ex taking daughter back to thailand WITHOUT MY PERMISSION

[balo]

You can never win this battle. What did you expect  , a happy family life in the UK ?

Thai family always comes first and if she's not happy , you will not win . 

 

[MadMuhummad]

On 8 August 2016 at 6:39 PM, IMA_FARANG said:

In thailand simply being listed on a birth certificate as the father .does not automatically make you thre legal father.

The fact that you are not married to your girlfriend may cause you problems here in Thailand.

It qould be better if you coild show you were legally married to your wife at the time your child eas born.

This is not the U.K.  and the rules there do not apply here.

God luck but your assymption she will automatically be better of in the U.K. than here "[n the Jungle" will ot go over well here in Thailand

 

Youre aware he's actually in the U.K. right now?

[MadMuhummad]

2 hours ago, AlexRich said:

If the child is in Thailand and is a Thai national I don't think a UK court can do anything, and a Thai court is more likely to favour the mother. A heart breaking situation for anyone who wants to be involved and influence his daughters future. I guess the practical solution, if you want to call it that, is to maintain reasonable relations with the mother without putting a strain on your finances ... but don't allow yourself to be bled dry, and all the very best. 

Once again, he's still in the U.K.

[MadMuhummad]

Unfortunately their looks to be no concrete previous experience with this matter mate. As mentioned previously, go pay the money for some quality profession advice.

Good luck with keeping your girl with you...

[sead]

I'm almost 100% certain she can't take out your baby without your consent.  just file a report to the police and the toll at airport stating that your wife is trying to take your baby out

[Dene16]

1 hour ago, sead said:

I'm almost 100% certain she can't take out your baby without your consent.  just file a report to the police and the toll at airport stating that your wife is trying to take your baby out

 

As much as i hate to say it, even if possible, what would be the point of stopping the child leaving as you would only prolong the process

Look at the facts

95+ % of custody battles do go to the mother, this is simply because a mother, has and will continue to be, the parent the child sees on a regular basis and therefore has a strong bond. People will argue this but it's a fact. As someone has already mentioned would she be farmed out to relatives or childminders.

The child has grown up in Thailand and has no family ties/familiarity, apart from yourself, to anyone in the UK.

Why would she be better off here if you were supporting your daughter in Thailand

Would she struggle because of the language barrier

You claim she wanted  her to stay here, this is hearsay and means nothing.

Although the child's best interests are foremost they would also have to take into account (although minor) Thai law  does not recognise you as the father. 

The list can go on but the bottom line is it's a battle very very unlikely to win and will cost you money and heartache as she will turn her against you.

Keep in constant contact and when she is 14 years old ( in UK law) has a say in who she want to live with . Bring her here on holidays, whenever possible and if she can integrate with others i'm sure she will want to stay.

Good luck with your efforts.

I used to travel 300 miles every 2 weeks  to see mine until she forced her mother to return to our home town after 7 months. It was me she chose to live with when she could.

 

[alofthailand]

Play dirty. Assert that the wife was/is a prostitute and your child will be groomed to be a prostitute. Get immigration to check on the legal status of the others girls -Drugs? Prostitution- gambling- partying - drinking- immigrant status etc etc. The lesson for the rest of men marrying Thais -Don't take them back home- keep them trained and obedient on a short leash!

[F4UCorsair]

You can take the girl out of Thailand, but you can't tale Thailand out of the girl.

 

Asians, generally, don't settle well anywhere other than home.

 

 

[AlexRich]

9 hours ago, MadMuhummad said:

Once again, he's still in the U.K.

 

I think you'll find it's a "she", if you are referring to the child?

[SOUTHERNSTAR]

23 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

No it's not. He can make arrangements to save for his daughter's future and / or provide things rather than simply giving cash over.

 

So if the arrangements don't meet his requirements he don't pay maintenance ? Last time I checked the court will decide on maintenance to be paid and don't control how its spend by the parent with primary custody. If the maintenance is not spend according to acceptable norms then the father will have legal recourse, but the father have no right to withhold maintenance because he thinks the mother will not spend the money correctly.

[manfredtillmann]

6 hours ago, F4UCorsair said:

You can take the girl out of Thailand, but you can't tale Thailand out of the girl.

 

Asians, generally, don't settle well anywhere other than home.

 

 

what a load of misplaced, opinionated crap.

 

[manfredtillmann]

On 8/12/2016 at 10:15 PM, bobrussell said:

Absolutely incorrect! The authorities are perfectly entitled to prevent a child being taken out of the country. This happened with my niece.

The Police have short term powers if it is considered imminent. The Family Court may issue a residence order which will generally stipulate where the child is to live and what rights each parent has.

If you had bothered to check any of the links you would know who is talking crap!

 

There is no guarantee what the outcome of the case will be but there are plenty who have been through 'this crap'.

 

Could it be that you were badly advised?

no!

[Baerboxer]

12 minutes ago, SOUTHERNSTAR said:

So if the arrangements don't meet his requirements he don't pay maintenance ? Last time I checked the court will decide on maintenance to be paid and don't control how its spend by the parent with primary custody. If the maintenance is not spend according to acceptable norms then the father will have legal recourse, but the father have no right to withhold maintenance because he thinks the mother will not spend the money correctly.

 

He's in the UK. He hasn't divorced, there is no court order specifying maintenance. He is talking about making voluntary contributions. In which case he can dictate how it's spent, or change the amount, or stop paying as he wishes.

 

If he chooses to provide things - clothes. toys, pay schools direct etc that is his privilege. 

 

This will be subject to Thai law - and we know how good that is or UK law. His wife would have to go to court in the UK to get a caught order for support payments. The Child Support Agency will not get involved if the child is outside the UK. In fact, even if he was paying via the CSA that would tell him the entitlement ceases when the child is no linger resident in the UK. 

 

That's why he needs good legal advice, not urban myths or opinions from people in irrelevant legal jurisdictions.

[Baerboxer]

9 minutes ago, manfredtillmann said:

what a load of misplaced, opinionated crap.

 

 

That would be in your experience would it?

 

Mine is that most Thai people I've met in Europe or other Asian countries all want to buy property in Thailand so than can go back sooner or later.

[manfredtillmann]

5 minutes ago, Baerboxer said:

 

He's in the UK. He hasn't divorced, there is no court order specifying maintenance. He is talking about making voluntary contributions. In which case he can dictate how it's spent, or change the amount, or stop paying as he wishes.

 

If he chooses to provide things - clothes. toys, pay schools direct etc that is his privilege. 

 

This will be subject to Thai law - and we know how good that is or UK law. His wife would have to go to court in the UK to get a caught order for support payments. The Child Support Agency will not get involved if the child is outside the UK. In fact, even if he was paying via the CSA that would tell him the entitlement ceases when the child is no linger resident in the UK. 

 

That's why he needs good legal advice, not urban myths or opinions from people in irrelevant legal jurisdictions.

i believe child support claims will not be able to be made or enforced if the child is in thailand and the father in gb.

the notion of him 'dictating' the conditions of spending are just ludicrous, how on earth is he going to police this.

1 minute ago, Baerboxer said:

 

That would be in your experience would it?

 

Mine is that most Thai people I've met in Europe or other Asian countries all want to buy property in Thailand so than can go back sooner or later.

strange you so vehemently support someone else's post but, claiming: 'Asians, generally, don't settle well anywhere other than home.' has been dis - proved by history so many times.

just two little examples, and please feel free to google 1000nds more:

#1chinese cooks supporting the american railway building effort and after settling building successful business empires in the usa.

#2 'boat people' immigrants to australia in the 70's, now making up very large proportion of wealthy families strongly involved in local politics and business affairs. approx. 12% of all australians have some form of asian background and if you'd like to dig a little deeper,just check out which european ethnic majority features most heavily in the social security support statistics...

so, no, this is not MY experience at all,

[Baerboxer]

19 minutes ago, manfredtillmann said:

i believe child support claims will not be able to be made or enforced if the child is in thailand and the father in gb.

the notion of him 'dictating' the conditions of spending are just ludicrous, how on earth is he going to police this.

strange you so vehemently support someone else's post but, claiming: 'Asians, generally, don't settle well anywhere other than home.' has been dis - proved by history so many times.

just two little examples, and please feel free to google 1000nds more:

#1chinese cooks supporting the american railway building effort and after settling building successful business empires in the usa.

#2 'boat people' immigrants to australia in the 70's, now making up very large proportion of wealthy families strongly involved in local politics and business affairs. approx. 12% of all australians have some form of asian background and if you'd like to dig a little deeper,just check out which european ethnic majority features most heavily in the social security support statistics...

so, no, this is not MY experience at all,

 

Did it escape your notice that the Chinese were fleeing poverty and repressive imperial regimes at the time? And how many Chinese-Americans live in America compared to Chinese people in China. Hardly a mass exodus. Chinese people, like Indians, spread to many countries, leaving their own heavily populated countries in search of better futures.

 

The boat people were also fleeing a communist regime.

 

That doesn't mean many, and IME a great proportion, like to buy property back in the "home' country or that of their parents. Many Asian I know buy property and land in their country of origin whilst retaining their new citizenship. And Thais, IME, all like to buy property and land in Thailand as soon as they get the chance. 

 

Yes, many Asian offspring and subsequent generations build successful careers, obtain wealth, education, take part in civil life in their new countries. Doesn't mean they loose the connection with their origins.

 

As for controlling spend for his daughter's benefit - pretty obvious if you think about it creatively.

Edited August 23, 2016 by Baerboxer

[mercman24]

why is everyone still posting on this subject, the HORSE HAS BOLTED as it were, the child is now back on Thailand, there is nothing this guy can do about it now, and he has thanked you all, (with much mis-information ) may i add. anyhow, beware of sending too much money, you will be keeping uncle tom cobbly and all otherwise, enjoy your visit in September. best wishes. i know of many who come to the UK and get dreadfully homesick, that is why many thai marriages do not work out.once in the UK (lives with 3 friends in the same boat) for example

[SOUTHERNSTAR]

2 hours ago, Baerboxer said:

 

He's in the UK. He hasn't divorced, there is no court order specifying maintenance. He is talking about making voluntary contributions. In which case he can dictate how it's spent, or change the amount, or stop paying as he wishes.

 

If he chooses to provide things - clothes. toys, pay schools direct etc that is his privilege. 

 

This will be subject to Thai law - and we know how good that is or UK law. His wife would have to go to court in the UK to get a caught order for support payments. The Child Support Agency will not get involved if the child is outside the UK. In fact, even if he was paying via the CSA that would tell him the entitlement ceases when the child is no linger resident in the UK. 

 

That's why he needs good legal advice, not urban myths or opinions from people in irrelevant legal jurisdictions.

I wrote my original comment due to the OP's comment below. From this its clear he don't want to pay maintenance and will pay money into his daughters UK account, which will be of no use for her until she's 18 years old. If you disagree its okay but it seems to me he is on the wrong way. As for legal advice I agree, but he already have seen a lawyer, so my advice was not a legal opinion but a life experience piece of advice. If he refuse to pay maintenance even after a court order which will most probably be a Thai one he will not be able to visit his daughter in the jungle without being arrested. This will mean that he will not see his daughter until she is old enough to travel on her own. Do you think the money is worth the girl growing up without seeing her father ?

 

"thanks for all your advice ,,, i went to see lawyer yesterday morning and was told it was going to cost at least £3000 pounds to put a stop n her taking the baby out of the uk ,, he wanted £1000 on account yesterday ! just to start the ball rolling ,, he said it would cost several thousand pounds at least ??  crazy  i only want best for my baby .. i rang the mother yesterday , she was alone and talked differantly to when the other thai women are there .. i offered her money to keep the baby here , she said NO i offered £5000 pounds as a starter she still said NO ,, she said the baby isnt going to the jungle which i find hard to believe ?? she and the father of her first baby have never takien care of the 10 year old ,, in fact i sent money to the grand parents every month for a child which isnty mine . ive thought long and hard about this and i am going to put money in my babys uk bank every month and hen shes 18 she will have a nice nest egg 

im not supporting the lazy whisky drinking vermin up in the jungle while i work hard here in the uk

ill leave the ball in the exs corner and lets see what happens when the family start putting pressure on the ex to find money for 2 kids ?

ive took care of ex for 4 years  now its her turn !!

AGAIN THANKS ALL ill keep you posted "

[manfredtillmann]

4 minutes ago, SOUTHERNSTAR said:

I wrote my original comment due to the OP's comment below. From this its clear he don't want to pay maintenance and will pay money into his daughters UK account, which will be of no use for her until she's 18 years old. If you disagree its okay but it seems to me he is on the wrong way. As for legal advice I agree, but he already have seen a lawyer, so my advice was not a legal opinion but a life experience piece of advice. If he refuse to pay maintenance even after a court order which will most probably be a Thai one he will not be able to visit his daughter in the jungle without being arrested. This will mean that he will not see his daughter until she is old enough to travel on her own. Do you think the money is worth the girl growing up without seeing her father ?

 

"thanks for all your advice ,,, i went to see lawyer yesterday morning and was told it was going to cost at least £3000 pounds to put a stop n her taking the baby out of the uk ,, he wanted £1000 on account yesterday ! just to start the ball rolling ,, he said it would cost several thousand pounds at least ??  crazy  i only want best for my baby .. i rang the mother yesterday , she was alone and talked differantly to when the other thai women are there .. i offered her money to keep the baby here , she said NO i offered £5000 pounds as a starter she still said NO ,, she said the baby isnt going to the jungle which i find hard to believe ?? she and the father of her first baby have never takien care of the 10 year old ,, in fact i sent money to the grand parents every month for a child which isnty mine . ive thought long and hard about this and i am going to put money in my babys uk bank every month and hen shes 18 she will have a nice nest egg 

im not supporting the lazy whisky drinking vermin up in the jungle while i work hard here in the uk

ill leave the ball in the exs corner and lets see what happens when the family start putting pressure on the ex to find money for 2 kids ?

ive took care of ex for 4 years  now its her turn !!

AGAIN THANKS ALL ill keep you posted "

and that is the only sensible way to deal with this. and don't let it get to you over the years when she does not reply to your birthday wishes or else...  put it in some little corner of your mind and try to move on.

[jacksam]

14 hours ago, alofthailand said:

Play dirty. Assert that the wife was/is a prostitute and your child will be groomed to be a prostitute. Get immigration to check on the legal status of the others girls -Drugs? Prostitution- gambling- partying - drinking- immigrant status etc etc. The lesson for the rest of men marrying Thais -Don't take them back home- keep them trained and obedient on a short leash!

Most ridiculous post on this thread thus far....and thinking impossible to top.

[Baerboxer]

19 hours ago, SOUTHERNSTAR said:

I wrote my original comment due to the OP's comment below. From this its clear he don't want to pay maintenance and will pay money into his daughters UK account, which will be of no use for her until she's 18 years old. If you disagree its okay but it seems to me he is on the wrong way. As for legal advice I agree, but he already have seen a lawyer, so my advice was not a legal opinion but a life experience piece of advice. If he refuse to pay maintenance even after a court order which will most probably be a Thai one he will not be able to visit his daughter in the jungle without being arrested. This will mean that he will not see his daughter until she is old enough to travel on her own. Do you think the money is worth the girl growing up without seeing her father ?

 

"thanks for all your advice ,,, i went to see lawyer yesterday morning and was told it was going to cost at least £3000 pounds to put a stop n her taking the baby out of the uk ,, he wanted £1000 on account yesterday ! just to start the ball rolling ,, he said it would cost several thousand pounds at least ??  crazy  i only want best for my baby .. i rang the mother yesterday , she was alone and talked differantly to when the other thai women are there .. i offered her money to keep the baby here , she said NO i offered £5000 pounds as a starter she still said NO ,, she said the baby isnt going to the jungle which i find hard to believe ?? she and the father of her first baby have never takien care of the 10 year old ,, in fact i sent money to the grand parents every month for a child which isnty mine . ive thought long and hard about this and i am going to put money in my babys uk bank every month and hen shes 18 she will have a nice nest egg 

im not supporting the lazy whisky drinking vermin up in the jungle while i work hard here in the uk

ill leave the ball in the exs corner and lets see what happens when the family start putting pressure on the ex to find money for 2 kids ?

ive took care of ex for 4 years  now its her turn !!

AGAIN THANKS ALL ill keep you posted "

 

Always a difficult balance - emotional/love versus money and bitterness between former partners. If the wife uses money exclusively for the daughter and is co-operative on contact then that's different to using the daughter to blackmail money which she then does as she pleases with. And should be dealt with differently.

Court orders must be adhered to, or face the consequences. But, the OP, IMO. missed the chance by not acting more quickly to get the matter resolved in the UK before his wife brought his daughter back to Thailand. Bear in mind, the driving factor for a UK Family Court is always the child's best interest and future. A lot would have depended on all the circumstances which we are not privy too; and yes, courts normally do favor keeping young children with their mothers. But, we don't know all the context.

 

It's going to be very difficulty for the OP now and he has my deep sympathy. It's so annoying that legal services are so expensive in the UK. But there are public information offices, charities, NGO's, legal organizations and parent groups where the OP can obtain help, support and advice. He would be well advises to pursue those. And not assume that what happens in one legal system is the same as another.

[BuriramDevelopers]

Plain and simple, that's child abduction.  i Know my wife could never cross a border, leaving Europe,  with our child .She needs to show a letter of permission from me, or won't be able to board a plane. That is Holland and i suppose main land Europe. Don't know the rules elsewhre, but can imagine they have somthing similar there.

A visit to the police station will be sufficient to mark her name . She will get a visit from child protection service and police soon after.

And leaving will be concidered a crime. Thailand has good understandings with the Duth government in these matters. That is what i have seen in past experiences in my surroundings. Hope your country has the same

Good luck to you.

Edited August 24, 2016 by BuriramDevelopers