Phuket hoteliers petition against 92,000 illegal hotel rooms

[webfact]

Phuket hoteliers petition against 92,000 illegal hotel rooms
Darawan Naknakhon


Global online booking giant Agoda currently touts that it accepts bookings for 2,381 accommodation establishments in Phuket. Image: Website screenshot

PHUKET: -- Dr Kritsada Tonsakul, who heads the Phuket-based Southern Thailand chapter of the Thai Hotels Association, today (Dec 28) led a delegation of tourism and hospitality leaders in filing a petition calling for the government to take action against an estimated 92,000 illegal hotel rooms in Phuket.

Dr Krisada handed the petition in person to Phuket Vice Governor Dr Prajied Aksornthammakul, Phuket Provincial Hall.

“About 70 per cent of the hotels in Phuket are illegal,” Dr Kritsada said. “Almost all of them offer daily-rate accommodation. Some have applied to register, but others have not.”

“If they do not register their own businesses, that will have negative consequence in several ways, especially the economic effect on the general tourism industry of three and four-star hotels.

Full story: http://www.thephuketnews.com/phuket-hoteliers-petition-against-92-000-illegal-hotel-rooms-55605.php


-- Phuket News 2015-12-29

[Chang_paarp]

The downturn starting to bite?

Agoda lists guest houses as hotels, maybe the THA should be complaining to Agoda for not giving them priority listing over the lowly guest houses.

[z42]

So the expensive hotels are whinging because people want to stay in cheaper rooms.

It's called competition. Deal with it or actually try to compete

[frankphuket]

Not quite sure why some here are looking down at this? Completely agree with fair competition, but hotels which have not been registered, nor have they been legally approved by government should be penalized for the simple fact that they have not gone through the legalization process probably because they can't as they were either build wrongly, not obliging by building rules, etc. This means very often they lack a number of safety features in the building code.

Now, if i were a guests I would still be concerned about it...of course most of us won't even think about it, but when "shit hits the fan" well who they will blame, sure not that they paid less money?

It is not fair competition that some hotels or as indicated here a big part get away with doing things on the 'cheap' and lowering the standards of the hotel industry by not following rules and regulations, whereas other hotels spend a considerably amount of money doing so. Yes, it might affect rates, but come on, there must be some standards and rules which we must be able to rely on. Overall prices of hotels in Thailand are probably the cheapest in the world (except Peak season maybe).

[bearpolar]

So the expensive hotels are whinging because people want to stay in cheaper rooms.

It's called competition. Deal with it or actually try to compete

sad part is that nowadays a lot of hostels and mini hotels have much much nicer rooms than those shitty expensive hotels. 1500+ per night? Old, broken down and uncomfortable. 500b per night? Brand new expensive imported furniture, top of the line mattress(when you choose right)..

[GiantFan]

They should all be registered and pay the same fees as the rest per night to upkeep the island infrastructure (555). H&S issues, insurance for guests as well as paying their company income tax to support the local governments budget (555). These unregistered guesthouses / hotels / villa's should never have been allowed to mushroom to this level. I recall many years ago that the per night fee per guest that many hotels charged was not strictly enforced. So some hotels could decide by themselves not to pay. What a crazy island we live on.

[grumpyoldman]

[AJBangkok]

It sounds like the Phuket Hoteliers Association has just found a copy of the phuket taxi cooperative's operational guide book.

[trogers]

What are these illegal hotel rooms? Even guesthouses would be classified as a hotel requiring an appropriate license.

So, what are these 70% in actuality?

[madmitch]

What is the definition of an illegal hotel? I have no idea.

Our guesthouse is registered with the local municipality and we pay them for a licence to rent out rooms but we are not members of the Thai Hotels Association so are we legal or not?

Sounds to me that the big boys' profits are down and their way out of it is not to improve services or competitiveness but to wipe out the competition.

This has been mooted before but as far as I know nothing has ever happened so it'll probably fizzle out again.

[Roel]

Reminds me of the lady who owns a bunch of bus companies and asked to government to intervene and order airlines to increase prices for domestic flights. The cheap flights were so unfair.

Edited December 29, 2015 by Roel

[kmj]

Like you can really believe Agodas figures? There are currently 14 people looking at my resort at this very minute 555

Edited December 29, 2015 by kmj

[webfact]

70 per cent of Phuket hotel rooms illegal, say experts
Phuket Gazette


Phuket Vice Governor Prajiad Aksornthammakul addresses members of the Thai Hotels Association Southern Chapter. Photo: Kritsada Mueanhawong

PHUKET: -- More than 70 per cent of hotel and resort rooms in Phuket are illegal, a problem that is severely harming the industry, said experts in a complaint filed to the Phuket Governor this morning.

“According to our records, there are about 92,000 hotel rooms on the island. Of those, about 70 per cent are illegal,” said Kritsada Tansakul, director of the Thai Hotels Association Southern Chapter. “There are at least 200 hotel owners operating their businesses without the proper hotel licence.”

Mr Kritsada led a group of affected hoteliers and business owners to Phuket Provincial Hall to file a complaint to Phuket Governor Chamroen Tipayapongtada.

The letter was accepted on the Governor’s behalf by Phuket Vice Governor Prajiad Aksornthammakul.

Full story: http://www.phuketgazette.net/phuket-news/70-per-cent-Phuket-hotel-rooms-illegal/62749?desktopversion


-- Phuket Gazette 2015-12-29

[clockman]

The brown envelope syndrome!

[elgordo38]

The downturn starting to bite?

Agoda lists guest houses as hotels, maybe the THA should be complaining to Agoda for not giving them priority listing over the lowly guest houses.

What is wrong with one night accommodations????

[elgordo38]

Not quite sure why some here are looking down at this? Completely agree with fair competition, but hotels which have not been registered, nor have they been legally approved by government should be penalized for the simple fact that they have not gone through the legalization process probably because they can't as they were either build wrongly, not obliging by building rules, etc. This means very often they lack a number of safety features in the building code.

Now, if i were a guests I would still be concerned about it...of course most of us won't even think about it, but when "shit hits the fan" well who they will blame, sure not that they paid less money?

It is not fair competition that some hotels or as indicated here a big part get away with doing things on the 'cheap' and lowering the standards of the hotel industry by not following rules and regulations, whereas other hotels spend a considerably amount of money doing so. Yes, it might affect rates, but come on, there must be some standards and rules which we must be able to rely on. Overall prices of hotels in Thailand are probably the cheapest in the world (except Peak season maybe).

So they are Uber style lodgings. BnB clients are renting on a short term basis in our condo bldg. The world is changing travel included. Dinosaurs are falling left and right. Being on a small pension I am not a 5 star traveler and if I do travel which is rarely I shop for a bargain.

[elgordo38]

70 per cent of Phuket hotel rooms illegal, say experts

Phuket Gazette

Phuket Vice Governor Prajiad Aksornthammakul addresses members of the Thai Hotels Association Southern Chapter. Photo: Kritsada Mueanhawong

PHUKET: -- More than 70 per cent of hotel and resort rooms in Phuket are illegal, a problem that is severely harming the industry, said experts in a complaint filed to the Phuket Governor this morning.

According to our records, there are about 92,000 hotel rooms on the island. Of those, about 70 per cent are illegal, said Kritsada Tansakul, director of the Thai Hotels Association Southern Chapter. There are at least 200 hotel owners operating their businesses without the proper hotel licence.

Mr Kritsada led a group of affected hoteliers and business owners to Phuket Provincial Hall to file a complaint to Phuket Governor Chamroen Tipayapongtada.

The letter was accepted on the Governors behalf by Phuket Vice Governor Prajiad Aksornthammakul.

Full story: http://www.phuketgazette.net/phuket-news/70-per-cent-Phuket-hotel-rooms-illegal/62749?desktopversion

-- Phuket Gazette 2015-12-29

A sure sign that the Chinese are coming in increasing numbers. They want bargain basement accommodations.

[frankphuket]

Many people guessing and have no clue....well, well.

There are things you are supposed to have licenses for in order to operate....(ex: such as a driving license....well and here we go also, as many Thais don't have one). I don't think you would ever drive in Germany or other European countries without a license...and I would think nobody would disagree.

The same goes with businesses.. a lawyers office operating without a proper license...or any other business? fair to the others? Hardly?

A hotel is supposed to have a HOTEL LICENSE which is issued by the government and it is only issued if the hotel is following standards in terms of building, environmental studies, etc. A hotel not having a license of course does not mean that they don't follow those standards, but it means they have not been checked or accepted by the government.

It is not old vs new. 5 star vs 1,2,3 star. There are many hotels in the 2,3, 4 star category which have licenses and there are many hotels in the 5 star category which don't.

What the THA wants to point out and rightly so, is that the hotels which do not have applied for proper licenses should do so in terms of fairplay and it should be the government to check carefully, otherwise we have more and more hotels mushrooming without any control.

I am certain you can't just build a hotel in most of the countries in the world and open it and operate it without going through the process of getting the proper paperwork. So, why some here are putting this down is beyond me...get a grip on reality. I know in many ways Thailand is still "Wild West" and many of those who putting the THA motion down are actually also the ones probably complaining about it. I for one would love to see a bit more rules and regulations here and the enforcement of it....in my view it will give more civilization to the country.

[Jdietz]

Like you can really believe Agodas figures? There are currently 14 people looking at my resort at this very minute 555

Absolutely! There are 14 people that accessed the site in the last hour or so with search parameters that has your 'resort' included as well on page 154.

[simon43]

Deleted

Edited December 29, 2015 by simon43

[SOTIRIOS]

......then one wonders why foreigners 'bust their b*lls' trying to comply 'with the law'....and fail...time and again....but are deemed 'the guilty ones'....

.....just getting a work permit for a simple teaching job is a 50/50 proposition.....

...but again.....'all our fault'....jeez...!!!...

[DGS1244]

A very misleading headline, it is not that the rooms are 'illegal' it's the business that is illegal, they say. I would love to now what an 'illegal' room looks like!!!

[Doc46]

How long has this been going on and known by the government ,,, And they have closed their eyes and filled their pockets without closing them down and make them register or put them in jail?

[NamKangMan]

Many people guessing and have no clue....well, well.

There are things you are supposed to have licenses for in order to operate....(ex: such as a driving license....well and here we go also, as many Thais don't have one). I don't think you would ever drive in Germany or other European countries without a license...and I would think nobody would disagree.

The same goes with businesses.. a lawyers office operating without a proper license...or any other business? fair to the others? Hardly?

A hotel is supposed to have a HOTEL LICENSE which is issued by the government and it is only issued if the hotel is following standards in terms of building, environmental studies, etc. A hotel not having a license of course does not mean that they don't follow those standards, but it means they have not been checked or accepted by the government.

It is not old vs new. 5 star vs 1,2,3 star. There are many hotels in the 2,3, 4 star category which have licenses and there are many hotels in the 5 star category which don't.

What the THA wants to point out and rightly so, is that the hotels which do not have applied for proper licenses should do so in terms of fairplay and it should be the government to check carefully, otherwise we have more and more hotels mushrooming without any control.

I am certain you can't just build a hotel in most of the countries in the world and open it and operate it without going through the process of getting the proper paperwork. So, why some here are putting this down is beyond me...get a grip on reality. I know in many ways Thailand is still "Wild West" and many of those who putting the THA motion down are actually also the ones probably complaining about it. I for one would love to see a bit more rules and regulations here and the enforcement of it....in my view it will give more civilization to the country.

"I for one would love to see a bit more rules and regulations here and the enforcement of it....in my view it will give more civilization to the country." - Thailand, but in particular, Phuket, is too corrupt for proper enforcement, and therefore, to develop into a civilized nation.

It's just not the way it works here. Corruption is part of Thai culture.

The system is designed so those in power have something over those who do not, and therefore, they must pay to be in existence.

They have known about these unregistered hotels for years, yet, have done nothing about them. Why do you think that is?

[Colabamumbai]

So 200 owners have 64,000 rooms?????

[eisfeld]

So 200 owners have 64,000 rooms?????

Nobody claimed that. They said that 64,400 rooms are illegal and at least 200 hotel owners have no license. There could be owners with a license but some of the rooms are still illegal.

And btw why do the news articles always get basic facts wrong? First one claims 92k rooms illegal, second one about 64k.

[simon43]

As for the Thai Hotels Association, the word 'hotel' in their name clarifies is telling. It is an association for hotels, not for resorts or guesthouses.

Many years ago, I tried to join the THA but was rebuffed because my legally registered resort only had 10 guest rooms. According to the province definition, a hotel has to have more than 12 guest rooms, otherwise it is considered to be a guesthouse, (even if it has the word 'hotel' in its trading name).

So many legally-registered accommodation businesses do not qualify to join the THA, and are not illegal hotels, because they are not hotels anyway, according to the provincial definition.

Edited December 30, 2015 by simon43

[retarius]

Not quite sure why some here are looking down at this? Completely agree with fair competition, but hotels which have not been registered, nor have they been legally approved by government should be penalized for the simple fact that they have not gone through the legalization process probably because they can't as they were either build wrongly, not obliging by building rules, etc. This means very often they lack a number of safety features in the building code.

Now, if i were a guests I would still be concerned about it...of course most of us won't even think about it, but when "shit hits the fan" well who they will blame, sure not that they paid less money?

It is not fair competition that some hotels or as indicated here a big part get away with doing things on the 'cheap' and lowering the standards of the hotel industry by not following rules and regulations, whereas other hotels spend a considerably amount of money doing so. Yes, it might affect rates, but come on, there must be some standards and rules which we must be able to rely on. Overall prices of hotels in Thailand are probably the cheapest in the world (except Peak season maybe).

If you read the story the 'illegality' has nothing to do with shoddy building; the example cited is that they offer 'daily rates'. Now I am not in the hotel business but I am sure that having an advertised daily rate is good for customers who don;t want to book in advance and want the option to move. Seems like the competition is too hot for the big boys with their lack of transparency in pricing.

[frankphuket]

Not quite sure why some here are looking down at this? Completely agree with fair competition, but hotels which have not been registered, nor have they been legally approved by government should be penalized for the simple fact that they have not gone through the legalization process probably because they can't as they were either build wrongly, not obliging by building rules, etc. This means very often they lack a number of safety features in the building code.

Now, if i were a guests I would still be concerned about it...of course most of us won't even think about it, but when "shit hits the fan" well who they will blame, sure not that they paid less money?

It is not fair competition that some hotels or as indicated here a big part get away with doing things on the 'cheap' and lowering the standards of the hotel industry by not following rules and regulations, whereas other hotels spend a considerably amount of money doing so. Yes, it might affect rates, but come on, there must be some standards and rules which we must be able to rely on. Overall prices of hotels in Thailand are probably the cheapest in the world (except Peak season maybe).

If you read the story the 'illegality' has nothing to do with shoddy building; the example cited is that they offer 'daily rates'. Now I am not in the hotel business but I am sure that having an advertised daily rate is good for customers who don;t want to book in advance and want the option to move. Seems like the competition is too hot for the big boys with their lack of transparency in pricing.

Guys, transparency on pricing is not an issue at all, at least not in the past 10 years i would say with online agents showing daily rates, such as AGODA, EXPEDIA, Booking.com, etc.

You can find daily rates from top 5 star international hotels to 1 or 2 star guest houses.

The issue is the lack of execution of laws, of course the local government know who the culprits are, but choose to ignore for 'whatever reason'....

I agree the Phuket has still a long way to go, but it has come somehow further in the past 2 years due to the military government, just look at the taxi issue we had here since forever....solved nearly overnight...at least to a big part. So i guess we need to keep on pushing for 'right'.

[wabothai]

Close 70% of your hotel rooms and there will be a severe accomodation problem.

Why did they not start investigating and dealing with this years ago?

Where does the 70% come from anyhow? Hotelowners association?