Massive petition calls for EU referendum re-run

[Basil B]

A vote is a vote. If you lose, you lose. 16m voted against who are not happy, 17.5m voted for who are. That is what a vote is. Win or lose you have to get on with it. In football if you lose do you vote for a rematch? In a national election, if you lose do we vote again? NO - IT IS PART OF THE DEMOCRATIC PROCESS - CALLED DEMOCRACY. We vote for who we want. Try voting in China!! Or Thailand, at the moment. We have always been free to make our choice. DONT BE BAD LOSERS, PUT YOUR ENERGY TO MAKING THE CHOICE OF THE MAJORITY WORK. Use your energy in the right way and make Britain great again - and stop moaning.

Please tell that to Ms N Sturgeon MP...

Why I feel the Brexit referendum was wrong was was so inconclusive on the actual mandate, even though it was a vote to exit the EU those that were campaigning for out were saying we can still be part of the EU like Norway or Switzerland...

I feel that if there were to be major changes in Europe and there was a really good offer on the table then possibly lets have another referendum, but to change the rules on the referendum to two thirds in favour...

Edited June 26, 2016 by Basil B

[Crowes]

As I predicted

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36634407?SThisFB

It's an online petition. It's fraud from the get go with no basis.

[Basil B]

Scottish Parliament could veto Brexit:

Can you imagine the fury of the British people if you stopped them leaving Europe? asked the presenter. Ms Sturgeon replied: I can, but its perhaps similar to the fury of many of the people in Scotland right now as we face the prospect of being taken out of the European Union against our will.

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/nicola-sturgeon-veto-brexit-scottish-parliament-eu-referendum-scotland-latest-a7104046.html

Yesterday she was going to the EU to keep Scotland in, ... I think a short phone to Strasbourg put her right on that one.

And what veto??? are the "Loony 50" going to filibust debates, or physically stop MP's entering the Lobby to vote???

[sujoop]

This comment from a poster on another thread resonates:

"The next time I hear an Englishman in Thailand complain about xenophobia, I'll laugh in their face. Look at what you have become - an embarrassment to your once great nation."

[MJP]

People voted for Brexit for all manner of reasons.

All those I know who voted for Leave did it because of the issues of democracy in an increasingly powerful federalist EU.

[Basil B]

As I predicted

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-politics-eu-referendum-36634407?SThisFB

77,000 votes out of over 3.3 million (2.5%) I would not be surprised if there were not more than 2.5% fraudulent votes in the referendum.

Then who is behind it, "Remain"? ...or "Leave" to discredit the petition???

Unless over 97% signatures are fraudulent then there are over 100,000 valid signatures enough to get it considered for debate.

[alocacoc]

I didn't know British voters are that stupid. But read by yourself.

Anger over 'Bregret' as Leave voters say they thought UK would stay in EU

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-anger-bregret-leave-voters-protest-vote-thought-uk-stay-in-eu-remain-win-a7102516.html

If they want kidding around, better they go to Disneyland.

Edited June 26, 2016 by alocacoc

[wooloomooloo]

I didn't know British voters are that stupid. But read by yourself.

Anger over 'Bregret' as Leave voters say they thought UK would stay in EU

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-anger-bregret-leave-voters-protest-vote-thought-uk-stay-in-eu-remain-win-a7102516.html

If they want kidding around, better they go to Disneyland.

The referendum result was final and parliament will enact an EU leave. Get over it.

Edited June 26, 2016 by wooloomooloo

[bkkcanuck8]

I didn't know British voters are that stupid. But read by yourself.

Anger over 'Bregret' as Leave voters say they thought UK would stay in EU

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-anger-bregret-leave-voters-protest-vote-thought-uk-stay-in-eu-remain-win-a7102516.html

If they want kidding around, better they go to Disneyland.

Democracy of one vote for one person and every person can vote is based on the believe that yes -- you will have complete morons who will participate -- but that on average they will nullify each other out by being spread out over all sides. Yes, stupid people do vote.... but stupidity is not an excuse.

[Grouse]

I have accepted the decision although I believe it's a disaster

The Brexiteers got 36% Remain got 34% of the electorate

Whoever set up the referendum was a fool. To make such a major change should have required a real majority. But too late now

I do feel queasy after seeing the demographics

Young people lost

Educated people lost

Demographic groups A and B lost

London and Scotland lost

BTW, where are the new "leaders"? What's the plan? The truth is, there isn't a plan. Boris didn't actually want Brexit. He wanted a slim remain victory so he was set up to take over the Conservative party.

It's a disaster.

[oldsailor35]

Load of crap, anyone from anywhere in the world can sign these petitions. They mean nothing.

[sujoop]

Personally, I don't really care what the results are. I'm American and we have our own political disasters.

But I hate to see a flawed process- what I refer to as the tyranny of the majority. You either have a representative democracy (a Republic), or you have a referendum democracy. Mix and match them willy nilly based on the prevailing whims coming from the headlines today, and you have a disaster in the making.

What's next? Voting whether to redistribute the wealth of the Royal Family? Because if you put that to a vote, they'd be stripped bare next week. Ban all foreigners visiting from predominately Muslim countries? Would pass in a heartbeat.

Back during the race riots in the '60's, Americans would have voted to deport all blacks to Africa had it come to a referendum. (We'd vote to strip Trump of his citizenship if it came to a vote today...)

And all of them would be wrong. Based on the emotions of a malleable and transient public opinion.

Leave the EU, stay in the EU. I don't care. But 52-48% at a single point in time inflamed by the refugee/migrant situation isn't the way to do it.

The most reasoned post thus far. Well stated sir. Respect.

Edited June 26, 2016 by sujoop

[MJP]

I have accepted the decision although I believe it's a disaster

The Brexiteers got 36% Remain got 34% of the electorate

Whoever set up the referendum was a fool. To make such a major change should have required a real majority. But too late now

I do feel queasy after seeing the demographics

Young people lost

Educated people lost

Demographic groups A and B lost

London and Scotland lost

BTW, where are the new "leaders"? What's the plan? The truth is, there isn't a plan. Boris didn't actually want Brexit. He wanted a slim remain victory so he was set up to take over the Conservative party.

It's a disaster.

It needn't have been a disaster, but between the Tories, Labour and Juncker & Co it's certainly being turned into one.

I am officially very worried.

[mommysboy]

I didn't know British voters are that stupid. But read by yourself.

Anger over 'Bregret' as Leave voters say they thought UK would stay in EU

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-anger-bregret-leave-voters-protest-vote-thought-uk-stay-in-eu-remain-win-a7102516.html

If they want kidding around, better they go to Disneyland.

Yep, why would they be any different from your own?

I would class this as dumb, dumb, dumb.

It's so dumb it should be a criminal offence, like reckless behaviour.

[bkkcanuck8]

I have accepted the decision although I believe it's a disaster

The Brexiteers got 36% Remain got 34% of the electorate

Whoever set up the referendum was a fool. To make such a major change should have required a real majority. But too late now

I do feel queasy after seeing the demographics

Young people lost

Educated people lost

Demographic groups A and B lost

London and Scotland lost

BTW, where are the new "leaders"? What's the plan? The truth is, there isn't a plan. Boris didn't actually want Brexit. He wanted a slim remain victory so he was set up to take over the Conservative party.

It's a disaster.

It needn't have been a disaster, but between the Tories, Labour and Juncker & Co it's certainly being turned into one.

I am officially very worried.

The only ones to blame for it being turned into one - is the Leave campaign. It is there responsibility to have a coherent after referendum plan on. Any delay, any lack of action leads to more confusion and additional damage.

It should have been as simple as election - win. Before the markets open, handing over the notice of Article 50. Having an outline of what the plan of what needs to be accomplished sent as an editorial to all the newspapers which get out in the morning newspapers.

[wooloomooloo]

Personally, I don't really care what the results are. I'm American and we have our own political disasters.

But I hate to see a flawed process- what I refer to as the tyranny of the majority. You either have a representative democracy (a Republic), or you have a referendum democracy. Mix and match them willy nilly based on the prevailing whims coming from the headlines today, and you have a disaster in the making.

What's next? Voting whether to redistribute the wealth of the Royal Family? Because if you put that to a vote, they'd be stripped bare next week. Ban all foreigners visiting from predominately Muslim countries? Would pass in a heartbeat.

Back during the race riots in the '60's, Americans would have voted to deport all blacks to Africa had it come to a referendum. (We'd vote to strip Trump of his citizenship if it came to a vote today...)

And all of them would be wrong. Based on the emotions of a malleable and transient public opinion.

Leave the EU, stay in the EU. I don't care. But 52-48% at a single point in time inflamed by the refugee/migrant situation isn't the way to do it.

The most reasoned post thus far. Well stated sir. Respect.

Load of nonsense. Another post emphatically stating that 17MM+ are wrong but impulse doesn't care, though. Strange.

Worry about your forthcoming and as yet undecided presidential election, impulse, as the referendum is already decided.

The Donald for president by the way.

Edited June 26, 2016 by wooloomooloo

[MJP]

I have accepted the decision although I believe it's a disaster

The Brexiteers got 36% Remain got 34% of the electorate

Whoever set up the referendum was a fool. To make such a major change should have required a real majority. But too late now

I do feel queasy after seeing the demographics

Young people lost

Educated people lost

Demographic groups A and B lost

London and Scotland lost

BTW, where are the new "leaders"? What's the plan? The truth is, there isn't a plan. Boris didn't actually want Brexit. He wanted a slim remain victory so he was set up to take over the Conservative party.

It's a disaster.

It needn't have been a disaster, but between the Tories, Labour and Juncker & Co it's certainly being turned into one.

I am officially very worried.

The only ones to blame for it being turned into one - is the Leave campaign. It is there responsibility to have a coherent after referendum plan on. Any delay, any lack of action leads to more confusion and additional damage.

It should have been as simple as election - win. Before the markets open, handing over the notice of Article 50. Having an outline of what the plan of what needs to be accomplished sent as an editorial to all the newspapers which get out in the morning newspapers.

I made a similar comment earlier on in another thread. The response to Brexit should have been unified, not just between UK politicians but UK politicians and the EU commissars, stating clearly the separation would be done smoothly without damage to either the EU or the UK.

They screwed it, mostly down to ego as usual.

[mommysboy]

I have accepted the decision although I believe it's a disaster

The Brexiteers got 36% Remain got 34% of the electorate

Whoever set up the referendum was a fool. To make such a major change should have required a real majority. But too late now

I do feel queasy after seeing the demographics

Young people lost

Educated people lost

Demographic groups A and B lost

London and Scotland lost

BTW, where are the new "leaders"? What's the plan? The truth is, there isn't a plan. Boris didn't actually want Brexit. He wanted a slim remain victory so he was set up to take over the Conservative party.

It's a disaster.

It needn't have been a disaster, but between the Tories, Labour and Juncker & Co it's certainly being turned into one.

I am officially very worried.

The only ones to blame for it being turned into one - is the Leave campaign. It is there responsibility to have a coherent after referendum plan on. Any delay, any lack of action leads to more confusion and additional damage.

It should have been as simple as election - win. Before the markets open, handing over the notice of Article 50. Having an outline of what the plan of what needs to be accomplished sent as an editorial to all the newspapers which get out in the morning newspapers.

It's become a poison chalice. Whoever picks it up, consigns himself to be the man that took UK out of Europe, that broke up the Union, caused recession, went against parliament's wishes. I think the Brexits thought tossacoin Dave was going to be the fall guy. I can see the reasoning: he's been a fool about everything else.

Edited June 26, 2016 by mommysboy

[wooloomooloo]

They screwed it, mostly down to ego as usual.

I'd say that the remainers and the twenty seven EU states are sulking like little girls. Leave them to it.

[wooloomooloo]

It's become a poison chalice. Whoever picks it up, consigns himself to be the man that took UK out of Europe, that broke up the Union, caused recession, went against parliaments wishes.

Parliament is there for the good of the people and not parliamentarians. You've a lot to learn.

[MJP]

They screwed it, mostly down to ego as usual.

I'd say that the remainers and the twenty seven EU states are sulking like little girls. Leave them to it.

The only reason this IS becoming a disaster is the way it's being handled (or not handled at all by those who should be handling it).

None of this is good thus far. I have a disturbing feeling it's started as it means to go on.

Edited June 26, 2016 by MJP

[JHolmesJr]

Personally, I don't really care what the results are. I'm American and we have our own political disasters.

But I hate to see a flawed process- what I refer to as the tyranny of the majority. You either have a representative democracy (a Republic), or you have a referendum democracy. Mix and match them willy nilly based on the prevailing whims coming from the headlines today, and you have a disaster in the making.

What's next? Voting whether to redistribute the wealth of the Royal Family? Because if you put that to a vote, they'd be stripped bare next week. Ban all foreigners visiting from predominately Muslim countries? Would pass in a heartbeat.

Back during the race riots in the '60's, Americans would have voted to deport all blacks to Africa had it come to a referendum. (We'd vote to strip Trump of his citizenship if it came to a vote today...)

And all of them would be wrong. Based on the emotions of a malleable and transient public opinion.

Leave the EU, stay in the EU. I don't care. But 52-48% at a single point in time inflamed by the refugee/migrant situation isn't the way to do it.

The most reasoned post thus far. Well stated sir. Respect.

Never seen anyone complain when referendums give the result the referendum initiator is expecting….but when they lose then it becomes the….

Tyranny of the majority???

What are you on about? You think everyone who votes is some kind of genius with a phd in global economics and finance? They are just people who vote in what they want and vote out what they don't.

That's the will of the voters….for better or worse.

Now the politicians need to accept that and make this situation work….or resign so someone else can give it a go.

[MJP]

Watching a BBC Question Time Special right now.

Yikes! None have a clue. We have NO leadership. It's carnage.

[mommysboy]

I didn't know British voters are that stupid. But read by yourself.

Anger over 'Bregret' as Leave voters say they thought UK would stay in EU

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-anger-bregret-leave-voters-protest-vote-thought-uk-stay-in-eu-remain-win-a7102516.html

If they want kidding around, better they go to Disneyland.

Democracy of one vote for one person and every person can vote is based on the believe that yes -- you will have complete morons who will participate -- but that on average they will nullify each other out by being spread out over all sides. Yes, stupid people do vote.... but stupidity is not an excuse.

There should be a basic competence test: being able to recognize your own name, walk and chew gum at the same time, getting the answer to 2 plus 2 right.

[bkkcanuck8]

I didn't know British voters are that stupid. But read by yourself.

Anger over 'Bregret' as Leave voters say they thought UK would stay in EU

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/uk/politics/brexit-anger-bregret-leave-voters-protest-vote-thought-uk-stay-in-eu-remain-win-a7102516.html

If they want kidding around, better they go to Disneyland.

Democracy of one vote for one person and every person can vote is based on the believe that yes -- you will have complete morons who will participate -- but that on average they will nullify each other out by being spread out over all sides. Yes, stupid people do vote.... but stupidity is not an excuse.

There should be a basic competence test: being able to recognize your own name, walk and chew gum at the same time, getting the answer to 2 plus 2 right.

Great idea, more people with a disgusting habit

[Guest]

The only reason this IS becoming a disaster is the way it's being handled (or not handled at all by those who should be handling it).

None of this is good thus far. I have a disturbing feeling it's started as it means to go on.

The whole brexit started many years ago as a power game in UK. There was a need to please the Eurosceptics to gain votes.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu-britain-finland-idUSBRE89H19J20121018

Cameron was eager to prove his view that everybody loves EU that he announced the referendum vote. He was 110% sure it would be a jog in a park. After all, all the previous votes had been successes.

Cameron was dead wrong. He did not understood how sick and tired ordinary people were about the UK politics. These people wanted to show that they have power and voted against Cameron.. as well as the EU which Cameron supported.

The populists saw the opportunity and used the agony of British people for their own gain. They wanted power. They wanted to rule the UK. For the populists, there is almost nothing what is considered as beyond fair play. It's ok to lie, it's ok to make false claims. It's ok to do pretty much anything to gain votes and manipulate people's minds. The populists did exactly that.

So, now we are in this mess. UK people don't really wish to leave the EU, but they have voted to do so. How to manage the unbearable situation? The situation which very few people actually wants. Some old sods do, but they are in minority.

There are different ways. One is to have a second referendum. Another easy way out is to get Scotland to veto the result.

Then there is a possibility of general elections. The newly elected government wouldn't be obligated to follow the promises to obey the results of the advisory referendum poll.

On top of all this, there is the EU. EU might see Brexit as an opportunity to make EU a more functional entity. It might be happy for the referendum results and the fact that UK is out of the EU's core.

I'm with the EU, but I'll be sad for the good folks in UK.

Edited June 26, 2016 by Guest

[MJP]

The only reason this IS becoming a disaster is the way it's being handled (or not handled at all by those who should be handling it).

None of this is good thus far. I have a disturbing feeling it's started as it means to go on.

The whole brexit started many years ago as a power game in UK. There was a need to please the Eurosceptics to gain votes.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu-britain-finland-idUSBRE89H19J20121018

Cameron was eager to prove his view that everybody loves EU that he announced the referendum vote. He was 110% sure it would be a jog in a park. After all, all the previous votes had been successes.

Cameron was dead wrong. He did not understood how sick and tired ordinary people were about the UK politics. These people wanted to show that they have power and voted against Cameron.. as well as the EU which Cameron supported.

So, now we are in this mess. UK people don't really wish to leave the EU, but they have voted to do so. How to manage the unbearable situation? The situation which very few people actually wants. Some old sods do, but they are in minority.

There are different ways. One is to have a second referendum. Another easy way out is to get Scotland to veto the result.

Then there is a possibility of general elections. The newly elected government wouldn't be obligated to follow the promises to obey the results of the advisory referendum poll.

On top of all this, there is the EU. EU might see Brexit as an opportunity to make EU a more functional entity. It might be happy for the referendum results and the fact that UK is out of the EU's core.

I'm with the EU, but I'll be sad for the good folks in UK.

Oly, if one good thing comes out of this it'll be the abandonment of political parties. Party "politics" has been riding roughshod over the UK for decades.

New system needed. Perhaps all independent MP's and everything a free vote.

Look at the UK press today. Nothing about how to make the best of it. Everything about the Labour Party or the Conservative Party. Sick of it!

[bkkcanuck8]

The only reason this IS becoming a disaster is the way it's being handled (or not handled at all by those who should be handling it).

None of this is good thus far. I have a disturbing feeling it's started as it means to go on.

The whole brexit started many years ago as a power game in UK. There was a need to please the Eurosceptics to gain votes.

http://www.reuters.com/article/us-eu-britain-finland-idUSBRE89H19J20121018

Cameron was eager to prove his view that everybody loves EU that he announced the referendum vote. He was 110% sure it would be a jog in a park. After all, all the previous votes had been successes.

Cameron was dead wrong. He did not understood how sick and tired ordinary people were about the UK politics. These people wanted to show that they have power and voted against Cameron.. as well as the EU which Cameron supported.

So, now we are in this mess. UK people don't really wish to leave the EU, but they have voted to do so. How to manage the unbearable situation? The situation which very few people actually wants. Some old sods do, but they are in minority.

There are different ways. One is to have a second referendum. Another easy way out is to get Scotland to veto the result.

Then there is a possibility of general elections. The newly elected government wouldn't be obligated to follow the promises to obey the results of the advisory referendum poll.

On top of all this, there is the EU. EU might see Brexit as an opportunity to make EU a more functional entity. It might be happy for the referendum results and the fact that UK is out of the EU's core.

I'm with the EU, but I'll be sad for the good folks in UK.

Scotland does not have a veto, just a veto over changing Scottish regulations with respect to the EU.

The only valid way out is if they could force an election and a pro-EU party campaigned on the a primary platform of UK in the EU - then they would have a mandate to ignore the referendum results. Of course article 50 should have already been executed which would have made it difficult, but it hasn't for whatever reasons - even some on here that seemed to be for UK out seem to be in no rush to invoke article 50... which to me sounds like they just wanted to cry wolf.

[mommysboy]

Watching a BBC Question Time Special right now.

Yikes! None have a clue. We have NO leadership. It's carnage.

Yup, I get the impression it was the result no one wanted, especially the Brexiters. Call my bluff.

Reminds me of Til Death Us Do Part - The Movie. Alf was cockahoop when war was declared, then he accidently got his call up papers. Went white in the face.

Brexiteers got the call up papers.

[Guest]

Oly, if one good thing comes out of this it'll be the abandonment of political parties. Party "politics" has been riding roughshod over the UK for decades.

New system needed. Perhaps all independent MP's and everything a free vote.

Look at the UK press today. Nothing about how to make the best of it. Everything about the Labour Party or the Conservative Party. Sick of it!

I agree. The only way I can think of to improve the current system, is to drop the power of decision to the lowest possible entity.

This means that the villages can deal with their own issues, if they choose to do so.

Then there are things like hospitals, which should be co-operative between villages as it would be beneficial for all.

The major things, like military etc. are still done in the country level. If the country is part of the EU, then these should be handed to EU.

Same applies to negotiating deals, wether these are freedom of movement or financial matters.

It quite the same as we have already done over the centuries. The difference would be, that one of the upper levels objectives is trying to push the decision making process down to smaller entities, instead of trying to keep the power with themselves.