Did I buy fake Tramadol?

[YogaVeg]

Following surgery I was given Ultracet. It definitely helped sleep and eased pain.

Looking online I noticed that Volcidol is a Thai Tramadol, at 50mg presumably stronger than Ultracet, and a fraction of the cost. It also isn't mixed with anything (I think) and Ultracet is. So I went looking...

 

After a few "no's" I found a little pharmacy (non-tourist area, no English signs, ect.) in a quiet Thai neighborhood that said sure, how many do you want? 5 baht each. They were sold in bulk and no ID was needed nor receipt provided.

 

They don't seem to have the effect. Ultracet definitely gave me a noticeable 'buzz' and put me to sleep. I don't get that from these little green and yellow capsules. The capsules are unmarked, which I also find odd, tho a Google search of images brings up equal amounts of pictures of marked and unmarked capsules.

Unpackaged capsules make me skeptical as well...

 

Thankfully the pain is more tolerable everyday, so I'm considering just throwing them away.

 

But I thought I would ask the community:

1-if anyone has first-hand experience with effects of the 2 different products? Were your capsules marked?

2-how likely do you think, to buy a fake product at an actual (non-tourist) pharmacy?

3-any methods of testing available?

[BritManToo]

This is what I buy, 40bht for 10 tabs. Same deal, from a small local pharmacy, no foreigners around.

Pills themselves are unmarked.

 

 

Edited October 4, 2018 by BritManToo

[blackhorse]

I use the same brand. A container of a 1000 for 4k.
Not as strong as Ultracet so you pop a few more and they do the job

[Falcon]

I have a load of these direct from the hospital, don’t really do anything to relieve the pain at all. I take 2 at a time and feel no benefit from them whatsoever. Not sure if fake capsules, but, as I already said, directly from the hospital, or just really inderdosed.

[blackhorse]

I have a load of these direct from the hospital, don’t really do anything to relieve the pain at all. I take 2 at a time and feel no benefit from them whatsoever. Not sure if fake capsules, but, as I already said, directly from the hospital, or just really inderdosed.

I made a mistake my brand is different. Wonder why they gave you a generic?

[Colabamumbai]

Best taken with Acetaminophen, that is why it is in Ultracet.

[blackhorse]

Best taken with Acetaminophen, that is why it is in Ultracet.

Is that that the generic name? I'm might try it and see if I can cut down the tramadol dose
I tried Ultracet and it was brilliant but expensive here

[impulse]

1 hour ago, blackhorse said:

1 hour ago, Colabamumbai said:

Best taken with Acetaminophen, that is why it is in Ultracet.

Is that that the generic name? I'm might try it and see if I can cut down the tramadol dose
I tried Ultracet and it was brilliant but expensive here

 

Acetaminophen is American for Paracetamol (Generic Tylenol).

[Suradit69]

1 hour ago, blackhorse said:

tried Ultracet and it was brilliant but expensive here

 

The Ultracet I get is from Fascino, produced by Janssen and contains 37.5 mg tramadol. Only Baht 189 for 10 tablets. I find it to be pretty effective, but then that will obviously vary from individual to individual. I rarely use it more than a couple of times a month because it contains paracetamol which usually ramps up my tinnitus and it is, after all,  an opioid.

 

Very rarely I take 50mg tramadol tablets produced by Medic Pharma. I've not found a pharmacy that sells them so I've seen a doctor at Bangkok Hospital Pattaya in the Orthopedic Center who I've consulted in the past and he prescribes the tramadol to be supplied by the hospital pharmacy. It's been a  year since I last got 30 tablets and I still have at least half that number left. Can't recall how much they cost.  I find them to really work when pain is excessive.

 

I generally try to get by using 400 mg Celebrex most days. Not as effective as Tramadol or Ultracet, but most of the time it takes the edge off the pain.  Again, what works for one person may or may not do the job for someone else.

 

Edited October 5, 2018 by Suradit69

[Thaiwrath]

I go to the Government Hospital every 4 months for follow up appointments following ACDF surgery.

At my last appointment, 2 months ago, I requested 120 Tramadol, to last me until my next appointment at the end of November. The specialist obliged, prescribed 120 tablets, and my bill was 50 baht consultation fee, and 120 baht for the Tramadol, total 170 baht.

[blackhorse]

I go to the Government Hospital every 4 months for follow up appointments following ACDF surgery.
At my last appointment, 2 months ago, I requested 120 Tramadol, to last me until my next appointment at the end of November. The specialist obliged, prescribed 120 tablets, and my bill was 50 baht consultation fee, and 120 baht for the Tramadol, total 170 baht.

1 baht per tablet. How do they even make a profit on that

[Formaleins]

1 hour ago, blackhorse said:

1 hour ago, Thaiwrath said:

I go to the Government Hospital every 4 months for follow up appointments following ACDF surgery.
At my last appointment, 2 months ago, I requested 120 Tramadol, to last me until my next appointment at the end of November. The specialist obliged, prescribed 120 tablets, and my bill was 50 baht consultation fee, and 120 baht for the Tramadol, total 170 baht.

1 baht per tablet. How do they even make a profit on that

That is the point of the Govt. hospitals, they are not really there to make a profit. However, that is an extremely good price. Normally you do not get the "real" Tramadol from those hospitals, usually it is something generic like "Paindol"

 

I have been taking (3 per day prescribed) 4 or 5 caps daily for 8 months, and trying to get off these and get them out of my system is killing me! They have a terrible effect, if I do not take one in 8 hours they knock me for 6, to the point I cannot even walk downstairs, they make you totally zombified, but you cannot sleep, it is like the living dead. It takes me over a week to get it out of my system. But then if the pain starts again I am forced to take them and then I am back at square one. Really good for pain but a nightmare to give up.

[blackhorse]

That is the point of the Govt. hospitals, they are not really there to make a profit. However, that is an extremely good price. Normally you do not get the "real" Tramadol from those hospitals, usually it is something generic like "Paindol"
If you think you are getting fakes, try taking 6 of those 50mG yellow/green caps before you go to bed. If you can get out of bed feeling "normal"  the next day then they are fake.
 
I have been taking (3 per day prescribed) 4 or 5 caps daily for 8 months, and trying to get off these and get them out of my system is killing me! They have a terrible effect, if I do not take one in 8 hours they knock me for 6, to the point I cannot even walk downstairs, they make you totally zombified, but you cannot sleep, it is like the living dead. It takes me over a week to get it out of my system. But then if the pain starts again I am forced to take them and then I am back at square one. Really good for pain but a nightmare to give up.

Very true. I've been on 200 to 400 mg daily for 7 years due to nerve pain along with a cocktail of other pain killers so it's for life however what many don't know is its also a very efficient anti depressant although not classified as one

That in particular makes it very difficult to stop taking them after extended use

[YogaVeg]

3 hours ago, Colabamumbai said:

Best taken with Acetaminophen, that is why it is in Ultracet.

Acetaminophen is aslo added to opiodes to discourage drug abuse. Google it. 

The problem with this method of drug control is the acetaminophen then becomes the most dangerous compound of the drug.

Edited October 5, 2018 by YogaVeg

[digger70]

19 minutes ago, blackhorse said:

Very true. I've been on 200 to 400 mg daily for 7 years due to nerve pain along with a cocktail of other pain killers so it's for life however what many don't know is its also a very efficient anti depressant although not classified as one

That in particular makes it very difficult to stop taking them after extended use

U doing great I am on 450 mg Tramadol  + 3000 mg Paracetamol per day for the last 10 years  they are still working but it could be better.Must soon look for something better for my Ostioarthraitis.

[seajae]

38 minutes ago, Formaleins said:

That is the point of the Govt. hospitals, they are not really there to make a profit. However, that is an extremely good price. Normally you do not get the "real" Tramadol from those hospitals, usually it is something generic like "Paindol"

If you think you are getting fakes, try taking 6 of those 50mG yellow/green caps before you go to bed. If you can get out of bed feeling "normal"  the next day then they are fake.

 

I have been taking (3 per day prescribed) 4 or 5 caps daily for 8 months, and trying to get off these and get them out of my system is killing me! They have a terrible effect, if I do not take one in 8 hours they knock me for 6, to the point I cannot even walk downstairs, they make you totally zombified, but you cannot sleep, it is like the living dead. It takes me over a week to get it out of my system. But then if the pain starts again I am forced to take them and then I am back at square one. Really good for pain but a nightmare to give up.

I used "cookies" to help me get off them after almost 20 years(400mg a day plus plus endone when needed for really bad pain), took me ages to get down to just 50mg at night so I could sleep but couldnt stop till a mate told me to try eating a "cookie" or part of one before going to bed, worked a treat and I was finally off them after a few weeks

 

Edited October 5, 2018 by seajae

[YogaVeg]

4 minutes ago, digger70 said:

U doing great I am on 450 mg Tramadol  + 3000 mg Paracetamol per day for the last 10 years  they are still working but it could be better.Must soon look for something better for my Ostioarthraitis.

Like big doses of natural tumeric/curcumin and fish oils.

Edited October 5, 2018 by YogaVeg

[digger70]

1 minute ago, YogaVeg said:

Like big doses of natural tumeric/curcumin and fish oils.

Does that work too?  

[oobar]

11 minutes ago, YogaVeg said:

Acetaminophen is aslo added to opiodes to discourage drug abuse. Google it. 

The problem with this method of drug control is the acetaminophen then becomes the most dangerous compound of the drug.

This is very, very true.  Except for developing a tolerance and an opioid habit, tramadol is safe for long-term use, but NSAIDs, such as ibuprofen and acetaminophen taken with it, can pretty much destroy your kidneys.

Edited October 5, 2018 by oobar
comma

[Thian]

I only buy from pharmacies in the biggest malls and ask them for western brands...when they give it i ask for the description in english which western brands supply with their medicines. When they can show me the english description i assume it's real.

 

 

[YogaVeg]

49 minutes ago, digger70 said:

Does that work too?  

Yes, please research naturopathic remedies and benefits of turmeric, fish oils, and anti-inflammatory diets.

It'll change your life! This simple inexpensive book was where I began: https://www.amazon.com/Anti-Inflammation-Diet-Recipe-Book-Arthritis/dp/0897934857

[Coota]

1 hour ago, Formaleins said:

That is the point of the Govt. hospitals, they are not really there to make a profit. However, that is an extremely good price. Normally you do not get the "real" Tramadol from those hospitals, usually it is something generic like "Paindol"

 

I have been taking (3 per day prescribed) 4 or 5 caps daily for 8 months, and trying to get off these and get them out of my system is killing me! They have a terrible effect, if I do not take one in 8 hours they knock me for 6, to the point I cannot even walk downstairs, they make you totally zombified, but you cannot sleep, it is like the living dead. It takes me over a week to get it out of my system. But then if the pain starts again I am forced to take them and then I am back at square one. Really good for pain but a nightmare to give up.

I know the feeling, I have been fighting Tramadol addiction for about 3 years since I had a disc fusion in Oz about  5 years ago. I had the good stuff in Oz, Codeine 30mg but couldn't get it here when I moved here. So I sourced Tramadol that I got for 50 baht a strip, the green and gold ones, 50mg. Was taking up to 250 mg a day at times then I would ween myself off them only to find myself back on them after a day or 2 of being clean.  They made me feel normal and gave me a bit of a buzz especially when mixed with a few beers. The pills were ruling my life and I was displaying all the behaviour of an addict.  I bit the bullet  2 weeks ago and weened myself off them again, went through a lot of hellish days but am finally off them now for 6 days. I still am tempted but as I'm starting to feel normal again without taking the pills I'll hopefully stay off them for ever. 

Edited October 5, 2018 by Coota

[Coota]

1 hour ago, digger70 said:

U doing great I am on 450 mg Tramadol  + 3000 mg Paracetamol per day for the last 10 years  they are still working but it could be better.Must soon look for something better for my Ostioarthraitis.

Digger, I can't believe you are taking that much Tramadol, I was addicted but I drew the line at 250 mg per day.  Do you have any health issues from taking that amount for so long?  Plus, 400 mg is the recommended maximum daily dose, do you get the urge to take more than that? 

[how241]

Like any drug,  just slowly reduce the dosage.  You can open them up and pour out a little as you go from 200mg, 175, 150, 125, 100...Give 3-4 days between each lower dosage as you won't really notice it...Of course,  there is the mental aspect too,  so you might think you notice a big difference...

[timkeen08]

Tramadol is a synthetic opioid medication that does not have a base opium content and is not a derivative of opium.  Tramadol works on the brain and central nervous system receptors triggering the neurotransmitters serotonin and norepinephrine.  Tramadol has been used to treat opiate addiction.  I am not saying that it cannot be dangerous if used unwisely but that it does not contain opium.  I use 100mg every morning and sometimes another 50 mg if needed throughout the day if my pain becomes worse but it never makes me sleepy.  It definitely does not take the place of the 10 mg Percocet that I was taking in America and that is what is so dangerous about Tramadol since it is not as effective.  If I take Tramadol later in the day or evening it does cause me trouble going to sleep so that is something I avoid.  I have had to increase my dosage over the last year from my original 50mg dose every morning for the same pain relief.  I purchase my Tramadol from a government certified chain pharmacy that enters my purchases in a log book and restricts the purchase of two 10-packs every two weeks.  The trick is that my wife also makes a purchase and we go to the big city often every month anyway (she does occasionally use a Tramadol for major pain).  I maintain a stash just in case they crack down and take them off the market like they did last year.  If needed, this gives me plenty to handle a slow reduction to stop and some left to then use 50mg for those occasional days that the pain has increased more than normal.  Always use addictive drugs or any medication with caution.  Opiates are not the only medication that has serious addiction possibilities, varied serious withdrawal symptoms, and have precautions against sudden stop.  Although the doctors nor pharmacists here inform you or check for any medication interactions.  I have had only one doctor here to ask for a list of my medications.

[Lacessit]

I try to bring in my meds each time from Australia. Even though they are more expensive, I would trust only hospital pharmacies here.

[Lacessit]

OP said " Any methods of testing?"

Not unless you have access to a laboratory with instruments such as GC/MS, FTIR and LC. Plus the expertise to run them. Medications are very complex molecules/compounds.

[Coota]

There are other threads on this subject on this Forum, I believe, that are quite lengthy and have some bad stories of Tramadol addiction.  

[blackhorse]

There are other threads on this subject on this Forum, I believe, that are quite lengthy and have some bad stories of Tramadol addiction.  

There is a big difference between addiction and dependancy though. Many of us are on it for life and it would be pointless to stop unless pain is your thing

[Lacessit]

2 hours ago, blackhorse said:

2 hours ago, Coota said:

There are other threads on this subject on this Forum, I believe, that are quite lengthy and have some bad stories of Tramadol addiction.  

There is a big difference between addiction and dependancy though. Many of us are on it for life and it would be pointless to stop unless pain is your thing

I don't disagree with improving one's quality of life. However, perhaps you could explain the distinction between addiction and dependency.