British expats in Thailand feeling the misery as the UK pound drops to record low levels.

[billd766]

4 hours ago, whiteman said:

do u not know every body here is ex special forces or so they tell every one when they are out and about in Thailand :0

 

Not me. I was a corporal RAF when I retired back in 1984.

 

I have know only one or two ex SAS guys and they are the quiet ones, who don't brag about what they were and walk away at the first sign of trouble. They have nothing to prove.

[jeab1980]

5 hours ago, whiteman said:

do u not know every body here is ex special forces or so they tell every one when they are out and about in Thailand :0

 no such thing as EX OAMAAM.

Edited August 30, 2017 by jeab1980

[bazza73]

On 8/29/2017 at 3:58 PM, rickudon said:

Trying to find an alternative investment to savings accounts can provide a bit of a challenge,and it also leaves a bad taste in your mouth. I was looking at buying some shares in water companies (because it is a product with no real substitute and production costs are fairly stable), so i looked at Thames Water. It is no longer a public company, having been bought out of public ownership by a network of international trusts. It no longer pays corporation tax (why?) and pays massive dividends to it's offshore owners. Also being asset stripped and little investment. The next water company was in a similar situation, but still had public ownership - but paid no dividends to share holders. The reality is that to many British companies have become vehicles to drain capital out of the country. 

 

Not surprising then that my FTSE tracker fund has been a Dodo for the last 10 years, having achieved a growth of around 10% in that time (mainly being in negative territory). I do have some other investments, but they have only done slightly better. I actually achieve similar returns on my savings (where, due to much account switching, i still get at least 2-3%).

 

I have decided to cash all the surplus in and spend it, after all i may as well enjoy about 3 years before it is gone. I might have gone as well. I will still have survival level money after that, if bad times persist.

I am wondering why peer-to-peer lending is not getting a mention. Ratesetter in the UK apparently has quite a good reputation. Better interest rates than the banks.

[mstevens]

Peer to peer lending is still not widely known by the masses - and that usually means that the masses likely wouldn't trust it, even if it was carefully explained to them how it works.  In theory, peer to peer is a good idea.  Personally, I remain unconvinced of it.  I have been tempted to put some money in to it but just cannot pull the trigger.

[bazza73]

4 hours ago, mstevens said:

Peer to peer lending is still not widely known by the masses - and that usually means that the masses likely wouldn't trust it, even if it was carefully explained to them how it works.  In theory, peer to peer is a good idea.  Personally, I remain unconvinced of it.  I have been tempted to put some money in to it but just cannot pull the trigger.

Start off small, and assess each loan on the risk profile. I look for businesses which are generating and growing profits, and have positive equity.

The banks are taking deposited funds, paying depositors 1-2%, then lending out at 5-15%. Peer to peer is just cutting out the middleman.

Some borrowers can't get a bank loan because the bank deems them to be too risky. There are others, however, who prefer peer-to=peer because it's a faster and simpler process.

[Tofer]

11 hours ago, bazza73 said:

I am wondering why peer-to-peer lending is not getting a mention. Ratesetter in the UK apparently has quite a good reputation. Better interest rates than the banks.

I was considering this type of investment a few years ago. The company I spoke to told me all loans were secured by assets, but when asked to confirm that my capital was guaranteed they refused. Suffice to say I took it no further.

[bazza73]

Just now, Tofer said:

I was considering this type of investment a few years ago. The company I spoke to told me all loans were secured by assets, but when asked to confirm that my capital was guaranteed they refused. Suffice to say I took it no further.

Capital guarantees are a myth, just like debentures.

Think your money is safe in a bank? Only if the taxpayer is providing a capital buffer, and assuming the government doesn't pull the rug out. Cyprus showed that very clearly.

Security by way of assets is always dependent on the quality of the assets. The biggest shonks are those that dress up a crappy asset to look like it is gilt-edged. That's what the financial institutions were doing prior to the GFC. I understand they are at it again, only CDO's now have a different name.

[sandyf]

On 8/30/2017 at 2:38 AM, cyberfarang said:

I began paying into my company pension at age 21. It was compulsory with the job at the time.

 

When I first began paying into the scheme none of us employees were told about contracting out the State pension, in-fact we did not know there was such a thing as contracting out and back in those days before the Internet there were no easy ways to gain the information unless someone explained it to us and it was never mentioned to us by our employer, nor was it mentioned in our company pension handbook guide. I did not discover about contacting out until I reached 50 and applied for a State pension forecast. Had the shock of my life of how hard my State pension would be hit by being contacted out.

My full State pension would have been just over £155 per week, but after they deducted my contracted out years it was reduced to £126 per week. This means in Thai bahts that’s a reduction of (£124) 5300 baht per calendar month at today’s exchange rates, which is a lot of money in Thailand. I feel I was duped right from the start and between the banks and the UK government I’m always going to be in lose, lose situation. It’s like playing the chips at a casino where the odds are always with the house. And yes, I do feel bitter about it.

It is very convenient to look at your state pension in isolation. The component of your NI contributions that would have gone towards additional state pension would have ceased on contracting out. However that component was not 'lost' as some seem to think but invested in a separate income. A percentage of your occupational pension will be derived from your NI contributions and should be taken into account when considering your state pension. Chances are that in overall terms pension wise you will have gained from being contracted out.

I was never contracted out and worse off pension wise than peers that were. There is no dispute that information on the subject was virtually non existent back in the day and had it been it may well have influenced my work choices.

[Mover1]

I've put some into a peer-to-peer lender called Assetz Capital, and it's been fine so far. Currently averaging 6.42% return, been investing for around 7 months with them. Their borrowers tend to have loans secured on assets and it shows the level of LTV (Loan To Value) on each one, which is usually property.

 

They've also added a Quick Access account which pays 3.75% while funds are sitting idle and waiting to be invested. 

 

Of course it's a risk, same as buying shares or owning rental properties. A crash could balls it all up. Buying gold through Bullionvault is my hedge in case a crash did ever happen. Just wish i'd bought a few grands worth of Bitcoins a few years ago! Haha

[Kwasaki]

20 minutes ago, Mover1 said:

which is usually property.

Can there be a risk of a property price crash. ?

[Mover1]

Can there be a risk of a property price crash. ?

Did you read my whole comment?


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[partington]

On 8/30/2017 at 2:38 AM, cyberfarang said:

I began paying into my company pension at age 21. It was compulsory with the job at the time.

 

When I first began paying into the scheme none of us employees were told about contracting out the State pension, in-fact we did not know there was such a thing as contracting out and back in those days before the Internet there were no easy ways to gain the information unless someone explained it to us and it was never mentioned to us by our employer, nor was it mentioned in our company pension handbook guide. I did not discover about contacting out until I reached 50 and applied for a State pension forecast. Had the shock of my life of how hard my State pension would be hit by being contacted out.

My full State pension would have been just over £155 per week, but after they deducted my contracted out years it was reduced to £126 per week. This means in Thai bahts that’s a reduction of (£124) 5300 baht per calendar month at today’s exchange rates, which is a lot of money in Thailand. I feel I was duped right from the start and between the banks and the UK government I’m always going to be in lose, lose situation. It’s like playing the chips at a casino where the odds are always with the house. And yes, I do feel bitter about it.

You do understand, right that "contracting out" means that you paid into a supplementary pension system, and you will get an additional pension amount on top of your estimated state pension?

 

It seems like a lot of people don't even realise this. You paid less NI than other workers who did not contract out , and so will get less state pension, BUT you decided to pay into an additional supplementary pension scheme that will also pay you an amount on top .

 

Until you know what that amount will be you can't compare what you are getting to the State pension because it is likely you will end up getting more in total!

[mommysboy]

The thread isn't really about UK pensions.  It's really more about the declining value of our money as the pound seems to get ever weaker, while it's vice-versa for the baht.  Ironically, the pinch has made me healthier, since fruit and veg is cheap,  and making my own entertainment invariably involves sport.

 

 

Edited September 2, 2017 by mommysboy

[travelingman1959]

When reading some blogs the xchange thai to pound seems realy bad at the present..im thinking ov moving from uk to udon area with my thai wife in 3 years .its got me thinking what if the bart falls more .i hope people hang on in there and one thing i allways do is enjoy the crack at concrete seating areas.

Sent from my LG-V500 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[elliss]

On 8/28/2017 at 1:16 PM, jeab1980 said:

Well youll be waiting for a very very long time tben. In fact youll be dead.

Come back in 2 years when the UK finaly leaves and see where the £ is then

        No progress  at all on the Brexit  negotiations,  so  what happens after two years of stalemate ?.

        Will  the UK exit application  be void ,  or do they just kick us out of the EU.

         Euro and gbp  parity soon, good news for exports.  UK expats, tougher times ahead .

       

Edited September 2, 2017 by elliss

[whiteman]

i hope people hang on in there and one thing i all ways do is enjoy the crack at concrete seating areas.

 

Is that were you get your food from for your nightly meals :)

Edited September 2, 2017 by whiteman

[thaibeachlovers]

On ‎8‎/‎28‎/‎2017 at 5:00 PM, Craig krup said:

And no matter what anyone says you won't slow down. 

 

1) Relying on crooked financial advisers, buying things you don't understand, trading, buying opaque nonsense, buying into trends...

 

2) Waiting until the sh1t hits the fan and City of London investment trust goes to a discount, with the FTSE way below 6,000, and buying steadily on near 5% yields, holding forever....

 

For you "1" and "2" are the same things, aren't they, and there's nothing to talk about? 

 

http://www.hl.co.uk/shares/shares-search-results/c/city-of-london-investment-trust-ord-25p

 

 

I don't fully understand your post, but I don't "invest" my money with anyone except banks, because there is no real alternatives. I think the entire financial sector is build on lies and is out to screw as many people as possible.

If there were only $100 in the whole world, the finance people would have $99 and the rest of the population would have to fight over $1. It's not even as though "money" is real anymore, and whoever controls the computers controls it.

 

Al Jazeera has some excellent documentaries about the crooks that run the financial systems on the world, and how they always screw the people if they are allowed to.

 

How do we tell the difference between "crooked financial advisers" and "non crooked financial advisers"?

I can't. IMO, they are all crooks. 

As I write this the big banks are trying to replay the subprime scenario.

[travelingman1959]

i hope people hang on in there and one thing i all ways do is enjoy the crack at concrete seating areas.
 
Is that were you get your food from for your nightly meals :)

My wife looks after me good.heh mam lives near suphanburi which i think the villages around there such assam chuck .sing buri etc are very nice but in nov this year we go to nongkigh then udon thani .but i find the foods much better on the streets and i hate getting ripped of cos they think we all like air con on .i simply like the cheap street food and the big bottles of leo on the nice street seats

Sent from my LG-H815 using Tapatalk

[thaibeachlovers]

46 minutes ago, elliss said:

        No progress  at all on the Brexit  negotiations,  so  what happens after two years of stalemate ?.

        Will  the UK exit application  be void ,  or do they just kick us out of the EU.

         Euro and gbp  parity soon, good news for exports.  UK expats, tougher times ahead .

       

If I only learned one thing in my life it's that nothing stays good. It's not even swings, just a descending rollercoaster that levels out occasionally.

 

Different world from the one my parents lived in when things were getting better, slowly. I think it started to go bad during the Vietnam war when the 1% realised they could get rich, very rich by rigging financial markets and investing in never ending wars.

[jeab1980]

1 hour ago, elliss said:

        No progress  at all on the Brexit  negotiations,  so  what happens after two years of stalemate ?.

        Will  the UK exit application  be void ,  or do they just kick us out of the EU.

         Euro and gbp  parity soon, good news for exports.  UK expats, tougher times ahead .

       

If there is no setlement after two years we are on our own. Its early days pf talks yet dont panick all will be solved neither the EU money grabers or the UK penny pinchers want a non settlement BRexit. Plenty of time yet.

The £ will never be on parity with the Euro trust me. No tough times ahead here.

[scubascuba3]

When reading some blogs the xchange thai to pound seems realy bad at the present..im thinking ov moving from uk to udon area with my thai wife in 3 years .its got me thinking what if the bart falls more .i hope people hang on in there and one thing i allways do is enjoy the crack at concrete seating areas.

Sent from my LG-V500 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

When you do your budget for the future you need to include different exchange rates. I think GBP will get stronger once brexit is out of the way, may be a few years though who knows

[jeab1980]

2 hours ago, partington said:

You do understand, right that "contracting out" means that you paid into a supplementary pension system, and you will get an additional pension amount on top of your estimated state pension?

 

It seems like a lot of people don't even realise this. You paid less NI than other workers who did not contract out , and so will get less state pension, BUT you decided to pay into an additional supplementary pension scheme that will also pay you an amount on top .

 

Until you know what that amount will be you can't compare what you are getting to the State pension because it is likely you will end up getting more in total!

No quite as simple as that the vast majority of people who were contracted out didnt have a clue they were. Only last year did i find out that HM forces were opted out on mass back whenever. As far as we were all concerned we paid full stamp. So as far as im concerned I call it Fraud.

So no " YOU" as you put it ie me did not decide.  It was done under the table without my consent.

Your statement about actually getting more money is quite wrong as figures quoted back then to people who actually did contract out by choice have as usual with the British government been completley wrong.

 

"Can anything be done to help people who are losing out?

'I don’t believe that the Government Actuary wilfully made assumptions in the 1980s and 1990s that he knew would turn out to be wrong,' writes Steve Webb in his latest column.

'But many people reaching pension age in the coming years will now have a lower total pension than if they had stayed in the state scheme as result of those assumptions turning out to be too optimistic.

'The assumptions can't simply be changed now and state pensions adjusted accordingly. This is because taxpayers back in the 1980s or 1990s in effect agreed to go along with the best guess of the Government Actuary of what had be paid out to pensioners in the decades to come.

'Today’s taxpayers are unlikely to be prepared to make good the shortfall where investments in individual pensions did not turn out as well as hoped at the time.'

Waites says of people who lost out: 'Unfortunately there isn’t much they can do. They can’t undo contracting out so they should try the usual routes to make up holes in their NI record.' "

 

Shaffted every which way

Edited September 2, 2017 by jeab1980

[partington]

21 minutes ago, jeab1980 said:

 

"Can anything be done to help people who are losing out?

'I don’t believe that the Government Actuary wilfully made assumptions in the 1980s and 1990s that he knew would turn out to be wrong,' writes Steve Webb in his latest column.

'

 

Shaffted every which way

Well I must say, I didn't realise  that anyone contracted out would end up getting a total of State plus additional pension that added up to less than the £159.55 per week full State pension, my mistake.

 

This of course isn't fair.

Edited September 2, 2017 by partington
corrected figure for state pension

[SheungWan]

3 hours ago, travelingman1959 said:

When reading some blogs the xchange thai to pound seems realy bad at the present..im thinking ov moving from uk to udon area with my thai wife in 3 years .its got me thinking what if the bart falls more .i hope people hang on in there and one thing i allways do is enjoy the crack at concrete seating areas.

Sent from my LG-V500 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

I think you mean if the pound falls more. yes?

[SheungWan]

2 hours ago, scubascuba3 said:

3 hours ago, travelingman1959 said:

When reading some blogs the xchange thai to pound seems realy bad at the present..im thinking ov moving from uk to udon area with my thai wife in 3 years .its got me thinking what if the bart falls more .i hope people hang on in there and one thing i allways do is enjoy the crack at concrete seating areas.

Sent from my LG-V500 using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

When you do your budget for the future you need to include different exchange rates. I think GBP will get stronger once brexit is out of the way, may be a few years though who knows

You cannot think that GBP will get stronger and who knows. One or the other in binary terms Better to make a call say....that you think there is a 70% chance of GBPTHB improving >10% within 5 years. Next, is that call sufficient for you to modify your plans for staying in Thailand.

[Craig krup]

8 hours ago, Mover1 said:

I've put some into a peer-to-peer lender called Assetz Capital, and it's been fine so far. Currently averaging 6.42% return, been investing for around 7 months with them. Their borrowers tend to have loans secured on assets and it shows the level of LTV (Loan To Value) on each one, which is usually property.

 

They've also added a Quick Access account which pays 3.75% while funds are sitting idle and waiting to be invested. 

 

Of course it's a risk, same as buying shares or owning rental properties. A crash could balls it all up. Buying gold through Bullionvault is my hedge in case a crash did ever happen. Just wish i'd bought a few grands worth of Bitcoins a few years ago! Haha

 

When I was an obnoxious schoolkid - quite bright, but a waster - the option if you didn't want to take French was Accountancy. I was instantly good at it. Some folk just seem to find money difficult. On Friday I was talking to a clever bloke who has a physics degree, and he wanted my advice about a page of "savings accounts" he was looking at: he'd just come into a load of money. Needless to say these really good savings accounts were peer-to-peer lenders. When I explained what this meant he said what another clever bloke I know said: "Ah, but you;re covered by the financial compensation scheme up to eight five grand". He actually f*****g thought that - in some possible world - you could lend someone unreliable (say) fifty grand at 8%, and if they didn't pay back you'd still get your money. How the **** could that possibly be how the world worked? How can people be so bloody stupid? I had someone tell me the same thing about bond funds. They thought the money they'd sank into a corporate bond fund (7% interest when the banks were paying 1%) was completely safe because the compensation scheme would kick in. I've got a pal with an Economics degree who has a load of buy-to-let properties. He said that he owed the banks the money or the properties. The stupid **** actually thought that it was a one-way bet. Either the price went up, and which case he won big, or the price fell and he could walk away. It was quite a revelation to him when I pointed out that the flats would be repossessed, sold at auction, the legal and auction costs added to the debts, and the whole lot his problem for decades, with assets seized, wages arrested and (perhaps) employers firing you for breaching your terms of employment. 

 

Peer-to-peer lending is a disaster waiting to happen. If you're desperate for income a cheap covered call option share fund is a reasonable idea. I used to invest in Fidelity Enhanced Income. It's the basic mainly FTSE 100 Moneybuilder blue chip fund with what's called a "covered call option" strategy added to it. If you own a lot of it through Alliance Trust Savings the costs are very low. Basically you own a massive spread of ordinary shares (AstraZeneca, HSBC, British American Tobacco, GlaxoSmithKline...) and the fund managers sell other people the right to buy the shares at higher prices. So if share prices rise the fund under-performs as you get "called away" - the managers have to sell the shares at the agreed price, but you still make a gain. If the option price is never reached they keep the option money, and it pads the dividends. It's a pretty bog-standard approach to generating a lot of income. The capital returns are poor, but you're looking at nearly 7% income and the possibility of growth. You could make losses, but I'd invest in this before I went near peer-to-peer lending. 

[scubascuba3]

You cannot think that GBP will get stronger and who knows. One or the other in binary terms Better to make a call say....that you think there is a 70% chance of GBPTHB improving >10% within 5 years. Next, is that call sufficient for you to modify your plans for staying in Thailand.

There are loads of different views, my personal one is GBP will recover and be in late 40s/50s in a few years. Your view may be different and that is fine. I tend to invest based on what i think not what others think. I'm not suggesting changing any plans but to budget for different exchange rates.

[Mover1]

12 hours ago, Craig krup said:

 

When I was an obnoxious schoolkid - quite bright, but a waster - the option if you didn't want to take French was Accountancy. I was instantly good at it. Some folk just seem to find money difficult. On Friday I was talking to a clever bloke who has a physics degree, and he wanted my advice about a page of "savings accounts" he was looking at: he'd just come into a load of money. Needless to say these really good savings accounts were peer-to-peer lenders. When I explained what this meant he said what another clever bloke I know said: "Ah, but you;re covered by the financial compensation scheme up to eight five grand". He actually f*****g thought that - in some possible world - you could lend someone unreliable (say) fifty grand at 8%, and if they didn't pay back you'd still get your money. How the **** could that possibly be how the world worked? How can people be so bloody stupid? I had someone tell me the same thing about bond funds. They thought the money they'd sank into a corporate bond fund (7% interest when the banks were paying 1%) was completely safe because the compensation scheme would kick in. I've got a pal with an Economics degree who has a load of buy-to-let properties. He said that he owed the banks the money or the properties. The stupid **** actually thought that it was a one-way bet. Either the price went up, and which case he won big, or the price fell and he could walk away. It was quite a revelation to him when I pointed out that the flats would be repossessed, sold at auction, the legal and auction costs added to the debts, and the whole lot his problem for decades, with assets seized, wages arrested and (perhaps) employers firing you for breaching your terms of employment. 

 

Peer-to-peer lending is a disaster waiting to happen. If you're desperate for income a cheap covered call option share fund is a reasonable idea. I used to invest in Fidelity Enhanced Income. It's the basic mainly FTSE 100 Moneybuilder blue chip fund with what's called a "covered call option" strategy added to it. If you own a lot of it through Alliance Trust Savings the costs are very low. Basically you own a massive spread of ordinary shares (AstraZeneca, HSBC, British American Tobacco, GlaxoSmithKline...) and the fund managers sell other people the right to buy the shares at higher prices. So if share prices rise the fund under-performs as you get "called away" - the managers have to sell the shares at the agreed price, but you still make a gain. If the option price is never reached they keep the option money, and it pads the dividends. It's a pretty bog-standard approach to generating a lot of income. The capital returns are poor, but you're looking at nearly 7% income and the possibility of growth. You could make losses, but I'd invest in this before I went near peer-to-peer lending. 

 

OOOhh i feel like i've just been told off, haha!

 

Like i said, it's all a risk Craig. No one mentioned anything about protection in P2P from the FSCS, but you've got me wondering if its covered now. Obviously P2P lending doesn't appeal to you, ah well - Up To You mate. I'm not a massive advocate of it, just part of my plan, right or wrong. Guess i'll find out in a few years.

 

Anyone fretting about the value of GBP should just invest their money somewhere (away from Thailand) so it's making more money, and try not to worry about things that are out of their control.

[bazza73]

12 hours ago, Craig krup said:

 

Peer-to-peer lending is a disaster waiting to happen. If you're desperate for income a cheap covered call option share fund is a reasonable idea. I used to invest in Fidelity Enhanced Income. It's the basic mainly FTSE 100 Moneybuilder blue chip fund with what's called a "covered call option" strategy added to it. If you own a lot of it through Alliance Trust Savings the costs are very low. Basically you own a massive spread of ordinary shares (AstraZeneca, HSBC, British American Tobacco, GlaxoSmithKline...) and the fund managers sell other people the right to buy the shares at higher prices. So if share prices rise the fund under-performs as you get "called away" - the managers have to sell the shares at the agreed price, but you still make a gain. If the option price is never reached they keep the option money, and it pads the dividends. It's a pretty bog-standard approach to generating a lot of income. The capital returns are poor, but you're looking at nearly 7% income and the possibility of growth. You could make losses, but I'd invest in this before I went near peer-to-peer lending. 

Everything is a disaster waiting to happen under the right conditions. The covered call fund you speak of - if there's a bear market, the shares tank and there is no option to be written that will make a profit. The managers can't sell the call option at below the share purchase price because then they will have a capital loss. So no income from calls.

If it's a market meltdown, the first thing companies do to conserve cash is cut dividends. So an investor can get screwed both ways.

Just like shares, peer-to-peer lending has its risk. I assess each loan on the financials, e.g. profit/loss, book value, credit record etc. etc. I don't put more than $3000 into any one loan. Sometimes I'll only be loaning $300 - $400.

What do you think the banks are doing? They take depositor funds, on which they pay 1-2% interest, and lend out at anywhere between 5 and 15%. Peer to peer lending is no different, except you are cutting out a greedy middleman.

I have a foot in both camps. I buy blue-chip Australian stocks for dividends and covered call income, doing it myself rather than paying a fund manager. I rotate through the bluechips as I see fit.

I get an Australian part age pension. My aim is to generate enough income from investment to live well, plus conserve or grow my capital base.

I've been capital stable for the last 8 years, averaging 7% return. So I guess I'm doing just as well as the FTSE fund.

[cyberfarang]

19 hours ago, jeab1980 said:

No quite as simple as that the vast majority of people who were contracted out didnt have a clue they were. Only last year did i find out that HM forces were opted out on mass back whenever. As far as we were all concerned we paid full stamp. So as far as im concerned I call it Fraud.

So no " YOU" as you put it ie me did not decide.  It was done under the table without my consent.

Your statement about actually getting more money is quite wrong as figures quoted back then to people who actually did contract out by choice have as usual with the British government been completley wrong.

 

"Can anything be done to help people who are losing out?

'I don’t believe that the Government Actuary wilfully made assumptions in the 1980s and 1990s that he knew would turn out to be wrong,' writes Steve Webb in his latest column.

'But many people reaching pension age in the coming years will now have a lower total pension than if they had stayed in the state scheme as result of those assumptions turning out to be too optimistic.

'The assumptions can't simply be changed now and state pensions adjusted accordingly. This is because taxpayers back in the 1980s or 1990s in effect agreed to go along with the best guess of the Government Actuary of what had be paid out to pensioners in the decades to come.

'Today’s taxpayers are unlikely to be prepared to make good the shortfall where investments in individual pensions did not turn out as well as hoped at the time.'

Waites says of people who lost out: 'Unfortunately there isn’t much they can do. They can’t undo contracting out so they should try the usual routes to make up holes in their NI record.' "

 

Shaffted every which way

Thanks for your post.

 

When I signed up and begun to pay into my company`s compulsory pension scheme during the early 1970s when I was 21 year old,  there was nothing mentioned in the contract nor was it explained to me that I would be opting out the State pension scheme. How would I had thought to have asked if I had no knowledge that opting out existed. Not only me but also the thousands employed by the company were also left in the dark. Also, young people in their 20s took very little interest in their pensions because to them retirement age was a million years away, it was never going to happen.  The employers and the pension scheme company used our ignorance to their own advantage. Obviously knowing what I know now, I`d had made other choices if being more clued up at the time, but instead we paid into our company pension scheme in ignorant bliss believing our employer and the pension company had our best interests at heart.