BREAKING NEWS British Embassy statement on income letters: Officials knew about problems in May and say that US nationals will also be affected

[theguyfromanotherforum]

23 minutes ago, NCC1701A said:

it is odd... many people say Transfer wise is cheap.  But when I looked at their costs they wanted $98.00 USD to transfer $5000.00. $45 is what my US Bank charges. And even that is expensive.

 

Did you bother to check the exchange rate you would get from your bank?

 

[Rod the Sod]

I am really amazed at the mindset of many of the posters here:

 

1. There seems to be a view that having worked the system for years and being of no identifiable trouble to the Thai authorities they should have a right to stay here. Bu**sh*t

2. The Embassy is not just verifying pension payments but maybe dividends, rental income, matrimony payments etc. Would they pay TB50k for their letter if the Embassy was to set up an investigative department and actually charge for the work involved?

3. If Thailand is sooooo bad why the hell are you here? Go home and vote for Corbyn and then see what misery really looks like.

4. They want to live here, enjoy the benefits but "for one reason or another" want to keep their finances separated from their new home country. No, come clean and comply!!

 

The Thai Government set up a scheme that welcomes people who fit a certain criteria. The majority of the posters never did fit this criteria and are now whinging because the requirements are at long last being implemented. Basically many are here illegally but argue they are no trouble Gov, so we have a right to stay.

 

If you don't like it or cannot fit the criteria go somewhere else where you fit in and stop the good name of the people who do everything and pay everything to comply being rubbished.

 

I await the barrage of abuse.....

[tropo]

4 hours ago, poohy said:

Thanks oh Great British embassy for throwing us under the bus!

the fact you have known since May does in no way help you!

 

complete and utter wasters 

I think they could be throwing everyone under a bus. If the UK and US Embassies don't issue income letters, Thai immigration may change the rules for everyone. Maybe the US Embassy was getting close to doing this and the UK beat them to it.

[flexomike]

2 hours ago, sqwakvfr said:

As an American I am cofused?  So The British Embassy is now announcing the future actions of the American Embassy? I have an appointment next to get the Income Affidavit.  Should I cancel my appointment?  

please ask them about the future of these statements, I have to go in March and would like to prepare for the worsrt

[Wanderlust]

1 minute ago, theguyfromanotherforum said:

 

Did you bother to check the exchange rate you would get from your bank?

 

To be fair, the fees TW charge for USD transfers are quite a bit higher - 0.85% + $2, compared to 0.55% + £1.50 for GBP. However you are right about the rates, all the banks screw you on them, and I have also found that I do not get charged a fee at the Thai end with TW either. When you take those things into account TW is quite a bit cheaper, particularly for smaller amounts.

[EricTh]

It's high time that UK and US embassies plug up these loopholes.

 

I doubt the embassy clerks there bother to check any of the income sources and just approve the SD. I am sure there are genuine cases but they seem to be the minority.

 

They should also close the loopholes in other countries. It's just not fair to others.

 

 

 

[imaderbyfan]

3 hours ago, chudless said:

Why is a problem? Just show your cash in  a Thai bank, sorted. Furore over nothing.

So....how do I do that if I use a no fee credit card issued in the UK, take from ATM's and pay it off using my online banking, incurring no interest and an on the day Mastercard rate?

It works for me, and I therefore rely on the Embassy letter....

[bobbin]

After 2 days of reading the associated threads on this issue, I want to comment...

 

First of all, I want to state that my faith in humanity and basic decency has been re-affirmed.. not. I'm talking about several posters in these threads, not the British Embassy or Thai Immigration

 

All of the smug posters decrying "poor" expats as people who don't belong  here make me nauseous.. People old enough to be discussing retirement issues should be old enough and have enough life experience to know that nothing in this world is conveniently black or white. Some people may have been abusing this method, while others are simply using one of the 3 options available to satisfy Thai Immigration. Consider the expat who has purchased a condominium, a motorcycle and or a car. This is certainly an example of FDI (Foreign Direct Investment). As such, and for however long they have been here, they are injecting, as a group and as individuals, "new" offshore funds.  Having made relatively large investments that significantly reduce their monthly expenses, they are now being, at this point, forced to come up with a significant additional financial surety.

 

Secondly, none of the affected individuals is costing the Thai Government money in the form of State-funded assistance. Not possible..because there is no such assistance. They are all self-funded, no matter the source of such funds. No harm, no foul.

 

Thirdly, the British Embassy should be ashamed of themselves for sitting on this information for approximately 4 months before dropping this "oh, by the way" bombshell without announcing well in advance the change in policy. A complete fail, but not a surprising one, given the official attitude to Brits in Europe affected by the pending Brexit.

 

Fourthly, this is a Thai "story" on a grand scale. Makes all those posts we have read over the years of Westerners being shown the door in their personal relationships after their period of maximum usefulness has expired, seem like merely an appetizer.

 

Out with the old, In with the new.

 

Nihao...

[dontoearth]

2 hours ago, Jip99 said:

 

 

You really think Thai Immigration will accept an unfamiliar piece of paper purporting to be a bank statement ?

 

It is Thai Immigration who insisted on the embassy “verifying” income..... which they are not prepared to do.

     I think you understand the problem.  Thai immigration would have no way to verify or check foreign bank account statements so they are demanding the embassy do it.  The embassy realizes it would be a total nightmare to verify those papers so they just refused.  Retirement visa holders left stranded.  

[NCC1701A]

1 minute ago, theguyfromanotherforum said:

 

Did you bother to check the exchange rate you would get from your bank?

 

I send USD and Bangkok Bank does the exchange. It has always been a good rate. Someone just said that Transferwise is more expensive for Americans and the more you send the more it costs. not the case with my US banks. one flat fee. I transfer $5000-$10000 at a time.  Maybe Transfer wise is good for sending small amounts.      

[Ratt Thai]

4 minutes ago, Rod the Sod said:

If you don't like it or cannot fit the criteria go somewhere else where you fit in and stop the good name of the people who do everything and pay everything to comply being rubbished.

 

The rules did not change... they are just enforcing them now to "catch" those who like to bent some simple rules.... If you faked your proof of income then the time has come to worry...
Lets wait what really going to be... what proof of income they accept besides the income letter of the embassy...

[marcusarelus]

31 minutes ago, garyk said:

It is a scam by the banks and government to bring in money IMO.

for 800K you can easily bring in over 100 US dollars a month in a secure money market account.

Easily done. I do it without any problems at all.

Thais paying British gov? 

[zzaa09]

9 minutes ago, zydeco said:

I doubt that the British embassy speaks for the US government or State Department.  Frankly, they're being presumptuous. 

Well.....from personal gathered info of the last couple of days - The American authorities in Thailand have no intentions or plans to follow suit per current British policy. 

 

Remaining the same, for now.

[imaderbyfan]

3 hours ago, chudless said:

Clearly I have as it shows those who can barely afford to live here with no cash reserves are scared sh*tless. No sympathy at all. 

There are many ways to fund ones lifestyle......

many chose the monthly income route which was until now easily done.

At this late juncture the carpet has been pulled from under the feet of these people.

And the 800,000 baht in the bank route is not so quickly , or maybe impossible to achieve.

[EricTh]

10 minutes ago, dontoearth said:

     I think you understand the problem.  Thai immigration would have no way to verify or check foreign bank account statements so they are demanding the embassy do it.  The embassy realizes it would be a total nightmare to verify those papers so they just refused.  Retirement visa holders left stranded.  

 

Thai immigration assumed that the embassies would give a thorough check in the past until somebody woke Thai immigration up.

 

Yes, for majority of the cases, it's impossible to check unless you are getting government pension and even that takes a few days or weeks, I think.

 

But I don't think most government pension goes up to 65k per month. 

[marcusarelus]

7 minutes ago, imaderbyfan said:

So....how do I do that if I use a no fee credit card issued in the UK, take from ATM's and pay it off using my online banking, incurring no interest and an on the day Mastercard rate?

It works for me, and I therefore rely on the Embassy letter....

How much have you lost or are going to lose Thai baht vs pound sterling? 

[theguyfromanotherforum]

3 minutes ago, NCC1701A said:

I send USD and Bangkok Bank does the exchange. It has always been a good rate. Someone just said that Transferwise is more expensive for Americans and the more you send the more it costs. not the case with my US banks. one flat fee. I transfer $5000-$10000 at a time.  Maybe Transfer wise is good for sending small amounts.      

 

Nope, it's better all around.

 

I do a lot of transfers and I have saved literally thousands of dollars last year over using a bank.

 

Get verified and try it once. Do the same amount of transfer with your bank and transferwise and you will see. Transferwise is a peer to peer exchange, so this is why they don't make money on exchange rates. They only charge a transfer fee.

[evadgib]

1 hour ago, Bangkok Barry said:

 

And The British Embassy clearly has no interest in spending its time satisfying Thai bureaucracy. Why should they? If the Thais want the info let them find it.  As they say, Thai Immigration is able to verify the income in a Thai bank account. What the Thai government demands really has nothing to do with the British Embassy.

Bang on ???? Pity the majority can't grasp it.

[Nyezhov]

I had this long post written but emotions are running high so Ill just make these three points.

 

1. The US Embassy is required to Notarize that which is put in front of them as long as the requirements are met, ie identity and swearing.

 

2. The Thais are not going to screw with US retirees or indeed most US citizens.

 

3. I have an appointment next week and will ask them.,

 

[metisdead]

An inflammatory post and a reply has been removed:

 

7) You will respect fellow members and post in a civil manner. No personal attacks, hateful or insulting towards other members, (flaming) Stalking of members on either the forum or via PM will not be allowed.

 

A Trump troll post has been removed. 

[Shouldhaveknownbetter]

Just now, sqwakvfr said:

As an American I am cofused?  So The British Embassy is now announcing the future actions of the American Embassy? I have an appointment next to get the Income Affidavit.  Should I cancel my appointment?  

I just renewed my retirement Visa.  Chiang Mai Consulate issued the income affidavit and I brought 6 months of bank statements showing incoming transfers and had no problems..

[dontoearth]

3 minutes ago, EricTh said:

 

Thai immigration assumed that the embassies would give a thorough check in the past until somebody woke Thai immigration up.

 

Yes, for majority of the cases, it's impossible to check unless you are getting government pension. But I dont think government pension goes up to 65k per month. 

  In the US the embassy would not be allowed to check government pensions either.  All of the various income statements would have to be supplied by the individual applying or a sign-off letter giving the embassy power of attorney to exam govt. pensions, bank accounts, etc.   It is just way to complicated.  Our major pension Social Security top range is close to 2K or 65K baht but very few qualify for that much monthly payment, perhaps 5% of the pensioners would get that much.  Then the embassy or thai govt. is left trying to verify private pension letters.  Something even banks are not too skilled at doing from the amount of worldwide fraud that takes place.

[Jingthing]

3 minutes ago, Shouldhaveknownbetter said:

I just renewed my retirement Visa.  Chiang Mai Consulate issued the income affidavit and I brought 6 months of bank statements showing incoming transfers and had no problems..

To a Thai bank or U.S. bank?

Did they require the statements or did you present them without being asked?

[tropo]

22 minutes ago, zydeco said:

I doubt that the British embassy speaks for the US government or State Department.  Frankly, they're being presumptuous. 

This is not the concern. If one or two embassies stop issuing income letters, it's how Thai immigration decides to proceed in a situation where a large number of expats will need to use other methods. I don't think Thai immigration will be interested in serving certain nationalities differently than others. It just makes it too complicated for them.

[TallGuyJohninBKK]

7 minutes ago, EricTh said:

 I am sure there are genuine cases but they seem to be the minority.

 

You're making the presumption that many, or the majority, of people seeking income affidavits are lying or don't have the income they're claiming. You have absolutely no basis for making that presumption.

 

Also, as has already been made clear here before, the U.S. Embassy staff are NOT verifying anything about income. They're verifying that their citizens have made a legal declaration to the Embassy of a receiving a certain amount of monthly income from outside Thailand. And all along, if Immigration had any doubts about the truthfulness of those declarations, they were and are perfectly able to demand backup documentation. Can't provide it upon request? No extension of stay.

 

All of this strikes me as just another example of the anti-foreigner ethos that's been coming out of the current government for quite some time now, including having a Tourist Police chief (and now Immigration chief) who was more interested in arresting and threatening foreigners than he ever was in helping foreigners who found themselves victims of crimes or other troubles in Thailand, which supposedly was one of the primary missions of the Tourist Police, at least in the past.

 

[EricTh]

2 minutes ago, dontoearth said:

    It is just way to complicated.  Our major pension Social Security top range is close to 2K or 65K baht but very few qualify for that much monthly payment, 

 

Sorry. The difference between 2K and 65K is huge, so which is it?

 

If they are in the top range, most probably they don't need to live in a foreign country where everything is different.

[dufusdonald]

2 minutes ago, Jingthing said:

To a Thai bank or U.S. bank?

Did they require the statements or did you present them without being asked?

And how much is the letter fee? 

[zydeco]

39 minutes ago, Suradit69 said:

 

I question the propriety of one embassy announcing something on behalf of another embassy. If nothing else it demonstrates that British diplomats (if that's not gilding the dandelion) lack diplomacy.

Not to mention Thai Visa's action.  They should have contacted the US embassy for comment as they did with other embassies or not published an unconfirmed rumor. 

[Derek B]

4 hours ago, SkyNets said:

So just get a print out from your Thai bank showing your pension payments. Whats the problem, unless you have been lying.....

Then expect to be liable for paying Thai income tax.

[Spidey]

1 hour ago, TallGuyJohninBKK said:

 

I can't speak for the UK, but for the U.S., there are VERY few and limited options for Americans to make international fund transfers to Thailand without paying not insignificant bank international transfer fees -- both on the sending end in the U.S., and then on the receiving end by the Thai banks when they handle currency conversion.

 

And this just so happens to be coming at the same time that one of the most popular and economical international transfer methods used by Americans -- the Bangkok Bank NY branch ACH method -- is shutting down that service next April because of banking regulations.

 

 

I've already described the method I use in another thread but here goes:

 

I have a Halifax Clarity CC (Mastercard). It incurs no extra overseas charges.

 

I go to the local branch of my Thai Bank, withdraw the required amount on my CC and deposit it in my Thai bank account. I then go home and pay my CC off online. 5 minutes to transfer money from my UK account to my Thai account and zero bank charges.