5 Years In Los And Still Don't Understand . .

[simon43]

Last week, my wife's sister took an American man to visit her family in Isaan.

During that visit, someone stole $1,000 of travellers cheques from this guy....

After investigation, the cheques were found in the possession of a 16 year old family friend who had been cleaning the room.

This girl was due to 'marry' the 18 year old son of my wife's sister. She thought the cheques were 'real' money.

After family discussions, it was agreed that the marriage could not go ahead.

My wife's family has agreed to pay this 'thief' 20,000 baht and 1 baht of gold in compensation for the cancelled wedding.

Now . . . how can compensating this thief ever be right??????

What would you have done? (I told my wife in no uncertain terms that this girl should be paying my wife's family compensation for the shame brought upon them by this theft taking place in her mother's house...)

What do you think??

Simon

[In the Rai!]

Last week, my wife's sister took an American man to visit her family in Isaan.

During that visit, someone stole $1,000 of travellers cheques from this guy....

After investigation, the cheques were found in the possession of a 16 year old family friend who had been cleaning the room.

This girl was due to 'marry' the 18 year old son of my wife's sister. She thought the cheques were 'real' money.

After family discussions, it was agreed that the marriage could not go ahead.

My wife's family has agreed to pay this 'thief' 20,000 baht and 1 baht of gold in compensation for the cancelled wedding.

Now . . . how can compensating this thief ever be right??????

What would you have done? (I told my wife in no uncertain terms that this girl should be paying my wife's family compensation for the shame brought upon them by this theft taking place in her mother's house...)

What do you think??

Simon

It's sounds very strange indeed that money was paid as compensation as the cancellation was due to theft from the bride to be. If the cancellation was just a change of mind then I guess fair enough but under these circumstances I wouldnt have given her a brass razoo.

When were they going to get married? She was only 16 years old!

[markuk]

they are obviously choosing to handle it in a way that no one loses face, whilst i dont agree with it i can sort of understand

16 year old girl comes across a lot of money - too good to be true and takes it.

Wedding cancelled, fine reason for cancellation?? If they say she stole then will she be ashamed and maybe have to leave village / town? never chance to find husband again? and destrying her life for a daft mistake?

I think the family are doing an honourable thing and giving her a second chance. I think if it were me though i wouldnt pay her i would just be saying go away quietly before we shame you.

[simon43]

.. and of course my concern is that this money will - in a roundabout way - come from me! Unless I monitor every baht that my wife receives from our hotel business, then I can well imagine that she will help to pay this thief, (her sister/family not having this money themselves...)_

Simon

[PeaceBlondie]

simon, can you clearly explain to the family that this is their decision to spend their money to pay a thief, but that it violates your religion, your culture, your morality, or your face? Therefore, no money will come from you? They don't have to agree with you, just agree not to collect the money from you and your wife, or your business.

[cm-happy]

Is it possible, the 20,K baht was a return of the Bride price or dowry because of the cancelled wedding? Dont know if they practice this custom in LOS. What a pitty that the bride shamed and disgraced hereself, AND her family who still have to live in the village.

[Totster]

I'm just wondering if some money had been paid "upfront". for instance I'm pretty sure that when the marriage of my wifes nephew was discussed, gold necklaces were given to the happy couple at the end of the sinsod discussions. Just a thought.

totster

[simon43]

For me, the most important point is that it is totally contrary to my morality. You should not reward a thief, end of story.

I've had previous problems with the family over my stance on 'honesty'.

Eg - When one of our bar-staff pocketed 500 baht from a customer because they were too drunk to notice, I paid him back next day out of my own money, (he hadn't realised that the money was missing).

Or, just last week when a tour company at Phuket Airport overcharged some of our hotel guests, I went back to the tour company and extracted the money from them, (with great difficulty..)

I can understand the temptation to steal, but that doesn't make it a justifiable act.

(And I realise that the vast majority of Thai people are totally honest).

It just annoys me when the issue of face seems to be more important than stealing.

Simon

[ding]

Last week, my wife's sister took an American man to visit her family in Isaan.

During that visit, someone stole $1,000 of travellers cheques from this guy....

After investigation, the cheques were found in the possession of a 16 year old family friend who had been cleaning the room.

This girl was due to 'marry' the 18 year old son of my wife's sister. She thought the cheques were 'real' money.

After family discussions, it was agreed that the marriage could not go ahead.

My wife's family has agreed to pay this 'thief' 20,000 baht and 1 baht of gold in compensation for the cancelled wedding.

Now . . . how can compensating this thief ever be right??????

What would you have done? (I told my wife in no uncertain terms that this girl should be paying my wife's family compensation for the shame brought upon them by this theft taking place in her mother's house...)

What do you think??

Simon

Cheap way to help the other party save face. Good idea, I think. But I don't really know Thai ways. There's probably less resentment this way at least -good for the long haul if you live nearby.

And it was just farang money after all.

TIT

[bkkmadness]

For me, the most important point is that it is totally contrary to my morality. You should not reward a thief, end of story.

I guess losing the marriage and her face was her punishment but they decided not to make it too harsh by compensating with 20 k and some gold. She's just lost out on the dowry payment after all, for let's face it a childish crime really and one I expect many of us might have partaken in were we in similar circumstances to the girl.

If they didn't think the money was going to come from you do you think they would still have offered her this money? Perhaps because they are all part of a 'rich family' now they can afford to start throwing the cash about a bit more?

I'd tell them the money isn't coming from you in anyway, roundabout or not and see what happens to the girl's compensation then.

Edited January 17, 2007 by bkkmadness

[Totster]

Simon, I think you're looking at it the wrong way. They are not rewarding the thief, but rather compensating her family for inconvenience.. which is different.

totster

[Jet Gorgon]

So, I got robbed on 42nd Street in NYC. And I was innocent.

Sorry to say it, but get on with yer life and quit whining.

[lannarebirth]

One of the nice things about America, as opposed to Thailand is, that a family like this probably won't have a beautiful daughter that you're willing to marry and suffer these abuses.

[Jet Gorgon]

One of the nice things about America, as opposed to Thailand is, that a family like this probably won't have a beautiful daughter that you're willing to marry and suffer these abuses.

Huh? Are you on the droid mix there, lannarebirth?

[lannarebirth]

One of the nice things about America, as opposed to Thailand is, that a family like this probably won't have a beautiful daughter that you're willing to marry and suffer these abuses.

Huh? Are you on the droid mix there, lannarebirth?

Not sure what that is Jet. I was just thinking what a nice lesson this was for the visiting American, and in the end it didn't cost him anything. I hope the OP is as fortunate.

[bendix]

It's all kinda academic anyway, isnt it?

The was effectively no theft. Even if the girl hadnt been discovered as the thief, the American wouldnt have lost anything because they were traveller's cheques, and the girl wouldn't have been able to use them.

It's a bit like trying to murder a corpse.

[terry57]

they are obviously choosing to handle it in a way that no one loses face, whilst i dont agree with it i can sort of understand

16 year old girl comes across a lot of money - too good to be true and takes it.

Wedding cancelled, fine reason for cancellation?? If they say she stole then will she be ashamed and maybe have to leave village / town? never chance to find husband again? and destrying her life for a daft mistake?

I think the family are doing an honourable thing and giving her a second chance. I think if it were me though i wouldnt pay her i would just be saying go away quietly before we shame you.

i think you got a good handle on it mate.

in australia i would of kicked her arse all the way to the police station as she is old enough to know better.

but being thailand i think we must settle it thai way and us farang must step back and let them sort it.

i can see the point of not letting the girl lose face in such a small community as maybe the punishment might not fit the crime. ( destroy her life for a silly mistake) lets hope she has learned her lesson.

i think that young people are allowed to make 1 major cock up like this and be given a second chance as thats the privilage of youth. doing somethink really stupid because your young.

i say let it go and give her a last chance to put things right.

cheers

[TRIPxCORE]

It almost sounds like if someone steals something, you can't punish them, yell at them or talk about it to them because they will suffer loss of face. This is complete B.S. I don't care what country I am in and what the customs are, what's wrong is wrong. I'd tell that girl to take a hike!

[GuestHouse]

My wife's family has agreed to pay this 'thief' 20,000 baht and 1 baht of gold in compensation

So long as this was not coming out of my pocket I wouldn't mind what they did.

What I would not want is Thais stroking each other's delicate faces with my money.

[Jet Gorgon]

One of the nice things about America, as opposed to Thailand is, that a family like this probably won't have a beautiful daughter that you're willing to marry and suffer these abuses.

Huh? Are you on the droid mix there, lannarebirth?

Not sure what that is Jet. I was just thinking what a nice lesson this was for the visiting American, and in the end it didn't cost him anything. I hope the OP is as fortunate.

Um, I'm still lost here. Mind you, I need coaching every baby step. Besides being bereft of common sense (not a joke) I am dyslexic, schizophrenic, obsessive compulsive, manic depressive and occasionally deaf, dumb and blind. I play good snooker.

[smartecosse]

It's all kinda academic anyway, isnt it?

The was effectively no theft. Even if the girl hadnt been discovered as the thief, the American wouldnt have lost anything because they were traveller's cheques, and the girl wouldn't have been able to use them.

It's a bit like trying to murder a corpse.

what a load of <deleted>

she took what she thought was money, that theft

the fact that she was found out and that they were travelers checks in neither here nor there

bit like me stealing your car, smashing it to bits in a demolition derby and then saying " well you have insurance so what the problem?"

muppet

[TRIPxCORE]

The girls age and the fact that nothing actually was taken in the end is irrelevant. A 16 year old knows stealing is wrong and she took it because she thought it was money. Her intent was bad.

Edited January 17, 2007 by TRIPxCORE

[bkkmadness]

What I would not want is Thais stroking each other's delicate faces with my money.

Just what I was saying, lets see how fast the compensation offer disappears when they find out Simon43 isn't paying out this time.

[lannarebirth]

Really, shouldn't it be the American visitor who has lost face here? He shows up with travellers checks, which strongly implies that there may be some untrustworthy Thais about. Pretty rude if you ask me. He should be made to compensate someone too. Family meeting time.

Edited January 17, 2007 by lannarebirth

[Neeranam]

I think what you don't understand is how rich you are compared to these people.

You to them is like the Shinawatra family to you.

You probably get more a year than they do collectively(the whole family) in a lifetime.

If Thaksin came to visit my family and someone stole of him - it would almost seem right as he is ridiculously rich.

Edited January 17, 2007 by Neeranam

[simon43]

As for the American, he was 'upcountry' and on his way to Laos. He had to return to BKK, visit the bank, cancel his cheques, order new ones, wait 2 days in BKK for them to arrive before continuing his trip to Laos.

His view now of my wife's family is not worth repeating.

The loss of face to my wife's family was enormous. This thief should be paying them, not the other way round.

How's that for no harm caused????

Simon

[Bananaman]

I think what you don't understand is how rich you are compared to these people.

You to them is like the Shinawatra family to you.

You probably get more a year than they do collectively(the whole family) in a lifetime.

If Thaksin came to visit my family and someone stole of him - it would almost seem right as he is ridiculously rich.

Get out of here, theft is theft. If you're gonna start cr*p like that then where do you draw the line? It's alright for the poor som tum vendor to short change the Thai businessman after all "he can afford it"???

[simon43]

Oops!

My wife has just ask to borrow the compensation money from me!!!

What's the politeness answer that I can give?

Simon

[lannarebirth]

Oops!

My wife has just ask to borrow the compensation money from me!!!

What's the politeness answer that I can give?

Simon

Let's have a poll, shall we?

[terry57]

cant we put this one down to experience?

as long as the american does not have to pay the compensation, its ok.

if the thai family pay the compensation, well let them get on with it.

the american now thinks that the thai girl is scum and the family has lost face. end of story.

this can happen anywhere in the world and its just bad luck.

many people have lost lots more and at the end of the day he lost nothing.

carry on regardless.