Wine In Checked Baggage

[webfact]

Analysis: Trump's U.N. speech shows nationalist instincts firmly intact

By Jeff Mason and Steve Holland

 

U.S. President Donald Trump addresses the 72nd United Nations General Assembly at U.N. headquarters in New York, U.S., September 19, 2017. REUTERS/Brendan McDermid

 

NEW YORK (Reuters) - Chalk one up for the nationalists.

 

Among the many signals that Donald Trump sent in his speech to the United Nations on Tuesday, one was especially clear: former chief strategist Steve Bannon's White House departure has not muted the president's "America First" foreign policy instincts.

 

Trump's eight months in office have been characterized by a sometimes dramatic tug-of-war between "globalists" and "nationalist" advisers who have sought to move the president in myriad ways on issues both domestic and international.

 

Bannon's exit last month caused some of the former New York businessman's core supporters to fret that the more multilateral-leaning group inside the administration had gained ground.

 

Not on foreign policy, at least not on Tuesday.

 

Trump's strident defense of national sovereignty during his debut at the annual U.N. General Assembly showed his campaign-honed policy inclinations very much intact and presented a Trump Doctrine to the world that focused unabashedly on the U.S. homeland.

 

"The chief nationalist in this administration is Donald J. Trump. And he knows what he’s trying to say,” said Newt Gingrich, the former speaker of the U.S. House of Representatives and a Trump supporter.

 

He said the speech showed that Trump had a doctrine that was defined by more than tweets, with roots in the conservative philosophies of former U.S. President Ronald Reagan, France's Charles de Gaulle, and Britain's Margaret Thatcher.

 

“It’s not a one-sided American nationalism, it’s a re-centering on sovereignty that’s really, really important,” Gingrich said.

 

The speech, in which Trump threatened to "totally destroy" North Korea if attacked, divided Trump's supporters and opponents. Ben Rhodes, an adviser to former Democratic President Barack Obama, said Trump was upending international order with threats of war and attacks on diplomacy.

 

It did not divide Trump's often warring advisers, however, an administration official said.

 

“It was the most collaborative speech among the senior people in the national security cabinet that the president has given to date,” the official said.

 

He said Secretary of State Rex Tillerson stood up after Trump’s speech and shook chief speechwriter Stephen Miller’s hand and said “you did a great job.” Miller is considered a nationalist and an ally of Bannon, while Tillerson is more globally minded.

 

"This was more ... Trump just being Trump,” said Sam Nunberg, a former Trump campaign adviser, adding he thought the nationalist versus globalist tension in the administration played itself out more on domestic policy issues such as immigration policy.

 

The administration has given mixed signals on foreign policy, too. Gary Cohn, the president's top economic adviser and a member of the so-called globalist wing, had to clarify with U.S. allies this week that Trump still intended to pull the United States out of the Paris climate change agreement unless there were a renegotiation to make it more favorable for U.S. interests.

 

But Trump seemed to stun some people in the United Nations hall, despite his well-known penchant for blunt talk.

His speech included a condemnation of the Iran nuclear agreement reached with U.S. allies under Obama, and an observation that some portions of the world were "going to hell".

 

Aaron David Miller, a former Middle East negotiator for Democratic and Republican administrations, said allies would interpret the speech as a sign that Trump was wary of undertaking major commitments around the world.

 

“Neither of the biggest problems, North Korea and Iran, can be solved by an America First, Lone Ranger policy," he said, adding the speech showed that globalists within his administrations were “throwaways” and that Trump was still driven by nationalism.

 

(Reporting by Jeff Mason and Steve Holland; Additional reporting by Matt Spetalnick; Editing by James Dalgleish)

 

-- © Copyright Reuters 2017-09-20

[retarius]

Trump is certifiably insane. He needs to be sectioned asap. How much more US aggression can the world accept. It is time for nations to unite against US aggression but the supine, pusillanimous leaders of big western nations like May, Merkel and Macron are scared to death. 

Russia and China need to wake up and sign a mutual defense contract or else be picked off one at a time.

What is disturbing about NK is that, like Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya and Syria, it is not about NK aggression (who have they invaded recently?). No the problem with NK is if they get a deterrent then they become immune to US hegemony, and NK have no beef with the vast majority of nations on this earth...only the regime changing warmongers like US and UK.

[Morch]

15 minutes ago, retarius said:

Trump is certifiably insane. He needs to be sectioned asap. How much more US aggression can the world accept. It is time for nations to unite against US aggression but the supine, pusillanimous leaders of big western nations like May, Merkel and Macron are scared to death. 

Russia and China need to wake up and sign a mutual defense contract or else be picked off one at a time.

What is disturbing about NK is that, like Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya and Syria, it is not about NK aggression (who have they invaded recently?). No the problem with NK is if they get a deterrent then they become immune to US hegemony, and NK have no beef with the vast majority of nations on this earth...only the regime changing warmongers like US and UK.

 

North Korea invaded South Korea. If that's too remote, try the many hostile actions taken over the years against SK. Neither Russia nor the PRC are thrilled with NK nuclear ambitions and capabilities. Both supported sanctions on NK.

Edited September 20, 2017 by Morch

[Dagnabbit]

For those that listened to his speech and not the whiney liberal reaction - it was a masterpiece.

 

He is absolutely right that the job of government is to look after it's people. He said his job was to put America first but it was in no way isolationist. He talked about the problems in the world and all working together to life people from poverty globally.

 

Yet CNN et al are calling it disgusting, atrocious. Which as we all know is what they planned to call it before even hearing it.

[dunroaming]

40 minutes ago, Dagnabbit said:

For those that listened to his speech and not the whiney liberal reaction - it was a masterpiece.

 

He is absolutely right that the job of government is to look after it's people. He said his job was to put America first but it was in no way isolationist. He talked about the problems in the world and all working together to life people from poverty globally.

 

Yet CNN et al are calling it disgusting, atrocious. Which as we all know is what they planned to call it before even hearing it.

You see the problem with Trump is that he leads with his mouth.  What he says today he will deny or flip flop tomorrow.  There is absolutely no point in taking any notice of what he says (which we are constantly being told by his supporters on TV) only what he does.

 

He really is mentally unstable but at least so far the checks and balances are in place to stop him doing too much damage.  Let's hope he continues to just be hot air and bluster until he can be removed.

[Dagnabbit]

41 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

You see the problem with Trump is that he leads with his mouth.  What he says today he will deny or flip flop tomorrow.  There is absolutely no point in taking any notice of what he says (which we are constantly being told by his supporters on TV) only what he does.

 

He really is mentally unstable but at least so far the checks and balances are in place to stop him doing too much damage.  Let's hope he continues to just be hot air and bluster until he can be removed.

So you didn't listen to it and have no comment on it whatsoever?

 

Very typical uneducated, knee-jerk reaction we see from those who already decided long ago that everything Trump does is bad.

 

If Obama had given the same speech - the press (and you) would be fawning...

[tonray]

1 minute ago, Dagnabbit said:

So you didn't listen to it and have no comment on it whatsoever?

 

Very typical uneducated, knee-jerk reaction we see from those who already decided long ago that everything Trump does is bad.

 

If Obama had given the same speech - the press (and you) would be fawning...

The funny thing is...OBAMA NEVER GAVE SUCH A SPEECH !

 

You guys are experts at deflecting...well if Obama had done the same thing, and if Hilary were president....blah blah blah.

 

It's about Trump's speech not Obama...stay on topic !

[dunroaming]

25 minutes ago, Dagnabbit said:

So you didn't listen to it and have no comment on it whatsoever?

 

Very typical uneducated, knee-jerk reaction we see from those who already decided long ago that everything Trump does is bad.

 

If Obama had given the same speech - the press (and you) would be fawning...

Why do you assume I didn't listen to it?  Not only did I listen to it but I also saw Trump's chief of staff John Kelly with his head in his hand with embarrassment.  The speech was toe curling and the reaction from the people there said it all.

 

Do I think everything that Trump does is bad?  No idea as I only comment on the threads that are posted.  Do you think everything he does is good?

 

As tonray says the trumpsters always revert to trying stupid " knee jerk" comparisons with Obama and Clinton.  You guys need to move on.

[attrayant]

Let's go to the floor to get reaction from Chief of Staff, John Kelly.  Tell us Mr. Kelly, what did you think of the speech?

 

 

[stevenl]

Sovereignty if it suits the US.

[Jingthing]

Very bizarre speech from the most bizarre "president" in U.S. history.

 

Be afraid! 

 

Even if you're a trumpist, this article is funny.

 

Quote

 

Trump’s Oracular Sermonizing at the U.N. Is a Real Head Trip
...

It’s often said that politicians campaign in poetry and govern in prose. Trump campaigned in insult comedy and, at least on the world stage, wants to govern in Wagnerian opera. 

...

Reconciling such lofty rhetoric with the enfant terrible who taunts celebrities on Twitter is a bit of a head trip. Does the guy who retweeted a doctored GIF of himself nailing Hillary Clinton with a golf ball have much insight into the aching contents of every sacred soul?

 

 

http://www.slate.com/blogs/the_slatest/2017/09/19/the_lofty_rhetoric_of_trump_s_u_n_speech_was_at_odds_with_the_man_his_politics.html

 

BTW, yes I did watch the speech. It reeked of fascism. 

 

Edited September 20, 2017 by Jingthing

[champers]

Of those in attendance, Benjamin Netanyahu liked the speech and ...... er .....that's it.

Apparently, he is due a major bo**ocking from Teresa May. So it's not all bad news for him.

Edited September 20, 2017 by champers

[JHolmesJr]

11 hours ago, webfact said:

Ben Rhodes, an adviser to former Democratic President Barack Obama, said Trump was upending international order with threats of war and attacks on diplomacy.

 

Let me guess…barack obama disagrees too.

[Jingthing]

I heard he scheduled it for an hour to leave room for all the applause.
He talked for about 45 minutes. 

[funandsuninbangkok]

I love New Yorkers! Especially from Queens!

 

Yo, I'm walkin hea! 

 

You lookin at me??? 

 

All other cities are fakin it

 

 

 

 

[funandsuninbangkok]

1 hour ago, JHolmesJr said:

 

Let me guess…barack obama disagrees too.

Yes we need more liberal Democratic policy. (Communist raise in Europe and Central South America, Raise of Iran fundamentalist, Sadam Hussain ,Osama bibLaden, North Korea)

 

Republican policy of confrontation does nothing (except crush the Iron Curtain,  end communism in South and Central America, free Kuwait,  kill Hussein, and destroy al-Queada. )

 

lets just be nice like Obama. 

[Thongkorn]

Balls that big , the GUy needs a wheelbarrow , well said a bit of truth for a change.

[Jingthing]

42 minutes ago, Thongkorn said:

Balls that big , the GUy needs a wheelbarrow , well said a bit of truth for a change.

I don't know how big his balls are, but I reckon they're hangin' really really LOW like any 71 year old. I don't think that tiny hands is predictive of balls. 

Edited September 20, 2017 by Jingthing

[Jingthing]

More about trump's fascist speech at the U.N. The U.S. used to at least stand for good things. Now we don't. That's a crying shame.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2017/09/trump_at_the_u_n_was_just_another_populist_thug.html

 

Quote

 

Our Demagogue

...

For the first time, the American president was just another populist thug.

...

Culture, spirit, national will. We’ve heard those appeals before. We know where they led. That’s why we have a United Nations.

 

 

[Dagnabbit]

2 hours ago, Jingthing said:

More about trump's fascist speech at the U.N. The U.S. used to at least stand for good things. Now we don't. That's a crying shame.

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2017/09/trump_at_the_u_n_was_just_another_populist_thug.html

 

 

 

Translation: More liberal whining from The Slate, that was probably written before Trump gave the speech

[Si Thea01]

21 hours ago, retarius said:

Trump is certifiably insane. He needs to be sectioned asap. How much more US aggression can the world accept. It is time for nations to unite against US aggression but the supine, pusillanimous leaders of big western nations like May, Merkel and Macron are scared to death. 

Russia and China need to wake up and sign a mutual defense contract or else be picked off one at a time.

What is disturbing about NK is that, like Iraq, Afghanistan, Libya and Syria, it is not about NK aggression (who have they invaded recently?). No the problem with NK is if they get a deterrent then they become immune to US hegemony, and NK have no beef with the vast majority of nations on this earth...only the regime changing warmongers like US and UK.

 

And your medical qualifications are and when did you exam the POTUS in order to provide your certification?  Why haven't you give the same diagnosis to NK's  beloved leader, dictator and murderer?  Is it because you want to gather browny points by only slinging of at those who offer challenges to this moron?  A little one sided me thinks. Who started the Korean War?  Not a hard question but I give you a hint, it wasn't South Korea or the USA.  Technically, they are still at war, no peace treaty has ever been signed.

 

So to fly ICBM's over Japan is not aggressive; to tell the USA that they will destroy them is not aggressive; to tell South Korea they will destroy them is not aggressive; to kill and imprison millions of his people, kill his relatives is apparently not aggressive either, is that correct?  Please wake up and take off your rose coloured glasses.

 

Of course NK has no beef with many other nations, why would they when they are selling drugs to them, buying arms from them, trading with and are never criticised by them.  They won't bite the hands that feed them and become aggressive when a few stand up to them.  There is a non nuclear proliferation treaty in place on the peninsular so why has NK pulled out of this treaty, can you answer that?

 

And the UN, of which NK is a member, since 1991, has put in place, by a 15 vote to 0 majority, sanctions in an attempt to reign them in, and stop them from becoming the nuclear power that "Rocket Man" wants, yet NK gives them the "Bird" and continues to promote itself as the destroyer of the USA and certain allies.  

 

I hope that there is no war, as many millions will perish but "Rocket Man" should tread lightly, as if he starts something then it can be assured he will not finish it and a beautiful country, that most of us know nothing about, will no longer exist should America  bring it's might to bear on this murderous regime.

[landslide]

"...then-President Bill Clinton made a remarkably similar threat back in 1993 against Kim’s grandfather, Kim Il-sung. During a trip through Asia, Clinton said this about his policy towards North Korea: “We would overwhelmingly retaliate if they were to ever use, to develop and use nuclear weapons. It would mean the end of their country as they know it.” How did liberals respond? Says Kengor: “They loved it. They pumped their firsts. They pounded their chests. They gave high-fives.”"  Reactions are based on who is giving the speech.  Liberals hate Trump, so their reaction is expected.

 

http://nypost.com/2017/09/20/look-who-else-threatened-north-korea-hillarys-new-delusions-and-other-comments/

[Jingthing]

16 minutes ago, landslide said:

"...then-President Bill Clinton made a remarkably similar threat back in 1993 against Kim’s grandfather, Kim Il-sung. During a trip through Asia, Clinton said this about his policy towards North Korea: “We would overwhelmingly retaliate if they were to ever use, to develop and use nuclear weapons. It would mean the end of their country as they know it.” How did liberals respond? Says Kengor: “They loved it. They pumped their firsts. They pounded their chests. They gave high-fives.”"  Reactions are based on who is giving the speech.  Liberals hate Trump, so their reaction is expected.

 

http://nypost.com/2017/09/20/look-who-else-threatened-north-korea-hillarys-new-delusions-and-other-comments/

Massively different tone, context  and emphasis. Who do you you're fooling claiming they're the same? 

[landslide]

3 hours ago, Jingthing said:

Massively different tone, context  and emphasis. Who do you you're fooling claiming they're the same? 

A very different time, as well.  North Korea did not have nuclear weapons yet.  They did not have potential ICBM technology yet   Clinton decided to attempt to appease North Korea with $5 billion in aid.  That obviously did not work.  Obama's non-confrontational milquetoast  lack of response to North Korea's nuclear tests did not work.  You are the one trying to fool people due to your passionate hatred of Trump.  

[Slip]

On 9/20/2017 at 11:34 PM, funandsuninbangkok said:

I love New Yorkers! Especially from Queens!

 

Yo, I'm walkin hea! 

 

You lookin at me??? 

 

All other cities are fakin it

 

 

 

 

Seeing this massively off topic post has been allowed to stand I guess I am allowed to respond- I saw the Beastie Boys live back in the late 80's supporting Run DMC.  The Beastie Boys were utterly <deleted>.  Run DMC on the other hand were bloody amazing. So there you go.

[Jingthing]

23 minutes ago, landslide said:

A very different time, as well.  North Korea did not have nuclear weapons yet.  They did not have potential ICBM technology yet   Clinton decided to attempt to appease North Korea with $5 billion in aid.  That obviously did not work.  Obama's non-confrontational milquetoast  lack of response to North Korea's nuclear tests did not work.  You are the one trying to fool people due to your passionate hatred of Trump.  

Cute deflection. So it turns out that you agree with me that the speeches were not at all the same. 

[landslide]

4 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Cute deflection. So it turns out that you agree with me that the speeches were not at all the same. 

I don't agree with you at all.  Given the climate at the time, Clinton's speech was as aggressive as was Trump's.  Also different is that Trump will not try to bribe North Korea, as did Clinton, in an attempt to put off the problem until later.  

[Jingthing]

2 minutes ago, landslide said:

I don't agree with you at all.  Given the climate at the time, Clinton's speech was as aggressive as was Trump's.  Also different is that Trump will not try to bribe North Korea, as did Clinton, in an attempt to put off the problem until later.  

Turns out you do agree whether you admit or not. You posted a right wing propaganda piece from the New York Post, took the thoughts as your own, but it turns out they were not the same speech at all. That's an objective fact. Deal with it. 

I also agree with you these are different times.

I don't agree that trump's bombastic nuclear war threats were helpful. 

Edited September 21, 2017 by Jingthing

[landslide]

36 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

Turns out you do agree whether you admit or not. You posted a right wing propaganda piece from the New York Post, took the thoughts as your own, but it turns out they were not the same speech at all. That's an objective fact. Deal with it. 

I also agree with you these are different times.

I don't agree that trump's bombastic nuclear war threats were helpful. 

I read the New York Post.  I also read the Washington Post and the New York Times, the Los Angeles Times and the San Francisco Chronicle, the Portland Oregonian and the Seattle Times.  I try to get all sides of the news.  Based on your posting history, you are not open to alternative points of view, so I won't bother you any more.  Have a good day.

[Scott]

Off-topic post removed.