Australia's refugee solution: An expensive joke? BBC point of view

[Mudcrab]

For those who say asylum seekers pass many safe countries on the way to Australia, no they don't. Australia is the only accounted that allows refugees between the Middle East and tyere. There are no countries an asylum seeker can stop at on the way.

India, Malaysia, Indonesia, Thailand....how many more do you want?

Both Malaysia and Indonesia are Muslim countries....no passport or immigration controls required for Muslims. Free passage and no threat of persecution. i.e place of safety under the UN convention. But also no free handouts/social security/dole payments. No wonder they don't want to stay.

Nice try..none of the countries you mention in post #26 are signatories to the 1951 UN Convention relating to the status of refugees.

Who really cares...that was written over 60 years ago in a different era for a different set of circumstances.

The UN has become an impotent anachronism from another time and should be disbanded.

When it comes to the crunch a sovereign state will decide who enters their borders and the manner in which they shall do so.

When that right is abrogated.....war will surely follow.

sorry for the messed up quotes

Edited September 19, 2015 by Mudcrab

[alex88]

How naive for somebody to say asylum seekers can stay in Malaysia or Indonesia without fear of persecution. As I already said all asylum seekers are imprisoned in those countries as soon as they are discovered. Asylum seekers are not allowed to stay in Malaysia or Indonesia. Neither country accepts them.

[Mudcrab]

How naive for somebody to say asylum seekers can stay in Malaysia or Indonesia without fear of persecution. As I already said all asylum seekers are imprisoned in those countries as soon as they are discovered. Asylum seekers are not allowed to stay in Malaysia or Indonesia. Neither country accepts them.

Nonsense...many illegals were staying Indonesia for months prior to boarding boats.

[meltingpot2015]

@mudcrab:

Who really cares

...when a state signs a document, they are bound by it. Unless you are saying that these documents states sign don't matter.

Like you say the UN has been going strong for over 60 years.

Circumstances are the same...Refugees fleeing persecution.

When it comes to the crunch a sovereign state will decide who enters their borders and the manner in which they shall do so.

Have you been watching the news of what is happening in Europe?. Clearly not. Also, read the news about what is happening in Thailand. Prime Minister Chan-o-cha has recently said Thailand's economic problems are due to its economy being "closely interlinked with the international economy". So the sovereign state is becoming more and more of a misnomer.

As for the rest of your post...cynical and also contradictory. The different set of circumstances you mention.... Note that conflict causes people to become refugees. Not the other way round...The UN convention came about due to the second world war.

All this talk of war, you are clearly an Ultra-realist.

Edited September 19, 2015 by meltingpot2015

[kaorop]

Australia have a bad record and under Abbot's government I was deeply cynical about the P.R about refugees!

Australia had a bad record under the previous Labor governments....50,000 illegal immigrants and over 1,000 people drowned.

That number is now zero.

Pretty good record under Abbott I think.

Saved a lot of lives.

What so many seem to have forgotten was that the scabbot gov blocked the reporting of refugees arriving by boats

So we dont know what happened.

Then when you get the leaks, where they PAID people smugglers to not bring people, the ridiculously expensive cambo experiment

you realize its about garnering votes from the average easily lead and often racist australian.

[kaorop]

I agree rich countries need to help and its easy to say solve the root cause in those countries and you fix the problem. But tell me, for people with no skills, how on earth will they even buy a house in AUS with the cheapest thing you can get for AUD 500k - or is the expectation that they will be on DSS for life? From the bleeding left wing apart from yelling "Let them in", please tell me what is your integration plan for people with no skills and no education (Except reciting the Koran from cover to cover)?

You ought ask the Greeks and Italians after WW2, or the Vietnamese, maybe the Chinese back in the gold rush or even the prisoners from the ole country?

Were they skilled?, obviously not, things like this dont get fixed in the next election period and take many years, but they eventually improve the country.

[meltingpot2015]

@weegee:

I've never heard of a country called Hungry. Do you mean Hungary?

The Australian 'stop the boats' plan only appeal to a right-wing dutch lawmaker. His party PVV has only 12 out of 150 seats in the Dutch parliament and 4 out of 26 seats in the European Parliament.

Actually, UK, Germany, France and even Australia have pledged to take more Syrian Refugees.

Edited September 19, 2015 by meltingpot2015

[masuk]

Australia have a bad record and under Abbot's government I was deeply cynical about the P.R about refugees!

Australia has a quota of some thousands of migrants/refugees each year. These people will arrive legally, and not sneaking in through the back door by hulks from Indonesia.

Over and above this annual quota, 12,000 refugees from the current crisis will be moving to Australia before Christmas.

I agree that the debacle over Cambodia must be causing a few red faces in Canberra, but the program has stopped people risking life and limb to get to Oz illegally.

[gigman]

Australia rich country...???....

Maybe for those sucking out resources paying peanuts in return.As to hard working Australian already nightmare start to appear for coming uncertainty and future age pensions...

[simple1]

Most asylum seekers fly into Malaysia and then cross into Indonesia from where they take a boat to Christmas Island in Australian territory. Both Malaysia and Indonesia imprison asylum seekers upon discovery.

Both Malaysia and Indonesia are Muslim countries....no passport or immigration controls required for Muslims. Free passage and no threat of persecution. i.e place of safety under the UN convention. But also no free handouts/social security/dole payments. No wonder they don't want to stay.

None of the countries you mention are signatory to the UN Convention for refugees, do not have suitable legal protection for refugees, nor permitted to legally work. Malaysia & Indonesia do require passport / immigration control for those from Islamic countries; e.g.

http://www.freemalaysiatoday.com/category/nation/2013/07/16/no-visa-privilege-for-foreign-muslim-nationals/

As you say sovereign countries have the right to decide who can enter their territory or not. However, the UN Convention for Refugees with the 1967 Protocol is important as it provides standards for the handling and resettlement process for refugees.

Edited September 20, 2015 by simple1

[duckmandon]

Well that doesn't really fill the whole picture, but I think it paints enough to get its point accross. My feelings on the offshore processing of refugees by Australia to be a shameful act, and quite embarrassing. While it is a burden on the taxpayers of Australia and some complain about integration issues, for genuine refugees, I think collectively Australia can handle it. As for economic refugees, there is some merit to their case, but not so much, especially with out far beyond their home they go.

Sad all the same, we are all humans, but running and trying to claim an upgrade seems like a bit of a a cop out. conflicting indeed.

People don't look at the big picture. Australia is a great country, a land of oportunity, but we lack the ability to take thousands upon thousands of so called refugees. Australia has high unemployment & we have a social system that the few that work are paying for the many on welfare. Add to that thousands of refugees & you have problems being able to afford the ongoing costs. We have all heard of the refigees turning up in designer clothes with gold jewelery & mobile phones. Once again these so called refugees are taking advantage of refugee status. They have no identification & say they are persecuted in their own country. With the world being battered by terrorism would you honestly let anyone into your country without proper clearance. Alot of the the current refugees being processed in Australia are being accommodated in hotels/motels & are given allowances to live. They are getting more than the poor, yes poor families in Australia who are struggling to make ends meet. Is it not the duty of any governement to look after their own citizens first. It may be a harsh statement but send them back from where they came & if they do wish to come to Australia do it like normal immigrants & go through the sysytem and apply for a visa. Then come to Australia & get a job to support your family, not just rely on welfare like many do.

[steven100]

Australia have a bad record and under Abbot's government I was deeply cynical about the P.R about refugees!

Australia has a quota of some thousands of migrants/refugees each year. These people will arrive legally, and not sneaking in through the back door by hulks from Indonesia.

Over and above this annual quota, 12,000 refugees from the current crisis will be moving to Australia before Christmas.

I agree that the debacle over Cambodia must be causing a few red faces in Canberra, but the program has stopped people risking life and limb to get to Oz illegally.

correct ....... the Cambodian setup is costly based on numbers of refugees there, but this will change and it won't be as costly as paying million of $$ year after year keeping boat families in Australia.

The off-shore processing has scared most illegal immigrants and it has stopped the boats.

[springheeled jack]

the world is in a mess millions of refugees trying to find a safe haven are being turned back by countries big enough to take them in a really sad state of affairs, Australia should stop passing the buck and give these refugees a place to live .

[AlexRRR]

US destabilisation of the. Middle East and mind you they hell bent on Iran and North Korea too I suggest we take up a collection buy some boats fill them full of refuges and send them towards Hawaii San Francisco and LA, since they started the problem let them take care off the mess.

[masuk]

the world is in a mess millions of refugees trying to find a safe haven are being turned back by countries big enough to take them in a really sad state of affairs, Australia should stop passing the buck and give these refugees a place to live .

Well, in defence of the present migrant and refugee system, I think Australia is being more than fair with the numbers it's taking in.

The Oz population is still below 22million, and will take in an EXTRA 12,000 refugees before Christmas. The USA population is currently 319 million, but I haven't seen the proposed refugee intake as yet. Pro-rata it would be 174,000. !

With regard to the illegal 'boat people' who arrived before the present halt, many 'economic refugees' have been returned to their home countries, according to newspaper reports.

[tookwan cottage]

As the posts mount up on this subject...one thing is for sure.

Australians have had enough of every bastard wiping their backside with us...

We have learnt the pitfalls of this scam of "Refugees". Lets see which country other than Hungry wakes up and sees the light.

Readers of this Topic should take note of Australian sentiment thats growing daily....why?...think about it. Your country will be saying the same thing in the near future if you dont put a stop to this rort....and thats what it is ...a RORT!

You know what is a rort? The fact that taxpayers might have contributed to your education, and your lame diction, spelling, and grammar is the result. You may have material wealth, but your cognition is compromised.

Edited September 20, 2015 by tookwan cottage

[tookwan cottage]

Well that doesn't really fill the whole picture, but I think it paints enough to get its point accross. My feelings on the offshore processing of refugees by Australia to be a shameful act, and quite embarrassing. While it is a burden on the taxpayers of Australia and some complain about integration issues, for genuine refugees, I think collectively Australia can handle it. As for economic refugees, there is some merit to their case, but not so much, especially with out far beyond their home they go.

Sad all the same, we are all humans, but running and trying to claim an upgrade seems like a bit of a a cop out. conflicting indeed.

People don't look at the big picture. Australia is a great country, a land of oportunity, but we lack the ability to take thousands upon thousands of so called refugees. Australia has high unemployment & we have a social system that the few that work are paying for the many on welfare. Add to that thousands of refugees & you have problems being able to afford the ongoing costs. We have all heard of the refigees turning up in designer clothes with gold jewelery & mobile phones. Once again these so called refugees are taking advantage of refugee status. They have no identification & say they are persecuted in their own country. With the world being battered by terrorism would you honestly let anyone into your country without proper clearance. Alot of the the current refugees being processed in Australia are being accommodated in hotels/motels & are given allowances to live. They are getting more than the poor, yes poor families in Australia who are struggling to make ends meet. Is it not the duty of any governement to look after their own citizens first. It may be a harsh statement but send them back from where they came & if they do wish to come to Australia do it like normal immigrants & go through the sysytem and apply for a visa. Then come to Australia & get a job to support your family, not just rely on welfare like many do.

If the country is so "lacking" in this ability to accommodate refugees, then why do Australian businesses think nothing of exploiting slave-like labor conditions in Third World countries like those that the refugees are coming from? Given that Australia is a country of "mateship" and a "fair go," wouldn't it be respectful to not reap massive profits from the unethical practices in these countries if the country is not willing to help the people of such countries when they are in trouble? Given that these countries have allowed Australian businesses to reap massive windfalls, the least the country can do is show a mutual form of respect.

[Inepto Cracy]

Relocate them all in the Kalahari desert, in southern africa. This desert covers an area of 900,000 square kilometers. There they can build up their own Refugee land and be no burden on anybody. Failing that they can all go to the middle east. There they can enjoy the same culture, same religion, same food and the same way of dressing.

[simple1]

<snip>

They are getting more than the poor, yes poor families in Australia who are struggling to make ends meet.

assistance to refugees: fact v fiction

http://www.aph.gov.au/About_Parliament/Parliamentary_Departments/Parliamentary_Library/pubs/BN/2012-2013/AustGovAssistRefugees#_Toc336609242

[Doc46]

The only solution is that all countries close their borders for all invaders /refugees so they have to stay in their own country or go to a country with same Religion/Race...WHY do have other countries have to put up with their bullshit and cost to their country people,There are enough Poor troubled people in all countries without taking away money from them and waste it to the invaders ,the invaders ,(PROVEN in Australia) get more money and Benefits than the poor in their own country,,,,Why? What the Fac is more imported,their own poor people or some space invader? Grow up, Stuff all the do gooders (they don't pay for anything) and stupid governments and look after your own people.

Edited September 20, 2015 by Doc46

[Inepto Cracy]

Coming from Africa, I have personally had enough of working with "Refugees". In Botswana, there is a 7 year old boy, who was born with deformities to his arms and legs.

His dad got him a rickety bicycle to ride 14 miles to school and back, every day.

It is pitiful to see this poor kid battle everyday riding this bike.

However if you would like to help this kid and others like him, please send me $5.00 and I will . . . send you the video of him.

[spidermike007]

The only solution is that all countries close their borders for all invaders /refugees so they have to stay in their own country or go to a country with same Religion/Race...WHY do have other countries have to put up with their bullshit and cost to their country people,There are enough Poor troubled people in all countries without taking away money from them and waste it to the invaders ,the invaders ,(PROVEN in Australia) get more money and Benefits than the poor in their own country,,,,Why? What the Fac is more imported,their own poor people or some space invader? Grow up, Stuff all the do gooders (they don't pay for anything) and stupid governments and look after your own people.

You are obviously a man of great understanding, compassion, empathy and charity. What are we, if not a race they aids others in distress?

[meltingpot2015]

Relocate them all in the Kalahari desert, in southern africa. This desert covers an area of 900,000 square kilometers. There they can build up their own Refugee land and be no burden on anybody. Failing that they can all go to the middle east. There they can enjoy the same culture, same religion, same food and the same way of dressing.

If only the Aborigines said the same to those arriving by boat long ago.

[Inepto Cracy]

If 30 Australians drowned in Sydney Harbour, it would be a national tragedy.

BUT when 30 or more refugees drown off the Australian coast, it becomes a political question.

Quoted by Richard Flanagan

[Doc46]

As the posts mount up on this subject...one thing is for sure.

Australians have had enough of every bastard wiping their backside with us...

We have learnt the pitfalls of this scam of "Refugees". Lets see which country other than Hungry wakes up and sees the light.

Readers of this Topic should take note of Australian sentiment thats growing daily....why?...think about it. Your country will be saying the same thing in the near future if you dont put a stop to this rort....and thats what it is ...a RORT!

You know what is a rort? The fact that taxpayers might have contributed to your education, and your lame diction, spelling, and grammar is the result. You may have material wealth, but your cognition is compromised.

What the fac has Weegees cognition to do with your that stupid remark from you Stick to the Fact (RORT) NOT cognition

[jamiesilver]

Perfect location to send refugees, with just a couple of bribes they will be sitting on a beach in Thailand in no time.

[soomak]

As for the current situation in Europe ......................................how many MUSLIM countries are accepting any of these refugees ????

Any countries in the Middle East accepting any????

Any predominantly Muslim countries in South East Asia accepting any ?????

Actually yes.

There are about four million Syrian refugees, spread throughout Lebanon, Jordan, Egypt and Turkey.

Non in SEA as far as I know.

[tookwan cottage]

As the posts mount up on this subject...one thing is for sure.

Australians have had enough of every bastard wiping their backside with us...

We have learnt the pitfalls of this scam of "Refugees". Lets see which country other than Hungry wakes up and sees the light.

Readers of this Topic should take note of Australian sentiment thats growing daily....why?...think about it. Your country will be saying the same thing in the near future if you dont put a stop to this rort....and thats what it is ...a RORT!

You know what is a rort? The fact that taxpayers might have contributed to your education, and your lame diction, spelling, and grammar is the result. You may have material wealth, but your cognition is compromised.

What the fac has Weegees cognition to do with your that stupid remark from you Stick to the Fact (RORT) NOT cognition

Although, it is heartening to see compassion from another with the same cognitive deficiency. Best of luck to you both.

[AlexRRR]

Really pains me to see here the guys who have no sympathy for refugees, and I'm talking real refugees, all they worry about is there tax dollars the seemingly free ride they get...

The welfare system in AU isn't as generous as it seems, just ask a pensioner, if you wanna get angry at someone get angry with who starts all the crap, no uproar when US and Aussie troops go in to disrupt a nation or two then pull out and leave a god dam mess like we have now, IS would NEVER got a foot hold if Saddam Hussain was still president of Iraq, time some of you narrow sighted guy look beyond the tip of your nose and wake up to what's really going on in the world.

[meltingpot2015]

If only all multi-national corporations paid the corporation taxes they owe and not look for loopholes.

If only, all those serving them, not just rely on rhetoric, but are actually persuasive enough.