Living in Thailand with no health insurance

[balo]

Thanks for clearing that up. He just went in for a yearly check-up. Nothing was wrong with him, but one test came back 'unusual' and it ended up becoming an issue.

All is good as it ended up being nothing but the part that he had to pay up in the end. I hope he gets paid but with all things in this Country, nothing is for certain. In a perfect world, they should have kept their word from the beginning but we are talking Insurance and nothing in that sector is a certain and that is what I am trying to say.

That explains it then . a regular check-up is normally not covered by the insurance , if he was not sick in the first place.

Also with my insurance company BUPA I have experienced they do cover it , but it's normal practice to pay first , keep a copy of the receipts and then claim it So I went to the nearest BUPA office with all my documents , they faxed it to the head office , after 2 weeks I got my money back , in my case 26000 baht -

[anto]

Thanks for clearing that up. He just went in for a yearly check-up. Nothing was wrong with him, but one test came back 'unusual' and it ended up becoming an issue.

All is good as it ended up being nothing but the part that he had to pay up in the end. I hope he gets paid but with all things in this Country, nothing is for certain. In a perfect world, they should have kept their word from the beginning but we are talking Insurance and nothing in that sector is a certain and that is what I am trying to say.

That explains it then . a regular check-up is normally not covered by the insurance , if he was not sick in the first place.

Also with my insurance company BUPA I have experienced they do cover it , but it's normal practice to pay first , keep a copy of the receipts and then claim it So I went to the nearest BUPA office with all my documents , they faxed it to the head office , after 2 weeks I got my money back , in my case 26000 baht -

Your premiums must be substantial for them to be able to do that and still make a profit .Also B26k for a check up seems rather excessive .

[JLCrab]

I have never censored anything. And I have said for maybe 90+ % of persons, they probably will NOT come out ahead if they buy insurance ... it's just that you never know whether you might be part of that less than 10% who do have some major outcome and that 5 mill even in Thailand could get chewed up real fast.

The only way you come out "well ahead" for not buying insurance is if you don't have any major medical event -- but maybe near 100% of those that DO have a major medical event thought it would never happen to them, either.

[Spaniel]

I'll be 72 in July. I just got my BUPA renewal notice, Emerald Plan, B 67,313. Upgrade to Diamond, B 83,775 and Platinum 1 will costs B 119,597. Still undecided which plan to choose but current plan expires on 26 May.

[watgate]

A previous poster stated that his wife told him that Thai Banks are notorious for offering personal accident plans but,if and when then a policy holder of one of these plans needed to make a claim, the policies failed to deliver what they were supposedly intended for. Thus the posters wife said many complaints have been made to a consumer protection agency in Thailand. I was wondering if anyone had any first hand knowledge of a personal accident plan offered by a Thai Bank and if they, or someone they knew ever made a claim against their policy and what was the end result. I would like to know if taking out a personal accident policy is an exercise in futility or is it a wise choice which can be utilized if the need arises.

[balo]

Thanks for clearing that up. He just went in for a yearly check-up. Nothing was wrong with him, but one test came back 'unusual' and it ended up becoming an issue.

All is good as it ended up being nothing but the part that he had to pay up in the end. I hope he gets paid but with all things in this Country, nothing is for certain. In a perfect world, they should have kept their word from the beginning but we are talking Insurance and nothing in that sector is a certain and that is what I am trying to say.

That explains it then . a regular check-up is normally not covered by the insurance , if he was not sick in the first place.

Also with my insurance company BUPA I have experienced they do cover it , but it's normal practice to pay first , keep a copy of the receipts and then claim it So I went to the nearest BUPA office with all my documents , they faxed it to the head office , after 2 weeks I got my money back , in my case 26000 baht -

Your premiums must be substantial for them to be able to do that and still make a profit .Also B26k for a check up seems rather excessive .

No this was not a check-up , I had MR scan done and did some tests . Before the procedure Bumrungrad called BUPA to check if they would agree to cover it, they did and the hospital gave me the claim forms from BUPA , I just had to pay first , no big deal really as long as they agreed. Back then I had a low premium , I paid 8000 baht per year.

Now the premium has gone up since I am over 50.

[Kwasaki]

... and , but for libel laws, the gent above based upon his own personal experiences with Bumrungrad Hospital, would be capable of providing the ENTIRE picture?

Not sure if you mean me, l wouldn't go Bumrungrad Hospital, always go local gov hospital, private ones here where l live are useless.

[LivinLOS]

I have never censored anything. And I have said for maybe 90+ % of persons, they probably will NOT come out ahead if they buy insurance ...

I am glad thats finally agreed then..

So if 90% dont come out ahead.. and your someone who has access to (by far) enough to pay for even major medical issues.. Without it causing any change whatsoever in your living standard..

Why would you buy it ??

[Kwasaki]

Thanks for clearing that up. He just went in for a yearly check-up. Nothing was wrong with him, but one test came back 'unusual' and it ended up becoming an issue.

All is good as it ended up being nothing but the part that he had to pay up in the end. I hope he gets paid but with all things in this Country, nothing is for certain. In a perfect world, they should have kept their word from the beginning but we are talking Insurance and nothing in that sector is a certain and that is what I am trying to say.

That explains it then . a regular check-up is normally not covered by the insurance , if he was not sick in the first place.

Also with my insurance company BUPA I have experienced they do cover it , but it's normal practice to pay first , keep a copy of the receipts and then claim it So I went to the nearest BUPA office with all my documents , they faxed it to the head office , after 2 weeks I got my money back , in my case 26000 baht -

Whow !! 26,000. what they do for that ?.... My last yearly check up was 6000+ a bit.

[Kwasaki]

I'll be 72 in July. I just got my BUPA renewal notice, Emerald Plan, B 67,313. Upgrade to Diamond, B 83,775 and Platinum 1 will costs B 119,597. Still undecided which plan to choose but current plan expires on 26 May.

My advice would be, if you're happy staying with them go for which one is good for you or the one you can afford.

[JLCrab]

I have never censored anything. And I have said for maybe 90+ % of persons, they probably will NOT come out ahead if they buy insurance ...

I am glad thats finally agreed then..

So if 90% dont come out ahead.. and your someone who has access to (by far) enough to pay for even major medical issues.. Without it causing any change whatsoever in your living standard..

Why would you buy it ??

I have said the above on the Insurance Forum for years. There many are conveniences to having a medical paid by the insurer rather than doing it on a cash basis. Plus, it is the mindset of many persons who could access millions of USD in cash that they would not want to pay USD 100,000 for something that might have only cost them USD10,000 had they taken a different course of action.

And as I also have said for years, despite whatever claims to good health one may have, you never know when you are going to be part of that 10%.

[balo]

Thanks for clearing that up. He just went in for a yearly check-up. Nothing was wrong with him, but one test came back 'unusual' and it ended up becoming an issue.

All is good as it ended up being nothing but the part that he had to pay up in the end. I hope he gets paid but with all things in this Country, nothing is for certain. In a perfect world, they should have kept their word from the beginning but we are talking Insurance and nothing in that sector is a certain and that is what I am trying to say.

That explains it then . a regular check-up is normally not covered by the insurance , if he was not sick in the first place.

Also with my insurance company BUPA I have experienced they do cover it , but it's normal practice to pay first , keep a copy of the receipts and then claim it So I went to the nearest BUPA office with all my documents , they faxed it to the head office , after 2 weeks I got my money back , in my case 26000 baht -

Whow !! 26,000. what they do for that ?.... My last yearly check up was 6000+ a bit.

I explained that in post #276 if you continue reading .

[LivinLOS]

I have said the above on the Insurance Forum for years. There many are conveniences to having a medical paid by the insurer rather than doing it on a cash basis.

What would those be ??

the lack of discounting ??? and.. er.. er..

I find I get better treated, when paying directly, than any time when it has to go through slower 3rd parties.

[JLCrab]

In Thailand, the major health insurers have network hospitals whose billing departments they deal with them maybe hundreds of times per week. All but emergency situations are approved in advance by doctors at those network hospitals with whom the insurance companies are already familiar.

In the insurance industry, a risk that someone or some company is responsible solely 100% is called a 'naked risk'. I think that as an apt metaphor for your position.

[Kwasaki]

Your premiums must be substantial for them to be able to do that and still make a profit .Also B26k for a check up seems rather excessive .

No this was not a check-up , I had MR scan done and did some tests . Before the procedure Bumrungrad called BUPA to check if they would agree to cover it, they did and the hospital gave me the claim forms from BUPA , I just had to pay first , no big deal really as long as they agreed. Back then I had a low premium , I paid 8000 baht per year.

Now the premium has gone up since I am over 50.

Yes can see why expensive, I guess it's considered a top hospital and also being in Bangkok.

Last year had 2 MR checks top halve & bottom halve and blood tests etc..etc from a choosing checklist. 12,000 baht.

[LivinLOS]

In Thailand, the major health insurers have network hospitals whose billing departments they deal with them maybe hundreds of times per week. All but emergency situations are approved in advance by doctors at those network hospitals with whom the insurance companies are already familiar.

and again.. How is that in any way

There many are conveniences to having a medical paid by the insurer rather than doing it on a cash basis.

If I have a problem.. I just pay.. What is the greater convenience ?

Doesnt matter if its 100s of 1000s of USD.. I can just pay.. Given statistical averages, insurance adds nothing other than cost.

[NancyL]

This thread has basically turned into bickering between a few people, but a few pages back someone pointed out that the personal accident insurance policy I described as having bought from Bankgok Bank Kad Suan Kaew branch isn't found on the Bangkok Bank website. Very true. The only PA policy for seniors they list on their website has a max payout of 60,000 baht for an accident, doesn't cover if you're on a motorcycle and costs 5080 per year. It does cover up to age 100. http://www.bangkokbank.com/BangkokBank/PersonalBanking/BuildYourWealth/Bancassurance/NonLifeInsurance/Pages/PA1st.aspx

Hubby and I had that policy for a couple years but last year when we returned to the KSK branch to renew, they said they had a better plan. Still covered up to age 100, but 200,000 baht max for accident and no exclusion for riding on a motorcycle. (I must admit that sometimes I'm a passenger on a friend's) Cost just a little more, 7070 baht. The insurance card looked much like the previous one. I was surprised I couldn't find it on the Bangkok Bank website.

Turns out this policy is offered by Bangkok Insurance, and is something the KSK branch of Bangkok Bank has arranged because they have so many senior foreign customers. If you go to another Bangkok Bank branch, they're not going to know what you're talking about. The other Bangkok Bank policy is actually from Bangkok Insurance, too, and is a special promotion for Bangkok Bank. Here is the PA Happy 45+ policy from the Bangkok Insurance website. Unfortunately, they only have a version in Thai: http://www.bangkokinsurance.com/insurance/Pa45+-insurance-seller_th.html

The Kad Suan Kaew branch of Bangkok Bank has English-language material they can give you to describe the policy. And yes, I know numerous people who have made claims on this policy. As I've said, they have an accident -- like they're hit by a motorcycle while they're walking down a footpath, slip and fall in the bathroom at home, cut themselves with a kitchen knife -- whatever -- go into CM Ram hospital, present their PA insurance card from Bangkok Bank and never see a bill. You don't have to be a customer of Bangkok Bank or the KSK branch to buy this policy.

Scan_20160412.pdf

[JLCrab]

In Thailand, the major health insurers have network hospitals whose billing departments they deal with them maybe hundreds of times per week. All but emergency situations are approved in advance by doctors at those network hospitals with whom the insurance companies are already familiar.

and again.. How is that in any way

There many are conveniences to having a medical paid by the insurer rather than doing it on a cash basis.

If I have a problem.. I just pay.. What is the greater convenience ?

Doesnt matter if its 100s of 1000s of USD.. I can just pay.. Given statistical averages, insurance adds nothing other than cost.

Thank you. I have seen the light. I'm gonna let my insurance lapse and just walk around with my American Express Gold Card because I ain't gonna no more be no mug naked or otherwise. Praise be you and the CNX kid going off the grid is the cool thing to do and I sure want to be cool like you guys.

[NancyL]

I was in at Sripat yesterday and made an inquiry. They don't accept American Express.

[MadMac]

Nobody accepts AMEX in CNX I believe. Cancelled my card last year, useless.

[LivinLOS]

I see.. So when pressured to come up with the many conveniences you claim.. You just change the subject..

[JLCrab]

I see.. So when pressured to come up with the many conveniences you claim.. You just change the subject..

For any non-emergency procedure, you meet with the specialist at the network hospital . The Insurance department at the hospital gets an approval. You come to the hospital for surgery with your card. When it's time to check out, the hospital will bill you for any charges not covered by the insurer. In my case it was 2 cokes from the minibar.

No financial forms to sign or questions asked let alone any deposits or up-front payments. At least that was my experience for surgery that required 8 days in the hospital in a private room following surgery.

From the screenplay Broadcast News (1987)

Paul Moore: It must be nice to always believe you know better, to always think you're the smartest person in the room.

Jane Craig: No. It's awful.

[LivinLOS]

And I am still trying to work out the many and varied ways which you maintain there are 'many conveniences' which using insurance has over just paying..

Hospital provides bill, I get it discounted, open banking app on my phone.. Pay bill.. Walk out (hopefully).. Takes seconds..

We have already established and agreed that for 90% of people its more expensive to have insurance.. But you claim theres many conveniences also.. They are ??

[JLCrab]

Every year that I pay my premium I hope I get real sick so I can come on here and say that I am 'well ahead' just like you guys but it hasn't worked out that way. Maybe I'll get real sick next year bit with my luck I'll probably just stay healthy. Drats.

And we have already established that I am a mug so what more do you want?

[Social Media]

Not having to pay a HUGE bill yourself

Not being wiped out financially as a result of health issue.

The peace of mind knowing the above.

Having a "choice" for better Medical care (if available elsewhere)

Immediate treatment and not have to "pay up front" if carrying the insurance card.

No delay in treatment whilst you "arrange" upfront payment (serious/high value)

No confiscation of passport until the bill is paid.

Always better to use someone elses money than yours.

Probably more but that illustrates some.

[JLCrab]

Not having to pay a HUGE bill yourself

Not being wiped out financially as a result of health issue.

The peace of mind knowing the above.

Having a "choice" for better Medical care (if available elsewhere)

Immediate treatment and not have to "pay up front" if carrying the insurance card.

No delay in treatment whilst you "arrange" upfront payment (serious/high value)

No confiscation of passport until the bill is paid.

Always better to use someone elses money than yours.

Probably more but that illustrates some.

Such a plebeian are you.

[LivinLOS]

Every year that I pay my premium I hope I get real sick so I can come on here and say that I am 'well ahead' just like you guys but it hasn't worked out that way. Maybe I'll get real sick next year bit with my luck I'll probably just stay healthy. Drats.

And we have already established that I am a mug so what more do you want?

That has nothing to do with it.. Being healthy.. etc etc.. Thats sidetracking it..

We have already agreed that for 90% of people its cheaper to pay yourself. Thats the very nature of the business that is insurance.. The issue is for some people that bill could be more than they can pay without having an effect on their lifestyle, I have already said, if thats someones financial situation, they really should have it. However for anyone for who a hospital bill will have zero effect on their financial future.. Why have it ??

You claimed

There many are conveniences to having a medical paid by the insurer rather than doing it on a cash basis

So I am all ears.. Other that providing a shield for the fear of being unable to meet the unexpected cost, what are the 'many conveniences' ?? I really cant think of any.

[LivinLOS]

Not having to pay a HUGE bill yourself

Not being wiped out financially as a result of health issue.

The peace of mind knowing the above.

Having a "choice" for better Medical care (if available elsewhere)

Immediate treatment and not have to "pay up front" if carrying the insurance card.

No delay in treatment whilst you "arrange" upfront payment (serious/high value)

No confiscation of passport until the bill is paid.

Always better to use someone elses money than yours.

Probably more but that illustrates some.

I will never be 'wiped out' by medical costs.. So need no peace of mind to pay someone else to hide that fear from me.

None of the above are real issues, if you have access to funds. They are all variations on the fear of not being able to pay, and paying a premium for someone else to manage that risk for you.

[JLCrab]

Every year that I pay my premium I hope I get real sick so I can come on here and say that I am 'well ahead' just like you guys but it hasn't worked out that way. Maybe I'll get real sick next year bit with my luck I'll probably just stay healthy. Drats.

And we have already established that I am a mug so what more do you want?

That has nothing to do with it.. Being healthy.. etc etc.. Thats sidetracking it..

We have already agreed that for 90% of people its cheaper to pay yourself. Thats the very nature of the business that is insurance.. The issue is for some people that bill could be more than they can pay without having an effect on their lifestyle, I have already said, if thats someones financial situation, they really should have it. However for anyone for who a hospital bill will have zero effect on their financial future.. Why have it ??

You claimed

There many are conveniences to having a medical paid by the insurer rather than doing it on a cash basis

So I am all ears.. Other that providing a shield for the fear of being unable to meet the unexpected cost, what are the 'many conveniences' ?? I really cant think of any.

So you are all ears. Fine. This is for you

[Social Media]

Not having to pay a HUGE bill yourself

Not being wiped out financially as a result of health issue.

The peace of mind knowing the above.

Having a "choice" for better Medical care (if available elsewhere)

Immediate treatment and not have to "pay up front" if carrying the insurance card.

No delay in treatment whilst you "arrange" upfront payment (serious/high value)

No confiscation of passport until the bill is paid.

Always better to use someone elses money than yours.

Probably more but that illustrates some.

I will never be 'wiped out' by medical costs.. So need no peace of mind to pay someone else to hide that fear from me.

None of the above are real issues, if you have access to funds. They are all variations on the fear of not being able to pay, and paying a premium for someone else to manage that risk for you.

Well excuse me Multi-millionaire, I didnt realise your status.

To "most" it would be a concern, even if they had "access" as it could still leave a potentially large hole for the future going forward, if you are no longer able to replace it as you can no longer work etc due to age and would therefore be a real concern.

Having multi millions wont help you much if you are in a coma and unable to "arrange" anything, but that card in your pocket will at least take care of things in the interim.

Frankly, I believe you are just arguing for the sake of it and hair splitting to score points. Ok, we submit to powerful and wealthy individual who clearly knows better than the masses who purchase and search for adequate cover each and everyday.