USA income affidavit

[onera1961]

6 hours ago, billd766 said:

No. Dutch embassy requires proof if income.

I think embassy letters will be accepted if it's issued after income verification. But most embassies don't verify income and Thai immigration knows about those embassies, I guess. I knew an American, living on free foods and with 6OO USD monthly income from his savings, waiting to collect another 600 baht in SS when he will be 62. Those were the days and it is not going to be easy for him. 

[garyk]

2 minutes ago, blackhorse said:

Gee the subprime crisis smashed the real estate sector pretty bad. And people keep saying don't buy in Thailand lol.

May need to look into this a bit deeper. Can foreigners purchase in the USA on tourist visa?

Mine has more than doubled in value the last 15 years! A good solid investment to say the least. It has gone up over 20% in the last two years. I live in a hot spot in Texas though. 

It is predicted to go up another 11% next year. ????

 

[onera1961]

19 minutes ago, blackhorse said:

May need to look into this a bit deeper. Can foreigners purchase in the USA on tourist visa?

I think anybody can buy a house in the US. Opening a bank account may be a problem with current situation but  not impossible. Lots of cheap houses in University towns and most American houses come with at least two bed rooms, often three. If you're a handy man, you can fix them up (if required) and rent them also to university students on a per room basis for a semester contract. Another option is to do a reverse mortgage and you can live on the house (don't have to live year round) till you die. Reverse mortgage will give you some income every month. After your death, they will take your house. You need to be 62. I am not 62 yet. I will look into that once I am 62.

Edited October 24, 2018 by onera1961

[tropo]

6 hours ago, Wake Up said:

Yes and it is also a question on one of the forms I had to fill out. What is your purpose of being in Thailand or something like that. 

The normal extension form asks you the purpose of the extension, to which you answer "retirement". What else would they need to know?

[tropo]

6 hours ago, Expattaff1308 said:

14 hours ago, Wake Up said:

I forgot to mention she also said if I transferred 65 K a month every month  to a thai bank account that she would accept that instead of the 800k in the Thai account. But no more accepted USA embassy verification letters dated after January 1, 2019. 

and she said that this will be acceptable to Immigration?

The IO saying that is why I question her information. I can't see how showing 65k transferred every month is a suitable alternative, and more prone to fiddling than income letters. Also, that leaves a lot of people unable to show a year of transfers if they stop accepting income letters on Jan 1, 2019 - nearly every applicant other than some people who start now and get their extensions next October, or people who rush to their embassies over the next 2 months and extend before July.

[tropo]

5 hours ago, david555 said:

I know , when 10 years ago I came first condo Viewtalay 5 25000 baht /month , now you can easily find same for 15000 and even lower ….. same with the condo resales , not for the new ones , unless after a 2 years as I see now even those are dumping prices 

I just keep my eye on those few locations only I prefer and 1 is on FS...., but I think to give it until august passing ????

Stick around. If 800k in bank becomes the only method to retire, the rental prices will sink much lower still.

[blackhorse]

Stick around. If 800k in bank becomes the only method to retire, the rental prices will sink much lower still.

Lol. You think the income method retirees are going to dump condos. Common sense tells you they don't even have 800k let alone property gurus...Oh the irony in your own post that you can't even see.. Excuse me while I have a 5 minute belly laugh [emoji23]

 

Even if every one of the 3 thousand brits was a landlord it's hardly going to be a blimp on the real estate radar.

 

Just another of thousands of threads predicting the baht to implode, tourism to fail and of course the real estate bubble to burst

 

Wake up. AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN

 

 

[Scott]

Off-topic posts and replies removed.  

[tropo]

39 minutes ago, blackhorse said:

Lol. You think the income method retirees are going to dump condos. Common sense tells you they don't even have 800k let alone property gurus...Oh the irony in your own post that you can't even see.. Excuse me while I have a 5 minute belly laugh

 

Even if every one of the 3 thousand brits was a landlord it's hardly going to be a blimp on the real estate radar.

 

Just another of thousands of threads predicting the baht to implode, tourism to fail and of course the real estate bubble to burst

 

Wake up. AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN

 

 

Have a 30-minute belly laugh for all I care - wipe yourself out. If you took off your blinders you may comprehend what could happen if thousands of expats start leaving. I'm talking about expats that rent condos, not ones who own them... and I'm mainly considering areas where the density of expats is high (Pattaya) where there's already a glut of condos for sale and rent on the market.

 

I'm also not talking about Brits, but ALL expats from all nations. You need to wake up, as clearly YOU'RE the one who is sleeping.

 

 

 

 

 

[Mike Teavee]

13 hours ago, garyk said:

This is all pretty doggy IMO. You can get SS pension verification letters from SS. You can get verification letters from independent retirement accounts. Not only that you can show the funds being deposited into your account abroad. 

Which proves 65K or over minimum ballance. 

This is nothing more than a money grab from the financial institutions. Thai government to help shore up the system.

Nothing to do with anything else.

I know of no other country that requires you to actually put money in an account in that country to qualify for a retirement visa? 

If someone know of another country that requires this pleas let me know!

 

Not all countries in Asia offer "Retirement" visas but I would say most that do (Indonesia being the only one I can think of that doesn't except the > $3,600pa rent) have financial limits... 2 in Asia spring to mind... 

• Philippines (SRRV) - $20,000 US
• Malaysia (MM2H)  3.5Million MYR or 150,000 MYR + 10,000 MYR monthly income) 

Name me places that don't need to show money in the bank.

 

[assayer]

15 hours ago, wgdanson said:

As some people I know were doing exactly that with their UK bank 'income'. That is why the BE have said they cannot 'verify' the incomes, but the Thai IO want them to. 

If as Sirieou and you are saying, retirees are simply withdrawing and depositing the same 65,000 baht each month and therefore cheating on the income requirements could I ask what they are to use to buy their food, pay their rent, put fuel in their vehicles, etc, etc each and every month they live here?

My personal experience for the cost of living in Thailand is that I use nearly all of the 65,000 each month for these expenses, so I can not be doing what you say.

[gaviny]

Why only 2 nations? Does this not mean Aussies stat decs will be stopped as well? Indeed all nationalities retiring here should be treated equally?

I do think Australia will be included also if this poster was informed correctly and that would make sense because I couldn't understand why UK was singled out initially.

Sent from my Redmi Note 6 Pro using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

[garyk]

2 hours ago, Mike Teavee said:

Not all countries in Asia offer "Retirement" visas but I would say most that do (Indonesia being the only one I can think of that doesn't except the > $3,600pa rent) have financial limits... 2 in Asia spring to mind... 

• Philippines (SRRV) - $20,000 US
• Malaysia (MM2H)  3.5Million MYR or 150,000 MYR + 10,000 MYR monthly income) 

Name me places that don't need to show money in the bank.

 

Sure,

Mexico is one. Actually if an American you don't even need a visa. You can drive your own car across the border and stay 180 days with no problems, turn around come back across the border then go back for another 180 days. I head down to the Yucatan and have never had any problems. Show about 1600 dollars a month SS check and get up to four years and at the end of four years you automatically qualify for residency. 

Colombia, only show prof of income from SS. If you can handle the bland food, and like the women there? 

Peru, another one.

Actually Thailand is another one at the moment. Sounds like it will change? But, at the moment all you have to do is have a pension of 65K or more and you can stay here.

I am sure there are many more. Those three I have looked into personally. Actually I have been traveling a lot south of the border as I get older. Much closer for me to get home, no jet lag. Just a much more pleasant experience as i get older.

 

The problem is I have developed some ties in Thailand that will be difficult for me to break. But, I am one of the people that do not invest here what so ever, other than having an old pickup I bought 10 years ago. So loosing money is not a concern for me.

 

The people that sold out in America and came here to retire, bought homes and invested heavily here are the people that will have to put up with the new rules. But, I am sure they have the funds and can stay without any problems.

 

Regards

 

 

Edited October 25, 2018 by garyk

[quandow]

I contacted the U.S. embassy about this. Their paraphrased response "Don't know, don't care. Not our job."

[Thaidream]

4 minutes ago, quandow said:

contacted the U.S. embassy about this. Their paraphrased response "Don't know, don't care. Not our job."

So are you saying they are still issuing the Letters and they have no information from Thai Imm that they will not accept them?

[garyk]

6 minutes ago, quandow said:

I contacted the U.S. embassy about this. Their paraphrased response "Don't know, don't care. Not our job."

I believe it.

I was traveling to India a few years ago and my retirement visa had to be re-newed. I went to the embassy and gave them my visa. They said it needed to be replaced????? I told them and showed them I had a visa for India and plane tickets. They did not care and took it and would not give it back. I had to expedite a new visa, it was expensive and very stressful. 

They did not care in the least!

[Vacuum]

14 hours ago, onera1961 said:

Yes, when police can demand urine sample on the street, tries to track your every movement (by 90-day reporting which is not uniform across all immigration office), controls the Web, tries to monitor social media sites, bans e-cigarette, etc. etc. I can give many more examples, for me it is a police state.

Just curious, why are you here if you detest it so much? Speaking of "tracking", "control of the web", "monitor social media sites", I'm sure that doesn't happen in 'the land of the free'...

[quandow]

6 minutes ago, Thaidream said:

So are you saying they are still issuing the Letters and they have no information from Thai Imm that they will not accept them?

Again - "Don't know, don't care. Not our job to provide this information."

[RichardColeman]

Whole thing seems daft. If you need to have 800,000 baht in the bank 3 months, you could quite easily get together with 3 friends (who only have say 270,000) and every 3 months move the money to the account of the next friend in line wating the visa, thereby all clubbing together. Space the visa application on 4 month intevals and you have 3 people living in Thailand that have shown the amount in the bank legitimately who may be on considerably less than 65k a month.

[Thaidream]

1 minute ago, RichardColeman said:

Whole thing seems daft. If you need to have 800,000 baht in the bank 3 months, you could quite easily get together with 3 friends (who only have say 270,000) and every 3 months move the money to the account of the next friend in line wating the visa, thereby all clubbing together. Space the visa application on 4 month intevals and you have 3 people living in Thailand that have shown the amount in the bank legitimately who may be on considerably less than 65k a month.

Of course or use an agent who will put money into your account for a fee which is acceptable according to several posters.

[DJ54]

Is this pertaining to CW only adding requirements they feel necessary? Or will flow to all immigration offices. 

 

I will I’ll try to contact the office I go to.

 

OP thanks for the post

[Thaidream]

1 minute ago, DJ54 said:

s this pertaining to CW only adding requirements they feel necessary? Or will flow to all immigration offices. 

 

I will I’ll try to contact the office I go to.

 

OP thanks for the post

Unknown at this time- only one report from CW.  No other Embassies have out out info.  No new info on US Embassy website.

Please report back what you find out re acceptance of embassy letters etc.

[thailand49]

Not saying this immigration official is wrong. My experience living here and as recent as April of this year speaking English and Comprehending it are too different things with Thais here.

Many officials I have sat down with who speaks some English enjoy talking and providing their so call wisdom but the more they talk you break it down in your head it is loaded with question marks. It is power they have over you they do it because they can but do they actually know what the rumors are all about?

Here officials throw out smoke and mirrors right now seem to be the case since two Embassy seem to be in cloud nine without any conclusion.

As I noted in the Brit conversation someone walks into your office makes a accusation or note a problem but provide no evidence or solution. Whatever has been required by the Thai Government in the past this process is outline by them not any Embassy. Personally, not surprise of the response from the American Embassy generally it would be a rude response but in all the years I've been going to the Embassy for my letter every Thai or American has been profession in our conversation. You want rude glad you aren't trying to get a Visa for your love ones. I hope this was the response they gave the Thai official who they met and made the claim. I'm very curious whether the Embassy is verifying the income or not what are the numbers that causes the government to question the verification?

By the numbers?  you take the hundred if not thousands of applicants for these letter the U.S. it runs 1550 baht or $50.00 USD easy money for any Embassy? Thais, aren't stupid?  now required these applicants to put 800,000 baht untouched for 3 months before 3 months after? Banks anywhere make good use of this money and turn around giving you minimum interest for it's use. Or now as suggested they want you to show a 65,000 deposit each month into a Thai Bank, which in the U.S. they want every retiree living in Thailand to most likely deposit their Social Security/401/IRA/retired company source income to their HQ Bangkok Bank in New York, that could be a huge sum of money for any bank institution. If I was a member of the Bank of Thailand, sat down with the Immigration official and told him if you can scratch our backs we will scratch yours. The amount of money that can be made is crazy so greasing a few palms is nothing here.

To me at least there is some motive to this madness, someone walks into your office makes a accusation then walks out not leaving any real solutions except put it in a Thai bank?  I wonder if they made the same accusation at the China Embassy since everyone seem to walk out wearing not only a brown uniform but brown on their face.

 

 

Edited October 25, 2018 by thailand49

[Moonfire]

The request for a map to the house has been a common request for me every year for the last 5 years.  I use a verification letter, when I go to the US embassy I take my tax returns. They never ask, but in my thinking it is the easiest way to verify your income. In the US if you wish to loan money from the bank, it is the document the bank will want. To fix this verification issue just require showing your tax returned to the embassy; but that might just be too simple. 

[watgate]

You would think with all the problems the thai government is having with the lessening of chinese tourists to Thailand, they would not even consider creating onerous new regulations for long stays in Thailand. I get a pension and social security from the US and would have no problem whatsoever furnishing documentation to immigration at my annual retirement extension to show I meet the income limits for my retirement extension. In fact I always questioned how I could get an income affidavit from the US Consulate without verifying my income but, nevertheless that was how it was done so I followed the rules. What I would have a big problem with is if I have to now transfer 65k each month into Thailand. This would be expensive and quite cumbersome and would not like to have to do this. I have funds at my disposal which I can access on an as needed basis and my documentation showing my income should be sufficient to comply with the income limits. Also seeing as how I do not reside in Thailand full-time ( I usually stay between 8- 10 months each year) and then go back to the US i would not want to deposit 800k in a thai bank acct. What if I decided, at some point, to stop coming to Thailand each year. Would I have difficulty in withdrawing the funds to take back to the US? Would I be able to convert the thai baht back to US dollars or be able to wire the funds back to the US or would the thai bank give me a hard time? Also, if you put 800k in a thai bank it has to season for x number of months so you would be forced to bring or use more money to live here since you couldn't access your bank acct funds while it was seasoning. I also don't want to have to  be concerned about FATCA reporting requirements by having more then 10k usd in a foreign bank acct. While coming here these past 9 years I have helped my g/f and her daughter a great deal but if these onerous changes are implemented then I will either have to try and start obtaining tourist visas and see how that plays out or just stop coming here and go to another country that is more friendlier to retirees and does not place more burdensome restrictions and onerous new policies on retirees.

Edited October 25, 2018 by watgate
fixed a mispelled word

[garyk]

8 minutes ago, watgate said:

You would think with all the problems the thai government is having with the lessening of chinese tourists to Thailand, they would not even consider creating onerous new regulations for long stays in Thailand. I get a pension and social security from the US and would have no problem whatsoever furnishing documentation to immigration at my annual retirement extension to show I meet the income limits for my retirement extension. In fact I always questioned how I could get an income affiidavit from the US Consulate without verifying my income but, nevertheless that was how it was done so I followed the rules. What I would have a big problem with is if I have to now transfer 65k each month into Thailand. This would be expensive and quite cumbersome and would not like to have to do this. I have funds at my disposal which I can access on an as needed basis and my documentation showing my income should be sufficient to comply with the income limits. Also seeing as how I do not reside in Thailand full-time ( I usually stay between 8- 10 months each year) and then go back to the US i would not want to deposit 800k in a thai bank acct. What if I decided, at some point, to stop coming to Thailand each year. Would I have difficulty in withdrawing the funds to take back to the US? Would I be able to convert the thai baht back to US dollars or be able to wire the funds back to the US or would the thai bank give me a hard time? Also, if you put 800k in a thai bank it has to season for x number of months so you would be forced to bring or use more money to live here since you couldn't access your bank acct funds while it was seasoning. I also don't want to have to  be concerned about FATCA reporting requirements by having more then 10k usd in a foreign bank acct. While coming here these past 9 years I have helped my g/f and her daughter a great deal but if these onerous changes are implemented then I will either have to try and start obtaining tourist visas and see how that plays out or just stop coming here and go to another country that is more friendlier to retirees and does not place more burdensome restrictions and onerous new policies on retirees.

Damn you sound like my double.. Lol

Exactly the same here brother. 

IMO they do not want the documentation what so ever, they want the money. This is Thailand... haha

Edited October 25, 2018 by garyk

[stevenl]

13 hours ago, ubonjoe said:

That is what the UK embassy has been doing. They just look at what you give them and do the proof of income.

The statement is different. The Dutch embassy declares the statement verified and true, the UK embassy declares it according to the applicants information and declares the signature true.

[1FinickyOne]

18 hours ago, sirineou said:

 I don't do extensions to stay yet . As I still work outside Thailand and exit the country often enough not to need them, But I Will probably be putting my papers in for retirement next spring and will have to content with the above , so I am following this thread with interest,

   It would be reasonable , and pretty easy, If the above is true. as most   retirees should be receiving Social security and or a pension as it will be the case for me, IMO if someone does not have a monthly income of 65 k one is not ready to retire. 

Hi Sir... yes, this is true but i keep meeting older retirees with very low income and often no savings. 

 

But can you imagine these same people living back in ny or anywhere usa? They get a much better quality of life here but the trade off is no medicare...

 

I understand them wanting to stay and also understand the concerns of our host country...

 

All in all pretty sad stuff. .

[1FinickyOne]

46 minutes ago, RichardColeman said:

Whole thing seems daft. If you need to have 800,000 baht in the bank 3 months, you could quite easily get together with 3 friends (who only have say 270,000) and every 3 months move the money to the account of the next friend in line wating the visa, thereby all clubbing together. Space the visa application on 4 month intevals and you have 3 people living in Thailand that have shown the amount in the bank legitimately who may be on considerably less than 65k a month.

Inevitably one friend will be in a desperate situation and decide they would rather have 800k rather than 3 skint friends... a scheme like that wont last 1 year... even honest people dont always repay debts.. blood from a stone and all that.

[Thaidream]

2 minutes ago, kenk24 said:

cide they would rather have 800k rather than 3 skint friends... a scheme like that wont last 1 year... even honest people dont always repay debts.. blood from a stone and all that.

And then they will  go to agents...what a tangled web.