Court decides: AirBnB illegal in Thailand for daily and weekly rental

[bkk6060]

They are mostly using Booking.com and Agoda now anyway.

Edited May 17, 2018 by bkk6060

[Belzybob]

4 minutes ago, connda said:

It's interesting what the Thai government chooses to over-regulate as opposed to under-regulate.  Don't get me wrong.  Part of the reason I live here is to get away for the rampant, in-your-face, over-regulation that is a hallmark of the West.  However, here the regulation often seems to be in response to protecting wealthy business owners and other elites interests.  I'm thinking that this is the case here. 

Fact is that this law is well known on this forum; the topic crops up on a regular basis. Even if like most laws in Thailand it is poorly administered, there are still good reasons, other than purely commercial as to why this law exists.

 

It doesn't matter what booking service they are using, less than 30 days its illegal.

Edited May 17, 2018 by Belzybob

[newnative]

2 hours ago, KittenKong said:

I didnt "single out" Airbnb. They were mentioned and I continued to use their name. But obviously the same rules should apply to all other booking agencies, online or offline.

 

And no one is suggesting stopping Airbnb or anyone else from working. But they need to obey the law and as far as I can see that means no short-term rentals except in real B&B properties (ie a bedroom - not a condo - in your own residence in which you provide a bed and a breakfast). I see nothing wrong with longer term rentals being advertised on these booking sites.

The replacement for condos rented overnight? Hotels of course. That's what they are for. Condos are residential buildings and are intrinsically unsuitable for use as hotel accommodation. And the presence of transient tenants is highly detrimental to both the building and all resident co-owners and long-term tenants.

 

Extremely well-said.  Thank you!

[Peterw42]

2 hours ago, KittenKong said:

I didnt "single out" Airbnb. They were mentioned and I continued to use their name. But obviously the same rules should apply to all other booking agencies, online or offline.

 

And no one is suggesting stopping Airbnb or anyone else from working. But they need to obey the law and as far as I can see that means no short-term rentals except in real B&B properties (ie a bedroom - not a condo - in your own residence in which you provide a bed and a breakfast). I see nothing wrong with longer term rentals being advertised on these booking sites.

The replacement for condos rented overnight? Hotels of course. That's what they are for. Condos are residential buildings and are intrinsically unsuitable for use as hotel accommodation. And the presence of transient tenants is highly detrimental to both the building and all resident co-owners and long-term tenants.

 

You bring up an interesting point, why dont you get breakfast as part of an airBNB stay ?

[newnative]

2 hours ago, RBOP said:

So make a new law to make it legal.

No, don't.

[Get Real]

28 minutes ago, newnative said:

    The internet isn't the point.  Condo rentals of less than 30 days are illegal regardless of how the rental was secured. 

How is it that people can advertise freely about renting out their villas for one day up to a week?
I thought you would understand. I mentioned Internet, because AirBnB is located there, and I guess that was the point all from start.

[newnative]

2 hours ago, KittenKong said:

I expect it to have the opposite effect.

In my experience co-owners who rent out, especially those who rent out short-term, are those who want to spend the least on the building. Getting rid of them would make most buildings much better due to increased expenditure on infrastructure and maintenance, and that would put the value of the property up.

Many people who might like to buy a condo are put off from doing so by the large numbers of transients in some buildings, and the resulting poor maintenance. Other buildings that dont allow transients seem to enjoy much higher sale prices, much better management, and a much better class of resident.

    True.  One of the reasons my partner and I bought our current condo is there are no daily/weekly renters.  Even though the building is 35 years old it is being well-maintained.

[peter14]

20 hours ago, MaxLee said:

First UBER and now AirBnB...... 

Thailand  0.5   ... (4.0)   ... ...  The country is xxxx

[newnative]

1 hour ago, theguyfromanotherforum said:

 

This ruling can be challenged, but every building has the right to ban AirBnb and short term rentals. I know in Toronto short term rentals are allowed, but in my building and many others downtown rentals under 6 months are not allowed. Hence the guests are stuck staying in houses, shared rooms, ghettos and undesirable locations.

Or.....hotels?

[DevilsAdvocate]

20 minutes ago, Peterw42 said:

You bring up an interesting point, why dont you get breakfast as part of an airBNB stay ?

We stayed at an AirBNB apartment/condo, and the owner supplied breakfast for us. Croissants, Emmentaler cheese, ham, eggs, jam, coffee etc...

 

It was a good one, be a pity if they can no longer operate.  But, if the law states they are breaking the law, they need to find a way round it, legally.

[jippytum]

19 hours ago, shady86 said:

How can they regulate this? Airbnb is not located in Thailand and acting as a middle man. There is no money transaction done between owner and tenant too.

That is immaterial renting a condo unit for less than 30 days is illegal  ,Regardless of any middleman 

[newnative]

1 hour ago, IamNoone88 said:

By the same argument, they should be closing down thousands of the unlicensed guest houses and small hotels throughout Thailand that do not have a hotel license issued and provide the same daily/weekly service.

It depends.  Small guesthouses and the like with a limited number of rooms are exempt from the Hotel Law.  For example, a shophouse with a business on the ground floor few rental rooms upstairs.

[SmartyMarty]

19 hours ago, Mattd said:

Personally I will give a big thumbs up for this IF it is enforced.

Weekdays sees me staying in a condo in central Bangkok, approx. 1km from Nana area and the last few months one of the owners on the same floor has been short term renting their unit, last lot were some young kids on holiday, 4 of them in the one condo, absolutely no thought for anybody else, coming home drunk at 3 am, slamming doors, shouting in the corridors and so on.

Most others there are working (myself included) and have to get up around 6 am, the last thing you need or want is this!

Bad neighbours can be anywhere......sometimes not short term but permanent.

[steve73]

17 minutes ago, jippytum said:

That is immaterial renting a condo unit for less than 30 days is illegal  ,Regardless of any middleman 

Is it the "renting" that's illegal...?

What if I owned 2 units in a block; lived in one and rented the other in say 6 months blocks, but then allowed my maiden aunt (or more likely a randy uncle) to stay in it free of charge for a couple of weeks between long term lets... would this be deemed illegal...?

If not, what's to stop you allowing anyone stay in your condo for a short period... or would it just be the "thank-you gift" that would make it illegal?  

[midas]

20 hours ago, shady86 said:

How can they regulate this? Airbnb is not located in Thailand and acting as a middle man. There is no money transaction done between owner and tenant too.

But they can easily go after the condo owner if other busybody condo owners in the building who are dead against having short-term renters at their property report them.

[Surasak]

Day after day we here of idiots shooting themselves in the foot, or should that be feet. Every time they open their mouths, it is only to change feet or jump in with both feet. Could they organise a visit to the toilet for someone with a serious case of the runs?

[Surasak]

12 hours ago, happy chappie said:

The way around this one is to rent out the property every time for a month,then when they leave charge them for how long they've stayed.thatll have them scratching their heads for a while.

A serious case of splinters, me thinks

[Disillusioned farang]

Air B n B works very well the world over ! So sure it has to be illegal in Thailand !   

Once again ........ Hahahaha. The world looks on and laughs ! 

[mokwit]

1 minute ago, Disillusioned farang said:

Air B n B works very well the world over ! So sure it has to be illegal in Thailand !   

Once again ........ Hahahaha. The world looks on and laughs ! 

Works for who? Not those who live in buildings where there are AirBnB lets. It works for people who don't live here and a condo owner breaking the law. If it works so well why is Amsterdam now banning it, following moves by Venice and others? Coz the locals have had enough.

[africasiaeuro]

The Lobby spoke .. Wondering how much changed hands .. At this mom stay in an Airbnb in Venice area in a 100 yr old building .  Wanna know at what cost ? 87 bucks a week. Never saw anything like that. Don't know what you fools are still doing there .. Italy has so much to offer - and yes at cheaper rates than LOS. Secure, civilized, culture, I won't change the false smile with a genuine one anymore. check our blog- africasiaeuro.com

[Gunnar Horpestad]

Who is next?

[bkk6060]

14 minutes ago, africasiaeuro said:

. Italy has so much to offer 

The women have hairy armpits, stink, big mouths and are way to westernized and demanding.

 

Good you like it though.

[bander]

20 hours ago, MaxLee said:

First UBER and now AirBnB...... 

What's next?

When BIB don't have anything to crack down on they find something.

[BernieOnTour]

17 hours ago, MaxLee said:

No, Thailand - 0.04 

However ... the Thai are not alone

 

also:

Santa Monica 0.4

New York City 0.4

New Orleans 0.4

Paris 0.4

Berlin 0.4

 

 

With regard to UBER and GRAB:

I admit, I use also sometimes Grab, not at least because of the convenience of their platform...

However, the side effects are also clearly visible in Chiang Mai: TukTuk drivers, who earned an acceptable outcome for their families before, are now hanging around for hours at the hotspots for younger tourists, when at the same time dozens of private cars drop and pick up Grab passengers.

The result of that is - in former times I seldom paid more than the local price, 60 baht, now they (have to) charge 100 or more to compensate their loss of business

- driving even more into the arms of Alibaba/Jack Ma.

 

In the end, I assume, platforms as or similar to AirBnB and Grab will survive in Thailand, as history shows:

Motorbike taxis came up first in Bangkok and at that time, "the powers" tried to suppress them also. However, the demand pressure for that service finally forced them to accept motorbike taxis and they are now also in many other cities.

 

[WinnieTheKhwai]

10 hours ago, reenatinnakor said:

Accommodation is so cheap in thailand... Why would anyone want to use airbnb here? 

 

Because hotels persist living in the last century, when most travelers were single business people or a couple on a romantic weekend trip.  World has moved on, people travel with groups of friends, a family with kids and maybe grandma for good measure, and for those groups it's a LOT more civilized of an experience when you have a real home to yourself with a living room, proper kitchen, a garden or patio, etc. 

 

Many AirBnB listings aren't even cheaper than hotels, and AirBnB itself aims to go further up-market with all kinds of cool places and travel experiences. 

 

3 hours ago, Orac said:

Depends if they try and enforce it - not exactly rocket science for one of the many enforcement agencies here to turn up at a condo and then check ab&b for rooms for rent in it.

 

The location is typically not indicated exactly on the AirBnB site.   It's not completely impossible to figure out especially for certain well-known condominium buildings but the exact address and unit number typically doesn't show (unless the host puts it in the description), so they'd have to make a booking, or possibly send a message and ask which floor / which unit.  Again not that hard to do because hosts will readily tell anyone who asks.  If there is ever any serious kind of enforcement then this may change. (as opposed to virtually no enforcement right now, unless a condo operator or neighbor files a complaint.)

 

2 hours ago, Peterw42 said:

I have never seen a developer that sells specifically on the strength of short term rental, they sell on broad rental returns, ie: 10% return on long term legal rental.

 

Have you checked in the last two years. :)  It's definitely a big part of the equation right now in certain areas.

 

1 hour ago, Peterw42 said:

You bring up an interesting point, why dont you get breakfast as part of an airBNB stay ?

 

At some places you might.  The listing will tell you what's included.

 

[robsamui]

12 hours ago, Keira1 said:

Been visiting Thailand the last 18 years...getting more and more disappointed over this country, was actually planning my next trip using only airbnb, but now I know for sure, will not go to Thailand. Too much plastic, pollution, tourists, restrictions... forget it, I'm going elsewhere from now on...

Yeah right, clear off out of it you irritating farang. Who needs you when we're getting 100 super-white slanty-eyed daytrippers for every one of you. All you lot do is whinge and moan about soi dogs and pollution and our lovely police,  and spend your time trying to make us look stupid, but those nice Chinese people just wanna buy stuff and then turn round and go home. Who needs you. Go back to your own country. Ha!

Edited May 17, 2018 by robsamui
editing

[brewsterbudgen]

Yeah right, clear off out of it you irritating farang. Who needs you when we're getting 100 super-white slanty-eyed daytrippers for every one of you. All you lot do is whinge and moan about soi dogs and pollution and our lovely police,  and spend your time trying to make us look stupid, but those nice Chinese people just wanna buy stuff and then turn round and go home. Who needs you. Bye

I wouldn't put it quite that bluntly, but it does seem ridiculous to not go somewhere just because one accommodation option isn't available. Surely short-term rentals in condos are banned everywhere, aren't they? They certainly should as condos are not hotels.

Sent from my SM-G930F using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[rexall]

What if the contract is for 30 days but the owner and the guest privately understand that the actual occupancy will only be for, say, 7 days?   That might be a workaround for awhile.

[Chua]

First of all, except for the Thai Supreme Court, local and Regional Thai Court verdicts do not set a precedent as they do in other countries.  Each ruling is on a case-by-case basis.

Also, this situation arised in a multi-unit condominium, where the usage is very similar to a hotel.  While the article doesn't state specifically which law was broken, very likely it is the rule that multi-tenant buildings with a lobby should have a hotel license.

 

Some Condominiums also have their own internal rules Regarding what types of rentals are permitted.

 

Therefore none of the above applies to individual, single family homes for short term rental nor AirBnB as a business in Thailand. These type of homes really do not compete with hotels because they offer amenities such as full kitchens for families and private chefs, living rooms shared by multiple bedrooms, and completely private, enclosed gardens, etc.  Even if homeowners of these type of properties are concerned, all they need to do is apply for a hotel license but in reality it really does not apply to properties with less than 6 separately rentable bedrooms and no Lobby reception area.

 

Some regulations about this do exist in the metropolitan area of Bangkok but not in the other regions of Thailand.

 

[Vermor]

Prostitution is also illegal in Thailand...hum...