May ready for tough talks over Brexit

[Ace of Pop]

Last refuge of many uneducated racists is disguised humour.

Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[aright]

[aright]

I continue to be surprised that the remainers on here make no reference to Mr Juncker's speech yesterday. This is after all the template for the union you wanted to be a part of. You either liked it; so tell us, or you didn't like it. Answers gratefully received 

I thought his speech took democracy and prosperity off the agenda and replaced it with authoritarian austerity. 

 

 

[SheungWan]

Managing Brexit: MPs (The Exiting the EU Select Committe) launch enquiry as to whether David Davis's department knows what it is doing.

http://tinyurl.com/y7bbvfkg

 

Edited September 14, 2017 by SheungWan

[aright]

The obverse side of the coin

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/09/14/europe-starting-fear-no-deal-brexit-michel-barnier-best-not/

[Grouse]

11 hours ago, aright said:

Just a reminder........He's the man.....He did an excellent interview on radio4 this morning. When asked if he worried about the uncertainty as a result of Brexit he said business is all about uncertainty and uncertainty spells opportunity. He also said  the uncertainty is caused by Barnier refusing to respond to the UK's positive proposals.

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2016/09/13/sir-james-dyson-i-would-trigger-brexit-now--and-negotiate-trade/

The field of electric motors! Very droll ?!

 

It's all just torque!

 

So he does his manufacturing in Malaysia because of UK local council planning regs! Nothing to do with employment conditions, environmental laws and low wages then. That's a comfort!

 

The man has no sense of irony. All these Great British machines such as the English Electric Lightning, The Avto Vulcan when we do nomanufacture aircraft anymore and can barely afford a handful of F35s for our aircraft carrier.

 

Dyson is not exactly a British Apple!

 

Same as JCBamford, bring on Brexit and let's have a Victorian industrial society ?

[Grouse]

9 hours ago, aright said:

I'm surprised more remainers on here haven't endorsed Mr Juncker's speech from yesterday. It is after all the future they wanted by staying in the EU.

 

 

Not at all; that's a trolling statement

 

Unlike the poor Brexiters, many of us take a BALANCED view. I don't think this is the appropriate forum to discuss the finer points as it would be over the heads of many.

 

Suffice to say the man talks a great deal of Junk but he means well. Even the rather inadequate democracy in the EU will ensure that he will not gain much traction. In particular, bring in more poorer countries and extending the Euro area would introduce too much indigestion right now.

[Grouse]

6 hours ago, SheungWan said:

Managing Brexit: MPs (The Exiting the EU Select Committe) launch enquiry as to whether David Davis's department knows what it is doing.

http://tinyurl.com/y7bbvfkg

 

Both hillarious and embarrassing

[Grouse]

5 hours ago, aright said:

The obverse side of the coin

 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2017/09/14/europe-starting-fear-no-deal-brexit-michel-barnier-best-not/

Of course! No deal would allow the Cons to have their low tax, rent, benefit, wage, public services etc off shore money making machine. Not good for Europe and definitely not good for the bulk of Brexiters.

[aright]

1 hour ago, Grouse said:

The field of electric motors! Very droll ?!

 

It's all just torque!

 

So he does his manufacturing in Malaysia because of UK local council planning regs! Nothing to do with employment conditions, environmental laws and low wages then. That's a comfort!

 

The man has no sense of irony. All these Great British machines such as the English Electric Lightning, The Avto Vulcan when we do nomanufacture aircraft anymore and can barely afford a handful of F35s for our aircraft carrier.

 

Dyson is not exactly a British Apple!

 

Same as JCBamford, bring on Brexit and let's have a Victorian industrial society ?

There are times when quite frankly I despair.

"we do nomanufacture aircraft anymore" which took a little while to interpret, needs addressing.

 

At Filton (Airbus) 2000 people are employed,  in the design of manufacturing areas, procurement, finance and customer service. 2000 engineers are employed to work on flight physics, structures and research on future aircraft projects.

We are part of a consortium that produce the Typhoon Eurofighter.....most of the project is controlled by BAE.

At Broughton (Airbus) they assemble the wings for all Airbus planes......over 1000 wings a year.

In Bristol Rolls Royce produce jet engines which they sell globally to aircraft manufacturers and airlines ( at least I think it's engines it might be cars )

Bombardier passenger jets are produced in Belfast (yes, that's in the UK)

I think, but am not sure, Leonardo's Helicopter Division formerly Westland still produce in Yeovil. 

I won't continue to "large" the PharmaceuticalIndustry or powder Coatings etc ...I would be here all night.

Dyson employs 7000 people half in the UK. Apart from my interest in maintaining a strong manufacturing base I am also a consumer and if Dyson can reduce the cost of a vacuum  cleaner by assembling  it in Asia I am all for it. We don't need assembly work we need high tec work. Are you seriously suggesting we should set our sights on manufacturing goods for Poundland. Are you seriously suggesting we shouldn't bring in computers and TV's from China because you would prefer to pay 50-60% more for them if produced in the UK.

 

1 hour ago, Grouse said:

Not at all; that's a trolling statement

 

Unlike the poor Brexiters, many of us take a BALANCED view. I don't think this is the appropriate forum to discuss the finer points as it would be over the heads of many.

 

Suffice to say the man talks a great deal of Junk but he means well. Even the rather inadequate democracy in the EU will ensure that he will not gain much traction. In particular, bring in more poorer countries and extending the Euro area would introduce too much indigestion right now.

Its not a trolling statement  but not wanting to answer a simple request  to communicate your thoughts on Mr Junckers speech who is the man who will give you the Elysian Fields in Europe you aspire to is a trolling answer.

 

Are you home now after your hols and where is home?

 

 

    

 

[SheungWan]

1 hour ago, Grouse said:

The field of electric motors! Very droll ?!

 

It's all just torque!

 

So he does his manufacturing in Malaysia because of UK local council planning regs! Nothing to do with employment conditions, environmental laws and low wages then. That's a comfort!

 

The man has no sense of irony. All these Great British machines such as the English Electric Lightning, The Avto Vulcan when we do nomanufacture aircraft anymore and can barely afford a handful of F35s for our aircraft carrier.

 

Dyson is not exactly a British Apple!

 

Same as JCBamford, bring on Brexit and let's have a Victorian industrial society ?

I have gone through 2 generations of Dyson cleaners. Yes they look good and don't break down, but as any owner will tell you they are pretty filthy to empty and clean due to their non-bag design. So my next cleaner is likely to be, wait for it, a German Miele.

[aright]

Good idea1

Have you considered buying a Volkswagen Diesel?

I understand their carbon monoxide emission levels are excellent.

    

 

[aright]

I felt honour bound to give you this review

 

Not worth it. Not even close. Miele products break just as often as those by any other manufacturer, and they are vastly more expensive. I've just paid a Miele service guy £75 to have him come round and tell me that the motor in my Miele product needs replacing, and he quoted more to do that than to buy it again. So basically I've paid £75 for absolutely nothing. Great, Thanks for that, Miele. Now I'm going to buy a replacement machine from someone else instead. I advise you to do the same.

[SheungWan]

27 minutes ago, aright said:

I felt honour bound to give you this review

 

Not worth it. Not even close. Miele products break just as often as those by any other manufacturer, and they are vastly more expensive. I've just paid a Miele service guy £75 to have him come round and tell me that the motor in my Miele product needs replacing, and he quoted more to do that than to buy it again. So basically I've paid £75 for absolutely nothing. Great, Thanks for that, Miele. Now I'm going to buy a replacement machine from someone else instead. I advise you to do the same.

Oh no! That's not good news at all.

[aright]

1 minute ago, SheungWan said:

Oh no! That's not good news at all.

Never mind. Get the Volkswagen diesel instead

[Khun Han]

6 minutes ago, SheungWan said:

Oh no! That's not good news at all.

 

Don't, don't, don't believe the hype. Rah rah rah rah rah.

[nauseus]

2 hours ago, Grouse said:

Both hillarious and embarrassing

With Hillary Benn leading, I agree.

[aright]

7 minutes ago, nauseus said:

With Hillary Benn leading, I agree.

More like Bill and Ben

You have to understand some people live a flower pot existence. 

[SheungWan]

Just now, aright said:

More like Bill and Ben

You have to understand some people live a flower pot existence. 

Yes we do.

 

[Scott]

I realize some of these threads are quite long, but please try and stay on topic.   

[rockingrobin]

3 hours ago, aright said:

There are times when quite frankly I despair.

"we do nomanufacture aircraft anymore" which took a little while to interpret, needs addressing.

 

At Filton (Airbus) 2000 people are employed,  in the design of manufacturing areas, procurement, finance and customer service. 2000 engineers are employed to work on flight physics, structures and research on future aircraft projects.

We are part of a consortium that produce the Typhoon Eurofighter.....most of the project is controlled by BAE.

At Broughton (Airbus) they assemble the wings for all Airbus planes......over 1000 wings a year.

In Bristol Rolls Royce produce jet engines which they sell globally to aircraft manufacturers and airlines ( at least I think it's engines it might be cars )

Bombardier passenger jets are produced in Belfast (yes, that's in the UK)

I think, but am not sure, Leonardo's Helicopter Division formerly Westland still produce in Yeovil. 

I won't continue to "large" the PharmaceuticalIndustry or powder Coatings etc ...I would be here all night.

Dyson employs 7000 people half in the UK. Apart from my interest in maintaining a strong manufacturing base I am also a consumer and if Dyson can reduce the cost of a vacuum  cleaner by assembling  it in Asia I am all for it. We don't need assembly work we need high tec work. Are you seriously suggesting we should set our sights on manufacturing goods for Poundland. Are you seriously suggesting we shouldn't bring in computers and TV's from China because you would prefer to pay 50-60% more for them if produced in the UK.

 

Its not a trolling statement  but not wanting to answer a simple request  to communicate your thoughts on Mr Junckers speech who is the man who will give you the Elysian Fields in Europe you aspire to is a trolling answer.

 

Are you home now after your hols and where is home?

 

 

    

 

Dyson does not only assemble parts in asia, they also source parts from asia

From the interview James Dyson gave in 2012 , it is difficult to understand why his comments should have more weight than any other person

 

'I didn't enjoy being CEO that much. At an operational level, that becomes an enormous job, too big for me. I've never really been a businessman. I wanted to carry on the design and engineering myself. That's what I love doing.'

 

 

 

[Grouse]

4 hours ago, aright said:

There are times when quite frankly I despair.

"we do nomanufacture aircraft anymore" which took a little while to interpret, needs addressing.

 

At Filton (Airbus) 2000 people are employed,  in the design of manufacturing areas, procurement, finance and customer service. 2000 engineers are employed to work on flight physics, structures and research on future aircraft projects.

We are part of a consortium that produce the Typhoon Eurofighter.....most of the project is controlled by BAE.

At Broughton (Airbus) they assemble the wings for all Airbus planes......over 1000 wings a year.

In Bristol Rolls Royce produce jet engines which they sell globally to aircraft manufacturers and airlines ( at least I think it's engines it might be cars )

Bombardier passenger jets are produced in Belfast (yes, that's in the UK)

I think, but am not sure, Leonardo's Helicopter Division formerly Westland still produce in Yeovil. 

I won't continue to "large" the PharmaceuticalIndustry or powder Coatings etc ...I would be here all night.

Dyson employs 7000 people half in the UK. Apart from my interest in maintaining a strong manufacturing base I am also a consumer and if Dyson can reduce the cost of a vacuum  cleaner by assembling  it in Asia I am all for it. We don't need assembly work we need high tec work. Are you seriously suggesting we should set our sights on manufacturing goods for Poundland. Are you seriously suggesting we shouldn't bring in computers and TV's from China because you would prefer to pay 50-60% more for them if produced in the UK.

 

Its not a trolling statement  but not wanting to answer a simple request  to communicate your thoughts on Mr Junckers speech who is the man who will give you the Elysian Fields in Europe you aspire to is a trolling answer.

 

Are you home now after your hols and where is home?

 

 

    

 

Of course we manufacture hydraulic pedants but we used to produce complete aircraft. Did you really need to break the news about Rolls Royce engine manufacturing? You'll be telling me they make nuclear reactors next!

 

Have you given up on manufacturing anything in the U.K.? We used to manufacture all kinds of electrical and electronic products. Not the cheapest but high quality.

 

Dyson is concentrating everything on an engineering centre in Singapore. That's closer to the factory you see. Holding him up as British tech manufacturer is laughable.

 

Still travelling. Edinburgh next.

 

What or where is Poundland?

Edited September 15, 2017 by Grouse

[sandyf]

18 hours ago, aright said:

Are you saying we wouldn't have sold them had we stayed in the EU?

Throw in a bit of distortion why don't you.

The UK already has an extensive list of clients for this kind of product, so once free of the EU what other clients would be available.

 

"But the Defence Secretary faced awkward questions about some of Britain’s “clients”, who include totalitarian regimes and nations accused of perpetrating war crimes."

 

The UK is very keen to promote a world class arms manufacturing capability but unable to produce world class vehicles or commercial aircraft. Even the new nuclear power station is in the hands of foreign companies.  

Yes we all know about the joint ventures on bits of aircraft and the manufacture of foreign vehicles, both of which have been put in jeopardy. I suppose they only trying to offset the job losses.

[sandyf]

4 hours ago, aright said:

There are times when quite frankly I despair.

"we do nomanufacture aircraft anymore" which took a little while to interpret, needs addressing.

 

At Filton (Airbus) 2000 people are employed,  in the design of manufacturing areas, procurement, finance and customer service. 2000 engineers are employed to work on flight physics, structures and research on future aircraft projects.

We are part of a consortium that produce the Typhoon Eurofighter.....most of the project is controlled by BAE.

At Broughton (Airbus) they assemble the wings for all Airbus planes......over 1000 wings a year.

In Bristol Rolls Royce produce jet engines which they sell globally to aircraft manufacturers and airlines ( at least I think it's engines it might be cars )

Bombardier passenger jets are produced in Belfast (yes, that's in the UK)

 

Who knows how Airbus will react when they have to restate what parts of the aircraft are sourced outside the EU.

 

Bombardier is a Canadian company and the Belfast operation is under threat from an action by Boeing. That factory used to be British and built one of the best heavy lift aircraft, in 1971 I saw the whole production line take to the sky at the same time.

Edited September 15, 2017 by sandyf

[pitrevie]

39 minutes ago, sandyf said:

Who knows how Airbus will react when they have to restate what parts of the aircraft are sourced outside the EU.

 

Bombardier is a Canadian company and the Belfast operation is under threat from an action by Boeing. That factory used to be British and built one of the best heavy lift aircraft, in 1971 I saw the whole production line take to the sky at the same time.

UK aerospace industry fears loss of leading edge after Brexit

https://www.ft.com/content/77e6e934-c571-11e6-8f29-9445cac8966f

[sandyf]

23 minutes ago, pitrevie said:

UK aerospace industry fears loss of leading edge after Brexit

https://www.ft.com/content/77e6e934-c571-11e6-8f29-9445cac8966f

Good article, this comment about sums it up.

"Airbus, one of the UK’s biggest employers in the sector, will face pressure to bring jobs back to France, Germany and Spain, its original stakeholder countries, say several suppliers. “We are very worried about the impact of Brexit on the whole Airbus discussion,” says one."

 

 

[melvinmelvin]

4 hours ago, Grouse said:

Of course we manufacture hydraulic pedants but we used to produce complete aircraft. Did you really need to break the news about Rolls Royce engine manufacturing? You'll be telling me they make nuclear reactors next!

 

Have you given up on manufacturing anything in the U.K.? We used to manufacture all kinds of electrical and electronic products. Not the cheapest but high quality.

 

Dyson is concentrating everything on an engineering centre in Singapore. That's closer to the factory you see. Holding him up as British tech manufacturer is laughable.

 

Still travelling. Edinburgh next.

 

What or where is Poundland?

Edinburgh?

 

Went to UNI there / Rose Street & Royal Mile piss ups- ahh memories!!

 

RR; do some formidable marine stuff you guys seem to forget about,

       both engine/propulsion thingies

      as weel excellent electronic gadgets for the offshore industry - dynamic positioning and such

 

------------

Interesting and sizeable brexit related article in today's Bangkok Post:

 

One of several reasons that some people voted brexit was to stop the inflow of riff raff from the less

well off EU states (read Eastern Europe).

Seems that has been successful already, the inflow has stopped up severly,

hurting the UK service industry badly. More than 200 000 riff raff missing in the service industry already.

Several hotel and hotel like establishments suffer badly.

 

 

[aright]

5 hours ago, Grouse said:

Of course we manufacture hydraulic pedants but we used to produce complete aircraft. Did you really need to break the news about Rolls Royce engine manufacturing? You'll be telling me they make nuclear reactors next!

 

Have you given up on manufacturing anything in the U.K.? We used to manufacture all kinds of electrical and electronic products. Not the cheapest but high quality.

 

Dyson is concentrating everything on an engineering centre in Singapore. That's closer to the factory you see. Holding him up as British tech manufacturer is laughable.

 

Still travelling. Edinburgh next.

 

What or where is Poundland?

You need to read more and leave the first Industrial Revolution behind you. We are in phase 5 or is it 6 now.

Nobody produces complete aircraft anymore. It's all about modular systems.

Outsourcing

Many components are not built by Boeing but are outsourced to other manufacturers both in the US and increasingly around the world. This may be either for cost savings in production, specialist development or as an incentive for that country to buy other Boeing products. Here is a list of some of the outsourced components:

• Fuselage, engine nacelles and pylons - Spirit AeroSystems (formerly Boeing), Wichita.
• Slats and flaps - Spirit AeroSystems (formerly Boeing), Tulsa.
• Doors - Vought, Stuart, FL.
• Spoilers - Goodrich, Charlotte, NC.
• Vertical fin - Xi'an Aircraft Industry, China.
• Horizontal stabiliser - Korea Aerospace Industries.
• Ailerons - Asian Composites Manufacturing, Malaysia.
• Rudder - Bombardier, Belfast and AVIC subsidiary Chengfei Commercial Aircraft (CCAC), China
• Tail section (aluminium extrusions for) - Alcoa / Shanghai Aircraft Manufacturing, China.
• Main landing gear doors - Aerospace Industrial Development Corp, Taiwan.
• Inboard Flap - Mitsubishi, Japan.
• Elevator - Fuji, Japan.
• Winglets - Kawasaki, Japan.
• Fwd entry door & Overwing exits - Chengdu Aircraft, China.
• Wing-to-body fairing panels and tail cone - BHA Aero Composite Parts Co. Ltd, China.

As for nuclear reactors

http://www.cityam.com/256579/rolls-royce-launches-partnership-engineering-giants-amec

 

As for Dyson He claims that assembly as opposed to manufacturing  isn't worth a candle but what does he know? He claims in todays world intellectual property is more important than manufacturing. How much is his business worth? Do you think by assembling in Asia thus denying Brits jobs he is immoral?  As a shareholder myself of manufacturing companies I expect the owner or CEO  of those companies to have an obligation, to me, to maximise profits and share value and if that involves manufacturing off shore get it on. It's called Capitalism and I am the one risking my capital.  You can of course change this at the next election by voting for Corbyn who will nationalise everything and bring it all in house,  but be assured you will get a tractor report every week.

 

I was in Edinburgh last month for the Festival. Had dinner on 2 nights in Leith...great place.

Poundland is a chain of stores (Indian owned I think) where everything costs a £1. I doubt you would find them north of the border they are far too expensive for Scotland.      

[aright]

4 hours ago, sandyf said:

.

"Airbus, one of the UK’s biggest employers in the sector, will face pressure to bring jobs back to France, 

 

 

Why? So they can build a more expensive, less marketable plane?

They do considerable out sourcing now

 

http://www.deccanherald.com/content/471062/airbus-increase-outsourcing-india.html

[aright]

5 hours ago, sandyf said:

Throw in a bit of distortion why don't you.

The UK already has an extensive list of clients for this kind of product, so once free of the EU what other clients would be available.

 

Why not throw in some reality as well. The EU has no control over who we sell arms to now or post Brexit.