PM wants Thai-style democracy

[jenny2017]

1 hour ago, Becker said:

You know nothing about me and just make cheap, uniformed and rather unintelligent assumptions. And you know what they say about assumptions and those who make them.

Peace. That's not even close to the topic now. 

[StayinThailand2much]

58 minutes ago, wakeupplease said:

Being a Brit I can criticize the government, the Corporate companies even her upstairs (Elizabeth), write on Facebook, twitter and share, inform of corruption if found and sex perverts and nothing will happen to me but here I cannot even dare think of doing that as many farangs know.

I am sure, Thailand will have the same kind of democracy as soon as 2561 (AD 2561 that is). 

Edited January 14, 2018 by StayinThailand2much

[Muggi1968]

Is Thailand ready for real democracy or will yet another yinluck pay their way to power  ??

[nong38]

There are many types of democracy in the world and they all have one thing in common and that is that every 4 or 5 years there is a chance for the people to vote on how things are and change the Government if they so choose. Once the vote has been cast the result declared the politicians carry on as before in a world of their own, disregarding the public and doing what suits them, your member who represents you often does not he/she has to do what the "party" dictates, is that democracy? Some would say so and some would say not, different people have a different views on what democracy really is.

Prayut is saying what has gone on before has not been successful and the all powerful, all seeing and super intelligent military keep on having to take control and this not the way forward, good then no more coups after this one comes to an end, it will come to and end wont it?

It seems that as the military have injected themselves into the future democratic system with a controlling hand on what is really going to happen or not and that to me means that the will of the people might very well be adapted, after all the military are far more clever than the average voter who does really understand the full picture, I am not sure how many people think this plan and democracy go hand in hand unless as the PM says it will a "democracy Thai style". Shall we call it Thai ness?

Best not ask the people what they think about a bunch of soldiers vetoing their wishes, the current ruling people might be shocked by the result.

[Sir Dude]

4 minutes ago, Muggi1968 said:

Is Thailand ready for real democracy 

Dream on.....no way Jose, will never be allowed by the Chinese elite.

[Sir Dude]

5 minutes ago, Muggi1968 said:

...or will yet another yinluck pay their way to power  ??

No again, it will be military generals coercing their way into power for the next 10 years. The local politicians from the Dems or PT might as well whistle as it's not going to happen. Might as well get used to it man.

[metisdead]

Posts in violation of fair use policy have been removed as well as the replies.

 

A post containing a link to Bangkok Post has been removed. 

 

Off topic trolling posts and replies have been removed. 

[Srikcir]

38 minutes ago, jayboy said:

In Thailand these criteria must be applied.

They were all applied in Japan that has been a democratic constitutional monarchy since 1945 whereby the Emperor acts as the ceremonial head of state, and the Prime Minister is the head of government and the head of the Cabinet, which directs the executive branch.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics_of_Japan

No military coups. No abolished constitutions

Why can't Thailand achieve the same result?

 

[yellowboat]

2 hours ago, Father Fintan Stack said:

Anything 'Thai-style' is guaranteed to be a complete joke, as they cannot even make a cup of coffee properly.

 

Stick to the patriarchal, feudal system when thuggery, bullying and immorality is rewarded, and stop getting ideas above your station. 

Wrong:  The servants of the elite can make a good cup of coffee, while allowing their employers to partake in thuggery, bullying and immorality.  It is doubtful they think of much else.  Most are rich because they are rich, not because they are smart.

Edited January 14, 2018 by yellowboat

[jayboy]

2 hours ago, Srikcir said:

They were all applied in Japan that has been a democratic constitutional monarchy since 1945 whereby the Emperor acts as the ceremonial head of state, and the Prime Minister is the head of government and the head of the Cabinet, which directs the executive branch.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Politics_of_Japan

No military coups. No abolished constitutions

Why can't Thailand achieve the same result?

 

Possibly because in Japan the cataclysmic defeat in 1945 destroyed the idea of military domination in politics and enshrined democracy as the way forward.The price the Japanese people paid for their current admirable position was terrible but I'm not sure the example is currently very pertinent to Thailand.More relevant perhaps is the example of South Korea where civilian politicians eventually managed to tame the military, with the latter now firmly under the control of democratically elected civilian politicians.What I fear since all sides in Thailand seem to play the zero sum game is that the solution will be a protracted and bloody one.But the eventual outcome is not really in doubt.

[Jonah Tenner]

9 hours ago, Artisi said:

Disaster... 

I would have used another word, abbreviated CF

[metisdead]

A post containing comments in violation of the following has been removed:

 

 

[Classic Ray]

The whole ethos of democracy is that the people make, and can change, the rules. Democracy without changing existing rules is not democracy and will not achieve progress.

[lvr181]

12 hours ago, Muggi1968 said:

Is Thailand ready for real democracy or will yet another yinluck pay their way to power  ??

Normally, in a democracy the people get the Government they deserve. 

[nong38]

 I get the impression in Thailand that the military is not here to defend the country but to take care of the people whenever required, in times of flood or a perceived duff government for example which is not serving the public interest as defined by the military top bods.

Edited January 15, 2018 by nong38
missing words

[Hupaponics]

16 hours ago, Becker said:

Wow, a "if you don't like it go home" post! How original and profound.

How about this one. 

 

Go find your own planet and you can rearrange things to your liking, but here you are a guest like it or not. 

[Becker]

8 minutes ago, Hupaponics said:

How about this one. 

 

Go find your own planet and you can rearrange things to your liking, but here you are a guest like it or not. 

Yes, I know I'm a guest n Thailand even though I have lived here for almost 25 years and have basically everything I own and care about here. But I have, am and will continue to express my feelings about what's happening in Thailand on this forum as well as on other forums as long as I'm allowed to.

So you can take your "if you don't like it..." replies and insert it into a damp and rank place. OK?

Edited January 15, 2018 by Becker

[xylophone]

23 minutes ago, nong38 said:

 I get the impression in Thailand that the military is not here to defend the country but to take care of the people whenever required, in times of flood or a perceived duff government for example which is not serving the public interest as defined by the military top bods.

Let me re-phrase that somewhat............I get the impression in Thailand that the military is not here to defend the country but to take care of their own and the elite, and in times of need will do just enough to show that they care about the ordinary folk. 

 

Buying un-needed submarines enables them to have some toys whilst banking some kickbacks for the order. 

 

Different snouts, same trough.

 

 

[Hupaponics]

5 minutes ago, Becker said:

Yes, I know I'm a guest n Thailand even though I have lived here for almost 25 years and have basically everything I own and care about here. But I have, am and will continue to express my feelings about what's happening in Thailand on this forum as well as on other forums as long as I'm allowed to.

So you can take your "if you don't like it..." replies and insert it into a damp and rank place. OK?

It's good with different opinions (and I respect other people's opinion). Imagine how doll a forum would be if everyone expresses the same opinions:).

 

My opinion is that what is happening now in Thailand is good. Not for every individual naturally, but for the country and most of the people. 

I'm not saying it is so, just my opinion. 

 

Its a big boat to turn so I'm ready to give him some time. He is making some progress, you have to admit that. 

[Becker]

1 minute ago, Hupaponics said:

It's good with different opinions (and I respect other people's opinion). Imagine how doll a forum would be if everyone expresses the same opinions:).

 

My opinion is that what is happening now in Thailand is good. Not for every individual naturally, but for the country and most of the people. 

I'm not saying it is so, just my opinion. 

 

Its a big boat to turn so I'm ready to give him some time. He is making some progress, you have to admit that. 

No, I don't have to admit that since I happen to strongly disagree. Basic human rights have been taken away, people are incarcerated tried and sentenced by military tribunals without the right to representation nor right to appeal. The "fight against corruption" is obviously going nowhere (since they never meant it in the first place) and there has been no reform of the institution that keep holding Thailand back; the judiciary, police, armed forces and the bureaucracy in general. The only thing the dinos in the junta have achieved is to stack the deck in favor of the old elite, ensuring that their access to the trough is secured until the next violent upheaval occurs. And because of their gerrymandering they have guaranteed that Thailand will again experience periods of unrest.

 

They had the chance (just like every junta has had) to implement lasting and positive changes to Thailand but since their only goal is to perpetuate their access to the trough that has not happened.

[lvr181]

5 minutes ago, Hupaponics said:

It's good with different opinions (and I respect other people's opinion). Imagine how doll a forum would be if everyone expresses the same opinions:).

 

My opinion is that what is happening now in Thailand is good. Not for every individual naturally, but for the country and most of the people. 

I'm not saying it is so, just my opinion. 

 

Its a big boat to turn so I'm ready to give him some time. He is making some progress, you have to admit that. 

The PM maybe making some progress for the country, he seems to be spending up BIG - but I wonder who are really the beneficiaries of his largesse? 

 

He seems to be very soft on corruption! Until he belts a few heads around, punishes the corrupt and seizes their assets then all the big spending and its perceived benefits will not truly filter thru to the the average Thai citizen or the 'under-privileged'. 

 

I know of schools and communities in the north (and among the hill tribes) who STILL do not have electricity! Forget the Government's slogan/claim, Thai 4.0 they are still struggling with Thai 1.0!

[MichaelJohn]

I'm sure the General (sorry, the Politician who used to be a General), is aware that conflict can raise awareness of important issues and can challenge out-dated assumptions and provide better solutions to problems?

Managing conflict is better than letting it fester and come to a boil.

But, to manage conflict needs maturity and that's where it all falls flat.

Without conflict there can be no democracy and to make this point the Politician makes the statement of wearing his "old" General's uniform!

[steven100]

....    to the nayers   ....    lol

[Becker]

5 minutes ago, steven100 said:

....    to the nayers   ....    lol

Hey Steven, buddy! What a fine morning it is in Thailand! Maybe on this morning you can finally confirm that you will indeed move away from Thailand if/when a Shin supported government comes back into power?

Come on Steven - don't be coy!

 

PS. Why are you totally absent from the Prawit watch threads buddy? We miss your unique perspective on dino # 2's amazing display of undeclared wrist wealth!!

[Eric Loh]

22 minutes ago, Becker said:

No, I don't have to admit that since I happen to strongly disagree. Basic human rights have been taken away, people are incarcerated tried and sentenced by military tribunals without the right to representation nor right to appeal. The "fight against corruption" is obviously going nowhere (since they never meant it in the first place) and there has been no reform of the institution that keep holding Thailand back; the judiciary, police, armed forces and the bureaucracy in general. The only thing the dinos in the junta have achieved is to stack the deck in favor of the old elite, ensuring that their access to the trough is secured until the next violent upheaval occurs. And because of their gerrymandering they have guaranteed that Thailand will again experience periods of unrest.

 

They had the chance (just like every junta has had) to implement lasting and positive changes to Thailand but since their only goal is to perpetuate their access to the trough that has not happened.

Excellent post. Got to wonder why some farang seem to be satisfied with the few low bearing fruit successes by the junta and blinded by larger issues like taking away civil liberties, highly military leaning constitution, excessive use of draconian laws to jail dissenters and selective implementation of the law on corruption. 

[Hupaponics]

7 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

Excellent post. Got to wonder why some farang seem to be satisfied with the few low bearing fruit successes by the junta and blinded by larger issues like taking away civil liberties, highly military leaning constitution, excessive use of draconian laws to jail dissenters and selective implementation of the law on corruption. 

For starters, the low hanging fruit suites me well, like the infrastructure. 

Regarding corruption, how about clearing all those people out over a night. That would put the country to an absolute standstill as there is corruption in every corner. 

Small stepps are better than no steps at all. 

 

And what amazes me is that people move to a third world country by choice, and are frustrated about corruption and all the unfair issues. 

 

Honestly, I'm more concerned about global pollution (CO2 is not included) and new world war. 

Cheers

[Becker]

32 minutes ago, Hupaponics said:

For starters, the low hanging fruit suites me well, like the infrastructure. 

Regarding corruption, how about clearing all those people out over a night. That would put the country to an absolute standstill as there is corruption in every corner. 

Small stepps are better than no steps at all. 

 

And what amazes me is that people move to a third world country by choice, and are frustrated about corruption and all the unfair issues. 

 

Who is so frustrated about corruption? It seems to me that it's the junta supporters that bring this up ad nauseam as an example of what great work the junta is doing while spectacularly ignoring issues like the no # 2 toad's watch collection.

And going on four years can not be called "over night" in anyone's book - case closed.

 

PS. What about the infrastructure has you so enamored with the junta?

Edited January 15, 2018 by Becker

[Eric Loh]

41 minutes ago, Hupaponics said:

For starters, the low hanging fruit suites me well, like the infrastructure. 

Regarding corruption, how about clearing all those people out over a night. That would put the country to an absolute standstill as there is corruption in every corner. 

Small stepps are better than no steps at all. 

 

And what amazes me is that people move to a third world country by choice, and are frustrated about corruption and all the unfair issues. 

 

Honestly, I'm more concerned about global pollution (CO2 is not included) and new world war. 

Cheers

I think in your haste to "love" the junta's low hanging fruit successes, you forgotten that a big event like the military seizing power from an elected government was staged. Other countries will label that as a treasonous act but you seem nonchalant  about an event that abolished the people mandate. The low bearing fruit of a easy walkway, fixed lottery prices etc seem more important to you. Just remember that the coup was supposed to bring meaningful reforms, stamp out corruption and bring reconciliation forward. Don't think that are important matters to you. Anyway, you have a good day at the beach.  

[Hupaponics]

49 minutes ago, Becker said:

Who is so frustrated about corruption? It seems to me that it's the junta supporters that bring this up ad nauseam as an example of what great work the junta is doing while spectacularly ignoring issues like the no # 2 toad's watch collection.

And going on four years can not be called "over night" in anyone's book - case closed.

Don't get me wrong. I do not mean he is descendent by God (or whoever) and is the best guy/ruler in the world. Yingluck was no angel (although she almost look like one;) ) an her list of wrongdoing i probably don't need to list here, as you surely are aware of the maters.

It's coming down to least bad ruler. 

Anyhow, my point of view is, better to adapt to whats on, than yak yak on a forum that wont change a thing.

 

Regarding my issues with pollution I toke some action some years ago to make a degree and started to study. My aim is to introduce and implement modern technology in water treatment here in Thailand. 

The key word is "action" (not only on a keyboard behind a monitor).

 

I'm not saying you're not doing anything (I personally don't know you) but too many people on TV like to moan behind the screen and actually do not achieve[EDIT] anything.

 

Cheers

Edited January 15, 2018 by Hupaponics

[Hupaponics]

22 minutes ago, Eric Loh said:

I think in your haste to "love" the junta's low hanging fruit successes, you forgotten that a big event like the military seizing power from an elected government was staged. Other countries will label that as a treasonous act but you seem nonchalant  about an event that abolished the people mandate. The low bearing fruit of a easy walkway, fixed lottery prices etc seem more important to you. Just remember that the coup was supposed to bring meaningful reforms, stamp out corruption and bring reconciliation forward. Don't think that are important matters to you. Anyway, you have a good day at the beach.  

Ohh did i write "love", sorry i though i wrote "suites me well";)

I'm not gonna repet myself (se previous post from me) and I no longer live by the beach. That was like 10-15 years ago. But thanx for judging;)