the government,

Everything else, like elections, are just additional bits that can be added to the definition of democracy or ways of reaching the goal of democracy.

"The current "non democratic" government have an approval rating of over 80%"

Say's who?

The only measure of a Govt. popularity is its' re-electability. Or in this instance, its' elect-ability should it ever come to that.

It is why the anti-democrats prevented the last election...They know about this. This in spite of their best efforts to demonize the Govt., Yingluck, the rice-subsidy program, amnesty and any other issue they could seize on to advance their non-electoral circumstances...... There were many issues the Lumpini PDRC cycled through with great self-righteous indignation, trying to get traction for themselves and their well-known true objectives. But trying to make those objectives appear to be issue-based.

But when it came to an election, they did everything in their power to obstruct it. Like I said, they know about this stuff.

Re-electability is the measure of a Govt's popularity. Not public opinion Polls conducted under their auspices, by their own acolytes, pretending to be otherwise and independent.

Still trying to put the blame for the rice disaster and the amnesty bill anywhere but where it belongs I see. Here is a little light reading from some folks with no axe to grind, unlike you. http://www.economist.com/news/asia/21589436-governments-latest-attempt-get-thaksin-shinawatra-back-has-united-almost-everyone-against

[quandow]

"...DEMOCRACY in Thailand is a work in progress like it is in the United States, US charge d'affaires W Patrick Murphy said while expressing his wish for Thailand's reform process to succeed..."

What a bunch of dog doo. Democracy in the US is only being fine tuned, but the work is 95-98% done. The work consists mostly of closing loop-holes in the law to thwart corrupt politicians, but the guiding document, the US Constitution, was finished over 200 years ago and has stood the test of time pretty well up to now. Thailand hasn't even begun, mostly because they have no idea what Democracy is. They want to say it should look like something else because the Thai people are unique and that is nothing, buy more dog doo or maybe "kee kwai".

Sorry, oneday, gotta take issue with this one. I'm not going to drudge up the tired argument (in the voice of Pee Wee Herman) "It's not a democracy but a Republic."

The U.S. has actually become more of an oligarchy, defined as such: "A small group of people having control of a country, organization, or institution."

Or another apt description would be a corporatocracy: "A society or system that is governed or controlled by corporations."

The U.S., while technically a republic, has in fact been sold out as evidenced by the despicable "Citizens United" decision, or the unbelievably intricate tax code that has been warped to benefit only the rich, and then there's the way Monsanto has bulldozed its way into poisoning not only the U.S. but the entire world. In a truly honest democratic republic, these things would never happen, and the rest of the world appears to be following suit with the recent TTP agreement that the general public isn't allowed to know about the details but corporations have their own copies. Even U.S. Congress members aren't allowed to have a copy, they can only look at it in a secure area and can't even take notes.

Heavy sigh . . . Happy 4th of July.

Edited July 4, 2015 by quandow

[Bannum opinions]

Oops, double post

Edited July 4, 2015 by Bannum opinions

[Bannum opinions]

In 2006 the Thaksin government was reeling, the sale of Shincorp shares, exempt from taxes, as a result of a law that the party passed, had rioting citizens in the street. Political experts stated that there was no way the party would be reelected. The army intervened in the form of a coup. What it accomplished was a bailout, if they had let democracy run it's course, we may not have had the riots in 2010. Along came Yingluck and the unmitigated rice disaster, almost everyone in the country was dissatisfied with PTT, they had accrued a massive debt. If they had had to face election, based on their record, they would have certainly been defeated. Once again the army executes a coup, once again it bails out the government. Democracy can not thrive unless it allowed to deal with it's failures. Thailand is a more peaceful place than it was, there are not armed conflicts in the streets, children are safe from grenade attacks. It will probably only last as long as the army rules.....because nobody has learned anything, they didn't have to.

Political experts stated that there was no way the party would be reelected.

If they had had to face election, based on their record, they would have certainly been defeated.

Really!

If that was the case, wouldn't an election back then, have been better than a coup?

Your listing of all the transgressions leading you to the conclusions in above quotes, were all Opposition noise.

Short of dissecting them all individually, this demonstrates again how people take Opposition noise as if it came from the Bible or the Koran.

I consider the source and judge it accordingly.

We will never know how many of these Opposition charges and innuendo's had merit. They were certainly expressed with great over-the-top self-righteous indignation. They avoided trying to persuade the electorate of their veracity however...Why is that?...... They chose instead to incite like-minded acolytes onto the street where they wouldn't be confused with facts, and put up stages where they could 'preach to the choir"....Not exactly nation-wide electoral scrutiny.

Undoubtedly some of their complaints had merit, but they were afraid to test that notion via an election....Even as late as last February, they did everything in their power to obstruct an election.

Doesn't that tell you something. It tells me a lot, and puts everything in perspective.

But bottom line,,,Let's not fool ourselves...We all know what their objectives were, issues be damned.

Edited July 4, 2015 by Bannum opinions

[wabothai]

Only diplomatic hogwash he himself does not even believe in.

Makes me puke.

[ramrod711]

In 2006 the Thaksin government was reeling, the sale of Shincorp shares, exempt from taxes, as a result of a law that the party passed, had rioting citizens in the street. Political experts stated that there was no way the party would be reelected. The army intervened in the form of a coup. What it accomplished was a bailout, if they had let democracy run it's course, we may not have had the riots in 2010. Along came Yingluck and the unmitigated rice disaster, almost everyone in the country was dissatisfied with PTT, they had accrued a massive debt. If they had had to face election, based on their record, they would have certainly been defeated. Once again the army executes a coup, once again it bails out the government. Democracy can not thrive unless it allowed to deal with it's failures. Thailand is a more peaceful place than it was, there are not armed conflicts in the streets, children are safe from grenade attacks. It will probably only last as long as the army rules.....because nobody has learned anything, they didn't have to.

Political experts stated that there was no way the party would be reelected.

If they had had to face election, based on their record, they would have certainly been defeated.

Really!

If that was the case, wouldn't an election back then, have been better than a coup?

Your listing of all the transgressions leading you to the conclusions in above quotes, were all Opposition noise.

Short of dissecting them all individually, this demonstrates again how people take Opposition noise as if it came from the Bible or the Koran.

I consider the source and judge it accordingly.

We will never know how many of these Opposition charges and innuendo's had merit. They were certainly expressed with great over-the-top self-righteous indignation. They avoided trying to persuade the electorate of their veracity however...Why is that?...... They chose instead to incite like-minded acolytes onto the street where they wouldn't be confused with facts, and put up stages where they could 'preach to the choir"....Not exactly nation-wide electoral scrutiny.

Undoubtedly some of their complaints had merit, but they were afraid to test that notion via an election....Even as late as last February, they did everything in their power to obstruct an election.

Doesn't that tell you something. It tells me a lot, and puts everything in perspective.

But bottom line,,,Let's not fool ourselves...We all know what their objectives were, issues be damned.

Yes, an election would have been better that was my point. As for you, your username is wrong, it should have been Bannums opinion. because you only have one; Thaksin and all proxies good, everyone else bad.

[than]

Well US really need Prayut in their effort to contain Chinese hegemony in Southern asia and be sure Thailand remain ally of US

The needs of the many outweigh the needs of few or the one

Edited July 4, 2015 by than

[than]

Red-shirt leaders Thida Thavornseth, Weng Tojirakarn and Veerakarn Musikapong were also there.

US embassy Free buffet toady : they can't miss that

[heybruce]

When the red shirts were running the country the government approval rating was below 50%

When the yellow shirts was running the country the government approval rating was below 50%

Most western governments have a government approval rating below 50%

The current "non democratic" government have an approval rating of over 80%

The goal of democracy is to have as much of the population as possible approve of the government,

Everything else, like elections, are just additional bits that can be added to the definition of democracy or ways of reaching the goal of democracy.

I assume you are trusting polls taken under censorship, when criticism of the government is not just banned, it is against the junta orders and can lead to a closed trial without appeal in a military court. Is it any wonder the government gets approval ratings similar to North Korea's?

Edited July 4, 2015 by heybruce

[heybruce]

When the red shirts were running the country the government approval rating was below 50%

When the yellow shirts was running the country the government approval rating was below 50%

Most western governments have a government approval rating below 50%

The current "non democratic" government have an approval rating of over 80%

The goal of democracy is to have as much of the population as possible approve of the government,

Everything else, like elections, are just additional bits that can be added to the definition of democracy or ways of reaching the goal of democracy.

"The current "non democratic" government have an approval rating of over 80%"

Say's who?

The only measure of a Govt. popularity is its' re-electability. Or in this instance, its' elect-ability should it ever come to that.

It is why the anti-democrats prevented the last election...They know about this. This in spite of their best efforts to demonize the Govt., Yingluck, the rice-subsidy program, amnesty and any other issue they could seize on to advance their non-electoral circumstances...... There were many issues the Lumpini PDRC cycled through with great self-righteous indignation, trying to get traction for themselves and their well-known true objectives. But trying to make those objectives appear to be issue-based.

But when it came to an election, they did everything in their power to obstruct it. Like I said, they know about this stuff.

Re-electability is the measure of a Govt's popularity. Not public opinion Polls conducted under their auspices, by their own acolytes, pretending to be otherwise and independent.

Still trying to put the blame for the rice disaster and the amnesty bill anywhere but where it belongs I see. Here is a little light reading from some folks with no axe to grind, unlike you. http://www.economist.com/news/asia/21589436-governments-latest-attempt-get-thaksin-shinawatra-back-has-united-almost-everyone-against

The rice subsidy and amnesty bill were both incredibly bad ideas and justifiably unpopular. That's why 2014 would have been an excellent year for an election to allow the Thai voters the chance to pass judgment on the PTP's performance.