Pattaya going downhill!

[bkk6060]

If they decide to do away with visible the Gogo's, ladies, etc., no problem as there has been a huge transition anyway to online dating and contacts with numerous sites.  I actually use these more then the venues now.  You can actually have a semi conversation rather then trying to scream in their ear. But, I assume all guys know about this.  Anyway, there will always be a huge demand here obviously, FOR the money!. Pattaya is #1 the greatest place on earth.

[OMGImInPattaya]

4 hours ago, Awohalitsiktoli said:

Wouldn't it be hideous to have to live on an island in a hut with not much around but nature.  Actually, some of the most expensive holiday destinations on the planet cater to people who want just that (albeit with 5 star luxury):

 

 

This is on a private island in Fiji.  Horrible looking isn't it.  No traffic jams, no high-rise condo units.......and look at all those terrible trees.  There is almost no development that I can see.  It must be going "downhill."  Maybe if they would just come and take a look at Pattaya-Jomtien they could learn something about development that is going uphill.

I certainly wouldn't want to live there...where can i buy my artisanal bread and chocolates...where are the beautiful ladyboys? It might be a nice place to holiday for a week or so but I'll take Pattaya as a place to live any time.

[pattayadude]

7 hours ago, OMGImInPattaya said:

I certainly wouldn't want to live there...where can i buy my artisanal bread and chocolates...where are the beautiful ladyboys? It might be a nice place to holiday for a week or so but I'll take Pattaya as a place to live any time.

I agree with you.Not only this place lacks artisinal bread,designer chocolates and gorgeous ladyboys, look how bad it's flooded with ocean water.I bet this place has a huge traffic problem with millions of fish around the reef. Also too bad that it doesn't have any ocean front skyscrapers that I'm used to. I'll pass...

[OMGImInPattaya]

16 minutes ago, pattayadude said:

I agree with you.Not only this place lacks artisinal bread,designer chocolates and gorgeous ladyboys, look how bad it's flooded with ocean water.I bet this place has a huge traffic problem with millions of fish around the reef. Also too bad that it doesn't have any ocean front skyscrapers that I'm used to. I'll pass...

I bet the internet is slow as creepers too...no, the poster can have it.

[Awohalitsiktoli]

11 hours ago, OMGImInPattaya said:

I certainly wouldn't want to live there...where can i buy my artisanal bread and chocolates...where are the beautiful ladyboys? It might be a nice place to holiday for a week or so but I'll take Pattaya as a place to live any time.

I would only want to live there if I could easily take a trip to a nice city with all of the modern conveniences.   The not so obvious point that I was trying to make is that the positive elements (e.g. beautiful natural areas, uncrowded conditions, peace and quiet, etc.) that you see in the picture no longer exist in Pattaya-Jomtien.  Why?  Because the planners, influenced by greed and the idea that all growth is good, embraced the cancer model of development:  growth, growth, growth and more growth!  They actually could have created a lot of green spaces, but they did the opposite and destroyed the natural environment, replacing it with a huge slab of concrete.   IMHO, there is a relationship between development and quality of life, but unrestrained, unregulated development often leads to a decline in quality of life. At that point, the place in question is going downhill, not uphill. 

[SheungWan]

Nobody lives there.

[OMGImInPattaya]

2 hours ago, Awohalitsiktoli said:

I would only want to live there if I could easily take a trip to a nice city with all of the modern conveniences.   The not so obvious point that I was trying to make is that the positive elements (e.g. beautiful natural areas, uncrowded conditions, peace and quiet, etc.) that you see in the picture no longer exist in Pattaya-Jomtien.  Why?  Because the planners, influenced by greed and the idea that all growth is good, embraced the cancer model of development:  growth, growth, growth and more growth!  They actually could have created a lot of green spaces, but they did the opposite and destroyed the natural environment, replacing it with a huge slab of concrete.   IMHO, there is a relationship between development and quality of life, but unrestrained, unregulated development often leads to a decline in quality of life. At that point, the place in question is going downhill, not uphill. 

I think London has one of the highest ratios of public parks and green spaces to land area of any major metropolitan area...so I guess by your definition, it must have a great quality of life. Funny, however, the number of British tourists and expats Pattaya seems to attract. I guess parks are not the be-all and end-all of existence.

 

However, I agree with your general point...but poor Third World countries are generally not noted for the environmental protection and urban planning.  

[Awohalitsiktoli]

28 minutes ago, OMGImInPattaya said:

I think London has one of the highest ratios of public parks and green spaces to land area of any major metropolitan area...so I guess by your definition, it must have a great quality of life. Funny, however, the number of British tourists and expats Pattaya seems to attract. I guess parks are not the be-all and end-all of existence.

 

However, I agree with your general point...but poor Third World countries are generally not noted for the environmental protection and urban planning.  

No, London would not be a good example of what I am talking about.  Urban areas of that size have long since passed the point of no return. But green spaces do help.  The development of cities seems to go through three phases:  1) undeveloped phase; 2) a phase where there is not too much or too little development; 3) an overdeveloped phase and all of its associated problems (e.g. people pollution, traffic jams, air pollution, etc). Many of the posters who are stating that Pattaya-Jomtien is going downhill probably wish that it would have remained in the second phase of development.  What is happening now (phase 3) in terms of development is unsustainable, leading to a decline in quality of life for most (not all) of the residents.

[newnative]

I think Pattaya is actually at a good stage now. It's gotten big enough that it's able to attract nice shopping like Central Festival and the coming Terminal 21 plus stores like Index, Home Pro, and Chic Republic. Big enough to have theaters that play movies in English. Big enough to have a wide selection of housing--both condos and homes.  Big enough for quality hospitals.  Big enough for a wide variety of restaurants and food stores.  It's at a stage where the ticky-tacky and flimsy is being replaced by nicer and better quality.  Private industry is doing its part--companies big and small are making small to huge investments in Pattaya.  Now it's time for the city to step up to the plate and get working on major infrastructure improvements--including wider, better sidewalks on streets like Pattaya Second Road, improving road connectivity, eliminating parking on some major roads, reorganizing and expanding the baht taxi line, building parking garages, overhauling parking regulations, especially for buses, and enforcing better compliance with the laws. Unfortunately, a huge chunk of critical  infrastructure money is being spent on the very poorly planned tunnel project.

[onemorechang]

34 minutes ago, newnative said:

 Unfortunately, a huge chunk of critical  infrastructure money is being spent on the very poorly planned tunnel project.

 

Heavens forbid,   we cant have the pattaya  gravy boat starved of money.

what ever next. 

[pattayadude]

2 hours ago, OMGImInPattaya said:

I think London has one of the highest ratios of public parks and green spaces to land area of any major metropolitan area...so I guess by your definition, it must have a great quality of life. Funny, however, the number of British tourists and expats Pattaya seems to attract. I guess parks are not the be-all and end-all of existence.

 

However, I agree with your general point...but poor Third World countries are generally not noted for the environmental protection and urban planning.  

 

[pattayadude]

I am not qualified to comment whether or not Pattaya is going uphill or downhill but I still haven't been able to make sense of what happened to the new marina project near Bali Hai pier. It's mind boggling how  a billion baht project has been totally abandoned, let to rot and literally to be washed away right before it was almost completed.No one has taken responsibility! the area is in shambles! The least they could do is make an effort to fix it or dismantle it all together...I wonder if they realized that it's too expensive if they try to do anything so they may have decided that the nature should take care of it in a few hundred years just like in "Life after people" series.

 

Edited September 11, 2016 by pattayadude

[onemorechang]

1 minute ago, pattayadude said:

I am not qualified to comment whether or not Pattaya is going uphill or downhill but I still haven't been able to make sense of what happened to the new marina project near Bali Hai pier. It's mind boggling how  a billion baht project has been totally abandoned, let to rot and literally to be washed away right before it was almost completed.No one has taken responsibility! the area is in shambles! The least they could do is make an effort to fix it or dismantle it all together...I wonder if they realized that it's too expensive if they try to do anything so they may have decided that the nature should take care of it in a few hundred years just like in "Life after people" series.

 

Maybe the gravy boat was emptied,   before it was all finished.

 

 

[whitemouse]

20 hours ago, Awohalitsiktoli said:

Wouldn't it be hideous to have to live on an island in a hut with not much around but nature.  Actually, some of the most expensive holiday destinations on the planet cater to people who want just that (albeit with 5 star luxury):

 

 

This is on a private island in Fiji.  Horrible looking isn't it.  No traffic jams, no high-rise condo units.......and look at all those terrible trees.  There is almost no development that I can see.  It must be going "downhill."  Maybe if they would just come and take a look at Pattaya-Jomtien they could learn something about development that is going uphill.

 

This  may be very high end holiday resort, but could you live there 6 months?  How long ca anybody stare at the rock and water until you lose your mind? I'd die of boredom on day 3. 

[pattayadude]

Even the rich can't afford $1500 a day after day 3 .LOL

[thaibeachlovers]

2 hours ago, newnative said:

I think Pattaya is actually at a good stage now. It's gotten big enough that it's able to attract nice shopping like Central Festival and the coming Terminal 21 plus stores like Index, Home Pro, and Chic Republic. Big enough to have theaters that play movies in English. Big enough to have a wide selection of housing--both condos and homes.  Big enough for quality hospitals.  Big enough for a wide variety of restaurants and food stores.  It's at a stage where the ticky-tacky and flimsy is being replaced by nicer and better quality.  Private industry is doing its part--companies big and small are making small to huge investments in Pattaya.  Now it's time for the city to step up to the plate and get working on major infrastructure improvements--including wider, better sidewalks on streets like Pattaya Second Road, improving road connectivity, eliminating parking on some major roads, reorganizing and expanding the baht taxi line, building parking garages, overhauling parking regulations, especially for buses, and enforcing better compliance with the laws. Unfortunately, a huge chunk of critical  infrastructure money is being spent on the very poorly planned tunnel project.

Big enough to have theaters that play movies in English

 

LOL. Pattaya had everything you like over 20 years ago. It even had a very nice mall, though perhaps it has to be as large as Central to qualify for you.

 

As for wider pavements on Second, LOL, LOL, LOL. That would require planning, removing parking, and spending money on infrastructure, none of which are a Pattaya thing.

 

There are two types of farang in Pattaya- those that love Pattaya as it was, before the administration had dreams of the Riviera on Pattaya Bay, and those that want Pattaya to be the Riviera on Pattaya Bay. At the moment, neither sort are happy, and I doubt it's going to get any better than the way it is right now.

 

PS, IMO there is a very small category of farang that actually think Pattaya is great the way it is, but like I said, very small.

Edited September 11, 2016 by thaibeachlovers

[thaibeachlovers]

On 9 กันยายน 2559 at 7:55 AM, pattayadude said:

those who dislike pattaya can move elsewhere.Plain and simple!.No need to beat the poor horse if it's already dead...You came, you saw, you conquered.No need to bash and be considerate for those who like living or have to make a living there. And there are "only" hundreds of cities in the world and a several of them can last you a lifetime.Why force yourself to live in a place you don't enjoy anymore? true, Pattaya is facing overgrowth problems.The reason it floods every time it rains is that most of the city and outskirts of the city is now paved and water has no place to go. it rises and flows slow. The rising population because of "the gold rush" which creates heavy traffic most of the day, also is responsible for the bad smell and trash.but so what? there is no perfect place.I was recently in Medellin,Colombia and stayed 1 month.Perfect!..Clean, green,blue skies,mountainous, avg. temp. of 28day-time/20night-time throughout the year and lots of chicks.But no ocean   .Back to the topic,Pattaya isn't going downhill...Actually the whole world is!

Unfortunately, those that dislike Pattaya want to live there and change it to something more of their liking, rather than moving to somewhere that already is to their liking.

Perhaps they are only happy when railing aginst the existing structure, and would be bored living somewhere that was already OK for them.

Plenty of other beach towns in LOS without the bar scene.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 8 กันยายน 2559 at 2:29 PM, JSixpack said:

 

 

 

Relevant threads: When boredom starts to rule the day, I Love Pattaya, and Why live in Pattaya?

 

But this is talking to the wall. Next.

 

What you don't seem to understand is that they aren't calling for Pattaya to ban the bars, and both seem to accept Pattaya as it was. My beef is with those that want to change it to something it's never going to be.

[thaibeachlovers]

On 8 กันยายน 2559 at 2:30 PM, JSixpack said:

 

Why?

On 8 กันยายน 2559 at 2:30 PM, JSixpack said:

 

Why?

( Software malfunction )

 

If you have to ask that question, I doubt you even grasp what the OP is talking about. The OP is, IMO, about the bar scene, that's all. All the back and forth about condos and malls is just extraneous off topic noise.

[SheungWan]

15 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Unfortunately, those that dislike Pattaya want to live there and change it to something more of their liking, rather than moving to somewhere that already is to their liking.

Perhaps they are only happy when railing aginst the existing structure, and would be bored living somewhere that was already OK for them.

Plenty of other beach towns in LOS without the bar scene.

 

The magic formula is to leave Pattaya and then praise to the skies whichever boring dump they move to.

[newnative]

20 years ago Pattaya didn't have most of the things I mentioned and it certainly didn't have the wide choice of housing available now, both in condos and homes.  I know that less than 7 years ago when I arrived if you wanted a new, affordable highrise condo with a seaview it was pretty much the View Talays and few others.  

[Awohalitsiktoli]

4 hours ago, newnative said:

I think Pattaya is actually at a good stage now. It's gotten big enough that it's able to attract nice shopping like Central Festival and the coming Terminal 21 plus stores like Index, Home Pro, and Chic Republic. Big enough to have theaters that play movies in English. Big enough to have a wide selection of housing--both condos and homes.  Big enough for quality hospitals.  Big enough for a wide variety of restaurants and food stores.  It's at a stage where the ticky-tacky and flimsy is being replaced by nicer and better quality.  Private industry is doing its part--companies big and small are making small to huge investments in Pattaya.  Now it's time for the city to step up to the plate and get working on major infrastructure improvements--including wider, better sidewalks on streets like Pattaya Second Road, improving road connectivity, eliminating parking on some major roads, reorganizing and expanding the baht taxi line, building parking garages, overhauling parking regulations, especially for buses, and enforcing better compliance with the laws. Unfortunately, a huge chunk of critical  infrastructure money is being spent on the very poorly planned tunnel project.

In 2000 we had two malls that I can recall.  There were plenty of theaters that played movies in English. There was a wide selection of housing, just not a lot of people like today.  There were far more greenspaces than today.   And we had a nice hospital back then.  We also had plenty of places to eat.  We did not have Starbucks and Central Festival Mall--both of which I like.  The streets and other infrastructure are virtually the same as they were in 2000.  Both beachfronts in Pattaya and Jomtien were much better in 2000.  There was much less people pollution and traffic jams were very rare.  The air seemed cleaner back then; and it wasn't as hot.   It was much easier to find a parking place in 2000.  I really do not see a lot of positive (life quality enhancing) development since 2000.  I like some of the changes, but most of them are causing a decline in quality of life.  It is going downhill and has been going downhill for a long time.

[seedy]

Flaming post Removed

[Scotwight]

2 hours ago, Awohalitsiktoli said:

In 2000 we had two malls that I can recall.  There were plenty of theaters that played movies in English. There was a wide selection of housing, just not a lot of people like today.  There were far more greenspaces than today.   And we had a nice hospital back then.  We also had plenty of places to eat.  We did not have Starbucks and Central Festival Mall--both of which I like.  The streets and other infrastructure are virtually the same as they were in 2000.  Both beachfronts in Pattaya and Jomtien were much better in 2000.  There was much less people pollution and traffic jams were very rare.  The air seemed cleaner back then; and it wasn't as hot.   It was much easier to find a parking place in 2000.  I really do not see a lot of positive (life quality enhancing) development since 2000.  I like some of the changes, but most of them are causing a decline in quality of life.  It is going downhill and has been going downhill for a long time.

A lot less Brits and Russians now.  

[newnative]

Don't you love posters who say dopey things like 'another mall isn't going to raise your quality of life'.  Of course, they don't live here, they just visit friends, and then go back to places like London that have tons and tons and tons  of all sorts of shopping choices.  Seems they resent us living in this nice climate year round while they are stuck with rainy dreary, cold  weather day after day (and, that's just the summer, hehe) and, how DARE us wanting some shopping choices on top of that!  HOW DARE US!  Big C, Tesco, and 7-11 are all we need and deserve, they seem to think.  Well, I live here year-round and I am happy to have several malls to choose from and Terminal 21 on the way--just like I had several malls to shop at in America, go to a movie, and  then have dinner at one of the restaurants.  I like having nice stores like Index, Chic Republic, Home Port, Decco, Home Pro, etc. to browse in--just like I had interesting stores in America to shop at.  I like having a big variety of restaurants from the chains to the one of a kind--just like I had in America but cheaper.  I think most of the people living in Pattaya who are not lost in the past like its present size and the variety of everything that size brings.  

[onemorechang]

another mall isn't going to raise your quality of life 

[newnative]

It may not raise your quality of life but it will raise mine--and certainly more than another bar.

[onemorechang]

14 minutes ago, newnative said:

It may not raise your quality of life but it will raise mine--and certainly more than another bar.

 

Well if hanging out in malls and eating chain restaurant food is raising the bar

im happy well  below the bar,    there are great restaurants around town

you should try some. 

There is enough shopping opportunities around town now days.

BTW index have been here years.

 

 

[Jiu-Jitsu]

4 hours ago, newnative said:

Don't you love posters who say dopey things like 'another mall isn't going to raise your quality of life'.  Of course, they don't live here, they just visit friends, and then go back to places like London that have tons and tons and tons  of all sorts of shopping choices.  Seems they resent us living in this nice climate year round while they are stuck with rainy dreary, cold  weather day after day (and, that's just the summer, hehe) and, how DARE us wanting some shopping choices on top of that!  HOW DARE US!  Big C, Tesco, and 7-11 are all we need and deserve, they seem to think.  Well, I live here year-round and I am happy to have several malls to choose from and Terminal 21 on the way--just like I had several malls to shop at in America, go to a movie, and  then have dinner at one of the restaurants.  I like having nice stores like Index, Chic Republic, Home Port, Decco, Home Pro, etc. to browse in--just like I had interesting stores in America to shop at.  I like having a big variety of restaurants from the chains to the one of a kind--just like I had in America but cheaper.  I think most of the people living in Pattaya who are not lost in the past like its present size and the variety of everything that size brings.  

 

Oh the irony

Who are these people to whom you refer? You'll likely find that the people who are making comments have a lot more experience of Thailand than yourself.

That's part of the problem. That you want to have the USA inside Thailand.

 

 

 

 

 

[newnative]

I'm not looking for America in Thailand--I would have made the same comments if I was from Australia or Singapore--but I am happy that Pattaya is big enough now to have a fairly wide variety of shopping and restaurant choices that cities in America and other countries have, including some other cities in Thailand.  I often eat out both lunch and dinner and I do eat at a lot of the non-chain restaurants around town, both Thai and foreign-owned,  but it's nice to know Sizzler is there if I feel like pigging out at the buffet.