7 hours ago, fletchsmile said:

For us the "don't keep money in Thailand mantra blah blah blah" is totally flawed. The FX risks alone of not having money/ assets in Thailand can be massive. I believe more in can you afford not to invest in Thailand if it's your long term home.

The mantra is useful for uneducated people who don't know what they are doing though and for newbies LOL plus of course people who have so much money it's irrelevant

 

I'm not married to Thailand, I have no attachments here and I doubt that I will be here forever. Greener pastures are available.

 

But above all I cant consider it as my "long term home" simply because I have to ask for permission to stay every year. I have no faith at all that this permission will continue to be granted indefinitely on terms that are acceptable to me.

 

For a real long term home feeling I would need to be where I can have right of abode and cant be ejected on the whim of some immigration official. That said, I've always felt at home wherever I am so it would not be difficult at all for me to move to another country. I've done it twice already in my life and doing it again wont be a problem. With that in mind I see no reason to bring my wealth to a country that doesnt even have free capital movement and where the currency has no real value outside its borders.

Unless I have a special purchase to make such as a car, I usually keep no more than 150k in my Thai account. As others have said, can always SWIFT from an overseas account in minutes to top-up as needed, or in an emergency use a credit card.

 

One of my concerns is lack of accountability in Thailand when something goes wrong e.g. if someone steals from your account. So many stories of banks here not taking responsibility. Also, deposits in Australia are guaranteed by the government for up to 250k (over six million baht) per bank. While I trust banks in Australia, I still keep below that limit with any one bank.

 

Interest rates and Term Deposits in Australia still compare favorably with most countries. I've renewed two TD's this year at 2.8% and 3.0% which is okay if you want to stay low risk. There are better rates on offer with the big banks for longer terms but you might tie up your money for ten years, or have to cash out for a lower amount if you were ever to need the money sooner.

23 minutes ago, KittenKong said:

 

I'm not married to Thailand, I have no attachments here and I doubt that I will be here forever. Greener pastures are available.

 

But above all I cant consider it as my "long term home" simply because I have to ask for permission to stay every year. I have no faith at all that this permission will continue to be granted indefinitely on terms that are acceptable to me.

 

For a real long term home feeling I would need to be where I can have right of abode and cant be ejected on the whim of some immigration official. That said, I've always felt at home wherever I am so it would not be difficult at all for me to move to another country. I've done it twice already in my life and doing it again wont be a problem. With that in mind I see no reason to bring my wealth to a country that doesnt even have free capital movement and where the currency has no real value outside its borders.

This

 

I could not agree more and with the military controlling things, still and the entire world lurching toward populism you just never know. Yeah, old hands have been here for decades and I am being paranoid BUT everyone conveniently forgets emigration impossible, PR virtually impossible. We live on TEMPORARY allowance to stay. I joke with my wife her ten year visa to US was easier to get and is far more hassle free.

 

While our visits to CW have been without issue, I'm already tired of it and the 90 day crap. Years ago I'd do runners, anything to avoid begging an extension.

 

Thailand is a lovely place and Im married to a Thai but there are many countries that would be on my radar. South America, E EU even Japan. I'm by no means stuck, the wife is a solid Intl traveler. But I totally agree.

 

The idea of bringing money in is more due to the marriage. It would never all be here but I'm just curious how others manage their funds.

 

Thx, you always have sound advice.

 

 

KKERRY exactly, when it goes missing, everyone shrugs. Even if they didn't steal it themselves they need to sort it out and that is not a Thai strong point lol.

 

We all need to acknowledge that money goes missing here far too often. Oh, never happened to me! Well, I've never been in an auto accident here either but the roads are some of most dangerous in the world.

 

Edited February 24, 20179 yr by Number 6

Moral of the story, don't trust banks in ANY country. Man up and secure your wealth your self.

10 hours ago, fletchsmile said:

1. Prefer not to use safety deposit boxes. We have two home safes. A bigger old fashioned type with the dial to open and key - heavy and fireproof.  Then a smaller hotel style one with keypad and digits - as much to keep important things in one place as anything

 

2. Comfortable with a few million THB in a Thai bank. Spread the money across different banks though and different family members. Was planning for when the deposit protection came into effect as to whether to hold more than 1 mn in any one bank in any single name. As they deferred the reduction it's one for the future though. You should pick the strong banks first and rely on DPA second. Unlike the US system where bankruptcy is common place and relying on Uncle Sam to bail you out is the norm  - long run on average people end up worse off for that. Take responsibilty.

I also don't keep any Foreign currency bank accounts in Thailand - apart from not being good VFM they're not covered by DPA

 

3. If I wasn't an expat it would be 100%. As an expat I used to aim for 1/3 where I came from, 1/3 here in Thailand and 1/3 offshore. Now settled here with family and kids in school, condo, car etc, I am happy with up to 50% in Thailand give or take.

For us the "don't keep money in Thailand mantra blah blah blah" is totally flawed. The FX risks alone of not having money/ assets in Thailand can be massive. I believe more in can you afford not to invest in Thailand if it's your long term home.

The mantra is useful for uneducated people who don't know what they are doing though and for newbies LOL plus of course people who have so much money it's irrelevant

 

4. In Singapore the deposit protection is only SGD50k per person per bank on SGD cash. Foreign currency like  in Thailand is not covered. So that's a reasonable guide. If you want to make the 200k threshold common for many premier services across banks the extra 150k can be in all manner of other products. Singapore banks have much stronger credit ratings than Thai banks and are among the safest in the world - though it's all relative LOL

 

Having a good wife you can trust also means you can double all these deposit protection amounts 

 

Cheers

Fletch :)

Hi...can you add a bit more on the security of deposits in Singapore?  What do you mean that foreign currencies are not protected?  If you open a Singapore account and transfer money from Thailand to the new account, isn't that money protected?  Sorry if that's a stupid question...my gf is starting to save money, and I am also concerned about the safety and worthiness of Thai banks...

 

so I'm guessing branches of foreign banks in the USA are not covered by govt insurance (e.g., Bangkok Bank)?

The same amount as I have invested in my coin operated gf.....ZERO....and sleep very well knowing the score......lol...?

11 hours ago, nervona81732 said:

Moral of the story, don't trust banks in ANY country. Man up and secure your wealth your self.

not possible if you are cash rich

9 hours ago, hdkane said:

Hi...can you add a bit more on the security of deposits in Singapore?  What do you mean that foreign currencies are not protected?  If you open a Singapore account and transfer money from Thailand to the new account, isn't that money protected?  Sorry if that's a stupid question...my gf is starting to save money, and I am also concerned about the safety and worthiness of Thai banks...

 

so I'm guessing branches of foreign banks in the USA are not covered by govt insurance (e.g., Bangkok Bank)?

 

The Singapore deposit protection scheme only applies to Singapore dollar accounts.

 

Most of us have to keep at least 800k in the bank for visa purposes.

Anyone who thinks Western banks are safer than Thai banks is being a little naive IMHO.

 

I cannot recall any Asian banks having to be bailed out in the last financial crisis. Correct me if I am wrong.

 

I was in the UK at the time and the Halifax Bank was 48hrs away from having no money in their ATM's !!!!

For many years including the Asian crisis i have had large sums in different Thai banks and saving bonds issued by major banks .I never had a problem and continue to have confidence in the Thai banking system .

In my previous property i had a heavy duty safe installed .It took four men to place it in the required location and was boxed in with reinforced steel and cement  .Unfortunately a tenant lost both the key and the combination code .My Thai wife contacted Mr Key from the Thai yellow pages .Over the telephone he said he said even without looking at the safe he could open it and would require 1,000

baht in advance .I wondered why he wanted paying in advance but agreed to the terms.He arrived was paid and opened the safe in fourteen minutes. He explained later he could open any safe so quickly people would argue about paying the agreed fee.

I now have a safe deposit box at the bank .

28 minutes ago, jippytum said:

For many years including the Asian crisis i have had large sums in different Thai banks and saving bonds issued by major banks .I never had a problem and continue to have confidence in the Thai banking system .

In my previous property i had a heavy duty safe installed .It took four men to place it in the required location and was boxed in with reinforced steel and cement  .Unfortunately a tenant lost both the key and the combination code .My Thai wife contacted Mr Key from the Thai yellow pages .Over the telephone he said he said even without looking at the safe he could open it and would require 1,000

baht in advance .I wondered why he wanted paying in advance but agreed to the terms.He arrived was paid and opened the safe in fourteen minutes. He explained later he could open any safe so quickly people would argue about paying the agreed fee.

I now have a safe deposit box at the bank .

• So....you think you are safe now ...? In case of a treasury or money crisis you think you can have access to your bank safe....remember Greece latest time ....you would not have acces anymore ....remember your home is your castle ...

 

Btw. showing or letting use a tenant your heavy duty safe is not so high security thinking .... better install for those a standard room safe , and put yours on a hidden place (if available ...) as now somebody besides you knows you are concerned ...".so must be loaded ...(think)..."

And for loosing combination , buy those high end safes who also have the emergency electronic reader/edit device that you can connect electronic way to YOUR override code ....

Edited February 25, 20179 yr by david555

9 minutes ago, david555 said:

So....you think you are safe now ...? In case of a treasury or money crisis you think you can have access to your bank safe....remember Greece latest time ....

... and Argentina.

 

People who have a great  paranoia and worry too much about  losing their money generally manage to do so .

Can't remember who said that was it  Warren Buffet or  Bernie Madoff ???555

44 minutes ago, jippytum said:

People who have a great  paranoia and worry too much about  losing their money generally manage to do so .

Can't remember who said that was it  Warren Buffet or  Bernie Madoff ???555

Is this not the main reason for this topic posted by O.P.???  &  including "the one who does only trust now bank safes only"....? 555.....

 

And I even did not explained my high security tutorial for buying transporting and installing that safe safe  very anonymous ......as a secret only kept secret as only 1 person knows it ...., from the moment shared ..... it could be not a secret anymore........

Edited February 25, 20179 yr by david555

Been  in Thailand for around 12 years and never experienced a problem with Bangkok Bank.

 

On the amount. Well, I think many posters on here have investments and much more available dosh than I, so can afford to spread it around and many of the comments are very sensible.

 

However, the Immigration set the bar for me of 800,000 baht. So, what I do is jack up my account to 900,000 some three or four months before and then let it slowly sink throughout the next 9 months after my retirement extension.

 

Of course, I can always get a 'letter of income' from the UK Embassy but paying them nearly 60 pounds for that privilege sticks in the throat. 

Well, i don't have much money to worry about, but as said by some, if money goes missing from a Thai account good luck on getting it back. Also, although the Thai government 'guarantees' deposits in a Thai bank has this ever actually been honoured? I had money in a bank covered by the UK government guarantee (and Iceland's, Ha Ha ha). I got it back from the UK government, They just have to much tied up with confidence in the UK banking system to NOT honour it. 

 

I keep most money in UK, do not really have enough to keep large amounts overseas. I get interest rates of between 1% and 5% on all my money, probably averaging just below 3% (although it is getting tougher to achieve this). I can still get over 20,000 pounds booked at these rates no problem, by spreading across 5 banks. Have a bit more invested but returns have not been brilliant the last 5 years. I have a pension so don't need lots of cash, just draw it each month.

 

In Thailand i do not like to keep more than 100,000 baht in any account with ATM access, because of fraud. More possibly in a book only account as maybe safer. Not an issue so far as it doesn't sit around long enough ........

I'm really surprised by most of the responses - I had assumed most expats have 800k baht (or the equivalent in foreign currency) in Thai banks to qualify for the  1 year retirement visas or extensions.

 

I guess more marriage and work visas than I realized in this community.

 

I'm planning to do the 800k baht myself although the responses here make me feel less secure about it.

 

Someone stated that Thailand is the same as Singapore as far as not extending bank coverage to accounts if they are in foreign currency.

I see on the DPA site that is indeed correct.

 

Was planning to set up a USD account in a Thai bank but don't see myself doing that now.

 

Will exchange it for Baht but then can't root for the baht to fall vs. USD...

 

Edited February 26, 20179 yr by JimmyJ

1 hour ago, JimmyJ said:

I'm really surprised by most of the responses - I had assumed most expats have 800k baht (or the equivalent in foreign currency) in Thai banks to qualify for the  1 year retirement visas or extensions.

 

I guess more marriage and work visas than I realized in this community.

 

I'm planning to do the 800k baht myself although the responses here make me feel less secure about it.

 

Someone stated that Thailand is the same as Singapore as far as not extending bank coverage to accounts if they are in foreign currency.

I see on the DPA site that is indeed correct.

 

Was planning to set up a USD account in a Thai bank but don't see myself doing that now.

 

Will exchange it for Baht but then can't root for the baht to fall vs. USD...

 

You must not worry about Thai banks , but the way O.P put he topic question , is almost like  is asking how much money some have , because that people keep discretion , more people on ret. ext. than on marriage type ext. ...... even those married sometimes feel more secure to use the pure ret.ext. as complete  independent from" darling ...my girl is different "wifey''s" possible mood changes ...also immigration process is more simple for ret.ext. than for the marriage type ext. (more paperwork and controls ..) even immigration officers like to push for the pure ret.ext .,less job for them ....

On 2/24/2017 at 9:00 PM, hdkane said:

Hi...can you add a bit more on the security of deposits in Singapore?  What do you mean that foreign currencies are not protected?  If you open a Singapore account and transfer money from Thailand to the new account, isn't that money protected?  Sorry if that's a stupid question...my gf is starting to save money, and I am also concerned about the safety and worthiness of Thai banks...

 

so I'm guessing branches of foreign banks in the USA are not covered by govt insurance (e.g., Bangkok Bank)?

Basically in the same way that Thailand's Deposit Protection Act covers only Thai baht deposits, the Singapore equivalent covers only deposits in Singapore dollars. This is common for many countries.

 

Influenced by the fact if banks did go busts goverments could print money in their own domestic currency to cover it, but if the amount is in foreign currency they would have to buy it to provide protection, and this could lead to significant liabilities. Imagine a country with problems whose currency depreciates say 1000 times in value vs a foreign currency in times of crisis.

 

So Foreign currency deposits are not covered. Hence USD deposits would not be covered in Singapore or Thailand. THB deposits would not be covered in Singapore and SGD deposits would not be covered in Thailand.

 

Singapore overview

 

https://www.sdic.org.sg/SDIC/apps/services/www/SDICSecureApp/desktopbrowser/default/public/di_overview

 

Singapore FAQ:

 

https://www.sdic.org.sg/SDIC/apps/services/www/SDICSecureApp/desktopbrowser/default/faq/di_faq

 

On the question of which bank is covered or not it depends on whether they are members of the particular deposit protection scheme. You should check the relevant country website of the DPA/ equivalent or legislation. eg if you check the Singapore site there is a list as below. For Singapore it covers not only the main Singaporean banks but also some foreign banks are members such as Citi, StanChart, HSBC

 

https://www.sdic.org.sg/SDIC/apps/services/www/SDICSecureApp/desktopbrowser/default/sm_list/di_scheme_members

 

For the Thai DPA, you can find similar info on amounts, and links to which institutions etc here. In Thailand most of the Thai banks are covered, however, a handful of government/state banks are not covered by DPA but guaranteed by the government/state entities direct

 

http://www.dpa.or.th/main.php?filename=index___EN

 

List of Thai institutions, including some foreign institutions in addition to just Thai banks

 

http://www.dpa.or.th/ewt_news.php?nid=34&filename=index___EN

 

So 2 key general points:

1) go for the domestic currency of the country your account is in if you want deposit protection

2) check out the lists to make sure your bank is included. A bank's own website should also usually refer to whether they are a member/ covered or not on their site

 

Cheers

Fletch :)

Edited February 26, 20179 yr by fletchsmile

I keep the necessary 800k for the extension of stay plus a separate a/c of 500K for emergencies.  I am not into gold or the other valuables whilst my shares, the dividends that are banked, together with the remainder (majority) of my cash is held in Australia.  Every  month, I transfer a stipend that covers my monthly expenses and allows me to live quite comfortably.

 

I have no debt nor the worries of not being able to return home should , one day, I decide to do so.  And no one, not even my wife knows what I am worth and it will stay that way as I have heard to many tales of foreigners who get taken even after many years of so called happy married life. If everything remains as it is now then, one day, if she survives me, she will never want for anything and hopefully, pleasantly surprised. I have only two sayings that I have stuck by and that is one should never flaunt their wealth, whilst fools and their money are soon parted. 

On ‎25‎/‎02‎/‎2017 at 11:52 AM, cauldlad said:

Anyone who thinks Western banks are safer than Thai banks is being a little naive IMHO.

 

I cannot recall any Asian banks having to be bailed out in the last financial crisis. Correct me if I am wrong.

 

I was in the UK at the time and the Halifax Bank was 48hrs away from having no money in their ATM's !!!!

No Australian Bank had to be bailed out prior to, during or following the GFC, that's why the majority of my funds are kept there and I transfer, via internet banking, an amount that covers my monthly expenses.  I only have the two accounts here, one for retirement, the other for emergencies. I have no sleepless nights.

Edited February 27, 20179 yr by Si Thea01

This has been a great thread. Thanks everyone.

 

I've no problem sharing the value of my assets if there is a need with my wife. We live in Thailand, my money lives abroad. I love her dearly and she is surely entitled to what's left when I'm gone. Short of that she'd have a difficult time getting a satang more than I'd want to give her for a divorce - I'd just leave and she'd get nothing. But I purposely left the waifu angle out of the question.

 

I hardly flaunt wealth in fact, I'm clearly not wealthy lol. We live simple lives and will do so until I hit 62. After that a huge upgrade but still simple lives. Mywife asks nothing of me financially for herself or her family. She's more honest than I am.

 

 

It's purely a question about trust in Thai banks and for those that also keep valuables and metals safety boxes. Again, I do recall stories of bank employees rifling boxes.

 

Thanks Fletch, you are always a good read.

Edited March 23, 20179 yr by Number 6

Never more than a year's living expenses total either in the Thai bank or my personal safe. The rest overseas.

On 2/27/2017 at 8:08 AM, Si Thea01 said:

No Australian Bank had to be bailed out prior to, during or following the GFC, that's why the majority of my funds are kept there and I transfer, via internet banking, an amount that covers my monthly expenses.  I only have the two accounts here, one for retirement, the other for emergencies. I have no sleepless nights.

No Thai bank had to be bailed out over GFC either.... 

 

In fact working in a Thailand based bank at the time, and being part of the committees that discussed liquidity and capital for the bank, I was very happy to have money in Thai banks. I don't really think we'll ever know how close more of the western banks came to collapse and a knock on systemic effect.  I was comfortable that Thai banks were much more detached from their developed western counterparts and with relatively low amounts of FX exposure. Simply put, I was very happy in the knowledge my THB was safe here in Thailand, even if the US and Europe went pear shaped.

 

1997 of course was the opposite way round with your money safer in the west.

 

Aussie banks have had some capital issues in recent years. On the whole the top 4 Aussie banks are better run than the banks here, but I see it more as a case of not having all your eggs in one basket. Who's to say that the next financial crisis won't hit or even originate in Oz?

 

What was the comment a while back? Aussie banks aren't just too big too fail, they're almost too big to even get sick? 

 

 

Edited March 24, 20179 yr by fletchsmile