Immigration Promenada One Stop Service 2016-2017

[NancyL]

1 hour ago, hml367 said:

It sounds like you are really important to Immigration, NancyL. I find that amazing.

 

You would be a cause of heartache, also, to the people in the visa forum and thread about people being upset with the use of "visa extension" versus "permission to stay".

 

The powers-that-be at Imm. were feeding info to the Foreign Consul Corp and Embassies in Bangkok about what was going on there that was false, back in the days when we waited at Imm. Prom with the goats.  Still are to some extent.  That's why it's important to provide detailed reports like Eyecatcher's since they don't want people coming to "observe" and send emails to the Consular Corp.

 

Actually, I found the conditions to be OK yesterday, but for the life of me I wonder why they still haven't addressed some basics, really almost human rights issues that border on elder abuse, like having the lights on outside the Imm. office on during the early morning hours and having a "queue number being served" display board so people (perhaps hearing impaired) don't have to hang around trying to divine what queue number is being announced on their karaoke speaker system.

 

As for my sloppy use of the term "visa extension" vs. "extension of permission to stay" -- well perhaps you should notify UbonJoe and suggest he ban me from posting in the Visa forum until I I submit a document that shows I've typed "I will always refer to the annual madness at CM Imm as "extension of permission to stay" and not a "visa extension" 500 times."  At least I didn't call it "visa renewal"

"

 

[hml367]

NancyL,

 

Since I can't split a LIKE, I will give a LIKE to your last paragraph. Maybe you haven't seen the thread I referred to..... to much ego from some posters.

 

I don't "agree", with the other parts, but I don't want to belabor (sp.?) the points.

[hml367]

7 hours ago, NancyL said:

 

The powers-that-be at Imm. were feeding info to the Foreign Consul Corp and Embassies in Bangkok about what was going on there that was false, back in the days when we waited at Imm. Prom with the goats.  Still are to some extent.  That's why it's important to provide detailed reports like Eyecatcher's since they don't want people coming to "observe" and send emails to the Consular Corp.

 

Actually, I found the conditions to be OK yesterday, but for the life of me I wonder why they still haven't addressed some basics, really almost human rights issues that border on elder abuse, like having the lights on outside the Imm. office on during the early morning hours and having a "queue number being served" display board so people (perhaps hearing impaired) don't have to hang around trying to divine what queue number is being announced on their karaoke speaker system.

 

As for my sloppy use of the term "visa extension" vs. "extension of permission to stay" -- well perhaps you should notify UbonJoe and suggest he ban me from posting in the Visa forum until I I submit a document that shows I've typed "I will always refer to the annual madness at CM Imm as "extension of permission to stay" and not a "visa extension" 500 times."  At least I didn't call it "visa renewal"

"

 

To be very clear about the visa terminology on another forum thread, NancyL, I am one of the bad people saying that others should not get so wound up about what term some people use when they are asking questions.  As long as the people in the conversation know what each other is referring to, there is no need to admonish someone for using a different term.  Just politely tell them the correct term then answer their question were the points of my comments in that forum thread. I hope you are not taking offense at my sarcasm.  Even you use sarcasm at times. 

[ubonjoe]

A post that was a personal attack and a reply to it has been removed. A repeat of it will result in a formal warning.

[Lizard2010]

17 hours ago, hml367 said:

To be very clear about the visa terminology on another forum thread, NancyL, I am one of the bad people saying that others should not get so wound up about what term some people use when they are asking questions.  As long as the people in the conversation know what each other is referring to, there is no need to admonish someone for using a different term.  Just politely tell them the correct term then answer their question were the points of my comments in that forum thread. I hope you are not taking offense at my sarcasm.  Even you use sarcasm at times. 

I spoke to an Australian couple a while ago

They told me that a captain who came up from Bangkok Immigration to see what was actually going on

He saw them another time to see what had changed

I hear 2 lieutenants were removed form a position

Plus when i was at Immigration last Friday doing immigration stuff

iI was no too Busy

I many woman working the desks

So hings have changed

Not always for the best

Chiang Mai Immigration has a long way to go to be as proficient as any other in Thailand

Plus knocking Nancy for doing the job she was asked to do

 

Because No Embassy Or Consulate Can not Visit for any other purpose than to have an apointmant

because they did not want any political problems

Well this is my Australian Opinion

Others may differ But i am entitles to my opinion  plus i see most of the negative posters

Hopefully 2017 will be a better year at Immigration

IMHO

[hml367]

16 minutes ago, Lizard2010 said:

I spoke to an Australian couple a while ago

They told me that a captain who came up from Bangkok Immigration to see what was actually going on

He saw them another time to see what had changed

I hear 2 lieutenants were removed form a position

Plus when i was at Immigration last Friday doing immigration stuff

iI was no too Busy

I many woman working the desks

So hings have changed

Not always for the best

Chiang Mai Immigration has a long way to go to be as proficient as any other in Thailand

Plus knocking Nancy for doing the job she was asked to do

 

Because No Embassy Or Consulate Can not Visit for any other purpose than to have an apointmant

because they did not want any political problems

Well this is my Australian Opinion

Others may differ But i am entitles to my opinion  plus i see most of the negative posters

Hopefully 2017 will be a better year at Immigration

IMHO

 

What does any of that have to do with my post that you are quoting? And why are you answering for a clarification I sent for NancyL?

 

Also, for your information regarding my interaction with Immigration in Chiang Mai, nothing is better.  It was much better before people started trying to fix things around 2004. 

Edited December 30, 2016 by hml367

[NancyL]

2 hours ago, hml367 said:

 

What does any of that have to do with my post that you are quoting? And why are you answering for a clarification I sent for NancyL?

 

Also, for your information regarding my interaction with Immigration in Chiang Mai, nothing is better.  It was much better before people started trying to fix things around 2004. 

 

To say the problems developed because "people started to try to fix things" is just plain ludicrous.  

 

Your memory of 2004 was about the time that Chiang Mai became a popular destination for foreign retirement.  Until recently, CM Imm was using the same office and the same management techniques to handle a group of retirees that had increased substantially since 2004. Yes, I remember what it was like in 2006 when a real, actual Immigration officer would take the time to patiently explain the process of converting a visa-exempt entry to a long-term permission to stay to any newbie retiree who darkened their door.  Those days are long gone.  The Imm. manpower hasn't increased with the rising expat population.  Queues developed and the Imm. officers just didn't have the time to give personalized attention to every customer.  

 

Visa agents came on the scene and Imm. realized they could take up some of the workload and, frankly, Imm. doesn't have the incentive to fix problems related to management of workflow, poor IT systems, scheduling, etc when they benefit from the presence of the visa agents in so many ways.  Better to keep the "retail customers" in a state of chaos, so as to drive them to using visa agents.   

 

This is not the situation in other provinces for retirees.  No one had to "try to fix things" there.  Retirees have ease of access in Phuket and Pattaya.  Why not in Chiang Mai.  To blame those who have tried to improve conditions in this province is just plain wrong and irresponsible.

[hml367]

I don't agree with you, NancyL.

 

I also think you have a narrow and self serving view in the whole atmosphere.

 

I'm not trying to change your mind.... Impossible.

 

There are a lot more foreigners in Chiang Mai than you come into contact with.

 

As I posted, not one thing at Chiang Mai Immigration is better for me because of anything you have done. Quite the contrary in my opinion.

 

 

 

[NancyL]

2 hours ago, Lizard2010 said:

I spoke to an Australian couple a while ago

They told me that a captain who came up from Bangkok Immigration to see what was actually going on

He saw them another time to see what had changed

I hear 2 lieutenants were removed form a position

Plus when i was at Immigration last Friday doing immigration stuff

iI was no too Busy

I many woman working the desks

So hings have changed

Not always for the best

Chiang Mai Immigration has a long way to go to be as proficient as any other in Thailand

Plus knocking Nancy for doing the job she was asked to do

 

Because No Embassy Or Consulate Can not Visit for any other purpose than to have an apointmant

because they did not want any political problems

Well this is my Australian Opinion

Others may differ But i am entitles to my opinion  plus i see most of the negative posters

Hopefully 2017 will be a better year at Immigration

IMHO

 

Thank you Lizard2010, you're right.  The foreign Consuls or Embassy reps can't make unannounced visits at Imm. to see what's going on.  They have to have an appointment and, of course they're escorted about.  So, when their nationals complain about the conditions at CM Imm. and they want to "investigate", they're shown a very sanitized version.  Appointment at 11 am, quick run around the place, lunch at Duke's, all is good.  If they even see G4T, what they'll see is a shop on the second floor that has display cases left over from the previous tenants -- a musical instrument company.  Still have the brand names of the musical instruments on the display cases.  Nothing about the real services offered by G4T.  I wonder if they bring out a few guitars and ukuleles and put them in the display cases when the Embassy people turn up?  Perhaps tell 'em G4T stands for "Guitars for Thousands"  Don't know.

 

So, to get the "real story" on what was happening at Imm. Prom., some of the foreign consuls had asked me to monitor what was going on and keep the pulse on the members of CEC, monitor ThaiVisa, that sort of thing.  The foreign consuls don't like to see their people jerked around, but if they don't get first hand accounts, with actionable numbers like I was reporting, there's little they can do.

 

Case in point -- they were told that Imm. Prom is processing 30 or more retirement extensions a day at a time when they were only distributing 20 queue tickets and turning away people who had arrived as early as 5:30 am only to find they were No. 21.  What Imm. was doing, was counting the customers from G4T, who don't have to wait in the early morning queue and those aren't part of that 20 allotment, in making their report to the foreign consuls about how many retirement extensions they were processing.  The foreign consuls didn't know to ask "just the right question" i.e. how many queue tickets do you distribute each morning?, not how retirement extensions do you process each day.  Why is this point important?  It shows that the "real demand" is for retirement extensions and just how customers weren't being served and were being pushed over to G4T.  Imm. really should have been distributing 30 tickets and not artificially restricting supply to create demand for G4T.

 

[Thailand]

9 minutes ago, NancyL said:

 

This is driving me poty! 

[hml367]

Hopefully, tomorrow night can help, Thailand.... For me, I am the designated driver.

 

 

 

[NancyL]

52 minutes ago, hml367 said:

I don't agree with you, NancyL.

 

I also think you have a narrow and self serving view in the whole atmosphere.

 

I'm not trying to change your mind.... Impossible.

 

There are a lot more foreigners in Chiang Mai than you come into contact with.

 

As I posted, not one thing at Chiang Mai Immigration is better for me because of anything you have done. Quite the contrary in my opinion.

 

 

 

 

I'll agree that I have a "narrow" view in that I want the service levels for Chiang Mai's foreign retirees to be on par with what retirees experience in other Thai provinces.  After all, I'm president of CEC, largely a group of retirees.  I agree that I don't come into contact with every foreigner in Chiang Mai. I have little knowledge of the service levels other expat groups, like volunteers, teachers, business people, etc experience, but I am told it isn't on par with other provinces either.  

 

I fail to see how I am "self serving" in a monetary sense.  Sometime, you and a few other "anti-Nancy" posters act as if I pesonally make money from my activities here in Chiang Mai.  Quite the opposite in fact.

 

But this statement of yours has me mystified "As I posted, not one thing at Chiang Mai Immigration is better for me because of anything you have done. Quite the contrary in my opinion"  What have I done at CM Imm. that has made your situation worse?

 

 

[hml367]

I didn't mention anything about money. You are twisting the story as you have twisted other things in tha past, even going so far as accusing ne of teying to nake trouble. When I showed the post showing exactly what I said, you tried to give a readon instead of reading what I actually said in my post.

 

In answer to your question of what you may have done to make things difficult, you continually try to use Western tactics to change Asian ways.

 

But enough wasted posts. I don't agree with some of your thinking and I offer my reasons. Nothing more tgan that. TV readers can, hopefully, see different opinions and make their own minds up. 

 

You once offered something about Chiang Mai Immigration and the consuls/embassies which you indicated was a result of your actions. I contacted the US Embassy and their reply did not support your claims.

[hml367]

As I said, NancyL, enough bickering. Just please do not continue to refute my posts without something to back it up. I check before making my posts, as you are well aware.

[Touch wood]

3 hours ago, Thailand said:

This is driving me poty! 

Crazy crazy crazy place you have to be crazy to put up with it all.

 

[Touch wood]

4 hours ago, NancyL said:

 

To say the problems developed because "people started to try to fix things" is just plain ludicrous.  

 

Your memory of 2004 was about the time that Chiang Mai became a popular destination for foreign retirement.  Until recently, CM Imm was using the same office and the same management techniques to handle a group of retirees that had increased substantially since 2004. Yes, I remember what it was like in 2006 when a real, actual Immigration officer would take the time to patiently explain the process of converting a visa-exempt entry to a long-term permission to stay to any newbie retiree who darkened their door.  Those days are long gone.  The Imm. manpower hasn't increased with the rising expat population.  Queues developed and the Imm. officers just didn't have the time to give personalized attention to every customer.  

 

Visa agents came on the scene and Imm. realized they could take up some of the workload and, frankly, Imm. doesn't have the incentive to fix problems related to management of workflow, poor IT systems, scheduling, etc when they benefit from the presence of the visa agents in so many ways.  Better to keep the "retail customers" in a state of chaos, so as to drive them to using visa agents.   

 

This is not the situation in other provinces for retirees.  No one had to "try to fix things" there.  Retirees have ease of access in Phuket and Pattaya.  Why not in Chiang Mai.  To blame those who have tried to improve conditions in this province is just plain wrong and irresponsible.

Its all political. You have no idea.

[JimGant]

Quote

What have I done at CM Imm. that has made your situation worse?

 

Indeed, hml, how have Nancy's efforts to call attention to CM Immigration's "inefficiencies" caused you problems? It's so obvious that Immigration's only incentive is to drive customers to agents, from whom they get a piece of the pie. Nancy, calling attention to this, certainly has irritated Immigration -- and may, in fact, have worried someone in charge enough to preclude one more step into insane ineptness at Immigration. But her efforts certainly couldn't have caused you additional heartburn at Immigration.

 

No, I applaud Nancy's efforts -- but I -- in my older age -- submit to realpolitik, not idealism. So, I think Nancy's efforts are in vain. (But I wish her well in those efforts.)

 

Meanwhile, I'm content to play the Asian corruption game, knowing full well I became subject to the rice bowl mentality of greased palms when I moved to Thailand. Sorry for those who can't afford an agent (but not sure I really want them for a neighbor). And for those who can afford an agent, but remain intent to address the system on their own -- good luck. But remember where you are before you begin to whine too loudly.

[NancyL]

13 hours ago, hml367 said:

 

NancyL,

 

You were using Chiang Mai Immigration in 2006?

Yes, we relocated to Chiang Mai in 2008 but came here for a month in 2006 to investigate.  This is well documented and you, as one of my stalkers should know this.

[Touch wood]

12 hours ago, JimGant said:

 

Indeed, hml, how have Nancy's efforts to call attention to CM Immigration's "inefficiencies" caused you problems? It's so obvious that Immigration's only incentive is to drive customers to agents, from whom they get a piece of the pie. Nancy, calling attention to this, certainly has irritated Immigration -- and may, in fact, have worried someone in charge enough to preclude one more step into insane ineptness at Immigration. But her efforts certainly couldn't have caused you additional heartburn at Immigration.

 

No, I applaud Nancy's efforts -- but I -- in my older age -- submit to realpolitik, not idealism. So, I think Nancy's efforts are in vain. (But I wish her well in those efforts.)

 

Meanwhile, I'm content to play the Asian corruption game, knowing full well I became subject to the rice bowl mentality of greased palms when I moved to Thailand. Sorry for those who can't afford an agent (but not sure I really want them for a neighbor). And for those who can afford an agent, but remain intent to address the system on their own -- good luck. But remember where you are before you begin to whine too loudly.

13 hours ago, JimGant said:

 

Indeed, hml, how have Nancy's efforts to call attention to CM Immigration's "inefficiencies" caused you problems? It's so obvious that Immigration's only incentive is to drive customers to agents, from whom they get a piece of the pie. Nancy, calling attention to this, certainly has irritated Immigration -- and may, in fact, have worried someone in charge enough to preclude one more step into insane ineptness at Immigration. But her efforts certainly couldn't have caused you additional heartburn at Immigration.

 

No, I applaud Nancy's efforts -- but I -- in my older age -- submit to realpolitik, not idealism. So, I think Nancy's efforts are in vain. (But I wish her well in those efforts.)

 

Meanwhile, I'm content to play the Asian corruption game, knowing full well I became subject to the rice bowl mentality of greased palms when I moved to Thailand. Sorry for those who can't afford an agent (but not sure I really want them for a neighbor). And for those who can afford an agent, but remain intent to address the system on their own -- good luck. But remember where you are before you begin to whine too loudly.

Grow up all Aliens efforts are in vain that includes the highest leaders of your countries, it goes in one ear and out the other, you're wasting your time.

Bangkok does not want’s you to spend your 7%vet money in CM and they are doing a very good job of turning you guys away from CM.

[scottiejohn]

On ‎30‎/‎12‎/‎2016 at 4:26 PM, NancyL said:

It was much better before people started trying to fix things around 2004

I have just added the one quote above as I am interested as to why that year/fact(?) was chosen! There are many other comment above of which I just do not understand the relevance.

 

Anyway a few observations of my own. 'Agents' being used at immigration was happening in 2000! They were just called lawyers then.

 

Is anyone seriously saying that the facilities etc at Promenada (apart from location) are worse than the old airport facilities (or  lack thereof).   

 

We do not know for sure if Nancy L has had any influence in the change of location etc and made it any better.  I cannot see any evidence that she has made it any worse.

 

I commend Nancy for at least trying to help. 

 

Why snipe at her. What are you negative people doing to attempt to improve the system.

Edited December 31, 2016 by scottiejohn

[Sparkles]

17 minutes ago, scottiejohn said:

I have just added the one quote above as I am interested as to why that year/fact(?) was chosen! There are many other comment above of which I just do not understand the relevance.

 

Anyway a few observations of my own. 'Agents' being used at immigration was happening in 2000! They were just called lawyers then.

 

Is anyone seriously saying that the facilities etc at Promenada (apart from location) are worse than the old airport facilities (or  lack thereof).   

 

We do not know for sure if Nancy L has had any influence in the change of location etc and made it any better.  I cannot see any evidence that she has made it any worse.

 

I commend Nancy for at least trying to help. 

 

Why snipe at her. What are you negative people doing to attempt to improve the system.

The negative Nancy L stalkers are not doing anything and  never will but its a popular pastime, for a minority, here on TV.

[Touch wood]

44 minutes ago, Sparkles said:

The negative Nancy L stalkers are not doing anything and  never will but its a popular pastime, for a minority, here on TV.

Improve the system or change the system, grow up how big is your army?, You will need a very big army to change it to suit your idea of how people from your country should be treated in Thailand  .

[evenstevens]

4 hours ago, Sparkles said:

The negative Nancy L stalkers are not doing anything and  never will but its a popular pastime, for a minority, here on TV.

 

how can any member be called a Stalker, when, who ever posts. (including E/S) say on this thread . IS OPEN  ,  for any

members to reply with their opinions

otherwise ,no forum, anywhere would exist,!!

and moderators are in place to  adjudicate,who is a fair dinkum  stalker or not, leave it up to them  to decide

back on topic

due to  many reasons,within the next week  or so E/S  is paying a visit to Promenada G4T visa agency,to  possibly to carry out my  future visa applications etc etc

will endeavour to  to start a thread of my experiences there,  and  it is open to all   my stalkers (LOL)

 almost  new year, do sincerely hope  to all ,it will be a happy and above all a healthy one

E/S is off to the land of nod, giddy up!!!

 

 

 

Edited December 31, 2016 by evenstevens

[Scott]

Personal remarks directed at other members is called stalking and is not permitted.   Stay on topic or face a suspension.   

 

 

[scottiejohn]

12 hours ago, evenstevens said:

 

how can any member be called a Stalker, when, who ever posts. (including E/S) say on this thread . IS OPEN  ,  for any

members to reply with their opinions

otherwise ,no forum, anywhere would exist,!!

and moderators are in place to  adjudicate,who is a fair dinkum  stalker or not, leave it up to them  to decide

back on topic

due to  many reasons,within the next week  or so E/S  is paying a visit to Promenada G4T visa agency,to  possibly to carry out my  future visa applications etc etc

will endeavour to  to start a thread of my experiences there,  and  it is open to all   my stalkers (LOL)

 almost  new year, do sincerely hope  to all ,it will be a happy and above all a healthy one

E/S is off to the land of nod, giddy up!!!

 

 

 

Hi E/S

Any reason for the change in agency or are you just doing it to give another filly a chance down the gallop.  You have said you will do a thread on the experience, will it be in the same format as your last outing?

[evenstevens]

21 hours ago, scottiejohn said:

Hi E/S

Any reason for the change in agency or are you just doing it to give another filly a chance down the gallop.  You have said you will do a thread on the experience, will it be in the same format as your last outing?

 

there are are several reasons,but largely due to their office location  slap bang in the middle of Nimmihedin,with no parking facilities whats so ever,  residing in Beverly Hills Maerim ,on most occasions its a nightmare to reach their office(traffic chaos),where,s Promenada Immgr  Dept  and facilities, of G4T  appear to me, a easier route to drive to

a  minor  addition to the above,my  super duper visa agent, has just gave me a quote of three thousand baht,to t/f my current visas to my new passport,which would have been done with my impending 90 day report,find that a high price tag,but certainly can be corrected,if any member can give a heads up on this price tag

will give a nuts and bolts on how things  pan out,on a new thread, appologies if this is a off topic post

its a Lulu good morning to all

[Thailand]

Download the form from Immigration.go.th, I believe what used to be free is now 1900baht for transferring the stamps from an old passport to a new passport. 

You can do it when you do your ninety days, that is definitely free.

[EricTh]

On 12/29/2016 at 10:39 AM, NancyL said:

 

 

Hubby and I returned late last week from a trip to Malaysia where, among other things, we investigated the "Malaysia My Second Home" 10 year visa.  So, we needed to update our TM30s.  Our condo office tried several times.  Finally, we got   

 

So how was your investigation?

 

I don't think Malaysia needs the foreign retirees to report very 90 days, do they?

 

Do you see any people queuing up at ungodly hours for the retirement queue in Malaysia?

 

[balo]

I already gave up on CM immigration , I still have an address I use in Pattaya/Jomtien so I went into imm. office in Jomtien during my Christmas visit and sorted my 1 year visa there in 20 minutes before I went back to CM .  If I have to pay 1600 baht fine for not reporting then be it. I don't care. 

 

 

 

Edited January 2, 2017 by balo

[NancyL]

10 hours ago, xng said:

 

So how was your investigation?

 

I don't think Malaysia needs the foreign retirees to report very 90 days, do they?

 

Do you see any people queuing up at ungodly hours for the retirement queue in Malaysia?

 

 

That's absolutely correct.  No need for reporting or queueing.  In fact, most of the application process is done by post, it seems.   Foreigners can own a primary residence -- house AND land in their own name.  They can either import a car duty free or purchase one tax & duty free during their first six months.  You can volunteer without the need for a work permit and work at a paying job up so many hours per month, depending on your age.

 

But, you have to maintain a bank balance in the country at all times -- none of this bit about just having it "season" for a few months ahead of annual "renewal".  AND you have to show monthly income from abroad.  Plus, you have to have medical insurance cover.  So, the financial requirements are higher than Thailand's and it doesn't look like there is room to "play games" like applicants can in Thailand.  Plus, if you apply for the MM2H visa in the two states in Borneo, where we looked, the financial requirements are a little higher AND you need several local references.  Interestingly, those two states even restrict that ability of people from western Malaysia to come work there.

 

All-in-all it's a very well thought-out program, intended for people who plan ahead and aren't living on the edge financially.  You don't have to be rich to utilize this visa program, but certainly not someone who is just scraping by.  It appears as if you're treated with respect by the people in gov't tasked with enforcement of the program, too.