expelled from my flat and deposit kept

[BKKBrit]

On 22/01/2017 at 5:57 PM, siam2007 said:

I agree with those saying that it was not exactly a smart idea to sub-let the room, but as well I agree with the comments of the OP regarding the replies of some bitter haters and low-life-creatures.

 

Them need to know:

If you have nothing good (or useful) to say, better say nothing at all

 

Well said. I am appalled at some of the responses here. The OP has made a mistake, has lost money in the process, and evidently joined ThaiVisa to seek suggestions - not angry troll-like responses that make no one feel good.  Why are so many TV contributors so angry? 

[thaikahuna]

Lick your wounds dry your tears and go find another place to live...if you can. Methinks you may have just screwed yourself on living anywhere in CNX...

[mstevens]

I know if I let my apartment to you and you subletted it, I would be furious!

 

Now, with that said, I don't think the landlord has the right to keep your deposit.  So long as the property was repossessed in the same condition as when you moved in I think you should get your deposit back.

 

 

[Bassosa]

47 minutes ago, Kabula said:

In my opinion, if you paid rent including the time you were evicted without a legal contract you should be able to recover your deposit and perhaps secure additional damages.

 

It appears there was no binding legal contract between owner and tenant.

 

I would recommend talking to a competent, experienced, licensed lawyer specializing in owner, tenant disputes.  Not a Paralegal.  Ask to see his license to practice law.

 

Most competent Landlords in Thailand have tenants sign leases so both parties are protected.

When's the last time you signed a 'legal contract' at a hotel or this case 'serviced apartment'?

 

 

[pby92]

As I am French too I can tell you you can't not sublet in France without the owner agreement!!!!!

If you do same consequences can happen even if law is most protective .As where you live looks more as what is call as an appart'hotel the result will be had been the same in the same way.

[Jonmarleesco]

It's illegal, as far as the government/BMA is concerned. So I think safe to say you've no leg to stand on.

[Jonathan Swift]

On 1/22/2017 at 2:17 PM, deronnax said:

What a bunch of embittered, angry haters on this forum. Low life people. When I read all your angry comments, wishing me to lose all the money and telling I deserved it (because you decided so ?), I feel being a better human being, and I thank god I'm not you.

 

I live a good life, I don't need to post mean comments on forum to offload my frustration.

Well you learned two lessons. One is about rental contracts and the risks of subletting. The other is that this forum is populated by ignorant, shallow, prejudiced, bigoted, mean spirited know nothings, of the type that voted for Trump in the USA, and they take pleasure in the misfortunes of people like you. So if you post here expect to weed through buckets of verbal diarrhea in order to get any useful advice if there is any. But the best advice for this would come from a Thai lawyer. I wouldn't waste time throwing my problems in front of this forum like raw meat to hyenas, these people are not experts, all they know, if anything, comes from personal experiences, which may or may not be useful. Just as much of what is said here is speculation or flat out made up.I have read this forum long enough to know there is no useful advice for me here that I can count on, and I seek info elsewhere, mostly from long time expats whose credibility I can size up in person. Good luck to you friend

[samsingsong]

I'm sure this is a troll. Who but a complete imbecile would think it OK to sublet a condo without the owners permission? Come on.....really?   Would you be happy if somebody did that to your property?

 

I have another question, a bit off topic admittedly: Are any of these rental contacts, written in a foreign language, really legally enforceable in a Thai Court? Wouldn't they just throw out a contact not written in Thai and not understandable to the court?

I can't imagine in an English speaking country a court accepting documents for evidence submitted in the Thai language?

Aren't these just 'Rental Agreements' (i.e a 'Gentleman's Agreement', depending on a degree of trust and honesty) and not legally enforceable contracts? 

[Retiredandhappyhere]

"Section 544/545 of Thai Civil and Commercial Code clearly states that subletting without authorization is not allowed. The letter may terminate whatever agreement you would've had. By subletting you've waived your rights to have your deposit returned."

 

And, naturally, everyone in this country, Thais and farangs, have a copy of this code in their pocket, just as we farangs all have access to the Immigration web site, which clearly states their requirements for all sorts of things, including those for "renewals of extensions", which are then either partially ignored or substantially extended by various Immigration offices.

 

It is just not possible to know all the laws here or to understand their different interpretions by the authorities, including the police.  So, why don't we all agree to give posters on here with problems some slack and try to give helpful advice instead of vitriol?  

[Bassosa]

11 minutes ago, Retiredandhappyhere said:

"Section 544/545 of Thai Civil and Commercial Code clearly states that subletting without authorization is not allowed. The letter may terminate whatever agreement you would've had. By subletting you've waived your rights to have your deposit returned."

 

And, naturally, everyone in this country, Thais and farangs, have a copy of this code in their pocket, just as we farangs all have access to the Immigration web site, which clearly states their requirements for all sorts of things, including those for "renewals of extensions", which are then either partially ignored or substantially extended by various Immigration offices.

 

It is just not possible to know all the laws here or to understand their different interpretions by the authorities, including the police.  So, why don't we all agree to give posters on here with problems some slack and try to give helpful advice instead of vitriol?  

By posting this I wanted to let the OP know that he was at fault and that the flat owners rightfully kept the deposit (they actually kindly returned half it seems).

 

So he can cut his losses and accept his predicament.

Edited January 25, 2017 by Bassosa

[lungnorm]

What a stupid thing to do. AirBNB is not allowed in most situations in Thailand especially Condo's. Remember Thailand is not France its different so very different.

[little mary sunshine]

Expelled??   Your flat was in a school?

You attempted to sub lease to save couple

of bucks....to,bad...you lose!

 

 

 

[NoshowJones]

1 hour ago, BKKBrit said:

 

Well said. I am appalled at some of the responses here. The OP has made a mistake, has lost money in the process, and evidently joined ThaiVisa to seek suggestions - not angry troll-like responses that make no one feel good.  Why are so many TV contributors so angry? 

Forget the law, or what was signed or not signed, common sense should have told the OP that he should not have rented out other peoples property without their permission, if I was the landlord. I would also have thrown him out and not refunded his deposit. Yes, he got many negative replies, that's OK as long as they are not rude, but the OP asked for advice and TV members the only gave him their opinions.

[newnative]

No sympathy here.  Walk away and count yourself lucky.  As others have said, you broke the Thai Law against short-term rentals.  You could also be charged with operating a business without a work permit and failure to report income.  And, failure to report the rental person to Immigration.  Condos are definitely starting to crack down on the illegal activity of renting condos as hotel rooms--and it can't come soon enough in my opinion.  As with many others who have started to protest to their condo committees, I didn't buy my condo to live in a hotel with hotel behavior and I am happy to see the violators fined heavily and or thrown in jail.

[samsensam]

 

did you explain to the management that you would be sub-letting? and gain their agreement?

 

if not then i fully understand their reaction.

[steven100]

Dear OP,

not being mean or anything but you sublet the owners room without his permission.

Sorry, but you did wrong and he has the right to keep your rent and deposit.

 

It was you that made the mistake.

Accept it and move on.

Always think before doing something like what you did .. you underestimated the consequences.

[newnative]

On ‎6‎/‎1‎/‎2560 at 3:46 PM, A1Str8 said:

It's simple. It depends on what you signed. In Thailand it's not legal but if you didn't sign anything that said you cannot do it or doing so will be a breach of contract and they will keep your deposit then they have no right to move you out immediately and have no right to keep your deposit. Go report it to the police if you didn't sign anything that said you can't do what you did. 

If you did then there's nothing you can do.  

It reminds me of that hospital that recently confiscated the passport of a foreigner coz she couldn't pay. Then when she went public with it, the hospital all of a sudden gave back the passport and all the money she had paid till that day. 

If you don't let them screw you then they won't. That's all. But like I said that's only if you haven't signed anything that you should have not signed. 

 

But how is that even possible that you didn't sign any contract just a sheet with the prices? 

Then if it's true they broke the law because there must be a contract so report that too. 

By the way can I know the name of the apartment(you can PM me) so I won't go to that place when I am back to CM. 

Bad advice telling you to go to the police.  You don't want to point out to them your illegal activities--breaking the Thai Hotel law, operating a business without a license, not reporting income, not reporting tenant to Immigration, etc.   Keep your head down and quietly walk away.

[jojothai]

Silly that the OP got himself into such a situation.

However, it would be sillier still if he goes to a lawyer or the police as some suggested.

 

What he did was illegal. No point in throwing more money away and potentially getting a criminal record ($$$$$).

 

[HooHaa]

On 1/22/2017 at 3:17 PM, deronnax said:

What a bunch of embittered, angry haters on this forum. Low life people. When I read all your angry comments, wishing me to lose all the money and telling I deserved it (because you decided so ?), I feel being a better human being, and I thank god I'm not you.

 

I live a good life, I don't need to post mean comments on forum to offload my frustration.

 

Im not at all embittered, however i take great offence to someone subletting one of my properties.  If i ran a serviced apartment i would be even more pissed off.

 

Moreover if i were the poor sap that rented it, id be out for blood.

[amjamj]

But France never colonized Thailand it seems. So, yes, you are wrong froggy !

 

 

[RocketDog]

Yes, bad judgment, bad due diligence, etc.

Education is rarely free. I feel sure that most of the folks on TV have made some bone-headed mistakes in their time as well. I certainly have in my 67 years. And I usually paid for it.

That said, I too am constantly amazed at the hateful attitudes and verbal abuse doled out by SOME members on TV.

It's been said before but bears repeating. If you can't add something useful, then don't comment.

The world is full of enough Bulls**t that it doesn't need your vile contributions.

Sent from my SM-G930V using Thaivisa Connect mobile app

[kalidescopemind]

Tell us what your sub-letter did, kid.  Our popcorn is ready!  lol!

[buick]

OP - i know a couple people that sublet their apartments/condos for a couple weeks, up to a month (in bangkok).  there are ways to do it.  unfortunately you didn't execute all that well.  one critical item is to tell the tenants not to contact building management, they must contact you if there are any issues.  and of course one hopes there are not any issues.  one guy doesn't do it all that often (once or twice a year) and he tells the management upfront that he is having friends stay while he is out of town.  no problems.  but it probably would be if he did it more often. 

 

 

[KC 71]

The phrase 'don't mess with the rice-bowl springs to mind !


Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect

[SunsetT]

On 06/01/2017 at 7:29 PM, trogers said:

 

Nor can you sublet the room.

 

I have never come across a hotel requesting a month's rent and deposit of only Bt10,000 each.

Many hotels will rent a room on a cheaper monthly basis and some would probably also require a deposit. Ive done it myself but dont recall paying a deposit. I had stayed there many times before though.

[balo]

On 1/22/2017 at 2:17 PM, deronnax said:

What a bunch of embittered, angry haters on this forum

 

No they are not , they are just telling you that you broke the law .  

 

And you came here to ask for advice , you need a lawyer if you want to get something back from this . 

 

Just walk away , to save you from more troubles. 

 

[blackcab]

8 hours ago, Jonathan Swift said:

...this forum is populated by ignorant, shallow, prejudiced, bigoted, mean spirited know nothings, of the type that voted for Trump in the USA, and they take pleasure in the misfortunes of people like you. So if you post here expect to weed through buckets of verbal diarrhea in order to get any useful advice if there is any. But the best advice for this would come from a Thai lawyer. I wouldn't waste time throwing my problems in front of this forum like raw meat to hyenas, these people are not experts, all they know, if anything, comes from personal experiences, which may or may not be useful...

 

That's a bit harsh.

 

I work in the Real Estate sector in Thailand, and I predominantly post in this forum. I'm not sure if that qualifies me as an expert or not; you would have to read a few of my posts and form your own opinion on my subject knowledge.

 

I try to be helpful and impartial when I answer, which is not always easy with some posters.

[George FmplesdaCosteedback]

You screwed up. Plus you have ruined somebody else's holiday.

Go back to France where you belong, 1st class idiot.

Som nam nar (servers you right).

[timendres]

On 1/9/2017 at 10:49 AM, deronnax said:

@A1Str8. It's P.T. Residence, Nimman.

Lesson learnt is than when you give someone deposit, you better sign a contract to know in which conditions they can keep it.

Bargaining, I managed to get half of it back. Still 125€ down the drain + lost rent but it's good enough for me. Moved to another condominium.

 

And of course I'm not a troll. What would the point of making that up, it' s not even funny.

 

You did the smartest thing you could possibly do. Discuss it respectably, and get back some of the loss. I have found many times that polite conversation with reasonable people will result in a compromise.

[fekman]

No offense bro, but if a 20k baht hit affects your life, you should consider going back to where you came from. You can't hang as an expat. You're a month away from scamming other expats to buy a bowl of noodles....