SURVEY: Death Penalty -- More, less or none at all?

[Scott]

Thailand recently executed its first prisoner in nine years.   Which of the following best describes your opinion on the use of the death penalty?

 

Please feel free to leave a comment.

 

For further reading, here is the story:

 

 

[Samui Bodoh]

While I understand the desire on the part of some to see the death penalty used, especially for the most heinous of crimes, I do not believe it is rational to use it in Thailand because of the Police, the Legal System and the Judiciary.

 

The Police. Is there anyone here who will express high confidence in the abilities, honesty and professionalism of the police? Anyone?

 

The legal system. Inside the legal system, there are clerks who handle evidence, there are CSI technicians, there are administrators, there are court clerks and translators (as required), etc. Is there anyone here who will express high confidence in the abilities, honesty and professionalism of all these people? We all deal with Thai bureaucrats on a regular basis; anyone want to express that confidence?

 

The Judiciary. We have all seen several... dubious decisions by the Judiciary over the years, especially where there are High-Sos and/or money involved. Is there anyone here who will express high confidence in the abilities, honesty and professionalism of the Judiciary? Anyone?

 

If a society wants to have the Death Penalty, then it must have an incredibly effective, honest, professional and competent Police Force, Support People in the Justice System, and Judiciary. Can anyone argue that these things exist in Thailand?

 

Utilizing the Death Penalty in Thailand is madness. Unfortunately, the entire Justice system does not yet rise to the level of competence required to be able to assert that an innocent person would not be executed. And, until you can confidently assert that an innocent person will not be executed, you should not and must not use the Death Penalty.

 

 

[mikebell]

To all anti-death penalty apologists; check out the story of the woman found yesterday in Bangkok in a dozen pieces.  This perpetrator does not deserve to draw breath again ever.

[Wilsonandson]

To all anti-death penalty apologists; check out the story of the woman found yesterday in Bangkok in a dozen pieces.  This perpetrator does not deserve to draw breath again ever.

https://www.thaivisa.com/forum/applications/tapatalk/index.php?/topic/1044490-Female's-head-found-in-a-bag-in-northern-Bangkok---torso-nearby-in-fertilizer-sacks

Sent from my SM-A700FD using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[Lungstib]

 

I asked my wife what she and her friends thought about this issue. Her answer was why should we pay to keep a murderer alive for 40 years in a clean, dry environment with 3 meals a day, costing millions of baht over perhaps 40 years? The rest of us work hard, abide by the law, do the right thing and get nothing. Its a simple social issue to them. 

        I have read and completely understand and agree with the post above from Samui Bodoh who discusses the legal and moral issues about a govt setting itself up to judge others and having to be as near as possible to perfect before it can entertain taking life as punishment.

   There is a huge distance between these two ways of seeing the issue. It wont be easily solved.

[Cadbury]

Generally speaking I am against the death penalty. The thing that concerns me with "no death penalty" is that those murderers and/or rapists who are released back into the community prematurely just to do the same again. Probably get released because of overcrowding and one less mouth to feed. 

At least if they are put down like a rabid dog they don't get to kill other innocent people again.

[monkfish]

Self censored.

 

 

 

 

[Bluespunk]

The state should not kill its own citizens. 

[robblok]

50 minutes ago, Cadbury said:

Generally speaking I am against the death penalty. The thing that concerns me with "no death penalty" is that those murderers and/or rapists who are released back into the community prematurely just to do the same again. Probably get released because of overcrowding and one less mouth to feed. 

At least if they are put down like a rabid dog they don't get to kill other innocent people again.

That is not what I am concerned about then they should get a life sentence with no parole. Death is real final and I am ok with that in certain cases. Problem is (i don't like to agree with Samui Bodeh) the court system and police here are not really that fool proof. In certain cases with CCTV, lots of witnesses DNA and such and a real cruel murderer i could be pro death penalty. 

 

But generally speaking here in Thailand I would be against it because of the risk of wrong convicts. I have read it went wrong in the US more then a few times, in the Netherlands we had cases overturned too (no death penalty but cases people were sure about). So I am not against death penalty per se.. just afraid of wrongful executions.

[Ceruhe]

2 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

The Police. Is there anyone here who will express high confidence in the abilities, honesty and professionalism of the police? Anyone?

I firmly and with unquivering doubt will place the highest confidence in the police in their abilities to collect tea money, honesty denying doing such a thing and professionalism of efficiency it entrails.

 

 

Eh yea, again, not completly opposed to it, but I don't see it as a benefit for/in Thailand due to all the obvious pointed out in less than 10 posts already. Not to mention their laws would extend to make defamation punishable by death in no time haha

[Anak Nakal]

In Thailand money talks.

How much for Death Penalty?

[new2here]

2 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

While I understand the desire on the part of some to see the death penalty used, especially for the most heinous of crimes, I do not believe it is rational to use it in Thailand because of the Police, the Legal System and the Judiciary.

 

The Police. Is there anyone here who will express high confidence in the abilities, honesty and professionalism of the police? Anyone?

 

The legal system. Inside the legal system, there are clerks who handle evidence, there are CSI technicians, there are administrators, there are court clerks and translators (as required), etc. Is there anyone here who will express high confidence in the abilities, honesty and professionalism of all these people? We all deal with Thai bureaucrats on a regular basis; anyone want to express that confidence?

 

The Judiciary. We have all seen several... dubious decisions by the Judiciary over the years, especially where there are High-Sos and/or money involved. Is there anyone here who will express high confidence in the abilities, honesty and professionalism of the Judiciary? Anyone?

 

If a society wants to have the Death Penalty, then it must have an incredibly effective, honest, professional and competent Police Force, Support People in the Justice System, and Judiciary. Can anyone argue that these things exist in Thailand?

 

Utilizing the Death Penalty in Thailand is madness. Unfortunately, the entire Justice system does not yet rise to the level of competence required to be able to assert that an innocent person would not be executed. And, until you can confidently assert that an innocent person will not be executed, you should not and must not use the Death Penalty.

 

 

I agree.. given that the death penalty is finality - and can’t be reversed or even compensated if in error - BEFORE I would sanction its use, I would want very good assurances (recognizing that no system will ever be or can be wholly infallible) that the system from which it is a part of, is transparent, fair, equatable and that the rights of all parties are equally represented.

 

As an outsider to the Thai judicial system, it is my option only that the system here just does not rise in my mind, to a point where I’d feel comfortable that the death penalty was applied after a fair, transparent and equatable system has been administered.

[soistalker]

Death penalty should be the penalty for littering.

[AGareth2]

9 hours ago, Scott said:

Please feel free to leave a comment.

are we really allowed to comment?

[Scott]

Just now, AGareth2 said:

are we really allowed to comment?

I don't know why you wouldn't be able to comment.  Just follow the rules.   The survey is about your opinion of the administration of the death penalty.  

[AGareth2]

54 minutes ago, Bluespunk said:

The state should not kill its own citizens. 

so BURMESE ok?

[AGareth2]

That is what I meant

2 minutes ago, Scott said:

I don't know why you wouldn't be able to comment.  Just follow the rules

 

[fxe1200]

If the decision of the Supreme Court against the two Burmese is being upheld, the Burmese only can confess (which they did not do) to avoid the death penalty, which nowadays will then probably carried out. To address a petition with the King might not be successful. As the miscarriage of justice does happen to often in Thailand, therefore the bringing back of the execution practice will lead to the murder of innocent people. Thus this practice should be abolished.

[Bluespunk]

13 minutes ago, AGareth2 said:

so BURMESE ok?

No. 

Edited June 24, 2018 by Bluespunk

[rkidlad]

3 hours ago, mikebell said:

To all anti-death penalty apologists; check out the story of the woman found yesterday in Bangkok in a dozen pieces.  This perpetrator does not deserve to draw breath again ever.

Yes, and read the story of the lady who said that rapists shouldn’t be executed.

 

Some people seem to draw pleasure from misery. The whole call ‘fight’ when two people are on the cusp of exchanging blows. We need smart and rational people to call the shots. Not the disinfranchised.

 

Ever read a bleach bottle when on the toilet? It warns people not to drink it. That’s a signal that we are still evolving. 

[ezzra]

For heinous and inhuman crimes where's cruelty was dispropenionly used, i say jab the sucker with all you've got...

[Expatthailover]

3 hours ago, Samui Bodoh said:

While I understand the desire on the part of some to see the death penalty used, especially for the most heinous of crimes, I do not believe it is rational to use it in Thailand because of the Police, the Legal System and the Judiciary.

 

The Police. Is there anyone here who will express high confidence in the abilities, honesty and professionalism of the police? Anyone?

 

The legal system. Inside the legal system, there are clerks who handle evidence, there are CSI technicians, there are administrators, there are court clerks and translators (as required), etc. Is there anyone here who will express high confidence in the abilities, honesty and professionalism of all these people? We all deal with Thai bureaucrats on a regular basis; anyone want to express that confidence?

 

The Judiciary. We have all seen several... dubious decisions by the Judiciary over the years, especially where there are High-Sos and/or money involved. Is there anyone here who will express high confidence in the abilities, honesty and professionalism of the Judiciary? Anyone?

 

If a society wants to have the Death Penalty, then it must have an incredibly effective, honest, professional and competent Police Force, Support People in the Justice System, and Judiciary. Can anyone argue that these things exist in Thailand?

 

Utilizing the Death Penalty in Thailand is madness. Unfortunately, the entire Justice system does not yet rise to the level of competence required to be able to assert that an innocent person would not be executed. And, until you can confidently assert that an innocent person will not be executed, you should not and must not use the Death Penalty.

 

 

I am the anyone.

I trust the police here as much as I trust them in oz, uk or usa.

Neither me nor my wife's family have ever had a problem with police and our dealings ( few as they are ) have always been cordial and professional. 

Then again I am well mannered, respect the country that is gracious enough to let me reside and I dont have any personal agenda against thailand and its people.

Miscarriages of justice are still rife throughout the developed world. To point the finger solely at thailand suggests you have issues.

Edited June 24, 2018 by Expatthailover

[NoshowJones]

3 hours ago, mikebell said:

To all anti-death penalty apologists; check out the story of the woman found yesterday in Bangkok in a dozen pieces.  This perpetrator does not deserve to draw breath again ever.

I agree, but have to be 100% certain.

[300sd]

Death penalty here=kill innocent people.

 

1 minute ago, ezzra said:

For heinous and inhuman crimes where's cruelty was dispropenionly used, i say jab the sucker with all you've got...

Yes only if they are guilty. 

 

3 minutes ago, Expatthailover said:

To point the finger solely at thailand suggests you have issues.

No, but possibly he has seen what type of justice you can get here. Possibly you have not!

[connda]

After watching the fiasco at Koh Samui over the murders of a British couple I'm afraid that in this country (and others) that there is a good chance that innocent people end up getting framed for murder if it politically expedient to do so and the right patsies can be found, accused, and eventually murdered by the State to make the victim's families feel as though justice has been served and to show that the government 'did something' even if it means killing other innocent people. 

I might support capital punishment if there is a witnessed murder as one caught on video.  But I don't think the State should be the executioner, cut off from the sight of the public behind closed doors.  No, instead the family of the victim should be given the option to exercise an 'eye for an eye' if they choose to do so, and the execution should be in the full view of the public.  Those who argue for a 'deterrence' would get their wish. The family would be avenged.  And if the family choose compassion, then it's life in jail.  If the murder was not witnessed and is based on circumstantial evidence, then it's life in jail. 

[duanebigsby]

3 hours ago, mikebell said:

To all anti-death penalty apologists; check out the story of the woman found yesterday in Bangkok in a dozen pieces.  This perpetrator does not deserve to draw breath again ever.

Thailand has the death penalty.

Did it deter the perpetrator in any way?

No

Could the wrong person be convicted and put to death?

Quite possible especially in Thailand.

[Dmaxdan]

I believe the death penalty should only be used for the Ted Bundy type serial killers who are nothing but pure evil, but one-time murderers, say for example a crime of passion where they completely lose the plot (a seemingly common occurrence here) then an appropriate prison sentence should be applied. 

[dick dasterdly]

1 hour ago, robblok said:

That is not what I am concerned about then they should get a life sentence with no parole. Death is real final and I am ok with that in certain cases. Problem is (i don't like to agree with Samui Bodeh) the court system and police here are not really that fool proof. In certain cases with CCTV, lots of witnesses DNA and such and a real cruel murderer i could be pro death penalty. 

 

But generally speaking here in Thailand I would be against it because of the risk of wrong convicts. I have read it went wrong in the US more then a few times, in the Netherlands we had cases overturned too (no death penalty but cases people were sure about). So I am not against death penalty per se.. just afraid of wrongful executions.

"So I am not against death penalty per se.. just afraid of wrongful executions."

 

That's always been my reason for not supporting the death penalty too.  One person wrongly executed, is one too many.

 

I voted for the third option as it most closely represents my views, but only if there is 100% proof of guilt.

[robblok]

2 minutes ago, dick dasterdly said:

"So I am not against death penalty per se.. just afraid of wrongful executions."

 

That's always been my reason for not supporting the death penalty too.  One person wrongly executed, is one too many.

 

I voted for the third option as it most closely represents my views, but only if there is 100% proof of guilt.

Yes I have no problem with really bad murderers getting executed, problem is wrongful executions. Death is so final. 

[ianf]

3 hours ago, mikebell said:

To all anti-death penalty apologists; check out the story of the woman found yesterday in Bangkok in a dozen pieces.  This perpetrator does not deserve to draw breath again ever.

Absolutely don't agree with you. Simplistic solution? Actually if you researched the mental state of prisoners around the world, many are autistic, many have mental health problems and these types of problems should be dealt with properly by society rather than labeling people "evil" or "criminal" or whatever. I have vast experience of this having been inside prisons and examined the kinds of educational rehabilitation processes on offer. I've done this both in the USA and the UK and the results were identical. Too many people with severe problems are not cared for. In Thailand, you see them on the streets. Rather than incarcerate them or execute them, I would suggest that we, as a society, create care facilities that take these people out of harm's way and allows them to live as fulfilling a life as possible. Some people with mental health problems: sociopaths and narcissists manage to elevate themselves to positions of power and create havoc in their countries or in the world. Many people - usually identified by their extreme views - have their latent mental health problems made acceptable by these sociopathic leaders. Look at history or the current state of global affairs and you'll see what I mean. You see, old friend, it's not as easy as you seem to make out in your post above. You express prejudice, not rational thought.

Edited June 24, 2018 by ianf