Koh Tao: Trial opens for 2 accused of killing British tourists

[minikev]

GOLDBUGGY,

Nobody is claiming that the DNA test result rests on one Policemans word. Yes it has to go to a lab and pass many people.

It's the people who collected the samples and sent them. There was no forensic pathologist at the crime scene. WHatever reached the lab to be sampled has to be taken at face value, and THAT rests on the word of the people who collected it.

Also, about a week before the B2 were arrested EVERYONE on the island, including those 2 (photographs of them in line to be tested are old news) were tested and declared clear. So why did they turn up a match the second time???

What is not clear about this discrepancy??

I would love to agree with you here Rybanlor but I can't. If we are to make our minds up on what was reported at the time the B2 were possibly not previously cleared at that time. Had they stood in line and taken tests? I saw pictures of 2 of the 3 originally arrested in line. Only one of these is within the B2 the 3rd was arrested and released. Also as they were taking DNA from 200 people or so the samples were sent but were not yet verified there was a queue. According to a statement from the police at the time.

It is quite possible that their DNA had been sent and not yet processed.

[Rykbanlor]

I agree with Minikev, despite any feelings or suspicions, I think NS should be a moot point for the moment.

At the moment there are more tangible discrepancies regarding the crime scene and the B2.

[Rykbanlor]

GOLDBUGGY,

Nobody is claiming that the DNA test result rests on one Policemans word. Yes it has to go to a lab and pass many people.

It's the people who collected the samples and sent them. There was no forensic pathologist at the crime scene. WHatever reached the lab to be sampled has to be taken at face value, and THAT rests on the word of the people who collected it.

Also, about a week before the B2 were arrested EVERYONE on the island, including those 2 (photographs of them in line to be tested are old news) were tested and declared clear. So why did they turn up a match the second time???

What is not clear about this discrepancy??

I would love to agree with you here Rybanlor but I can't. If we are to make our minds up on what was reported at the time the B2 were possibly not previously cleared at that time. Had they stood in line and taken tests? I saw pictures of 2 of the 3 originally arrested in line. Only one of these is within the B2 the 3rd was arrested and released. Also as they were taking DNA from 200 people or so the samples were sent but were not yet verified there was a queue. According to a statement from the police at the time.

It is quite possible that their DNA had been sent and not yet processed.

Fair point. I guess again I am taking media reports as they come. That was how I understood it to transpire, but it may be that there were premature reports.

I stand by my first statement though, about the doubt over DNA sample collecting.

It's good you be objective about these things, it helps to be as clear as possible concerning all these issues.

[thailandchilli]

GOLDBUGGY,

Nobody is claiming that the DNA test result rests on one Policemans word. Yes it has to go to a lab and pass many people.

It's the people who collected the samples and sent them. There was no forensic pathologist at the crime scene. WHatever reached the lab to be sampled has to be taken at face value, and THAT rests on the word of the people who collected it.

Also, about a week before the B2 were arrested EVERYONE on the island, including those 2 (photographs of them in line to be tested are old news) were tested and declared clear. So why did they turn up a match the second time???

What is not clear about this discrepancy??

I would love to agree with you here Rybanlor but I can't. If we are to make our minds up on what was reported at the time the B2 were possibly not previously cleared at that time. Had they stood in line and taken tests? I saw pictures of 2 of the 3 originally arrested in line. Only one of these is within the B2 the 3rd was arrested and released. Also as they were taking DNA from 200 people or so the samples were sent but were not yet verified there was a queue. According to a statement from the police at the time.

It is quite possible that their DNA had been sent and not yet processed.

Fair point. I guess again I am taking media reports as they come. That was how I understood it to transpire, but it may be that there were premature reports.

I stand by my first statement though, about the doubt over DNA sample collecting.

It's good you be objective about these things, it helps to be as clear as possible concerning all these issues.

Agreed and this is what we should be concentrating on:

On July 10, the bench again ordered the DNA to be retested, only for the police to reveal that certain key samples — specifically those retrieved from the victims’ bodies — had been used up. The only items still available for retesting were objects found around the crime scene, including the suspected murder weapons, but one witness claimed that these had been washed. http://time.com/3955081/thailand-koh-tao-murder-david-miller-hannah-witheridge-zaw-lin-wai-phyo-burma-myanmar/

Those who still wish to say there is DNA evidence that proves the B2 carried out this crime are truly in a world of their own.

[GOLDBUGGY]

GOLDBUGGY,

Nobody is claiming that the DNA test result rests on one Policemans word. Yes it has to go to a lab and pass many people.

It's the people who collected the samples and sent them. There was no forensic pathologist at the crime scene. WHatever reached the lab to be sampled has to be taken at face value, and THAT rests on the word of the people who collected it.

Also, about a week before the B2 were arrested EVERYONE on the island, including those 2 (photographs of them in line to be tested are old news) were tested and declared clear. So why did they turn up a match the second time???

What is not clear about this discrepancy??

I would love to agree with you here Rybanlor but I can't. If we are to make our minds up on what was reported at the time the B2 were possibly not previously cleared at that time. Had they stood in line and taken tests? I saw pictures of 2 of the 3 originally arrested in line. Only one of these is within the B2 the 3rd was arrested and released. Also as they were taking DNA from 200 people or so the samples were sent but were not yet verified there was a queue. According to a statement from the police at the time.

It is quite possible that their DNA had been sent and not yet processed.

Fair point. I guess again I am taking media reports as they come. That was how I understood it to transpire, but it may be that there were premature reports.

I stand by my first statement though, about the doubt over DNA sample collecting.

It's good you be objective about these things, it helps to be as clear as possible concerning all these issues.

Agreed and this is what we should be concentrating on:

On July 10, the bench again ordered the DNA to be retested, only for the police to reveal that certain key samples — specifically those retrieved from the victims’ bodies — had been used up. The only items still available for retesting were objects found around the crime scene, including the suspected murder weapons, but one witness claimed that these had been washed. http://time.com/3955081/thailand-koh-tao-murder-david-miller-hannah-witheridge-zaw-lin-wai-phyo-burma-myanmar/

Those who still wish to say there is DNA evidence that proves the B2 carried out this crime are truly in a world of their own.

So you base their innocents on that their is no DNA left for further testing?

Well then, you had better let out the +95% Convicted Murders in your country because they never had their DNA Evidence done twice either. While you are at that, maybe protested against the Prosecution Team in your country for not assisting the the Defense in making their case. In my country the Prosecution tries to provide evidence in court that the accused are guilty beyond reasonable doubt. They do not try to prove that the accused are innocent.

[sammygood]

wow, almost 100 pages of speculation

this is the blockbuster story of the year

and they did not even have to use a ghost writer this time

and to say, crime does not pay (10+ ads per page)

[Rykbanlor]

GOLDBUGGY,

Nobody is claiming that the DNA test result rests on one Policemans word. Yes it has to go to a lab and pass many people.

It's the people who collected the samples and sent them. There was no forensic pathologist at the crime scene. WHatever reached the lab to be sampled has to be taken at face value, and THAT rests on the word of the people who collected it.

So you base their innocents on that their is no DNA left for further testing?

Well then, you had better let out the +95% Convicted Murders in your country because they never had their DNA Evidence done twice either. While you are at that, maybe protested against the Prosecution Team in your country for not assisting the the Defense in making their case. In my country the Prosecution tries to provide evidence in court that the accused are guilty beyond reasonable doubt. They do not try to prove that the accused are innocent.

Well, they seem incapable of doing either.

And i already stated why I believe the sample collection itself at the crime scene was flawed.

[smedly]

GOLDBUGGY,

Nobody is claiming that the DNA test result rests on one Policemans word. Yes it has to go to a lab and pass many people.

It's the people who collected the samples and sent them. There was no forensic pathologist at the crime scene. WHatever reached the lab to be sampled has to be taken at face value, and THAT rests on the word of the people who collected it.

Also, about a week before the B2 were arrested EVERYONE on the island, including those 2 (photographs of them in line to be tested are old news) were tested and declared clear. So why did they turn up a match the second time???

What is not clear about this discrepancy??

I would love to agree with you here Rybanlor but I can't. If we are to make our minds up on what was reported at the time the B2 were possibly not previously cleared at that time. Had they stood in line and taken tests? I saw pictures of 2 of the 3 originally arrested in line. Only one of these is within the B2 the 3rd was arrested and released. Also as they were taking DNA from 200 people or so the samples were sent but were not yet verified there was a queue. According to a statement from the police at the time.

It is quite possible that their DNA had been sent and not yet processed.

Fair point. I guess again I am taking media reports as they come. That was how I understood it to transpire, but it may be that there were premature reports.

I stand by my first statement though, about the doubt over DNA sample collecting.

It's good you be objective about these things, it helps to be as clear as possible concerning all these issues.

Agreed and this is what we should be concentrating on:

On July 10, the bench again ordered the DNA to be retested, only for the police to reveal that certain key samples — specifically those retrieved from the victims’ bodies — had been used up. The only items still available for retesting were objects found around the crime scene, including the suspected murder weapons, but one witness claimed that these had been washed. http://time.com/3955081/thailand-koh-tao-murder-david-miller-hannah-witheridge-zaw-lin-wai-phyo-burma-myanmar/

Those who still wish to say there is DNA evidence that proves the B2 carried out this crime are truly in a world of their own.

If testing protocols - DNA Sample Material management - DNA sample retention - Defence Council access protocols were not followed then the DNA test results should be ruled inadmissible in court.

If however DNA samples were taken and retained by a suitably qualified person and lab in the UK - then there is absolutely no reason why it cannot be used by this court to verify DNA evidence for the defence (if they want it) provided all legal protocols have been followed to the satisfaction of prosecution and court.

It could also be in the interest of prosecution to have these tests carried out in a UK lab - why would they not, it would certainly remove all the doubt and speculation surrounding this case

[smedly]

I would love to agree with you here Rybanlor but I can't. If we are to make our minds up on what was reported at the time the B2 were possibly not previously cleared at that time. Had they stood in line and taken tests? I saw pictures of 2 of the 3 originally arrested in line. Only one of these is within the B2 the 3rd was arrested and released. Also as they were taking DNA from 200 people or so the samples were sent but were not yet verified there was a queue. According to a statement from the police at the time.

It is quite possible that their DNA had been sent and not yet processed.

Fair point. I guess again I am taking media reports as they come. That was how I understood it to transpire, but it may be that there were premature reports.

I stand by my first statement though, about the doubt over DNA sample collecting.

It's good you be objective about these things, it helps to be as clear as possible concerning all these issues.

Agreed and this is what we should be concentrating on:

On July 10, the bench again ordered the DNA to be retested, only for the police to reveal that certain key samples — specifically those retrieved from the victims’ bodies — had been used up. The only items still available for retesting were objects found around the crime scene, including the suspected murder weapons, but one witness claimed that these had been washed. http://time.com/3955081/thailand-koh-tao-murder-david-miller-hannah-witheridge-zaw-lin-wai-phyo-burma-myanmar/

Those who still wish to say there is DNA evidence that proves the B2 carried out this crime are truly in a world of their own.

So you base their innocents on that their is no DNA left for further testing?

Well then, you had better let out the +95% Convicted Murders in your country because they never had their DNA Evidence done twice either. While you are at that, maybe protested against the Prosecution Team in your country for not assisting the the Defense in making their case. In my country the Prosecution tries to provide evidence in court that the accused are guilty beyond reasonable doubt. They do not try to prove that the accused are innocent.

you evidently have no idea of the protocols required by prosecutors courts and justice systems regarding DNA evidence that must be followed strictly - if I was on a murder charge based on DNA in the UK and they lost the original samples or as said in this case exhausted them without consulting defence council - I'd be walking out of court within minutes a free man

stop with this stupid nonsense for gods sake

[thailandchilli]

I would love to agree with you here Rybanlor but I can't. If we are to make our minds up on what was reported at the time the B2 were possibly not previously cleared at that time. Had they stood in line and taken tests? I saw pictures of 2 of the 3 originally arrested in line. Only one of these is within the B2 the 3rd was arrested and released. Also as they were taking DNA from 200 people or so the samples were sent but were not yet verified there was a queue. According to a statement from the police at the time.

It is quite possible that their DNA had been sent and not yet processed.

Fair point. I guess again I am taking media reports as they come. That was how I understood it to transpire, but it may be that there were premature reports.

I stand by my first statement though, about the doubt over DNA sample collecting.

It's good you be objective about these things, it helps to be as clear as possible concerning all these issues.

Agreed and this is what we should be concentrating on:

On July 10, the bench again ordered the DNA to be retested, only for the police to reveal that certain key samples — specifically those retrieved from the victims’ bodies — had been used up. The only items still available for retesting were objects found around the crime scene, including the suspected murder weapons, but one witness claimed that these had been washed. http://time.com/3955081/thailand-koh-tao-murder-david-miller-hannah-witheridge-zaw-lin-wai-phyo-burma-myanmar/

Those who still wish to say there is DNA evidence that proves the B2 carried out this crime are truly in a world of their own.

So you base their innocents on that their is no DNA left for further testing?

Well then, you had better let out the +95% Convicted Murders in your country because they never had their DNA Evidence done twice either. While you are at that, maybe protested against the Prosecution Team in your country for not assisting the the Defense in making their case. In my country the Prosecution tries to provide evidence in court that the accused are guilty beyond reasonable doubt. They do not try to prove that the accused are innocent.

The prosecution is doing a very good job on its own proving that the B2 are in jail for a crime with no verifiable evidence against them, and thats with no help from the defense, I look forward to the defenses turn

[boomerangutang]

I found a Bkk Post article which asserts that Panya, the initial head cop on the case, thought that Running Man videos showed Mon. How can a 45 yr old man look like a skinny kid? Maybe in Hollywood with special effects. A reasonable observer, when looking at the Runnng Man videos compared to other videos showing his body-type, his gait, his quirky mannerisms while he walks, will conclude it's Nomsod. Among other things, NS's odd way of swinging his arms and sheltering his left arm (he's allegedly left handed and David's wounds were mostly to the right side of his neck) ....give it away.

Maybe Panya didn't get everything wrong. On Sept. 24, 2014 he claimed "the (prime) suspect had left the island and went into hiding in the capital." (referring to Nomsod)

Another note, this one from Wikipedia: self-appointed PM Prayut appointed Police-General Somyot (declared assets: around Bt.350 million) head of the RTP following the coup of May 2014. Boomer's comment: it's surprising, a man can amass such a fortune on a policeman's salary of about Bt.12,000/month (starting salary used to be around Bt.9000 month). Prayut is the head policeman who assigned himself to take over the KT crime investigation, while concurrently assigning the prior head cop, Panya, to what was essentially an inactive post in Bkk.

To amass 350 million baht on a policeman's salary of 12,000/month, a person would have to work 2,500 years without spending anything, just saving.

[Eirene]

...more speculation...or just a wild guess. Perhaps his nickname DoDo is due to a wounded wing...flightless bird.

Watching these two videos again, I see something very interesting: notice how his right arm swings from the shoulder, but the left arm bends at the elbow as he swings it, in both videos. He seems to have something going on with his left arm--other photos show him holding his left arm up against his body.

What are the chances that two similar-looking people have this same odd thing going on with how they move their arms when walking? One in a million?

[GOLDBUGGY]

GOLDBUGGY,

Nobody is claiming that the DNA test result rests on one Policemans word. Yes it has to go to a lab and pass many people.

It's the people who collected the samples and sent them. There was no forensic pathologist at the crime scene. WHatever reached the lab to be sampled has to be taken at face value, and THAT rests on the word of the people who collected it.

Also, about a week before the B2 were arrested EVERYONE on the island, including those 2 (photographs of them in line to be tested are old news) were tested and declared clear. So why did they turn up a match the second time???

What is not clear about this discrepancy??

Because, if it was really them getting their sample collected, they would have been thrown in the same pile as 200 others. How long would it take to go through a pile like that? Especially if you buy someones story that it takes 48 hours per sample? Would 400 days be close. Even using 5 stations it is still 80 days. Plus stopping all other DNA Murder Cases going on at this time.

They just never got around to theirs yet.

[DM07]

Forget the CCTV images for now - is there actual witness proof or other photographic proof that Nomsod (Freshmilk) was on the island at the time?

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue which is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime and some are going to the most outrageous and laughable speculation, theories and conspiracies to pin it on him even if it means the actual murdering rapists go free.

Plus Nomsod had his DNA Tested and proved it did not match with Hannah's, which has cleared several other suspects in the past, including other Migrant Workers. .

Oh look...two comics for the price of one!

1) "a whole bunch" of evidence, that he was not on the island? Like testimony by his daddy and a still from what must be hours of CCTV- tape?

The CCTV-still shows 1 second in the life of a suspect in a double murder + rape case...what about seeing another...let's say 5 minutes?

What about seeing...for example...how he entered the building?

Let me ask you straight, JTJ: if you had a daughter (which for her sake, I hope not) and she would have been raped or murdered ...or both...would you be satisfied with the "evidence" the mighty RTP has gathered? Would you be happy with the testimony of daddy and a still- photo?

Especially, if there is conflicting testimony by ...let's say...the GIRLFRIEND of the suspect?

2) and here comes comic number 2- the guy who actually quotes the comical DNA-testing of Nomsod. Televised on National TV, with the head-policeman of Thailand taking part ("which has cleared several other suspects in the past, including other migrant workers") and with everyone stating BEFOREHAND that even a positive test- result, will not lead to any other thing than clearance for the suspect!

You amaze me...and not in a good way!

[stickylies]

it's surprising, a man can amass such a fortune on a policeman's salary of about Bt.12,000/month (starting salary used to be around Bt.9000 month). Prayut is the head policeman who assigned himself to take over the KT crime investigation, while concurrently assigning the prior head cop, Panya, to what was essentially an inactive post in Bkk.

To amass 350 million baht on a policeman's salary of 12,000/month, a person would have to work 2,500 years without spending anything, just saving.

1. Higher ranking cops earn (way) more than 9.000-12.000THB...

2. Thaksin was a copper. Rich families have cops too in their ranks.

[GOLDBUGGY]

Forget the CCTV images for now - is there actual witness proof or other photographic proof that Nomsod (Freshmilk) was on the island at the time?

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue which is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime and some are going to the most outrageous and laughable speculation, theories and conspiracies to pin it on him even if it means the actual murdering rapists go free.

Plus Nomsod had his DNA Tested and proved it did not match with Hannah's, which has cleared several other suspects in the past, including other Migrant Workers. .

Oh look...two comics for the price of one!

1) "a whole bunch" of evidence, that he was not on the island? Like testimony by his daddy and a still from what must be hours of CCTV- tape?

The CCTV-still shows 1 second in the life of a suspect in a double murder + rape case...what about seeing another...let's say 5 minutes?

What about seeing...for example...how he entered the building?

Let me ask you straight, JTJ: if you had a daughter (which for her sake, I hope not) and she would have been raped or murdered ...or both...would you be satisfied with the "evidence" the mighty RTP has gathered? Would you be happy with the testimony of daddy and a still- photo?

Especially, if there is conflicting testimony by ...let's say...the GIRLFRIEND of the suspect?

2) and here comes comic number 2- the guy who actually quotes the comical DNA-testing of Nomsod. Televised on National TV, with the head-policeman of Thailand taking part ("which has cleared several other suspects in the past, including other migrant workers") and with everyone stating BEFOREHAND that even a positive test- result, will not lead to any other thing than clearance for the suspect!

You amaze me...and not in a good way!

Well, I can't speak for John, but I can for myself.

I don't want to hurt your feelings, but if you want the honest truth I really don't care what you think about me or if this amazes you. Never did! Never will!

I do read through your post though, but what I see mostly is you flaming people who have a different opinion then you, and praising the ones who don't. But this doesn't phase me either as if you haven't noticed by now, I don't value your opinion one bit, even though I don't flame you for it.

[smedly]

Forget the CCTV images for now - is there actual witness proof or other photographic proof that Nomsod (Freshmilk) was on the island at the time?

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue which is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime and some are going to the most outrageous and laughable speculation, theories and conspiracies to pin it on him even if it means the actual murdering rapists go free.

Plus Nomsod had his DNA Tested and proved it did not match with Hannah's, which has cleared several other suspects in the past, including other Migrant Workers. .

Oh look...two comics for the price of one!

1) "a whole bunch" of evidence, that he was not on the island? Like testimony by his daddy and a still from what must be hours of CCTV- tape?

The CCTV-still shows 1 second in the life of a suspect in a double murder + rape case...what about seeing another...let's say 5 minutes?

What about seeing...for example...how he entered the building?

Let me ask you straight, JTJ: if you had a daughter (which for her sake, I hope not) and she would have been raped or murdered ...or both...would you be satisfied with the "evidence" the mighty RTP has gathered? Would you be happy with the testimony of daddy and a still- photo?

Especially, if there is conflicting testimony by ...let's say...the GIRLFRIEND of the suspect?

2) and here comes comic number 2- the guy who actually quotes the comical DNA-testing of Nomsod. Televised on National TV, with the head-policeman of Thailand taking part ("which has cleared several other suspects in the past, including other migrant workers") and with everyone stating BEFOREHAND that even a positive test- result, will not lead to any other thing than clearance for the suspect!

You amaze me...and not in a good way!

Ok so we have seen a still or as you say 1 sec of footage, we have to assume it is likely we are only seeing snippets of info released to the press and as NS is not on trial then we are likely to see nothing more, just saying

Since NS is not on trial then unfortunately the police really have no obligation to show us anything, a simple statement that he has been ruled out would/should have been all that was required, if Panorama or the like want to have an investigation of their own as they do in the UK with some controversial cases then that would be all done privately with the possibility of evidence being turned over to police when concluded - pipe dream I know

So like I have said many times - it all comes down to the credibility of the DNA evidence and possibly witness statements from certain individuals to make a defence bringing into question the prosecution case. If this case is thrown out of court (which I doubt no matter what happens) then I would suggest that Thailand install a new investigative team to start from scratch - I very much doubt that would happen either, in the west it is not unheard of for defence to produce evidence connecting others to a case to discredit the prosecution but in Thailand I don't see how that could work - different system - different mindset, accountability does not exist

[boomerangutang]

You have no proof he was on the island and what he told the Police as you were not there. What we all know for sure is Nomsod went in for DNA Testing and he was cleared of all suspicion based on the fact it did not match with the DNA they got from Hannah. The same way which cleared many other Migrant Workers who were tested, and other suspects of this crime, including a Fast Boat Operator, a Football Team, and his Uncle and Father.

How many times here have I heard that money talks in Thailand? Nomsod was a Rich Kid! Do you think having all this money he could not find a date? That he could not afford to pay for it with a Russian Woman, and many others like this in Bangkok, if he wanted to? Personally I think 2 men who may not have had sex in over a year, as they may not have had girlfriends on the Island, have more of a motive to have forced sex with a women, then a Rich Kid who can get that anywhere.

One addition / correction I would make is he was actually cleared well before he took the DNA tests.

The only thinking linking this kid to the crime was unfounded rumors that he was on the island and fled. The police took this claims serious and looked into them to found they were BS.

You're both off by a country mile. For starters, GB's claim; "no proof he was on the island" is bunk. Any objective viewer of the 'Runnin Man' vidoes can see that's Nomsod. NS's uncle claiming it was himself (Mon) doesn't fool anyone, except those few with a vested interest (to shield NS) will say it's Mon and not Nomsod. Mon can say it was himself, because he knows he's teflon covered, as are his cop buddy and his other buddies who should be prime suspects.

As for the CCTV of NS in Bkk at 9:30 am: It's moot, because it's already been established that it would not be difficult for a desperate young man with money to get from the island to an airport, and then fly to Bkk in the 4.5 hours between 5 am and 9:30 am. (It could be done in closer to 3.5 hours) There are some basic avenues of investigation which could prove or disprove that. For obvious reasons, RTP either hasn't looked, or has looked, and didn't like what they saw (because it implicated NS and proved he was a liar) ....so RTP trashed the findings.

Can we see CCTV from NS's apartment where he enters the lobby? The key time would be between 8 am and the time he leaves. We won't see that. If there is CCTV of him entering the lobby for the 20 or so hrs before 8 am Monday, then I'm wrong, and I will apologize. Connect the dots.

[flyingdoc]

Actual credibility sorely needed at this time !

[DM07]

Dear Mr. Goldbuggy

I honestly don't give 2 hot sh1t$, what think about me.

I would be interested though, what your rebuttal of my point is.

You know? The one with the trumped up DNA-testing, assisted by Thailand's top-cop and with the statement, that it really wouldn't matter, what the test results would be (+ the record testing time in the POLICE -hospital, when it was mentioned many times before, that Thailand's hospitals are not equipped to such testing, let alone in this short period of time) and your statement, that this is good evidence for the "innocence" of Nomsod...

[boomerangutang]

However in this kid;s case there is not only absolutely nothing offered to show he was on the island, let alone involved but numerous things to confirm he wasn't.

'absolutely nothing' according to JTJ are CCTV images showing Nomsod, minutes after the crime, shirtless and looking spooked.

"Living is easy with eyes closed, misunderstanding all you see."

- John Lennon, 'Stawberry Fields Forever'

Nomsod volunteered to give his DNA for testing to clear this conspiracy theory on social media against him. His DNA did not match the sperm samples collected from Hannah or any at the crime scene.

This means he did not do it regardless if he was on the Island or not or in his dorm or not. His DNA cleared him of any wrong doing. Finish! End of Story! No need to waste further Tax Payers Money on further investigation base on some Conspiracy Theory.

Gimme a f'ing break, dude. Are you still flapping that dead fish around over your head? DNA typing for Nomsod was probably done correctly, but THE WHOLE PRESS EVENT WAS STAGED. In order to believe NS's DNA didn't match, you have to believe the RTP top brass have no agenda in this game. You have to take the RTP's word for what constitues 'DNA taken from Hannah' - which no one else can verify. Not the defense, not the general public, not forensic experts. Right after that bogus conclusion, the RTP top brass announce they're not going to show NS's DNA typing to the Brit experts. If that doesn't blow it out of the water, then you're either easily duped or so firmly in Nomsod's camp, that no reason will prevail.

It's the exact same top brass cops who told everyone that the B2's DNA typing did match the DNA in/on the victim. ....and last week we're told that no one can access the samples taken from Hannah. I hate to break it to you, but the Tooth Fairy doesn't exist either.

[DennisF]

Forget the CCTV images for now - is there actual witness proof or other photographic proof that Nomsod (Freshmilk) was on the island at the time?

As has been reported in the news there is zero credible evidence that has been reported that shows he was on the island and whole bunch to show he was not but don't let that prevent the theorists from coming up with scenarios where he was on the island and then further make up reasons why he would have committed these crimes all to get to their real issue which is they are angry that they believe the headsman carries a lot of weight on the island. Would almost seem the anger is coming from insecurity and jealousy when looking at this case and there be absolutely nothing to indicate his son had any involvement in the crime and some are going to the most outrageous and laughable speculation, theories and conspiracies to pin it on him even if it means the actual murdering rapists go free.

Plus Nomsod had his DNA Tested and proved it did not match with Hannah's, which has cleared several other suspects in the past, including other Migrant Workers. .

All tests were done at establishments that are not certified or qualified for criminal DNA testing. At best he had a paternity type test.

But let us not spoil the anti-conspiracy train with truth, lets use phrases like 'credible evidence' to confuse and convince.

Pathetic.

[CockneyGit]

Go talk to people in Koh Tao, then you'll know who did it.

[GOLDBUGGY]

However in this kid;s case there is not only absolutely nothing offered to show he was on the island, let alone involved but numerous things to confirm he wasn't.

'absolutely nothing' according to JTJ are CCTV images showing Nomsod, minutes after the crime, shirtless and looking spooked.

"Living is easy with eyes closed, misunderstanding all you see."

- John Lennon, 'Stawberry Fields Forever'

Nomsod volunteered to give his DNA for testing to clear this conspiracy theory on social media against him. His DNA did not match the sperm samples collected from Hannah or any at the crime scene.

This means he did not do it regardless if he was on the Island or not or in his dorm or not. His DNA cleared him of any wrong doing. Finish! End of Story! No need to waste further Tax Payers Money on further investigation base on some Conspiracy Theory.

Gimme a f'ing break, dude. Are you still flapping that dead fish around over your head? DNA typing for Nomsod was probably done correctly, but THE WHOLE PRESS EVENT WAS STAGED. In order to believe NS's DNA didn't match, you have to believe the RTP top brass have no agenda in this game. You have to take the RTP's word for what constitues 'DNA taken from Hannah' - which no one else can verify. Not the defense, not the general public, not forensic experts. Right after that bogus conclusion, the RTP top brass announce they're not going to show NS's DNA typing to the Brit experts. If that doesn't blow it out of the water, then you're either easily duped or so firmly in Nomsod's camp, that no reason will prevail.

It's the exact same top brass cops who told everyone that the B2's DNA typing did match the DNA in/on the victim. ....and last week we're told that no one can access the samples taken from Hannah. I hate to break it to you, but the Tooth Fairy doesn't exist either.

Okay! Let's take Inventory here to see what we have.

I will use the word "Alleged" as I was not witness to any of this.

It is Alleged that:

1) The 2 accused confessed to these murders and rape on October 1st or 2nd.

2) That the 3rd Member of this party is being held as a Witness for the Prosecution as reported by the media. Media Reports of an eye witness to the murders but not verified as yet. So rumored!

3) Another Migrant Worker being held as a Witness for the Prosecution. One worker reportedly by media that he had told the Police he was given David Millers Mobile Phone to hold for 1 of the accused. He discarded it and showed the police where he put it, which they found. He was approached by the Police based on what 1 of the accused told them what he did with it.

4) Witness placing the accused near the crime scene close to the time of the murders. Even the 2 accused admitted to this. But say they saw nothing.

5) The 2 accused had their DNA Matched to Hannah by Forensics.

6) Possible CCTV Footage of 1 of the accused at the crime scene, when both denied being their.

7) A cigarette butt found at the crime scene matching the DNA of the accused.

8) No Alibi.

Yes! I agree! Someone is flapping a Dead Fish around here!

[cornishcarlos]

Go talk to people in Koh Tao, then you'll know who did it.

We have relatives in KT that we talk to, we don't know who did it !! You won't find many locals there spilling the beans

[StealthEnergiser]

However in this kid;s case there is not only absolutely nothing offered to show he was on the island, let alone involved but numerous things to confirm he wasn't.

'absolutely nothing' according to JTJ are CCTV images showing Nomsod, minutes after the crime, shirtless and looking spooked.

"Living is easy with eyes closed, misunderstanding all you see."

- John Lennon, 'Stawberry Fields Forever'

Nomsod volunteered to give his DNA for testing to clear this conspiracy theory on social media against him. His DNA did not match the sperm samples collected from Hannah or any at the crime scene.

This means he did not do it regardless if he was on the Island or not or in his dorm or not. His DNA cleared him of any wrong doing. Finish! End of Story! No need to waste further Tax Payers Money on further investigation base on some Conspiracy Theory.

Gimme a f'ing break, dude. Are you still flapping that dead fish around over your head? DNA typing for Nomsod was probably done correctly, but THE WHOLE PRESS EVENT WAS STAGED. In order to believe NS's DNA didn't match, you have to believe the RTP top brass have no agenda in this game. You have to take the RTP's word for what constitues 'DNA taken from Hannah' - which no one else can verify. Not the defense, not the general public, not forensic experts. Right after that bogus conclusion, the RTP top brass announce they're not going to show NS's DNA typing to the Brit experts. If that doesn't blow it out of the water, then you're either easily duped or so firmly in Nomsod's camp, that no reason will prevail.

It's the exact same top brass cops who told everyone that the B2's DNA typing did match the DNA in/on the victim. ....and last week we're told that no one can access the samples taken from Hannah. I hate to break it to you, but the Tooth Fairy doesn't exist either.

Don't feed the flapping fish they thrive on it has anyone seen their explanation of why the hoe was moved and dna washed off .?

[Nigeone]

T

The amount of people stating about DNA tests done by RTP are missing the point. Let's clear this up! The RTP stated that they had there DNA tested and it didn't match...And we all believe whatever the RTP say don't we.. They also said that DNA samples went to Singapore and that's been discounted now. They also said they couldn't do DNA test for a week as they needed to go to Bangkok. They then tested Nomsad and cleared him in 24 hours . No there liars and not very good ones at that. Plain to see!!

That Sir is a Farce!

As pointed out here several times in the past, and only if you would read this, the Police only play a small part in Forensics Evidence. There are several steps and procedures that must be followed and verified, before DNA can be validated and considered evidence. This can involve several other people in a Crime Lab, and Prosecution, and thus it is not just one Policeman's Word.

If you recall, which you probably don't as you probably never read this either, that when 1 of the accused was picked up on the main land, (Win I think) the Police requested that his DNA be tested as soon as possible, and the first results came in less than a day proving Positive. Or as reported by the Media anyway. In other words instead of waiting for all the other 200 samples they collected from the Island to be tested, they put this at the top of the list.

Since you seem to claim you know so much about DNA Testing Times, how long does it take to preform a DNA Test? .

Pol Lt Gen Kamrob Panyakaew, chief of the Office of Police Forensic Science, said the closest forensic lab to Koh Tao capable of conducting DNA tests was in Songkhla province, but it could not take on the testing as it was overloaded with cases from the southern conflict. He said experts in Bangkok were rushing to complete the tests, though each sample takes at least 48 hours to complete.

Bangkok Post 28-9-14

Gold buggy, do you even read what you write?! In your first sentence you acknowledge the fact that many people and factors are involved in verifying DNA. Shoot yourself in the foot if you want but the above poster is correct as to what was stated.. Also at one stage they were having to use Bangkok but it might take up to a week! The other matter is can you tell me, conspiracy aside!? that you are prepared to believe everything the RTP tell you?? I certainly don't trust that media joke DNA test done for the show that was carried out! So your happy to accept that a DNA test that they said couldn't be done for a couple of days or more conviently was produced,with all the necessary people and techniques you say are involved in less than a day! No way!

I will though just for your benefit check with my friend who's a CI in police here and was scenes of crime officer for 20 years for his take on DNA collection and reporting. I would say this will be a international standard procedures and not those that lose, use up or can't find the DNA at a later date when required by courts ! Point made ??

DNA Tests Done in 4 Hours

http://www.acs.org/content/acs/en/pressroom/presspacs/2010/acs-presspac-august-4-2010/fast-forensic-test-can-match-suspects-dna-with-crime-samples-in-four-hours.html

Did you read that attachment you posted. That method of testing is not readily available yet and if you can remember the compromised crime scene with complete contamination of scene in a totally unsterile environment and then witnessed the local police,not properly trained personal taking the samples you still think this matter wasn't utterly compromised . Also the article clearly states that Crime DNA takes 24 to 72 hours at least by qualified personal to take and compare. At no time was the proper testing at any stage was acquired and further more as another poster has quite clearly stated proper protocol in collecting, and independently !! checked and tested wasn't carried out. The many statements of DNA supposedly gathered has most been lost used up or none left as stated by the Police. The defense did not at any stage as required by law in a civilized country being allowed to independently verify said DNA so the whole case if in the UK or other country would not even make it to court I'm afraid. That's a fact. We already had a witness saying he moved the hoe, apparently the murder weapon! and then was asked to wash it! That's a crime scene! The policeman admitted to moving the body,the police stated the murdered couples clothes were in a neat pile! Pictures of the crime scene clearly show the items of clothing and pink shoes etc were all over the place. It's been totally compromised in every shape and form and should be stopped now. Now goldbuggy that's me finished answering you for now. It's a bit repetive I'm afraid

[boomerangutang]

Personally I don't really agree in chasing down this person (Nomsod) without enough evidence. I first think the defence of the B2. The police hopefully will go back and start from the beginning and then the evidence will lead them to wherever it leads them. I do think there was evidence that went unnoticed.

'....police hopefully will go back.....' that's got to be a big fat naive hope, my friend. I would hope so too, but this is Thailand, and police don't do their jobs like you and I would expect police to do.

'evidence that went unnoticed' .....that's an understatement. Not only unnoticed, but trashed, misinterpreted, contrived and altered.

It could also be in the interest of prosecution to have these (DNA) tests carried out in a UK lab - why would they not, it would certainly remove all the doubt and speculation surrounding this case.

That's too much common sense to fathom this early in the morning. It's not even noon yet. Actually, in a churlish way, I look forward to the prosecution & RTP continuing their screw-ups in the courtroom. If there was a song titled, "Chickens Coming Home to Roost", it would be appropriate theme music. The credits could have the music accompinament: Boogie Woogie Bungle Boys From Surat Thani. (taken without permission from: 'Boogie Woogie Bugle Boy From Company B') And the club next to the AC bar could face their speakers toward AC Bar and play Jimi Hendrix's 'Voodoo Child' at full volume. Watch for the feature film, coming to a theater near you.

[GOLDBUGGY]

Go talk to people in Koh Tao, then you'll know who did it.

We have relatives in KT that we talk to, we don't know who did it !! You won't find many locals there spilling the beans

I am sure what you said is true.

Where I live, I don't see many people walking around between the hours of 2 am and 4 am either, and when these murders were supposed to have taken place. Or reported that way anyway. Most people I know, including myself, are in bed this time of night. So what could they know about the murders? .

[GOLDBUGGY]

Personally I don't really agree in chasing down this person (Nomsod) without enough evidence. I first think the defence of the B2. The police hopefully will go back and start from the beginning and then the evidence will lead them to wherever it leads them. I do think there was evidence that went unnoticed.

'....police hopefully will go back.....' that's got to be a big fat naive hope, my friend. I would hope so too, but this is Thailand, and police don't do their jobs like you and I would expect police to do.

'evidence that went unnoticed' .....that's an understatement. Not only unnoticed, but trashed, misinterpreted, contrived and altered.

It could also be in the interest of prosecution to have these (DNA) tests carried out in a UK lab - why would they not, it would certainly remove all the doubt and speculation surrounding this case.

That's too much common sense to fathom this early in the morning. It's not even noon yet. Actually, in a churlish way, I look forward to the prosecution & RTP continuing their screw-ups in the courtroom. If there was a song titled, "Chickens Coming Home to Roost", it would be appropriate theme music. The credits could have the music accompinament: Boogie Woogie Bungle Boys From Surat Thani. (taken without permission from: 'Boogie Woogie Bugle Boy From Company B') And the club next to the AC bar could face their speakers toward AC Bar and play Jimi Hendrix's 'Voodoo Child' at full volume. Watch for the feature film, coming to a theater near you.

How about the song "Bye Bye Birdy Good Bye"?