SiSePuede419 Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 If you lived in the Red Light District in Amsterdam, I wouldn't expect you to be interested in learning about Dutch culture either, 555 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jingthing Posted May 31, 2016 Author Share Posted May 31, 2016 If you lived in the Red Light District in Amsterdam, I wouldn't expect you to be interested in learning about Dutch culture either, 555 So you think the entire Pattaya metro area is a red light district? Don't bother answering. The answer is most of it is NOT. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterb17 Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 What's being interested in Thai culture got to do with living in Pattaya? The reason you old boys live there is because you like being surrounded by cheap, young prostitutes and being in a environment that accepts the fact that you are there to use cheap, young prostitutes......it is what it is. A bit sad all round really. Oh well........... Absolutely - have three young fellows cavorting in the pool- another two in the roof top jacuzzi and more in each bedroom. Same same tired old response to belittle those who live in Pattaya and surrounding areas- who have nothing to do with the seedy side of things. Perhaps you speak from experience. I don't think Thai culture is so great- you could make a huge list ( actually vast) of negative points- not allowed on this forum. So why involve yourself - I think that is what Jingthing was saying ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oxforddon Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Some interesting posts ..... my view is that whether or not you show active interest in Thai culture - or whatever word you choose - you are involved every time you get an embarrassed smile at a check-in counter or wait for officialdom to serve you or get a spoon for a sandwich or see someone eat insects or hear noise from a Temple fair and a myriad of other things that one does not encounter in Western cultures. One can choose to embrace all this or otherwise. Laugh at it, wonder at it or get angry at it. As I said earlier, there is no right or wrong way to living here beyond being a generally nice person to others. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
i claudius Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 (edited) What's being interested in Thai culture got to do with living in Pattaya? The reason you old boys live there is because you like being surrounded by cheap, young prostitutes and being in a environment that accepts the fact that you are there to use cheap, young prostitutes......it is what it is. A bit sad all round really. Oh well........... Is that right,wow you are so intelligent,that you know these things,I must tell all my married friends here that we are doing it wrong ,bringing up a family and shopping in Tesco,doing the garden and watching tv , thanks for telling us. By the way how is the weather up there in Nakon Nowhere? Edited May 31, 2016 by i claudius Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rimmer Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 A post and a reply have been removed: http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/878797-updated-notice-to-members-posting-in-thailand-news/ Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peterb17 Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Some interesting posts ..... my view is that whether or not you show active interest in Thai culture - or whatever word you choose - you are involved every time you get an embarrassed smile at a check-in counter or wait for officialdom to serve you or get a spoon for a sandwich or see someone eat insects or hear noise from a Temple fair and a myriad of other things that one does not encounter in Western cultures. One can choose to embrace all this or otherwise. Laugh at it, wonder at it or get angry at it. As I said earlier, there is no right or wrong way to living here beyond being a generally nice person to others. Maybe my last post was a bit negative- of course we are all involved and experience Thai culture every day- load of friends descended last night- making Som Tam, BBQ a load of seafood, watching Isaan shows on You Tube , some Leo's, swimming late - all good fun - very Thai - enjoying life for the moment. Actually I love the music, food , noise, insanity of this country. Some things such as environmental issues drive me crazy. I posed the question before- what exactly is Thai culture - what are the key values of Thailand? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tropo Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 (edited) Most of us expats here are not IMMIGRANTS. I think REAL immigrants would be foolish to take the approach I do (and I know others do as well, to different levels). Also of course there are practical differences. If you're working here and you need to be more local to make that happen, well, there really isn't any choice, if you want to work here. Many foreigners here are SINCERELY interested in Thai culture. That's different. I'm saying if you realize over time that you're really not, then if you don't have to for practical reasons, why bother FAKING it? Some would say to be polite and respectful to the hosts here, as they see themselves as guests of the hosts. I hear that but it doesn't move me. I think we're getting tied up with the wrong words. If you were interested in Thai culture, that would have been in your early days here. As a result of your initial interest you would have learnt more about it, then possibly decided you don't like it. The longer I stay here the less I like Thai culture and the less interested I am in learning the language. This is coming from an expat that is not involved with a Thai national. If you're married to one, then learning the language and delving deeper into Thai culture becomes a duty, even if you don't like it. Edited May 31, 2016 by tropo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1FinickyOne Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Pattaya seems to exist outside of Thai culture with little need for language. It is an amusement park, disneyland where you get to take home Minnie Mouse if you like... I would not imagine that many people choose Pattaya as a place to live because they are delving into a study of language and culture.. If you enjoy living there, I see no requirement to study or involve yourself in things that don't interest you... after that, who cares? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tropo Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 People who depend on the bar scene and bar women need to wake up and get a real, satisfying life! Not to mention saving your liver and your health. Not understanding the culture of a country you live in is being ignorant and even dangerous. From reading this post it is clear the OP needs to change his thinking and his life and focus on being happy wherever that may be. If your bored, that is a red flag. Create new interests, and new friends. Learn the language and meet new friends in the high end malls, on the BTS, in coffee shops. Be the first to initiate conversation and listen. Join a club or start one. Diet, lose weight, spend more time walking or join a gym. Sun bath for 15 to 20 minutes a day. Go to bed early and get up early. Replace alcohol with clean water and flush out the fatty liver. If you smoke, stop now. Replace junk food with healthy fats and veggies. Avoid most prescription drugs. If you eat healthy your bodily will heal itself as intended. Avoid negative friends and substance abusers. Avoid bars for three weeks then limit dinks to 2 to 3, beer and wine only. Reduce sugar and sweetener intake. Soon, you will see what you have been missing in life. If it works for you, pass it on! I nearly threw up reading that. Are you a real person? It's hard to believe a person who tries so hard to be happy would have any time to enjoy their life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tropo Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Pattaya seems to exist outside of Thai culture with little need for language. It is an amusement park, disneyland where you get to take home Minnie Mouse if you like... I would not imagine that many people choose Pattaya as a place to live because they are delving into a study of language and culture.. If you enjoy living there, I see no requirement to study or involve yourself in things that don't interest you... after that, who cares? I would say Pattaya fits into Thai culture perfectly. These days it's all about material wealth and keeping up with the Joneses. Who's got the biggest car or house? Who's wearing the most expensive jewelry? If it's old (more than a year) - throw it out and get a new one. Colour the hair. Fix the nose. Botox. Facials. Plastic surgery. Bleach the skin. It's all about appearances these days. This culture infiltrates all the rural towns and cities too. Which family has the most wealthy Farang supporting them? Which girls have the most Farangs supporting them? Whatever you think is Thai Culture has changed and it's dying out with the older generations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gemguy Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Replying to: Is it "wrong" to live in Pattaya and not be interested in Thai culture? Nope...Not at all, seeing as the Thai people in Pattaya are not at all interested in "Your" culture rather the only thing about you that they are really interested in....... is all your money. Just thought I would clarify that for you ...and no need to thank me for that profound revelation...lol Cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1FinickyOne Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Pattaya seems to exist outside of Thai culture with little need for language. It is an amusement park, disneyland where you get to take home Minnie Mouse if you like... I would not imagine that many people choose Pattaya as a place to live because they are delving into a study of language and culture.. If you enjoy living there, I see no requirement to study or involve yourself in things that don't interest you... after that, who cares? I would say Pattaya fits into Thai culture perfectly. These days it's all about material wealth and keeping up with the Joneses. Who's got the biggest car or house? Who's wearing the most expensive jewelry? If it's old (more than a year) - throw it out and get a new one. Colour the hair. Fix the nose. Botox. Facials. Plastic surgery. Bleach the skin. It's all about appearances these days. This culture infiltrates all the rural towns and cities too. Which family has the most wealthy Farang supporting them? Which girls have the most Farangs supporting them? Whatever you think is Thai Culture has changed and it's dying out with the older generations. Yo Tro Po - Sure, that all exists here, though not the norm in the part of Thailand that I am living in - the rare time I am in places like Pattaya, it does not seem too much like the part where I live. I just took a vacation in Krabi and that also did not fele too much like Thailand... due to the abundance of tourists and so little chance for them to brush up against much that was Thai.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
balo Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 If I were a real immigrant I would not choose Thailand , not even on my top 10 list. I am an expat living here and I earn my small income from outside of Thailand. One of the reasons I settled down here is to be able to afford a decent lifestyle for less money than back home. Maybe that was my main reason to come here, and not to experience a different culture , it's just a part of the full package of living abroad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gemguy Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 (edited) Pattaya seems to exist outside of Thai culture with little need for language. It is an amusement park, disneyland where you get to take home Minnie Mouse if you like... I would not imagine that many people choose Pattaya as a place to live because they are delving into a study of language and culture.. If you enjoy living there, I see no requirement to study or involve yourself in things that don't interest you... after that, who cares? I would say Pattaya fits into Thai culture perfectly. These days it's all about material wealth and keeping up with the Joneses. Who's got the biggest car or house? Who's wearing the most expensive jewelry? If it's old (more than a year) - throw it out and get a new one. Colour the hair. Fix the nose. Botox. Facials. Plastic surgery. Bleach the skin. It's all about appearances these days. This culture infiltrates all the rural towns and cities too. Which family has the most wealthy Farang supporting them? Which girls have the most Farangs supporting them? Whatever you think is Thai Culture has changed and it's dying out with the older generations. Yo Tro Po - Sure, that all exists here, though not the norm in the part of Thailand that I am living in - the rare time I am in places like Pattaya, it does not seem too much like the part where I live. I just took a vacation in Krabi and that also did not fele too much like Thailand... due to the abundance of tourists and so little chance for them to brush up against much that was Thai.. True....But there has always been a big question mark about what is it that a Foreigner living in Thailand can do to emulate being a Thai ..or do to emulate Thai culture in an effort to understand it ...besides taking an interest in all things Thai and Thai ways. Eating spicy Thai food?....while sitting cross legged on a floor and share the rice bowl?...would that bring you closer to understanding Thai culture. Become a Monk and practice Thai Buddhism?......and search for the meaning of life? Wai people like the Thai people do?...and give up handshaking? Think like the Thai people ?...and act like the Thai people?.... and abandon your western ideals and western logic and mentality? Believe in Ghosts and Spirits like the Thai people do? ....and participate in ancient rituals? Dress the way that Thai people dress wearing the traditional Thai mode of dress? Go to temples and pray to the monks or prey with the monks? .....and talk Philosophy...."Ahhhhh... Grass Hopper ...you have much to learn" Become a poor rice farmer?...in an effort to really understand Thai culture Listen to Mor Lum and Lum Phuthai music or do Lum Phuthai dancing? Learn Thai Kick boxing?....and get bruised up a lot. Learn to drive a motor vehicle like the Thais?...free for all...wah hoo Learn how to drink and get drunk on Thai Whiskey and Thai beer like the Thai people do? ...and never mind what happens while drunk. Wear Thai amulets around your neck?....in the belief good luck really does exist. Get some Thai style Tattoos?....some really earthy stuff to help one further understand Thailand. Learn how to save face like the Thai people do?...(.mind you that is a difficult one to comprehend) Learn how to avoid responsibility like so many Thai people do? ( run from the scene of an accident ) Learn how to over charge people???...lol...but always give them the correct change....it is the right thing to do. I have been here for nearly 30 years now but I have never really been interested so much in Thai culture itself rather just enjoy the stimulation of living here more so than living in my own country....because..... I am not a Thai person...so I do not try to emulate the Thai people nor do I try to figure out Thai people all that much or figure out Thai culture and Thai ways. But a person should learn to speak the language, while learning to read and write Thai language is a big help. There are very few foreigners that come here and stay long term that really immerse themselves into Thai Culture while that would involve doing everything that the Thai people do including thinking like the Thai people which includes the Good, the Bad and the...Ugly aspects of Thai culture. You can read books on the subject as there are loads of books on the subject of Thai culture.....But no matter how much you learn about Thai culture....you will always remain a somewhat confused outsider, looking in, while never really understanding what exactly does Thai Culture mean. But torture yourself if you want while you may come to realize what I realized a long time ago...that being : The Thai people do not know the meaning of life or have the meaning of life figured out either...just like everyone else never figures it out.....no matter which "culture" you come from. Cheers Edited May 31, 2016 by gemguy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mesterm Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Same thing as all the people from the middle east living in Europe now and totally not interested in the local culture. So if there's nothing wrong with what you're doing, I guess there's nothing wrong with them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotwight Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 (edited) Is it wrong to live in the Musée du Louvre and not like art? It's not wrong it's just stupid. Edited May 31, 2016 by Scotwight Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
anotheruser Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 If you lived in the Red Light District in Amsterdam, I wouldn't expect you to be interested in learning about Dutch culture either, 555 So you think the entire Pattaya metro area is a red light district? Don't bother answering. The answer is most of it is NOT. What came first the chicken or the egg? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ozyjon Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 I used to be interested in Thai culture then i discovered girls Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NongMalee Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 I used to be interested in Thai culture then i discovered girls Thai girls ? I ask because many western/Thai relationships usually succumb to misunderstandings and issues regarding the very opening post believe it or not. So all those who say they don't really care for it but are involved with Thai women are already one step behind in the dating game here. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1FinickyOne Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Pattaya seems to exist outside of Thai culture with little need for language. It is an amusement park, disneyland where you get to take home Minnie Mouse if you like... I would not imagine that many people choose Pattaya as a place to live because they are delving into a study of language and culture.. If you enjoy living there, I see no requirement to study or involve yourself in things that don't interest you... after that, who cares? I would say Pattaya fits into Thai culture perfectly. These days it's all about material wealth and keeping up with the Joneses. Who's got the biggest car or house? Who's wearing the most expensive jewelry? If it's old (more than a year) - throw it out and get a new one. Colour the hair. Fix the nose. Botox. Facials. Plastic surgery. Bleach the skin. It's all about appearances these days. This culture infiltrates all the rural towns and cities too. Which family has the most wealthy Farang supporting them? Which girls have the most Farangs supporting them? Whatever you think is Thai Culture has changed and it's dying out with the older generations. Yo Tro Po - Sure, that all exists here, though not the norm in the part of Thailand that I am living in - the rare time I am in places like Pattaya, it does not seem too much like the part where I live. I just took a vacation in Krabi and that also did not fele too much like Thailand... due to the abundance of tourists and so little chance for them to brush up against much that was Thai.. True....But there has always been a big question mark about what is it that a Foreigner living in Thailand can do to emulate being a Thai ..or do to emulate Thai culture in an effort to understand it ...besides taking an interest in all things Thai and Thai ways. Eating spicy Thai food?....while sitting cross legged on a floor and share the rice bowl?...would that bring you closer to understanding Thai culture. Become a Monk and practice Thai Buddhism?......and search for the meaning of life? Wai people like the Thai people do?...and give up handshaking? Think like the Thai people ?...and act like the Thai people?.... and abandon your western ideals and western logic and mentality? Believe in Ghosts and Spirits like the Thai people do? ....and participate in ancient rituals? Dress the way that Thai people dress wearing the traditional Thai mode of dress? Go to temples and pray to the monks or prey with the monks? .....and talk Philosophy...."Ahhhhh... Grass Hopper ...you have much to learn" Become a poor rice farmer?...in an effort to really understand Thai culture Listen to Mor Lum and Lum Phuthai music or do Lum Phuthai dancing? Learn Thai Kick boxing?....and get bruised up a lot. Learn to drive a motor vehicle like the Thais?...free for all...wah hoo Learn how to drink and get drunk on Thai Whiskey and Thai beer like the Thai people do? ...and never mind what happens while drunk. Wear Thai amulets around your neck?....in the belief good luck really does exist. Get some Thai style Tattoos?....some really earthy stuff to help one further understand Thailand. Learn how to save face like the Thai people do?...(.mind you that is a difficult one to comprehend) Learn how to avoid responsibility like so many Thai people do? ( run from the scene of an accident ) Learn how to over charge people???...lol...but always give them the correct change....it is the right thing to do. I have been here for nearly 30 years now but I have never really been interested so much in Thai culture itself rather just enjoy the stimulation of living here more so than living in my own country....because..... I am not a Thai person...so I do not try to emulate the Thai people nor do I try to figure out Thai people all that much or figure out Thai culture and Thai ways. But a person should learn to speak the language, while learning to read and write Thai language is a big help. There are very few foreigners that come here and stay long term that really immerse themselves into Thai Culture while that would involve doing everything that the Thai people do including thinking like the Thai people which includes the Good, the Bad and the...Ugly aspects of Thai culture. You can read books on the subject as there are loads of books on the subject of Thai culture.....But no matter how much you learn about Thai culture....you will always remain a somewhat confused outsider, looking in, while never really understanding what exactly does Thai Culture mean. But torture yourself if you want while you may come to realize what I realized a long time ago...that being : The Thai people do not know the meaning of life or have the meaning of life figured out either...just like everyone else never figures it out.....no matter which "culture" you come from. Cheers Hi Gem - way too much here to respond to all and it would take a book length answer. Short answer is that I would definitely not say that I emulate Thai. I am pretty comfortable being me and never had a thought about trying to be Thai. "Observe" might be a better word and consider what I see. You have chosen a list of mostly uninteresting [for me] activities. I live with Thais, I do not adopt all of their habits and customs. Most of the ones you mention don't really suit me. I don't think Thai people have an answer for everything, just as everyone else and agree with you there - but I do find certain things of interest that go beyond many of the superficial points you make above. I am not saying or meaning to imply your post is superficial, as the larger questions raised are not. I would not really learn anything from sitting cross legged at dinner, though I have shared enough meals with family. Food is a hunger thing for me and sometimes it is a social thing too. I come and go as I please. I find many things about Thai people and Thai society interesting. Yes, they do seem to me to be happier than people from back home. I come from a small family in USA, though highly successful people, unhappy and a very dysfunctional family dynamic. Here I am a small but unique cog in a very very big family wheel. I live in a family compound. Mostly, people go about their individual days and ways, doing what they like, and help each other when needed, w/o need to ask or accounts kept. At the moment, my father in law is in the hospital. Even now at a hospital 2 hours away, he will have 10-20 family members visiting. I have been ferrying them. When I return home there will be an additional 20-30 people waiting to see if I need a meal or help with anything. He is the oldest of 10 siblings and you can imagine with each one having an extended family, we can hit 150 people w/a family party. In general, I see no hunger as everyone can go to the temple and be fed and no homelessness in the countryside and small cities. The whys and where of this I find interesting and a positive as in my "rich" home country, homelessness is an issue. Yes, I know there are some homeless drug addicts... but I am just trying to make a few general points here. Once below the surface, I have found that Thai are perceptive and many have a highly developed sixth sense that few farang have... and i am curious about this. So, amongst some of your assumptions, I don't find living in my village and learning about a different culture "torture" - I am really not into pain and would not do anything that I found unpleasant. I am a fairly practical guy. As to the original post, no, I do not think JT is wrong in any way by not being interested in the culture. I am sure he has other interests. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hal65 Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Some countries are known for their work ethic. Others, their history. What do you think of when you hear "Thailand"? Whether the Thais like it or not, Pattaya IS their culture; in fact the defining aspect. Learn Pattaya to learn the very best that Thailand has to offer. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2fishin2 Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 Some countries are known for their work ethic. Others, their history. What do you think of when you hear "Thailand"? Whether the Thais like it or not, Pattaya IS their culture; in fact the defining aspect. Learn Pattaya to learn the very best that Thailand has to offer. Huh I sure hope you are being sarcastic Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
slipperylobster Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 (edited) If you lived in the Red Light District in Amsterdam, I wouldn't expect you to be interested in learning about Dutch culture either, 555 So you think the entire Pattaya metro area is a red light district? Don't bother answering. The answer is most of it is NOT. What came first the chicken or the egg? There are two soi's that look like I could take the wife and kids to. Edited May 31, 2016 by slipperylobster Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotwight Posted May 31, 2016 Share Posted May 31, 2016 So you think the entire Pattaya metro area is a red light district? Don't bother answering. The answer is most of it is NOT. What came first the chicken or the egg? There are two soi's that look like I could take the wife and kids to. I go to Pattaya weekly with the wife no problem. The wife and kids see hookers every day in Thailand and are not turned into blocks of salt. Thai people are a bit more cosmopolitan than your average American I think and are able to deal with the reality of life without being kept in a box of make believe Disneyworld like situations. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cicero1520 Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 Watching Thais go off to work in pickups, replete with flip flops on the way to building sites, somehow hits a spot with me aand thank my lucky stars that it is not part of my culture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
puffy Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 Embracing and understanding Thai culture are two very different things. I think in most places in Thailand understanding Thai culture is very important, probably not so much in Pattaya. That does not mean you must embrace every aspect of it. There are a number of aspects I like about Thai culture, like the importance of family and sharing of food. I don't believe in their superstitions and I don't like Song Kran, whereas Loy Khratong I enjoy. I pick the parts I like and disregard what I don't. I also had a western upbringing and don't want to lose that identity either. It is about knowing yourself. As far as Pattaya is concerned I would say that a number of expats who choose to live their( not all) come from very low class backgrounds have a poor education and are probably incapable of understanding and culture different to their own. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1FinickyOne Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 Embracing and understanding Thai culture are two very different things. I think in most places in Thailand understanding Thai culture is very important, probably not so much in Pattaya. That does not mean you must embrace every aspect of it. There are a number of aspects I like about Thai culture, like the importance of family and sharing of food. I don't believe in their superstitions and I don't like Song Kran, whereas Loy Khratong I enjoy. I pick the parts I like and disregard what I don't. I also had a western upbringing and don't want to lose that identity either. It is about knowing yourself. As far as Pattaya is concerned I would say that a number of expats who choose to live their( not all) come from very low class backgrounds have a poor education and are probably incapable of understanding and culture different to their own. Hi Puffy - I go along with your first part... I embrace what I like while remaining myself... I don't know too many expats in Pattaya but the few I do know are pretty well educated and defintiely capable of understanding - if they are interested. If not, I do not hold it against them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rimmer Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 Various off topic and troll posts have been removed Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
impulse Posted June 1, 2016 Share Posted June 1, 2016 Is it wrong to live in the Musée du Louvre and not like art? It's not wrong it's just stupid. Not if you could get laid in the museum for a few bucks... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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