One month given to ease traffic in Bangkok

[whatproblem]

20 year extension in the pipeline

[dbrenn]

Another PR brain fart from the idiots in khaki.

 

[freebyrd]

3 hours ago, carlyai said:

Years ago the Japanese set up a system in Bangkok (or tried to ) where all traffic lights were computer controlled, so that traffic would feed and flow better, well a little better.

Think it was tested but never used.

Wouldn't a system like that work?

I think I know why it was installed but never used. Does anyone know the exact reason it was never used and why it shouldn't be looked at again?

I know there's too many cars in Banggers but....



Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk
 

 

It was used but the BIB turned it on and off at will because they thought they could do a better job!?! TIT

Edited September 15, 2016 by freebyrd
mispelling

[freebyrd]

1 hour ago, cumgranosalum said:

Yet another nape-of-the-neck dictum.

 

As there doesn't appear to be anyone properly qualified to handle trafffic problems in Thailand, let alone Bangkok, setting ridiculous  deadlines  just seems to have the hallmark of a senior official trying desperately to look as if he's doping something

 

A slip of the fingers when you were typing but he likely is doping something.

[freebyrd]

Dare I say bring in some well qualified traffic management experts from abroad. Whoops, silly of me, "we're Thai, we don't need any Farang help"

Edited September 15, 2016 by freebyrd
mispelling

[Grusa]

11 minutes ago, freebyrd said:

 

It was used but the BIB turned it on and off at will because they thought they could do a better job!?! TIT

When they built the railway line road in Pattaya, they installed traffic lights at every intersection.

when they turned them on, everything ground to a complete halt. Now, they are never used, and the traffic flows well - except at busy times, when they have BIB on traffic duty.

so......... 

1. Turn off all traffic lights permanently,

2. Shoot any BIB  who thinks (i know it's a non-sequitur) he can run a junction better than nature,

3. Shoot every selfish driver who does illegal u-turns, double parks, drives on the wrong side, wrong lane, etc., and confiscate and destroy tthe vehicle - including tour buses.

 

Not sure which of these will be most effective, though #3 will soon depopulate the country

[SoFarAndNear]

Brave. Set yourself a timeline of 1 months to solve a 4 decades old unfinished puzzle

[SoFarAndNear]

In my opinion Inner Bangkok will always be a traffic chaos. Simply because if the decades old uncountable Dead End Soi's.  In most other big cities you have many shortcuts and possibilities to drive around areas. But in Bangkok there are many Areas where ten or hundreds thousands of people live which are on reachable through a small road. And exactly these "hotspots" cause the big jams. If you really want to solve traffic chaos. Bangkok have to invest billions in new connection roads. Buy unused land and build connection roads.

 

There are even some condos or offices which charge to use their "private" road as a shortcuts. For example, The Base Project at On Nut Area. They charge 20 Baht to use their road to drive from On Nut to Sukhumvit 71. This can saves you up to 2 hours time in rush hour times. On Nut is a disaster. Sometimes I need 20minutes just to exit the car park and reach the road. 

[cumgranosalum]

1 hour ago, joepattaya1961 said:

Traffic congestion became a real problem after the 100,000 baht scheme some years ago which added about 600,000 cars to Bangkok's car-fleet. 

 

Discourage the use of private cars by extra toll-sections, reduce taxi-meters, increase airconditioned buses from the suburbs to BTS/MRT/BRT-hubs and create large parking lots near/next to MRT/BTS/Airportlink stations in the outskirts of Bangkok. 

This will reduce SOME congestion.

nonsense - traffic problems have plagued BKK since the 1970s

unless you understand the roots of the poblem it is difficult to see how one could come to a constructive suggestion on how to deal with it.

 

It is of course not just - or even - a question of personal perception, it is done to stats, figures etc which will show a different picture.

it is also not just a matter of traffic jams - the resulting solution is of course cause for concern, but it is also the effect on the built environment and health that needs to be taken into consideration as well as the colossal loss in man hours wasted

[cumgranosalum]

30 minutes ago, Grusa said:

When they built the railway line road in Pattaya, they installed traffic lights at every intersection.

when they turned them on, everything ground to a complete halt. Now, they are never used, and the traffic flows well - except at busy times, when they have BIB on traffic duty.

so......... 

1. Turn off all traffic lights permanently,

2. Shoot any BIB  who thinks (i know it's a non-sequitur) he can run a junction better than nature,

3. Shoot every selfish driver who does illegal u-turns, double parks, drives on the wrong side, wrong lane, etc., and confiscate and destroy tthe vehicle - including tour buses.

 

Not sure which of these will be most effective, though #3 will soon depopulate the country

Yet another example of someone who thinks that traffic is just one simplistic issue - it is far more than just "driving".

[cumgranosalum]

53 minutes ago, freebyrd said:

 

It was used but the BIB turned it on and off at will because they thought they could do a better job!?! TIT

It'll take more tha a new set of traffic lights to change things in Bkk.

[bark]

5 hours ago, leeneeds said:

ODDS  & EVENS on alternate days 

a fund set up to remove some taxis,

would help a little

Odds and Even is a good idea; but there is not enough public transportation from the surrounding areas of Bangkok.

Once you are in the city; it is OK.

[cumgranosalum]

26 minutes ago, bark said:

Odds and Even is a good idea; but there is not enough public transportation from the surrounding areas of Bangkok.

Once you are in the city; it is OK.

Public transport in BKK is a joke - it is unregulated so everyone tries to use the most lucrative routes, leaving people in the outskirts to find their own way - i.e. cars and motorcycles, which then need parking.

 

Odd/Even is by no means a panacea for traffic problems - it has been successful in some cites and an unmitigated disaster in others.

 

for instance in some cases pollution has actually increased - due to the fact that private cars targeted were in reality only responsible for 10% of the urban pollution the measures were trying to tackle.

 

it would seem that the chances of success are largely dependant on the authorities ability to control these regulations - with out corruption - and the free and complete support of a public transport system.

 

I think we can safely deduce that the introduction of such a system in Bkk would veer towards the "unmitigated disaster" end of the spectrum.

Edited September 15, 2016 by cumgranosalum

[huahinjoe]

They should really look into the initiative taken in Copenhagen to use the modern technology to analyze traffic...

 

Quote

 

"As part of the CITS project we have installed a mesh network of wifi access points that have the capability of geo locating wifi enabled devices on the streets without compromising privacy.

 

The data is aggregated, anonymised and then fed back into a cloud based software dashboard. The system enables city officials to both monitor traffic conditions in real time and also run a variety of simulations. The dashboard helps categorise traffic, look for patterns and identify long term behavioural tendencies amongst the road users.

 

It also allows for gathering insight into correlation’s between traffic conditions and other influences like weather, roadworks or special events etc. The simulation mode enables city officials to test various hypothesis based on historic data trends in conjunction with advanced mathematical models. A variety of simulations can be run as installable apps - for example asses the impact on a bus route by changing traffic light timings or the change in peak hour bottlenecks based on variable speed limits etc."

 

To properly enforce the law on the roads they should look into how Hungary installed some of these Single gantry free-flow traffic monitoring systems recently with great success to help reduce traffic violations and accidents and make sure the cars are roadworthy as well as encourages the drivers to have better habits towards a more respectful driving culture in the future.
 

 

[cumgranosalum]

4 minutes ago, huahinjoe said:

They should really look into the initiative taken in Copenhagen to use the modern technology to analyze traffic...

 

To properly enforce the law on the roads they should look into how Hungary installed some of these Single gantry free-flow traffic monitoring systems recently with great success to help reduce traffic violations and accidents and make sure the cars are roadworthy as well as encourages the drivers to have better habits towards a more respectful driving culture in the future.
 

 

Come on!!!

Population of Copenhagen 500,000, population of Bangkok 6.5 million.

 

For a system like Denmark's to work in Bkk, you would need to completely rebuild the road system in Bangkok.

 

you can't regulate traffic like that in a town where the roads are not even properly defined and drivers habitually make up their own traffic behaviour.

Edited September 15, 2016 by cumgranosalum

[williamgeorgeallen]

deadlines people deadlines. to get things done you must stipulate what needs to be done and within what time frame. goals need to be realistic and goals need to be defined. in this case neither neither seem to be defined or realistic. lets just give it 1 month and then comment, who knows maybe the 44 wand is going to be waved.

[Kwasaki]

5 hours ago, NongKhaiKid said:

I remember a BBC report when New Delhi tried the Odd and Even system and apart from the obvious initial confusion things weren't improved by the list of people who were exempt starting with politicians and officials.

Wonder what the list would look like here ? 

 

Crazy idea, Some people would swap plates, some arrange to swap cars, other with two cars already odd & even no problem.

Reminds me of London again when l kept getting fines through for non payments of entering the toll zone, number plate one mine the other copied. 

[huahinjoe]

12 minutes ago, cumgranosalum said:

Come on!!!

Population of Copenhagen 500,000, population of Bangkok 6.5 million.

 

For a system like Denmark's to work in Bkk, you would need to completely rebuild the road system in Bangkok.

 

you can't regulate traffic like that in a town where the roads are not even properly defined and drivers habitually make up their own traffic behaviour.

I agree about building more roads because the system already overgrown itself decades ago.. Also lots of cars are not roadworthy at all, old smoky vehicles causing massive pollution including relic 40y old trucks, buses, etc they should be banned long time ago but disagree with the numbers you mentioned regarding the population because statistical systems far more efficient if the participant's number are higher. Anyway it's doesn't really matter how big a city you still need to find the ways how to reduce congestion by designing an efficient system either managing the drivers or building more roads at the end you still need to monitor, analyze it properly first to get the best results out of the approach you make.

Look at the city on a holiday its a ghost town, the main problem with the masses travel everyday into the center travelling for hours sitting in traffic, wasting fuel.  

I know it might sounds a bit futuristic idea but in the long term they also should look into a modern Express Auto Train system to be built next to the major highways to transport out cars on an automatically loaded cargo, thousands of cars could be in or out of the city in rush hours it so much faster and safer, the only thing they need to invent is to load the cars really quick similar to modern parking automated systems somehow like simultaneously from the sides of the wagons for example all at once and the passengers stay in a personnel cabin with all the comfort they could require for safe and stress free daily travel. 
 

[kingstonkid]

This may seem strange but a thought.

 

Toronto had has the same problem.

 

The solution in the core is simple.  No parking on the street during rush hour,  No stopping, No stalls,  Police are on foot and tow trucks are located every couple of blocks.  If you are parked and not with your car a truck is called and say good bye to your car.  OH YEAH Huge fine.

 

There is parking at different Subway lines.

 

One other thing that has helped is that parking is very expensive.  Imagine if you had to pay 300-500 baht a day for parking.

 

Yes there is still congestion and that will never leave but these things do cut down on the cars in the city.

 

In the mean time take places like Don Muang, Sukumvit and other areas and setup not just minivans but buses that have a designated route and take people down town to different areas IE Mor Chit and outlying BTS MRT locations.

[jerojero]

Oh come on! A month? Why not just click their heels and it's done tomorrow? About same chance of that happening. Sheesh!

[selftaopath]

3 hours ago, freebyrd said:

 

It was used but the BIB turned it on and off at will because they thought they could do a better job!?! TIT

It's my understanding the system was sabotaged for job "security." Some thought the automated system would make BIB sitting at intersections irrelevant - leading to possible layoffs. lol lol Are the BIB at intersections relevant now? lol lol 

[carlyai]

 

It was Thaksin in 1994 who said he would solve the traffic problems in 6 months - then of course he denied saying that when he hadn't made any impact at all on the daily congestion. He also said he would use Chinooks to extract errant vehicles. Chinooks in busy traffic in an urban area?!! An ex policeman who had no idea that this would cause even more catastrophe!?!, why wasn't I surprised:clap2:.

 

Using a driving analogy - The mouth opens before the brain is in gear .

Yes, I think I remember pictures of him in a big balloon overlooking the traffic congestion. I know it's an over used word, but I think he was (here it comes).....planning.

Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk

[Familyonthemove]

2 minutes ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

 

 

Disagree. It was much worse in the 90's and the 00's.

 

 

Yes - in the pre-BTS days it was even worse.  But a London style congestion charge might help?  Bigger the car, the larger the payment to enter central Bangkok.  Motorbikes lower costs, bicycles free.

[selftaopath]

I recall reading that BKK was sinking; in a short time it would be underwater. Remember that? Well if that's the case.... 

[Americano555]

They are like children making promises. In one week they raise some other issue thinking everybody will have forgotten what was promised.

Just to blow some smoke to put some cash in their pockets and keep their jobs.

[carlyai]

I recall reading that BKK was sinking; in a short time it would be underwater. Remember that? Well if that's the case.... 

Ahhhhhh, got ya........submarines. Well I was wrong again......they are planning for the future. SUBPM. Super Underwater Big People Mover.

Hope the subs are not like the ones the Aussies are buying. The Aussies are borrowing money to buy nuclear subs, and then cause we aren't allowed to have nuclear subs, they're going to fit piston engines in them. <deleted>?

Sent from my SM-J700F using Tapatalk

[orchidlady]

2 suggestions how this might be accomplished in one month...No traffic stops for VIPs and their convoys, this means ALL VIPs.

Second, send all the dept heads from the meeting to the temple in Mukdahan to pray at the lucky fungus.

 

Oh well, these suggestions are probably better than what they will come up with.

Considering if they all have to get together in the same room to strategize they will have many important decisions to make before getting down to the task at hand.

 

First they would have to agree on the hotel meeting room (whose relative who is a hotel owner will get the business this time).

 Next what the morning snack will be, what lunch will be, what afternoon snack will be, what souvenirs the attendees will get, what the lucky draw prizes will be, what their bonus will be if they succeed. Maybe where they will have their dinner and entertainment after the meeting because they worked so hard on this problem..

Then they can start to talk about the process they are supposed to work on.

 

Sorry been to too many pre-meeting planning sessions here over the years...massive time wasters.

[PETERTHEEATER]

8 hours ago, jackinthebox said:

Well well....there IS a way to ease traffic! Even within days:

Gasohol 91: 59Baht

Super 95: 71Baht

Diesel: 52Baht

CNG: 33Baht

Problem solved!

Why cheaper diesel? Why should petrol burners subsidise oil burners?

 

Introduce cheaper DERV for commercials and up the automobile diesel price to where it should be.

 

But wait, what am I saying? Can the nations distributors really be trusted to ensure that only commercial vehicles get the DERV?

[ourmanflint]

The problem IMO is not that the traffic lights are not programmed properly, it's not even the amount of cars on the road, it is the total and complete lack of respect for rules. When so many vehicles are on the road, one <deleted> causing an obstruction, or delaying traffic has a massive knock on effect, it's like those big domino set-ups each knocking over the next. 

In a month they could enforce current road law massive campaign to drive within rules and huge fines for idiots disobeying.

[lvr181]

"....  resulting in some progress as manifested in less congestion in some areas. " And those areas are? And the percentage of less congestion is? Really, how about some truth instead of political spruiking!  Truth is better than inferences anytime.