Intellectual Whore

[amykat]

1 hour ago, Chicog said:

 

And still the tiresome generalisations....

 

I think I can see why men don't want to date you, you seem to have an extremely negative opinion of them.

 

 

 

I have already addressed the generalizations thing Chicog.  But to this next part ..you know nothing about me. I said nothing about my dating status here. I didn't even say that I had a low opinion of men here ..that is some of YOU men who keep saying that about yourselves!!!

 

That was an extremely insulting low blow and you know it!!  That is what you men on the forum do to shut us up and intimidate us from speaking. That is called bullying in the teenage world. 

 

What could I have possibly said that is so personally insulting to you???

 

It doesn't bother me because I think you would laugh if you knew me ..but okay.  If you are a man you will apologize right away.  If you were a gentleman you would have never said it in the first place.

 

[jpinx]

5 minutes ago, amykat said:

 

I have already addressed the generalizations thing Chicog.  But to this next part ..you know nothing about me. I said nothing about my dating status here. I didn't even say that I had a low opinion of men here ..that is some of YOU men who keep saying that about yourselves!!!

 

That was an extremely insulting low blow and you know it!!  That is what you men on the forum do to shut us up and intimidate us from speaking. That is called bullying in the teenage world. 

 

What could I have possibly said that is so personally insulting to you???

 

It doesn't bother me because I think you would laugh if you knew me ..but okay.  If you are a man you will apologize right away.  If you were a gentleman you would have never said it in the first place.

 

You might think you have "addressed" it, but you haven't "undressed" it so that we can see the intent.  I posited a couple of elements to try and narrow the generalisations down to something we can get a handle on. 

...hang on -- I'm editing...

Edited January 15, 2017 by jpinx

[Chicog]

5 minutes ago, amykat said:

 

I have already addressed the generalizations thing Chicog.  But to this next part ..you know nothing about me. I said nothing about my dating status here. I didn't even say that I had a low opinion of men here ..that is some of YOU men who keep saying that about yourselves!!!

 

That was an extremely insulting low blow and you know it!!  That is what you men on the forum do to shut us up and intimidate us from speaking. That is called bullying in the teenage world. 

 

Please don't play the bullying card, that's pathetic.

I'll remind you of your own words; frankly you're full of it and I'd say that regardless of your gender:
 

Quote

What I did NOT know ...men here hate Western women.  Thai women run the show.  Thai women do not allow friendships with other women.

[jpinx]

Here is a possible source of your discontent -- instead of getting upset and "tackling" a perceived grievance with Chicog, why don't you talk just treat such grievances with the contempt you believe they deserve, ignore them and move on to people who will actually converse with you in a way that you find more pleasant :)

 

[Chicog]

Quote

The 2nd reason you do this, I believe, is because of the "we hate Western women thing" you must stick to this to get peer approval. 

 

There's another absurd judgement from your own posts.

 

I don't need approval from anyone for anything. 

And I certainly don't hate Western women.

I do, on the other hand, intensely dislike bitching harpies.

 

 

 

Edited January 15, 2017 by Chicog

[amykat]

14 minutes ago, jpinx said:

 

Ah -- now it starts to become clear.  For "western" substitute "american" maybe?

I'm here watching TV and following the Brexit pantomime discussion.  You?

There were so many vague generalisations in that post quoted it's hard to know where to begin.  Example - what is typically "Western food" ?

I'm not being argumentative, but you asked for "substance" :)

 

 

 substance on the topic at hand

 

What a genius with that analysis!!  You and Mr. "No statement is true".  Did you go to the same school? You have nothing to say so you try to engage your brain at grade level 1 and tear apart a sentence??  Why don't you write me an essay on American food and Western food and I will grade it for you later okay?

[jpinx]

1 minute ago, amykat said:

 

 substance on the topic at hand

 

What a genius with that analysis!!  You and Mr. "No statement is true".  Did you go to the same school? You have nothing to say so you try to engage your brain at grade level 1 and tear apart a sentence??  Why don't you write me an essay on American food and Western food and I will grade it for you later okay?

So -- what do you consider to be the topic at hand?

[Chicog]

1 minute ago, jpinx said:

So -- what do you consider to be the topic at hand?

 

The topic appears to be "Why Western men and Thai women are all nasty".

 

 

[The Dark Lord]

On 14/01/2017 at 1:11 PM, buddhalady said:

Being in a similar situation myself since I was widowed, I have a lot of sympathy for the writer of the original post. Like her,  I'm slim, presentable, intelligent and on a retirement visa and,  like her, I find the attitudes of farang men in CM to be so difficult to accept that I just avoid them like the plague.

 

Let's face it, girls, older farang men don't come here for the weather, the food or the laid-back lifestyle, they arrive looking for their lost youth as regards their long-since faded attraction for the opposite sex. The sight of an intelligent farang woman is like a red rag to a bull, revealing misogynism second only to that of the USA's appalling president elect! 

 

OK, I'm being verbally provocative - but I've found the same problems since my husband died. I live outside town on the edge of a small farang community comprising guys married to Thai girls mostly less than half their ages, few of whom speak much English. The local mom and pop shop bar is the meeting place, with the men sitting at one end drinking, talking and listening to 60s/70s pop and the girls at the other end playing with their smartphones and chatting between themselves. I'm expected to sit in silence with the girls - if I don't and attempt to join in the conversation, I'm told I'm stupid more often than not. On the other hand, the girls are friendly and fun, but it's impossible to have a real conversation as my attempts to learn Thai are not so successful. Result - I can go a week or more without having any English language communication with another human being, especially since the massive increase of traffic here often means a 1.5 hour drive to town rather than the former 35-40 minutes! 

 

Some of the  replies to the OP could easily have come from the above-mentioned group of sad old guys who simply can't accept intelligent women as worth even talking to. One point, however - the OP states she's had the chance to chat about current affairs but has rejected the opportunity. I should be so lucky! Go with the flow, girl, and enjoy impromptu conversations when they occur whilst keeping you right to end them when you need to.

 

 

 

 

With the exception of your second para, I feel for you. It must be a sad existence especially after having lost the one you loved so much.

 

whilst there is certainly an element of truth in your second para it was perhaps unnecessary as, like most males today,  we are becoming increasingly fed up with anything that refers to the female as spoken by the male being tagged by the "expression of the month" that stupid and mostly wrongly used word and it's derivatives, misogyny.

 

i hope life improves for you as living in virtual seclusion can have serious effects on your health both mental and physical.

 

chin up old girl ( I am older than you so don't get offended please).

[jpinx]

It's a bit tricky to know what's going on,  The title is "Intellectual Whore" but I've seen nothing particularly intellectual being posted, and only gutter talk that might be meant to address the "whore" aspects.  I only stuck my nose in because it came up on the top of the list of recent posts and the "intellectual Whore" clickbait worked on me :)   I have been amazed at some of the posting about how much hand-holding farangs seem to need/expect in Thailand, but that's not an issue, just an observation .  Having been told to write an essay, I tried to distill a subject, but that seems to not be forthcoming........

[The Dark Lord]

On 14/01/2017 at 3:36 PM, buddhalady said:

You're rare - be proud!

Not so rare dear lady but we don't have the newsworthy or abuse worthy characteristics that you read about .

[Chicog]

I would say that, if it's that miserable then move. 

 

Buddhalady says she lives in a community comprised of old farang men married to Thais.

It's somewhat of a leap to then state that " I find the attitudes of farang men in CM to be so difficult to accept that I just avoid them like the plague", if that's all she gets to mix with on a daily basis.

 

 

 

 

[roo860]

I can't make top nor tail of it, really it's a load of boll@$/s.

Sent from my SM-G920F using Thaivisa Connect mobile app

[LivinLOS]

2 hours ago, amykat said:

Some of us women know all about that and can help you too!!  We know every single thing the experienced MEN know about Thailand.

 

 

Believe me.. You dont.. 

 

I wouldnt for a second presume to think I knew 'every single thing' about another genders experiences.. Yet you do. Which sums up a lot. 

[LivinLOS]

1 hour ago, buddhalady said:

Life being life, inactivity and the price of booze here might have meant they were widowed earlier than they might have expected or, worse still,  the husband might have succumbed to younger, more exotic charms! Rare, I believe, but it does happen.

 

 

A fate worse than death apparently.. 

[LivinLOS]

1 hour ago, buddhalady said:

As regards single women who decide to come to Thailand for whatever reason, including a dislike of the countries of their birth, why should they not be able to have a circle of friends and acquaintances of both sexes? Female independence is a relatively new phenomenon, could it possibly be that the male contingent here resents womens' freedoms to do what they've done? To me it says a lot about the quality of male expats here nowadays - sad, because  when I first came here over 10 years ago, the community was a great deal different.

 

In this I agree... So then why the intellectual whore reaction when someone strikes up a conversation. 

 

Thats the issue I am having with this thread.. The female contributions (Nancy's excepted generally) make no sense.. Its a cake and eat it too position.. We dont want to be approached, but we also expect to be approached ?? 

[A1Str8]

Oh that is really simple. First, other people flapping their mouth. What does that have to do with you?!

Why would you listen? Every time someone talks down to another person, he is simply showing his own insecurities. 

That's why he does it. To try to feel better about himself by belittling others. That's how you know whether you have just met a man or a stupid boy whose body is getting older. A man will lift you up, elevate your mood. An insecure little boy will talk trash about you because his self esteem is so low and he feels so bitter and bad about himself that he tries to bring you down to his level, because he obviously feels that he's less than you. He feels that he's inferior and tries to compensate. 

Don't worry about it. When a boy shows up, tell him to get lost and go back to mommy. Focus on real men. 

By the way chatting up a woman by trying to talk about boring brexit and other nonsense is another clear indication that he doesn't even know what to say when he sees a woman. With that being said, why wonder that they talk bad to you. Do you expect more from an insecure little kid who forgot to grow up?? I wouldn't. 

If I saw a woman with that nice shape you described, which is very attractive to a lot of men, I would compliment her on it and ask if she's seeing someone then take her for dinner instead of talking about brexit and try to make her feel bad about herself. 

If I saw a fat person, at worst I would tell her to love herself more, eat well and exercise. 

Most grown men you see in Thailand would never even get a chance to get a good looking woman back where we come from, Europe US whatever. That's one of the reasons they are here. So then they see a smart, nice looking lady who is intellectual, can hold a meaningful conversation other than talking about facebook and getting drunk on the weekends. 

They don't have access to that otherwise they would be living it up with a hot western wife wherever they wanted to instead of going to Thailand and settling there because it's cheap and the women are easy. 

What did you expect what they were going to say? Oh yes you look good, you are smart and I wish I could have a woman like you but my insecurities don't allow me to do that:)? 

Don't bother with what others say. It's about you and how you want and see things. Not what others try to force on you coz they are disappointed with life. 

[SoiBiker]

Well, this thread isn't exactly dispelling the idea that the expat men here don't like western women, is it?

[jpinx]

2 minutes ago, SoiBiker said:

Well, this thread isn't exactly dispelling the idea that the expat men here don't like western women, is it?

Going for the generalisations -  it might be more accurate to say that western men totally misunderstand western women in Thailand apart from the considerable numbers of them happily married to a Thai man and/or working in a happy job.

 

 

[rijb]

14 minutes ago, A1Str8 said:

Most grown men you see in Thailand would never even get a chance to get a good looking woman back where we come from, Europe US whatever. That's one of the reasons they are here.

 

Give me a break!  

[cyberfarang]

35 minutes ago, buddhalady said:

Cyberfarang - let me try to answer your question ...

 

Firstly, one group of older Western women may have decided, along with their partners or husbands, to relocate to Thailand as they're sick to death of developments in their home countries. Many may be newly retired and have savings for exactly that, and early retirees  may have benefited from capital gains after selling their property.  Life being life, inactivity and the price of booze here might have meant they were widowed earlier than they might have expected or, worse still,  the husband might have succumbed to younger, more exotic charms! Rare, I believe, but it does happen.

 

Being Western, and having been brought up to be kind and supportive to neighbours and those in trouble or grief, newly single Western women might not want to return to the country they left because they hated it when they left and hated it even more since they've become used to living here. However, expecting any kindness, friendship, support etc, seems to be a waste of time if this thread is an example of responses to genuine concerns. The shock of rejection can result in even more misery.

 

The general opinion of the majority of posters on this thread seems to be that those of us in that situation should immediately go back where we came from, leaving our homes, maybe our pets and any chance of getting a new life in a familiar, warm, inexpensive  location.

 

As regards single women who decide to come to Thailand for whatever reason, including a dislike of the countries of their birth, why should they not be able to have a circle of friends and acquaintances of both sexes? Female independence is a relatively new phenomenon, could it possibly be that the male contingent here resents womens' freedoms to do what they've done? To me it says a lot about the quality of male expats here nowadays - sad, because  when I first came here over 10 years ago, the community was a great deal different.

 

One more point - today's global village is open to all, including women with 50 or so years behind them who've raised their children, had a career, perhaps  been divorced and decided to make a new life in a very different country. If they don't know Thailand, it's too easy to believe the hype and give it a try. 

Please let me try and answer you in a direct, respectful and logical way:

 

Firstly, one group of older Western women may have decided, along with their partners or husbands, to relocate to Thailand as they're sick to death of developments in their home countries. Many may be newly retired and have savings for exactly that, and early retirees  may have benefited from capital gains after selling their property.  Life being life, inactivity and the price of booze here might have meant they were widowed earlier than they might have expected or, worse still,  the husband might have succumbed to younger, more exotic charms! Rare, I believe, but it does happen.

I agree with you situations can change for the worse. Western women can find themselves widowed and suddenly living alone in this foreign land. But again you are generalising men by bringing booze and women into the picture. You older western women seem to have an obsession about this. I must tell you this really irritates me and if that`s your general opinion then you are an expat I would not want to befriend or even be acquainted with.

 

Being Western, and having been brought up to be kind and supportive to neighbours and those in trouble or grief, newly single Western women might not want to return to the country they left because they hated it when they left and hated it even more since they've become used to living here. However, expecting any kindness, friendship, support etc, seems to be a waste of time if this thread is an example of responses to genuine concerns. The shock of rejection can result in even more misery.

When I was living in England unlike the good old days my neighbours rarely spoke with each other, most kept to themselves, the community spirit had long gone. One good reason I have no wish to return. If expats are finding themselves being rejected here then they have to ask themselves; is it them and their attitudes that are making them seem unapproachable? Or the old cleshay, it`s not me, it`s all the others?

 

The general opinion of the majority of posters on this thread seems to be that those of us in that situation should immediately go back where we came from, leaving our homes, maybe our pets and any chance of getting a new life in a familiar, warm, inexpensive  location.

Again more nonsense. The realistic opinions are, that for the western women who find it difficult to adapt and accept that the lifestyles in Thailand are different to that of their home countries are not going to find fulfillment and happiness in Thailand. They can either stay and suffer in silence or make the most of it and look for the best, not the worse in people.   

 

As regards single women who decide to come to Thailand for whatever reason, including a dislike of the countries of their birth, why should they not be able to have a circle of friends and acquaintances of both sexes? Female independence is a relatively new phenomenon, could it possibly be that the male contingent here resents womens' freedoms to do what they've done? To me it says a lot about the quality of male expats here nowadays - sad, because  when I first came here over 10 years ago, the community was a great deal different.

Why shouldn`t western women have a circle of friends of both sexes? Why not indeed, what`s stopping you, want`s your problem? Surely you are not blaming expat men for creating set backs in your life? Maybe subconsciously you are expecting more from the men than just friendships, in need of a full blown relationship and even if you are only seeking acquaintances or just friends, ask your self, could it be your own attitudes that are holding you back? Especially as you seem to have such low opinions of the men folk here.

 

One more point - today's global village is open to all, including women with 50 or so years behind them who've raised their children, had a career, perhaps  been divorced and decided to make a new life in a very different country. If they don't know Thailand, it's too easy to believe the hype and give it a try. 

That sounds like a warning to western women not to believe that Thailand is not all it`s cut out to be, meaning you`re not happy here that takes me back to my original question, what do you expect to get out of living here and what actually are you seeking for yourself in Thailand? Do you want to be solitary and independent? Do you prefer to have a social life and a circle of people around you? Or would you rather be in a relationship? Or is it how it seems on reading some of these ladies posts, that they are seeking fulfillment, but are confused and don`t really know what they want?

[amykat]

1 hour ago, Chicog said:

 

 

 

Without wishing to piss on your strawberries, that's exactly what you're doing. Maybe you just don't see it.

 

You seem to be an adherent to the old adage of "Give a dog a bad name and hang him"".

 

 

 

If I describe for you what happened in WW2, that is not having a bad attitude or thinking negatively, that is telling you what happened.

 

I am telling you what happened in Thailand  for me and what happens here for expat women. I am telling you what happens on this forum when women post. You are displaying the behavior yourself, but DON"T seem to KNOW IT.   Poor Nancy gets no end of shit from you guys in spite of everything she does here.  Not all guys, sorry I haven't memorized the specific ones, but there are many of them.

 

Not ONE MAN in this community has ever done so much for so many people here!!  You -oh -so -powerful MEN, who know everything!!! Yet do nothing.  I wonder who are the recipients of most of her care??

 

It is impossible to DENY the mainly sexist and misogynistic attitudes displayed by many men here in general, much less the general disdain towards Western women.  If you chose to do it, okay, have at it, but do not abuse me and call me delusional for stating the truth.  This is a statement of FACT not my opinion. You can find it outside this website on every website about expats in Thailand.

 

I am able to look beyond this and see what is behind it in most cases. Are you able to??

 

There are men here who are honest with themselves and will click like to what I have written or who will want to.  There are men here who just haven't figured it out yet ..what is really going on in Thailand.  I believe most men here are very nice people down deep and some have problems with socializing and other things.  There is a subsection of very bad people here.

 

You are one of the people, instead of seeing me as a friend is determined to see me as the enemy. I had no feeling like that towards you.  I have no feeling like that towards ANY man here.  Check your hearts men ...how do you feel towards us??

 

Edited January 15, 2017 by amykat

[Chicog]

Quote

If I saw a woman with that nice shape you described, which is very attractive to a lot of men, I would compliment her on it and ask if she's seeing someone then take her for dinner instead of talking about brexit and try to make her feel bad about herself. 

 

Christ on a bike it goes from bad to worse.

 

[Chicog]

5 minutes ago, amykat said:

I am telling you what happened in Thailand  for me

 

I can't say I'm surprised.

 

Quote

 

and what happens here for expat women.

 

 

Not the ones I know, who aren't judgmental and hostile to people they don't even know.

You appear to have a rather large chip on your shoulder.

[jpinx]

"............I am able to look beyond this and see what is behind it in most cases. Are you able to??........"

 

If that is the case -- why are you still chewing the fat in here?

 

[HooHaa]

6 hours ago, LivinLOS said:

 

 

I was pondering this, and I think I may have realized what the problem thats semi articulated is.. 

 

Is it the case of essentially feeling it unfair, that a man may find you mentally attractive, that he may wish to make use of your sharp wit and shared cultural backgrounds to talk and discuss matters.. But then still have ready access to younger attractive partners for his other desires ?? Is that where the 'whore' kind of vibe is coming from, that its 'using you' to satisfy a mental craving, but then not having any desire for a physical one ?? That this is in a way unfair ?? 

 

Is that close to the money ?? 

 

Because that would be somewhat valid if the entire female western world hadnt been complaining of the exact opposite 'oh my god, I thought he wanted to talk about 3rd wave feminism and french cinema and really he just wanted to get into my pants because I have tits.. What a creep'.. I mean if the above is close to the summary it would seem poetic justice as women have held the power of rationed sexuality as standard practice for since, well, forever.. It would also take a very special kind of blindness to not see how rationing the only appeal left (mental) as it should be part of a 'social package' is going to cause increased frustration and isolation for only the side doing the rationing. 

 

Just keeping it light are you?

 

No issues to be exposed here, no.

 

 

Edited January 15, 2017 by HooHaa

[jpinx]

This is all about projections.  Many people I know do it, of both/all sexes, nationalities, colours.  It's a natural reaction when someone has had bad experiences before and meet a situation that has a strong resemblance.  It's a defense mechanism, well known to doctors.  It's like tensing up for an injection, even though we know it actually hurts less when we relax.  The problem is exacerbated when the person feels trapped in the situation that is causing the projection, there is no apparent escape and the projection starts to impinge on things that are not actually involved, making the persons life truly miserable.  Ask any psychiatrist.

 

The cure is within you, you are in control of your own life and you make choices every day knowing, albeit subconsciously, which choices are going to hurt and which will alleviate the condition.  Once you recognise this, the power to overcome the deeply held "chip on the shoulder" becomes available to you - as if by magic.  :)

[SoiBiker]

1 minute ago, jpinx said:

This is all about projections.  Many people I know do it, of both/all sexes, nationalities, colours.  It's a natural reaction when someone has had bad experiences before and meet a situation that has a strong resemblance.  It's a defense mechanism, well known to doctors.  It's like tensing up for an injection, even though we know it actually hurts less when we relax.  The problem is exacerbated when the person feels trapped in the situation that is causing the projection, there is no apparent escape and the projection starts to impinge on things that are not actually involved, making the persons life truly miserable.  Ask any psychiatrist.

 

The cure is within you, you are in control of your own life and you make choices every day knowing, albeit subconsciously, which choices are going to hurt and which will alleviate the condition.  Once you recognise this, the power to overcome the deeply held "chip on the shoulder" becomes available to you - as if by magic.  :)

 

Top mansplaining. 

[cmsally]

I must say I have never come across anybody particularly rude or nasty, maybe I just live some sort of charmed existence.

 

I would say these days Chiang mai is becoming too large and disparate to form any kind of inclusive expat community. Most of my expat friends have been here more long term as have I, so we have more in common. However most of us also have a larger circle of friends that come and go from Chiang Mai.; many of my good friends visit once or twice a year.

It's just a fact of life that you will have more in common with some and will simply click with some people.

I wouldn't presume to know about anyone else's experience or even their perception of me and others. Most of the foreigners I have met here have been friendly, interesting and polite.

I must admit I don't really dwell on the male /female thing. I have both male and female friends.

I wouldn't say on the whole that either of that group is more friendly than the other, but then I have never really thought about it.

I really am not getting the whole "intellectual whore" thing. Someone wants to drink coffee and talk about interesting stuff. What's the problem?

 

 

[jpinx]

3 minutes ago, SoiBiker said:

 

Top mansplaining. 

Not at all -- it applies to men equally.