Farmers defend Yingluck scheme and ask for help

[webfact]

Farmers defend Yingluck scheme and ask for help

By Pratch Rujivanarom 
The Nation

 

Farmer Supachai Srithongjoi stands in front of his paddy field in Nakhon Pathom, which will be ready for harvesting in three months.

 

BANGKOK: -- The Supreme Court will read a verdict on the case involving ex-prime minister Yingluck Shinawatra and her controversial rice-pledging scheme on Friday.

Farmers in the central region tell The Nation’s Pratch Rujivanarom that the policy was actually helpful during a time of low rice prices.

 

Farmers say the rice-pledging scheme under Yingluck Shinawara’s administration was beneficial to them, and have urged the current government to help raise the price of rice. They say rice is very cheap now, and they can’t make enough profit from farming.

 

Amphai, a 54-year-old rice farmer in Nonthaburi’s Sai Noi district, said that during the time of the Yingluck government she could earn a lot of money from selling rice. At that time, due to the pledging scheme, the price was as high as Bt15,000 per tonne and she could expand her field up to 150 rai (24 hectares).

 

 

“It was a good time back then,” Amphai said. “The farmers could earn a substantial profit from rice and had a good standard of living. It was a good policy and I am sad to see my beloved former prime minister being sued in court for her good deed to farmers.”

 

She said that the situation was much worse nowadays, as paddy prices had plummeted as low as Bt6,500 a tonne, which did not even cover the cost of planting rice. This meant that many farmers, including her, had a large amount of debt.

 

“I am now reducing the rice-planting land to only 18 rai, as selling paddy rice is not profitable any more. The more we grow, the more debt we have, because the price of fertiliser and pesticide is more and more expensive in contrast to the rice price,” she said, noting that she was more than Bt1 million in debt with the Bank for Agriculture and Agricultural Cooperatives.

 

Yingluck’s rice-pledging policy was intended as a kind of price guarantee during a period of low rice prices. The government pledged farmers up to Bt15,000 per tonne for good quality rice. The idea was that when the rice price went up again, the farmers could redeem their rice and sell it for a high price in the market.

 

Another farmer in Nakhon Pathom’s Bang Len district, Withun, 75, told a similar story to Amphai’s. He said that his family’s livelihood was better during the Yingluck government due to high rice price.

 

“I have been growing rice for my entire life and I can say that now is the hardest time for farmers that I can remember,” he said.

 

“I cannot recall any time that the rice price was this low compared to my daily expenses. All of my children have had to abandon the family business and go to Bangkok to find a job.

 

“We do not want anything from the government, we just want them to keep the rice price at least Bt10,000 per tonne, or else the farmers nationwide will starve to death and there will be no more backbone of the country.”

 

The village head in Tambon Narapirom of Bang Len district, Supachai Srithongjoi, revealed that the debt problem had reached the point that many farmers have had to sell their land to topsoil mining businesses.

 

“Hundreds of rai of paddy field in this tambon have been sold to businessmen from outside to dig up the topsoil for sale,” Supachai said.

 

He added that the mining “caused many problems to the community, such as land sinking and landslides into nearby plots”.

“The large number of lorries that come to transport soil also damage the local roads,” Supachai said.

 

 

Asked about the government policy to reduce the amount of rice-farming area and encourage farmers to plant other crops, he said that most land in his region was not suitable for crops such as maize or sugarcane.

 

“Our region is irrigated by the Chao Phraya River and Ta Chin River, which is best for planting rice, and we can plant rice three times a year. Moreover, we do not have knowledge about growing other crops,” he said.

 

“I understand that the government wants to punish a corrupt politician, but at least we want the government to help us on this rice-price crisis.”

 

Another farmer from Phitsanulok’s Bang Rakam district, Suthon Manaowan, said that the government had provided no help on rice prices this year. He wanted government help not just because the price was so low, but because many farmers had suffered in the recent floods.

 

“Farmers need the rice price to be at least Bt7,000 per tonne if the government cannot bring back a |rice-pledging policy that can guarantee the price at Bt10,000 per tonne. If the government is going to issue a new policy to help the farmers, they have to do it soon,” Suthon said.

 

Asked about the claims of corruption, he said: “The government should let the justice system work out this issue, but they should also help the farmers.”

 

Source: http://www.nationmultimedia.com/detail/politics/30324484

 

-- © Copyright The Nation 2017-08-22

[wakeupplease]

Farmers all around the world complain about prices, but with no farmers there is no food so a compromise has to be reached hence subsidies which other countries pay there farmers but here the money just ends up in corrupt pockets including farmers but mainly the HISO.

[ezzra]

I don't expect the Thai farmers to react in any other way than to supprot

the person who gave them free billions of bahts...

There is no excuse to justify buying thousands of tons of rice paying inflated

prices just to manipulate the markets and for most of it to be just left there and rot away..., sure, there's is nothing in being 

a commerce savvy but i need to make your homework before committing

hundreds of billions of the public's money to such folly,,

it's got so bad, that rice from neighboring counrties were sold to the government

as Thai rice, i mean how low can you go?......

Edited August 21, 2017 by ezzra

[Ricardo]

" Farmers say the rice-pledging scheme under Yingluck Shinawara’s administration was beneficial to them, and have urged the current government to help raise the price of rice. They say rice is very cheap now, and they can’t make enough profit from farming. "

 

Clearly they don't get the connection, between over-production as-a-result-of the scheme & the disposal (only just now ended) of the excessive-stocks built-up by the end of it, and the lower-prices they have been seeing since then.

 

Thaksin's corner-the-world-market at-the-expense-of-the-Thai-taxpayer idea should get the credit it deserves for both !

[Baerboxer]

1 hour ago, Ricardo said:

" Farmers say the rice-pledging scheme under Yingluck Shinawara’s administration was beneficial to them, and have urged the current government to help raise the price of rice. They say rice is very cheap now, and they can’t make enough profit from farming. "

 

Clearly they don't get the connection, between over-production as-a-result-of the scheme & the disposal (only just now ended) of the excessive-stocks built-up by the end of it, and the lower-prices they have been seeing since then.

 

Thaksin's corner-the-world-market at-the-expense-of-the-Thai-taxpayer idea should get the credit it deserves for both !

 

To be fair, if PTP had managed to remain in power, and secured that 2.2 trillion baht loan, and kept it off the books and away from parliamentary scrutiny, then they could have easily covered the rice scheme losses and carried it on for much longer, securing their own tenure.

Of course, when that much much bigger bubble had burst, the consequences would have been dire. But certain families offshore wealth would have been massive so they wouldn't have cared.

[Xonax]

Like anywhere in the world, farmers need financial help from the government.  But it will have to be secured, that this is sustainable and can happen without fraud and corruption.  Selling the same rice twice to the government is not sustainable.

[seajae]

farmers seem to forget that the price of rice is set by the market, they also seem to forget that what the ptp did is the reason the prices are so bad now. These people cannot accept they are part of the reason the prices are low, they need to accept they were fooled by yl and her promises but they only react to any profits made, money rules.  Making excuses and blaming everyone else is what they do best, if they cant afford to grow rice the way they do currently they need to change what they are doing like other countries have,  time for them to accept they are a big part of the problem, thing is they cannot accept the truth of the matter. 

[bikerbri]

3 hours ago, ezzra said:

I don't expect the Thai farmers to react in any other way than to supprot

the person who gave them free billions of bahts...

There is no excuse to justify buying thousands of tons of rice paying inflated

prices just to manipulate the markets and for most of it to be just left there and rot away..., sure, there's is nothing in being 

a commerce savvy but i need to make your homework before committing

hundreds of billions of the public's money to such folly,,

it's got so bad, that rice from neighboring counrties were sold to the government

as Thai rice, i mean how low can you go?......

Tell me a country that doesn't support its farmers with subsidies.

[robblok]

3 hours ago, Ricardo said:

" Farmers say the rice-pledging scheme under Yingluck Shinawara’s administration was beneficial to them, and have urged the current government to help raise the price of rice. They say rice is very cheap now, and they can’t make enough profit from farming. "

 

Clearly they don't get the connection, between over-production as-a-result-of the scheme & the disposal (only just now ended) of the excessive-stocks built-up by the end of it, and the lower-prices they have been seeing since then.

 

Thaksin's corner-the-world-market at-the-expense-of-the-Thai-taxpayer idea should get the credit it deserves for both !

Yes the prices are so much lower BECAUSE of the rice program. (and the world market of course). There is an oversupply partly because of the rice program. 

[yellowboat]

11 minutes ago, seajae said:

farmers seem to forget that the price of rice is set by the market, they also seem to forget that what the ptp did is the reason the prices are so bad now. These people cannot accept they are part of the reason the prices are low, they need to accept they were fooled by yl and her promises but they only react to any profits made, money rules.  Making excuses and blaming everyone else is what they do best, if they cant afford to grow rice the way they do currently they need to change what they are doing like other countries have,  time for them to accept they are a big part of the problem, thing is they cannot accept the truth of the matter. 

You can sit on your high horse and give a hi-so lecture a very powerful voting block if you would like, pushing hate even further in Thailand, or you can reason with them.  One of the farmers said:

 

5 hours ago, webfact said:

“Our region is irrigated by the Chao Phraya River and Ta Chin River, which is best for planting rice, and we can plant rice three times a year. Moreover, we do not have knowledge about growing other crops,”

He has stated a problem.  If he is telling the truth and is ignored, the viscous cycle will continue.  Is the junta going to do anything for people who support and political adversary?  Perhaps not in today's Thailand. 

[kaorop]

With basically every country in the world subsidizing its farmers which is seemingly unsustainable.

 

Complex,  world wide, massive competing interests and trillions of dollars. 

 

Who can solve that can o worms?

[Eric Loh]

34 minutes ago, bikerbri said:

Tell me a country that doesn't support its farmers with subsidies.

http://www.worldwatch.org/agricultural-subsidies-remain-staple-industrial-world-0

 

True and only in Thailand has a PM been charged for a subsidy policy pledged to the people. If that is so, the top 20 food producing countries which has subsidies of USD480 B in 2012 will be similarly be charged. Direct payment that decouple from production is not uniquely Thai too. Direct payment is a common form of subsidy to farmers to produce as much or as little and still receive the subsidy. 

[worgeordie]

"They say rice is very cheap now", if that is true ,why is it so expensive in the shops.

regards Worgeordie

[kaorop]

8 minutes ago, worgeordie said:

"They say rice is very cheap now", if that is true ,why is it so expensive in the shops.

regards Worgeordie

The middle men, wholesalers and retailers never seem to struggle with prices like farmers or the general public do.

 

Co-operatives appear to work, but many of those fall into fleecing and corruption so I've read.

 

Edited August 22, 2017 by kaorop

[robblok]

34 minutes ago, yellowboat said:

You can sit on your high horse and give a hi-so lecture a very powerful voting block if you would like, pushing hate even further in Thailand, or you can reason with them.  One of the farmers said:

 

He has stated a problem.  If he is telling the truth and is ignored, the viscous cycle will continue.  Is the junta going to do anything for people who support and political adversary?  Perhaps not in today's Thailand. 

We do not have knowledge... there are plenty of programs to acquire knowledge.. sounds a lot like someone who does not want to change.

[Ricardo]

Someone needs to explain to the farmers how members of her government/party defrauded the rice-scheme, pretending to buy rice cheaply for G2G-export but then re-selling it back to the scheme, and pocketing a tidy profit.

 

https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/998265-case-of-fake-export-deals/

 

This directly reduced the funds still available to BAAC, with which to pay the poor farmers, and helped cause it to collapse all-the-sooner !  Although it would have collapse eventually anyway.

 

 

 

[Eric Loh]

17 minutes ago, Ricardo said:

Someone needs to explain to the farmers how members of her government/party defrauded the rice-scheme, pretending to buy rice cheaply for G2G-export but then re-selling it back to the scheme, and pocketing a tidy profit.

 

https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/998265-case-of-fake-export-deals/

 

This directly reduced the funds still available to BAAC, with which to pay the poor farmers, and helped cause it to collapse all-the-sooner !  Although it would have collapse eventually anyway.

 

 

 

Perhaps a reminder to you that the court will rule on the case on Friday. You seem to be privy to the verdict. How so? 

[bheard]

http://www.worldwatch.org/agricultural-subsidies-remain-staple-industrial-world-0
 
True and only in Thailand has a PM been charged for a subsidy policy pledged to the people. If that is so, the top 20 food producing countries which has subsidies of USD480 B in 2012 will be similarly be charged. Direct payment that decouple from production is not uniquely Thai too. Direct payment is a common form of subsidy to farmers to produce as much or as little and still receive the subsidy. 

Of course it is the case that this prosecution is the result of the current administration working for the BKK "born to rule" crowd and using the pledging scheme along with the corrupt justice system to nail their opposition.
Not much to do with the pledging scheme itself.

[ballpoint]

6 hours ago, webfact said:

Amphai, a 54-year-old rice farmer in Nonthaburi’s Sai Noi district, said that during the time of the Yingluck government she could earn a lot of money from selling rice. At that time, due to the pledging scheme, the price was as high as Bt15,000 per tonne and she could expand her field up to 150 rai (24 hectares).

Given that the average farm size in the Northeast is 2.4 hectares, this woman is hardly one of the poor rural folk who we are told were targeted for this scheme.  Given that she appears to be struggling with her 24 hectares, it is no wonder that the owner of a 2.4 hectare plot is in bad shape.  The problem is, a small family owned plot that was quite enough to feed the family, with some left over for bartering for other goods, back in the not so long ago days of buffalo power and no electricity / motor bikes / pick up trucks, and which has been divided up between the kids and grandkids into ever smaller ones since then, is never going to produce enough rice to be a viable source of income in this consumer age.  Unless the government educate the people to move into other jobs, the country will continue to be held hostage, if that's not too strong a term, by this group whose votes determine the balance of power.

[yellowboat]

42 minutes ago, robblok said:

We do not have knowledge... there are plenty of programs to acquire knowledge.. sounds a lot like someone who does not want to change.

So you are saying this guy is lying ?  Asked friends about such programs in Issan.  All I get is a funny look.  If there are programs, they do not appear to be implemented widely or correctly.  Wrong or right, these people are a huge voting force, unless you are a fan of might makes right, where votes do not count.  Pretty sure they are like most Thais; happy to make buck if possible. 

[Eric Loh]

3 minutes ago, ballpoint said:

Unless the government educate the people to move into other jobs, the country will continue to be held hostage, if that's not too strong a term, by this group whose votes determine the balance of power.

See your point but will be difficult when the public expenditure in Thailand has an over concentration in Bangkok and an inefficient budget distribution between the central government and province administrations. Got to add the frivolous defence spending on hardware rather than developing the poorer provinces. According to the World Bank, Thailand has the world's widest discrepancies in expenditure between the capital and upcountry. There really lack of desire by this junta government to develop and provide alternative opportunities for the farmers. Perhaps all this by design. Keep them poor, uneducated and submissive.    

[coulson]

Another farmer from Phitsanulok’s Bang Rakam district, Suthon Manaowan, said that the government had provided no help on rice prices this year.

Says it all.

Surprised they don't ask uncle to fix the annual rainfall also.

[robblok]

54 minutes ago, yellowboat said:

So you are saying this guy is lying ?  Asked friends about such programs in Issan.  All I get is a funny look.  If there are programs, they do not appear to be implemented widely or correctly.  Wrong or right, these people are a huge voting force, unless you are a fan of might makes right, where votes do not count.  Pretty sure they are like most Thais; happy to make buck if possible. 

I seen quite a few articles about programs like that and giving knowledge to farmers. I also know that farmers hate change and prefer a handout. 

[robblok]

43 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

See your point but will be difficult when the public expenditure in Thailand has an over concentration in Bangkok and an inefficient budget distribution between the central government and province administrations. Got to add the frivolous defence spending on hardware rather than developing the poorer provinces. According to the World Bank, Thailand has the world's widest discrepancies in expenditure between the capital and upcountry. There really lack of desire by this junta government to develop and provide alternative opportunities for the farmers. Perhaps all this by design. Keep them poor, uneducated and submissive.    

Eric,

 

When most of the money of taxes is collected in BKK its only fair that it gets put back there too. 

60% of taxes in 2010 64,4% in 2011 and 63,8% in 2012

 

[British Bulldog]

Figures of 6500 baht per ton, and others up to 15,000 per ton ??? Somethings wrong here ... no economy can withstand those sorts of extremes, even if there is good rice, normal and bad rice,  me thinks an slight pushing of the true facts here !

[starky]

36 minutes ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

It has always been thus and it is exactly why any Thaksin party always has widespread support.

 

The poorest parts of the country were targeted after the Asian financial crash and the rich got richer. The Democrat party is un-electable in the NE as a result.

 

The North remembers.

 

Posters here can lecture farmers with their poorly-educated bar-stool wisdom but the crux of the matter is Thaksin's policies benefited the poorest in the country and they will always remember (and re-elect) him for that. 

 

You can't have reconciliation without reducing the disparity between Thailand's rich and poor and that gap continues to increase markedly under the junta. 

 

 

 

 

Yes the North remembers and winter is coming...

[Muhendis]

The price for rice is currently 13,000 Baht/tonne where I live so what is all this rubbish about a price guarantee of 10,000/tonne? Perhaps that is the local price somewhere. If that's the case then these rice farmers need to get organised into some sort of consortium or federation and use group leverage to negotiate a better deal with the millers. If that is not the case then someone is trying to pull the wool over our eyes.

[Srikcir]

1 hour ago, robblok said:

When most of the money of taxes is collected in BKK its only fair that it gets put back there too. 

60% of taxes in 2010 64,4% in 2011 and 63,8% in 2012

That's because most of the nation's wealth is in Bangkok. Ergo, that's where most of the taxes are generated. But for Thailand to exist as a nation, it must redistribute such wealth in terms of tax revenues more equally to those provinces most needful to raise the standard of living nationwide.

Otherwise, Bangkok becomes a tyrant at the expense of the rest of the nation that dictates how the rest of the country advances or stagnates. As it has historically.

[billd766]

38 minutes ago, Muhendis said:

The price for rice is currently 13,000 Baht/tonne where I live so what is all this rubbish about a price guarantee of 10,000/tonne? Perhaps that is the local price somewhere. If that's the case then these rice farmers need to get organised into some sort of consortium or federation and use group leverage to negotiate a better deal with the millers. If that is not the case then someone is trying to pull the wool over our eyes.

I suspect it all depends on the type of rice.

 

Hom Mali has always been sold for a a higher price than standard white paddy rice.

 

At the end of the day it depends on the international market rates.

 

http://www.indexmundi.com/commodities/?commodity=rice&months=60

 

The rice exporter is the one in Thailand who gets the most money per ton and he has to make a profit.

 

He has to buy from his supplier etc until you get down to the farmers. Everyone makes a profit, including the farmers but they have to be really lucky every year, and most of them are not that lucky. The small scale farmers are the ones who suffer the most.

[robblok]

That's because most of the nation's wealth is in Bangkok. Ergo, that's where most of the taxes are generated. But for Thailand to exist as a nation, it must redistribute such wealth in terms of tax revenues more equally to those provinces most needful to raise the standard of living nationwide.
Otherwise, Bangkok becomes a tyrant at the expense of the rest of the nation that dictates how the rest of the country advances or stagnates. As it has historically.

Those who are paying tax should get the rewards too. Redistribute your own wealth please not that of others. If i pay a lot of tax id prefer to see the road in front of my house repaired first then others. Nothing tyrant about that just fairness if you pay in a system its normal to expect something back.