London murder rate overtakes New York's

[soalbundy]

16 minutes ago, GinBoy2 said:

It's somewhat interesting to read the Brits agonizing over this, given a lot of the sanctimonious posts everytime there is a shooting in the US.

Guns, knives, and in a rather curious UK phenomenon, acid all have been around for ever.

What makes society more or less violent is an interesting question.

Murder in the US, aside from the headline grabbing mass shootings is at it's lowest levels in decades, whereas it seems the UK rate is on the rise.

The various 'experts' on TVF have postulated everything from immigration to inequality, and probably fluoride in the water given time!

The US has one of the largest immigrant populations in the western world, yet the data (no matter what Trump says, data isn't his strong point) says immigrants have a lower crime rate than native born Americans. So why the reverse would be true in the UK, I can't imagine.

Income inequality. Well here we are in Thailand with a gun owning culture and massive income inequality, yet I don't see the same headline grabbing news.

I have no answers. But what I do know is that there probably isn't a single simple answer, more likely a very complex mix of interwoven societal reasons, with unfortunately no 'bumper sticker' solution

angry young men with poor schooling and no future

[car720]

6 hours ago, mbamber said:

I never left and most is Mass immigration and there believe when they are young they are invincible and it is carrying over to the so called whites so not a racist comment.

 

Gangs of New York anyone?   Please Sir, some more.

[lovelomsak]

Lets just hope if the violence continues it is contained to the young and they do not start attacking old men and women.

[Hupaponics]

I say open the gates to Europe wider. I’ve been told it is a good thing. 

What hapens in London (or my home country) has nothing to to with immigrants. 

Turkey will soon open the doors. Again, it surly is a good thing some say. 

 

Honestly I don’t care as Europe is according to me doomed and I left it to the people who love all the upcoming beauty. 

[mbamber]

43 minutes ago, lovelomsak said:

Lets just hope if the violence continues it is contained to the young and they do not start attacking old men and women.

I am afraid it has motorcycle gangs roam free mugging people and Police have been ordered not to chase them incase they fall off there bikes and get injured.

[lovelomsak]

27 minutes ago, mbamber said:

I am afraid it has motorcycle gangs roam free mugging people and Police have been ordered not to chase them incase they fall off there bikes and get injured.

The sad part is I believe this could be true.

Edited April 2, 2018 by lovelomsak

[Thakkar]

8 hours ago, bert bloggs said:

I was reading this and looking at the pictures of the people involved ,i could not help noticing that very few are what you would call "native British people " wonder if it has something to do with uncontroled immegration to my old country? sorry if i am not PC and do not wish to appear racist ,or any of the other things one gets accused of these days for daring to speak.

 

"Native british people"

This reminds me of a comedy skit:

 

If I ran this country, the first thing I'd do is get rid of all the bloody immigrants. Oh yeah, this country would be great again if we kicked out all the Polish. And the Indians, and the Chinese and the Africans. Yeah, and the Huguenots. Comin' over here from France in the late seventeenth century. And them Normans, coming over here in 1066, shooting their foreign arrows about. And before that it was the Vikings wasn't it? With their raping and their pillaging and their longboats and their stupid axes. and their open top bloody sandwiches- it's unnatural ain't it? And before that it was the Anglos, and the Saxons. What about the bleeding' Romans? Them Romans, yeah, probably built the straight roads so's they could get to the dole office faster. And all those weird guys in fur pelts claims they only came here across the land bridge to hunt mammoth. Not bloody likely, mate; hunt your own mammoth. And don't get me started on Homo Erectus; come over here from Africa, just because the land masses were linked up. I'm glad that tectonic shift sorted that out! Don't forget those early tetrapods, draggin' their fishy bodies outta the sea. Get back to the sea where you belong, you evolutionary bastards! Sling 'em out, sling 'em all out, I say. Then we'll just have the real Brits in the country. Anyway, I'm starving. Think I fancy a curry.

[mbamber]

16 minutes ago, lovelomsak said:

The sad part is I believe this could be true.

It is this is Feb 2018         

 

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/revealed-londons-moped-gangs-tell-how-swiping-phones-from-stupid-people-with-acid-and-swords-is-like-a3772181.html

[Thakkar]

6 hours ago, observer90210 said:

Some real weird comments here.....one can see highly dignified brown skinned people in London spending 600 £ on their groceries at Fortnum & Mason and on the other hand observe (from a safe distance) 2 cockneys bashing their drunken brains off in some gutter near a seedy pub....

 

.......making scapegoats of brown skinned people seems quite stupid as the high rise of murders is obviously due to the social discrepancies, crime involvement (no matter what the skin colour)  and has nothing to do with the origins or the colour of the perpetrators....racism and stupidity seem to be twins...

 

Conjoined twins, but, sadly, much less rare than actual conjoined twins.

[mbamber]

My Great Great Grandpappy  was born in 1725 in Mirfield Yorkshire England called Jonas Micklethwhaite some of the family went down to London & changed name to Micklewhite but Cousin Maurice Micklewhite had to go into hiding he has been in a few Films and is Known.

 

http://one-name.org/name_profile/micklethwaite/

[Andrew Dwyer]

My Great Great Grandpappy  was born in 1725 in Mirfield Yorkshire England called Jonas Micklethwhaite some of the family went down to London & changed name to Micklewhite but Cousin Maurice Micklewhite had to go into hiding he has been in a few Films and is Known.
 
http://one-name.org/name_profile/micklethwaite/

Not a lot of people know that [emoji848]

[mbamber]

2 minutes ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

Not a lot of people know that

True  the best bit I used to daydream about that on my way to & from school 50 years ago and last year found out it was true. 

Edited April 2, 2018 by mbamber

[soalbundy]

2 hours ago, Hupaponics said:

I say open the gates to Europe wider. I’ve been told it is a good thing. 

What hapens in London (or my home country) has nothing to to with immigrants. 

Turkey will soon open the doors. Again, it surly is a good thing some say. 

 

Honestly I don’t care as Europe is according to me doomed and I left it to the people who love all the upcoming beauty. 

Europe has often been doomed in the past and has always risen from the ashes stronger than before. It is the mother of most of the modern civilised world and has influenced the rest. Europe has an enormous amount of soft power and diplomatic leverage in the world, more so than America, you don't always need ICBM's and aircraft carriers if you use your intelligence, just look at how fat Kim is dancing on America's nose or how the Viet cong used their heads instead huge amounts of weaponry. Gandhi defeated the British in India using non violence but the British, unlike the Americans, could see the writing on the wall and left with their heads up. 

[soalbundy]

1 hour ago, mbamber said:

My Great Great Grandpappy  was born in 1725 in Mirfield Yorkshire England called Jonas Micklethwhaite some of the family went down to London & changed name to Micklewhite but Cousin Maurice Micklewhite had to go into hiding he has been in a few Films and is Known.

 

http://one-name.org/name_profile/micklethwaite/

but not by many

[7by7]

1 hour ago, mbamber said:

I am afraid it has motorcycle gangs roam free mugging people and Police have been ordered not to chase them incase they fall off there bikes and get injured.

 

1 hour ago, lovelomsak said:

The sad part is I believe this could be true.

 

1 hour ago, mbamber said:

It is this is Feb 2018         

 

https://www.standard.co.uk/news/crime/revealed-londons-moped-gangs-tell-how-swiping-phones-from-stupid-people-with-acid-and-swords-is-like-a3772181.html

 Except that article makes no mention of the police being ordered not to chase these gangs.

 

One reason bein g that it isn't true! From October 2017: Met Police to chase down moped gangs on scrambler bikes and use stinger spikes to thwart thugs, Scotland Yard reveals

Quote

Scotland Yard today unveiled new tactics in the battle against moped thugs rampaging across London, including deploying officers on scrambler motorbikes to chase down suspects.

Police are using the four specialist BMW scrambler bikes to go after moped riders who use alleyways and rat runs to evade more conventional pursuits.

 

Although this has nothing to do with the OP, I would like to ask those who blame the rise in crime in London to explain why, from pictures such as this, 

 

the majority of these thugs are white!

 

No doubt some xenophobe will claim they are Polish or similar!

 

Wrong: Three Islington males sentenced for moped-enabled thefts

Quote

Jack Burt, 22 (08.08.95) of Britannia Row, Islington and Jack Marsh, 21 (04.03.96) of Canalside Square, Islington were each sentenced on Tuesday, 6 February, at Southwark Crown Court.......

A 17-year-old youth from Islington was sentenced on Friday, 2 February, at Chelmsford Youth Court

 

Of course, criminals do come in all shapes, sizes and races:  Moped gang jailed for 110 years for raids across London worth £1,200,000

Quote

Moped gang: (top row left to right) Chris Costi, Bobby Kennedy, Alfie Kennedy, Adam Atallah, Dylan Castano-Lopez, (bottom row left to right) Courtney White, Mominur Rahman, Mohammed Anwar Hussain, Chang Mabiala and Mohammed Imran Ali (Picutre: PA)

 

 

[Mansell]

4 hours ago, soalbundy said:

Immigrant children don't orientate themselves on their parents but on the society around them, they go to school, they watch British television and they don't speak with their parents accent or broken English. If they are born and grow up in the UK they are as British as Hovis. When I was a small lad it was the Teddy boys with flick knives, then we had the mods and rockers who didn't play with magic dough, thugs and anti-social behaviour has always been a part of British life, it's the lead in the petrol or something.

I remember the Teddy boys, and the Spivs, and the Mods and Rockers. They were not a big issue....the Teddies were mostly around London, and the Spivs as well. The Mods Rockers had their moment of glory infamy at Brighton, but the police clamped down pretty quickly after that mess and blocked the roads to any other potential riot between these groups. Once again these groups were centered around London and the suburbs. So I don't find those groups relevant to the stabbings, shootings, and acid attacks today. 

[loll]

I was reading this and looking at the pictures of the people involved ,i could not help noticing that very few are what you would call "native British people " wonder if it has something to do with uncontroled immegration to my old country? sorry if i am not PC and do not wish to appear racist ,or any of the other things one gets accused of these days for daring to speak.

Iam not British,nor European,but I totally agree with you.Immigration should be controlled and authorities should be granted more legal power to deport law-breaking foreighners.

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[soalbundy]

1 minute ago, Mansell said:

I remember the Teddy boys, and the Spivs, and the Mods and Rockers. They were not a big issue....the Teddies were mostly around London, and the Spivs as well. The Mods Rockers had their moment of glory infamy at Brighton, but the police clamped down pretty quickly after that mess and blocked the roads to any other potential riot between these groups. Once again these groups were centered around London and the suburbs. So I don't find those groups relevant to the stabbings, shootings, and acid attacks today. 

most happen in London, so yes relevant.

[IAMHERE]

Darn, I got to give those UK types coodoo's on this. Surpass a murde rate and without guns, attaway.

[Thongkorn]

10 hours ago, darksidedog said:

And my family keep asking me why I dont want to come home! Very sad to see London up there with New York. Even sadder, is that I dont see things getting better any time soon.

 Bit ironic when you live in a place we’re 40.000 die ever year in road accidents then there is the Murders. Rose tinted glasses come to mind

[dunroaming]

10 hours ago, HLover said:

The rise in extremist immigration obviously has had an effect with regards to the increase in crime.

Absolute rubbish! This is all about gang warfare over drug dealing rights.  The perpetrators are predominantly black British youths.  Born raised and educated in the UK.  These crimes are specifically in one area concerning drug gangs and nothing whatsoever to do with immigrants.

 

However I know I am p*ssing in the wind trying to get through to racist posters here.  I just want the other posters on TV to realise that these racist idiots are in the minority in Britain and not in any way representative of what normal Brits believe at all. 

[Thongkorn]

The trouble is that The indigenous people white Brits are not aloud to speak their mind or act in response to many situations.For fear of not being PC. It’s ok for British criminals along with Forieng to commit  crime but as soon as people stand up to them. They have human rights and get better treatment than The victims. How many people have stood up and reacted in response to a crime being committed in front of them. Then they get a criminal record. Being told you should have called the police. It’s about time the British Govenment gave out punishment to fit the crime, and bring back the death penalty for murders that are 100% proof convictions. Along with treason. All prisons should be work factory’s to make prison a place you don’t want to be.Not a place to brush up on your pool or take drugs. There should be a fleet of air busses a380s to deport immediately any foreign person who commits a crime. 4000 long term foreign prisoners in British prisons. Many who we cannot deport because they have human rights. Where are the British citysens rights. That’s why Britain is a soft touch. To  many snowflakes in charge. Only today in the paper. The NHS has paid nearl 500 million to treat foreign health tourists, I could go on but obviously many people will not agree, I am 63 when I was young I got belted at school if I as much as looked at the teachers the wrong way, I think I have grown up fairly balanced, Now a days if a child’s goldfish dies the child is sent for counciling. And there parents want to sue the school. Think rant over, 

Edited April 2, 2018 by Thongkorn

[lovelomsak]

28 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

Absolute rubbish! This is all about gang warfare over drug dealing rights.  The perpetrators are predominantly black British youths.  Born raised and educated in the UK.  These crimes are specifically in one area concerning drug gangs and nothing whatsoever to do with immigrants.

 

However I know I am p*ssing in the wind trying to get through to racist posters here.  I just want the other posters on TV to realise that these racist idiots are in the minority in Britain and not in any way representative of what normal Brits believe at all. 

Yes but their parents were immigrants. and if they are all black as you say then it just goes further to show how immigration  is influencing the present times. Why do blacks even second generation get into drugs and gangs. They definitely have a choice  they are citizens. Maybe taking over Dad's business you know a family business must stay in the family. Brought their trade with them when immigrating

Edited April 2, 2018 by lovelomsak

[i claudius]

most happen in London, so yes relevant.

Yes but they did not stab and murder each other daily.

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[HAKAPALITA]

3 minutes ago, i claudius said:

Yes but they did not stab and murder each other daily.

Sent from my SM-A720F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app
 

Correct, to attain that figure Birmingham Machester and Bradford must be added.!

[citybiker]

Absolute rubbish! This is all about gang warfare over drug dealing rights.  The perpetrators are predominantly black British youths.  Born raised and educated in the UK.  These crimes are specifically in one area concerning drug gangs and nothing whatsoever to do with immigrants.
 
However I know I am p*ssing in the wind trying to get through to racist posters here.  I just want the other posters on TV to realise that these racist idiots are in the minority in Britain and not in any way representative of what normal Brits believe at all. 

Nail hit on head, abiet mostly.

Gangland warfare (post code wars) between London boroughs is rife, primarily between African-Caribbean communities and the facts and stats are there to support this argument. It’s all about turf, drugs, prostitution and people trafficking (immigrant related too) due to the demand for black market labour (no taxes paid).

However, the bigger picture is also tribal/clan related too, Eastern European versus Asian versus the Black community. I don’t think, apart from the more affluent areas no London borough is immune.




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[starky]

9 hours ago, samran said:

Immigrants complaining about immigrants right here on TV? Who would have thunk it? I guess it’s still 1 April in some parts of the world....

Not many immigrants here on TV old son. A lot of retirees ( non immigrants) and ex pats and of course those of us here who are married who are perpetually told we are on a non- immigrant visa. So not sure which immigrants you may be speaking of

[HLover]

44 minutes ago, dunroaming said:

and educated in the UK. 

You are joking.

[Thongkorn]

Just now, HLover said:

You are joking.

That’s the problem their parents don’t integrate bring bad habits and supperstions with them. They don’t get educated because their  parents know different.

[Trouble]

11 hours ago, Lungstib said:

With London one of the worlds best examples of the gulf between rich and poor this is the inevitable result. Cant get guns, use a knife, acid, anything to give an edge. 

It's not just a rich vs. poor situation and it only goes to show that maybe guns are not the problem. It's the overall degradation of the populace in general that is the problem.  People will find anything to substitute for a gun if they needed.  Hua Hin guy used an ice pick over a marital problem.  Any number of reasons why people kill each other.  The world is headed to a place we have seen in such movies as Hunger Games.  Fortunately I won't be around to see it.