Testosterone replacement in Bangkok

[mokwit]

1 hour ago, pineapple01 said:

Is injection the only way to administer.Rather off putting all this bickering. A Simple Yes or No would help. Thanks.

If anything is going work it will be injections. It is by far the most certain if you take total T to above 800ng/DL. This makes Enanthate more suitable than Undecanoate injections (Nebido) because with Nebido after an initial peak you spend 2+ months under 800 - around 600, which is within normal range and so rarely is the dose titrated above 800. Research in the 1940's found that to get any subjective benefits i.e. how you feel with exogenous T you had to have a total T above 800.

[mokwit]

7 minutes ago, lovesthespicy said:

That doesnt seem to bad. 8K to talk to someone who knows what their talking about with blood test done. I just dont want to be paying absurd prices for TRT every month when I'm completely comfortable buying and injecting something myself.

I felt I got very good value. I treat myself - specifically targeting high SHBG, but I often wonder if it is not a false economy to hand over to Tim Lopez or someone else I am sure of for, say 6-12 month period, to see how I feel - I could be short changing myself.

Edited August 25, 2020 by mokwit

[WaveHunter]

12 hours ago, Patts said:

The problem is you are comparing the health care you have experienced/received in the US and Thailand, I am comparing what is provided in the UK which is very different and I assure what I speak of is bang up to date. I would take the advice of Dr Stevens over any GP or Endo that's for sure 

Well this is a forum for those of us here in Thailand, not the UK. I certainly mean no offense to you by saying that BTW ????

 

Here in Thailand I have found (as many others have) that the quality of health care can be outstanding.  Thailand is ranked very highly on a global scale for being one of the finest health-providing nations in the world.  My personal experience with GP's both in Chiang Mai where I originally lived, and also in Jomtien (outside of Pattaya) is that they are exceptionally well trained and very knowledgable, and seem to take a personal interest in helping their patients (much more so than I ever experienced back home in the States).

 

Having said that, there are also absolute scam artist physicians, especially when it comes to TRT.  Most of the "anti aging" clinics in Bangkok and Pattaya are "worst of the worst"!  Sleazy physicians run them (usually in name only), charge exorbitant prices for services and usually insist that you buy the Test from them at ridiculous mark-ups.  The ones I came in contact with were either unknowledgeable about finer points of TRT or outright scam artists (probably a combination of both things!).

 

Worst of all, most of these scammers type clinics pander to unsuspecting potential patients promising all sorts of fantastical and unrealistic claims for TRT.

 

People that are considering TRT should do their own homework before visiting a doctor.  TRT is not the "magic bullet" that many health gurus on YouTube and other mainstream media make it out to be.  You are not going to become a sex stud, or shed pounds of fat, or magically get the physique of a body builder from it unless you abuse it. 

 

Most people on TRT really should not even be on it, to be perfectly honest!  Unless you have an absolute deficiency (as in below 300-400 ng/dL), it really should not be prescribed, yet it often is by doctors out to make a buck.  Just my opinion of course.

 

Personally I started TRT because my tested levels were around 200 ng/dL.  That is VERY low.  I was putting on weight and felt horrible so that's why I discussed TRT with an MD and started therapy. 

 

In a real round-about way I discovered that there are actually natural ways to increase testosterone that people should be aware of that require no drugs or "magic" T boosting potions or pills.  Simple exercise and good nutrition will go a long way to restoring T to healthy levels. 

 

Here is my "journey of discovery" in this regard, which you might find interesting ????.  

 

Over time, something very curious started happening with my TRT.  It was concerning and it actually took a while to figure out.  Starting about two years ago, every time I had my blood tests, my T levels were abnormally high.  It baffled me and my physician as well,  Naturally dosage was reduced, but when my next 6 month blood test was done, the same thing happened again!  When I say "abnormally high" I mean a BIG jump.  My target zone Was supposed to be around 700-900 ng/dL, and my tests were coming in at 1,500+.

 

What I had not taken into account or shared with my doctor was that this started happening right around the time that I made some pretty radical changes in my nutrition, and was started to really exercise a lot more than I ever had.  I was exploring the underlying metabolic science of plant-based eating (which turned out to be a pretty bad idea) but then started exploring ketogenic nutrition.  AT the same time I had become a fanatic about cycling (hill climbing and mountain biking).  My doctor wasn't really aware of this as it just never came up in conversations (though I guess it should have)

 

Long story short, It took a while to realize that my nutrition and exercise were responsible for raising my natural T levels!  I never believed the anecdotal stories or studies I had seen about the effects of exercise and diet on natural T, but apparently they are true!  Truth is, I'm really started to consider just ending TRT.

 

Just pointing this out because many who are considering TRT should consider just doing it naturally through diet and exercise.  Bottom line, don't expect TRT to be a "magic bullet" because it is not irregardless of what all the dopy health gurus claim it to be.  Also, even if you are clinically in need of TRT, don;t expect to see any sort of tangible results "overnight".  The changes that occur are very gradual and subtle and it really can take several months to notice any changes.  In other words, if you do TRT, be realistic about your expectations, and if you can do it (or transition to doing it) naturally without drugs, that's always going to be a better option.

 

Edited August 25, 2020 by WaveHunter

[Destiny1990]

6 hours ago, lovesthespicy said:

Thanks for the advice guys. Anyone know where a "good gp" would be to talk about these things in BKK. I can obv find a blood lab but not every doctor will have knowledge on TRT. 

 

Thanks

That mentioned trt clinic in Pattaya klang if still open is a valid option. otherwise go to a certified lab here and do a full blood test and send these results to a trt clinic in ur home country and let them advising you..

[WaveHunter]

7 hours ago, lovesthespicy said:

Thanks for the advice guys. Anyone know where a "good gp" would be to talk about these things in BKK. I can obv find a blood lab but not every doctor will have knowledge on TRT. 

 

Thanks

I think your best bet in BKK is to visit a hospital and ask to see a GP.  Tell them you want to discuss TRT with a knowledgable MD.  Chances are they will have you talk with a GP (not a specialist) because TRT has become so mainstream in the last few years that it is well within the domain of a GP to provide competent and most importantly, trusted advice.

 

You are not really going to know whether a GP is the right fit for you until you meet with him or her in person.  You should be well prepared with plenty of specific questions.  Really test his/her knowledge and get a feeling for how he or she relates to you, and listen carefully to how he or she responds, and what his/her views are on TRT in general.  You want to come away from that consult knowing that the doctor is not only knowledgable about TRT but has a genuine interest in your specific health concerns, and your long-term health.

 

That is a far better approach than visiting a TRT clinic where they have a vested financial interest in signing you up for treatment and where the chances are very good you won't even be talking with a licensed MD, but rather a glorified sales rep with a lofty title like "Wellness Advisor" or even "Clinic Director".  You want to be speaking, face to face, with a bonafide MD, not anyone else!

 

I was lucky when I first moved to Chiang Mai from the US because I found an excellent GP right off the bat that had an excellent understanding of TRT, and she was considered one of the best MD's in Chinag Mai, and simply had a genuinely caring and confident attitude which is real important in a doctor I think.

 

When I moved to Pattaya it was a lot harder.  I visited one of the most popular TRT clinics in Pattaya for a consult and it was a total joke; they did not even have a licensed MD on the premises!  It felt real scammy from the second I walked through the doors even tough they had all the trappings of an upscale clinic.  It felt even worse when the "Wellness Director" (yeah, right LOL) laid his aggressive sales pitch on me, trying to convince me that they were one of the best TRT clinics in all of Thailand!  I've seen used car salesmen that would have envied this guy's aggressive sales tactics!  

 

When I finally just went to the local hospital and did as I suggested above,  I found a great GP who was incredibly knowledgable, asked me all the right questions, and who I decided to have take over my treatment, and I had no regrets whatsoever! And even if that GP had not worked out, I could have easily asked to see another GP without offending him. 

 

I just think you want to stay away from any dedicated TRT clinic where they obviously have a serious (greedy) financial interest in your treatment.  I think it's safe to say that they will tell you whatever it takes to sign you up, whether or not it is in your best interests.  They may come off sounding real professional, ethical, and caring, but let's face it, they are in business to make money first and foremost.  A GP working at a hospital is far more likely to truly be acting in your best interests.  

Edited August 25, 2020 by WaveHunter

[faraday]

3 hours ago, WaveHunter said:

convince me that they were one of the best TRT clinics in all of Thailand!  I've

I expect the Test came in a gold bottle too! ????

 

Jokes aside, your posts are excellent. 

[WaveHunter]

37 minutes ago, faraday said:

I expect the Test came in a gold bottle too! ????

 

Jokes aside, your posts are excellent. 

Thanks Faraday; I appreciate you saying that ????  I've had a lot of experience with TRT and just want to share my thoughts so others considering TRT don't get led astray.  It's easy for that to happen when you hear all the fantastical, yet unrealistic claims made for TRT by those who's main motive is financial gain. 

 

In retrospect after having been on TRT for 6 years, I really believe that most people on TRT or considering it, really should not.  I'm genuinely convinced that many look to TRT as an easy fix to being lazy and just not practicing good health habits like eating right and exercising.  I've become a huge student of nutrition and how the body responds to exercise, and the more I learn about it, the more convinced I become that poor nutrition and lack of proper exercise are the root cause of many metabolic-related illnesses such as obesity, Diabetes type 2, and yes, even low testosterone.

 

Of course it's true that some people are genuinely deficient in natural testosterone and TRT is a necessary treatment so they can just get out of bed in the morning and function normally, but I think it should only be a temporary protocol for most people, and what they should really do is have a goal to transition from TRT to natural ways that will boost their T levels as soon as they can. I'm not talking about exotic "superfoods" or special supplements; I'm just talking about basic healthy nutrition like avoiding heavily processed foods, avoiding excessive carbohydrates, getting in regular resistance-type exercising...very basic stuff.

 

All it takes for many is just good nutrition and exercise.  I'm convinced it's as simple as that!  The famous quote, “Let food be thy medicine, and let medicine be thy food.” has a lot of wisdom to it, when you really think about it.

 

I found that to be true for myself entirely by accident, and I'm fairly certain I will discontinue TRT if my levels continue to stay up through the healthier lifestyle I now practice.

Edited August 25, 2020 by WaveHunter

[NightSky]

Does anyone know where to get 'free t' tested and/or how to calculate it from SHBG and total testosterone without needing to pay for a TRT doctor. I would just like to know my free t levels and I just wanted to do the test.

 

[WaveHunter]

16 hours ago, NightSky said:

Does anyone know where to get 'free t' tested and/or how to calculate it from SHBG and total testosterone without needing to pay for a TRT doctor. I would just like to know my free t levels and I just wanted to do the test.

 

It might help you get a specific answer if you say where you live.  Many labs will provide an FT blood test based on equilibrium dialysis, which is most precise but quite expensive.  In Pattaya, there is a lab that will send your samples to Bangkok where it's done for around 4.500 THB I think.  Some labs will only do it by calculation of TT, SHBC and Albumin, so you need to ask the specific lab if they provide a clinical or calculated test.

 

As far as calculated values goes, there are online sites where you just plug in your numbers and it calculates FT for you.  Just google "Free Testosterone calculator".  It is not nearly as precise, and it also depends on which formula is used.  The most accurate formula apparently is the Vermeulen equation (shown below).  Most online calculators will reference which formula they use so just look for the keyword "Vermeulen", or if you're really ambitious with mathematics, you can plug in your own numbers into the actual Vermeulen equation which is:

 

Edited August 27, 2020 by WaveHunter

[how241]

16 hours ago, NightSky said:

Does anyone know where to get 'free t' tested and/or how to calculate it from SHBG and total testosterone without needing to pay for a TRT doctor. I would just like to know my free t levels and I just wanted to do the test.

 

Many clinics will do a blood test and give you the results. 

[NightSky]

4 hours ago, WaveHunter said:

It might help you get a specific answer if you say where you live.  Many labs will provide an FT blood test based on equilibrium dialysis, which is most precise but quite expensive.  In Pattaya, there is a lab that will send your samples to Bangkok where it's done for around 4.500 THB I think.  Some labs will only do it by calculation of TT, SHBC and Albumin, so you need to ask the specific lab if they provide a clinical or calculated test.

 

As far as calculated values goes, there are online sites where you just plug in your numbers and it calculates FT for you.  Just google "Free Testosterone calculator".  It is not nearly as precise, and it also depends on which formula is used.  The most accurate formula apparently is the Vermeulen equation (shown below).  Most online calculators will reference which formula they use so just look for the keyword "Vermeulen", or if you're really ambitious with mathematics, you can plug in your own numbers into the actual Vermeulen equation which is:

 

Sorry yes im in bangkok.

 

 

[WaveHunter]

9 hours ago, NightSky said:

Sorry yes im in bangkok.

 

 

Since most of the blood labs throughout Thailand send FT blood tests to Bangkok for the actual testing, it should be pretty easy for you to find a lab in BKK, but if your TT is in the normal range, you should really just consult a good physician to discuss your symptoms since even an FT test is only going to be a small part of what's needed to diagnose the cause of your symptoms.  Due to the expense of a genuine clinical test, probably makes more sense to just have your TT, SHBG, and albumin tested and just plug the numbers into an online calculator to satisfy your curiosity.  A real diagnosis of your symptoms really needs to be by a doctor since such a diagnosis can involve a lot of factors beyond FT.  Just my personal opinion.

[tyler28]

Medconsult Clinic in Sukhumvit 49 will do all these tests.

 

The nurse will also do an injection (with testosterone you provide yourself) for 200 baht.

[cocoonclub]

Can someone recommend a doctor/hospital to do the testosterone test? Someone who knows what he/she is doing. Ideally someone who can also test for vitamin deficiencies.

[Sheryl]

16 hours ago, cocoonclub said:

Can someone recommend a doctor/hospital to do the testosterone test? Someone who knows what he/she is doing. Ideally someone who can also test for vitamin deficiencies.

Where in Thailand are you?