Norwegian man's death: He had prostate cancer and wanted to stop treatment, Thai media

[Foexie]

I start to have a weird feeling about this. And make me have to many questions.

 

You can not get in somebodies mind at the moment but i wonder what the man had been thinking when he did what is been writen.

 

"Ooh damn i don't want to live anymore. Ok i will first try cut myself in my arms and neck.  Darn that didn't work.

Ok let me use my home made shooting device. "Bang". Sh***t didn't worked either.

Ok what is left? Oh a rope because i just don't wanna jump from the building. "

 

And then there is the thing that he was kept alive with tubes for food and air?

I have seen it before. Peoples who are in that stage they are already (very) weaken.

So how could he still have the strenght to climb up there and bring all the stuff up to the roof.

It looks impossible to do all that in 1 time. So with his condition?!

 

And making the "gun" and get the stuff he needed did also required shopping and building of the thing. So nobody have seen him do that and hide the things?

 

So he did all that too having tubes in his body?

 

And his wife went to CM? The man was, most likely, dying and certainly needed care.

So if she didn't see any of this and didn't (need to) worry so much about his health she probably already went there a while before he even had made up his plans and/or his condition was poor.

 

Can't imagine he did all that alone. Wouldn't be surpriced they found sedatives or something in his blood if they would check.

 

Maybe it is just more simple then all those questions what keep comming in my mind now.

 

Hope he find his peace and happiness now. R.I.P.

 

[pastprime]

That crude gun,was given some thought,no matter how simple. two tubes ,one smaller one inserted into the other,welded to small base plate,attached to two cutting blocks. apparently wounds to his chin area ,gees what was the thinking there,not a hasty  decision

[Krataiboy]

Poor guy. He didn't seem to have many options, and must have been unbelievably desperate to have resorted to knives, a gun and finally a rope to escape his torment.

 

The report says his wife was in Chiang Mai at the time of his death. Did she really leave her stricken spouse  - a terminal cancer victim who relied on tubes to feed and breathe - to cope alone while she was away?  

 

If so, she should count herself extremely fortunate to have benefited from his Will.

 

[Mangkhut]

Its mentioned in norwegian media that this guy had a good bit of money and that he had monitored and had also had threats towards him. 

And the story that he killed himself with 1. Knifecuts in wrists and neck, 2. Shot himself with a gun, 3. Hanged himself out of huge very visible building in Pattaya «to avoid being feed and kept alive with tubes hoses» seems very very doubtful to me...

Edited November 15, 2018 by Mangkhut

[sambum]

6 hours ago, Burma Bill said:

Quote:- "wanted to stop help from tubes for breathing and feeding". Why not just remove these rather than go to such macabre efforts to end his life. RIP.

Would be a bit like drowning yourself slowly - not a nice way to go. And yes  - R.I.P. 

[KhaoYai]

6 hours ago, kannot said:

correct my Dad got it aged 66 died aged 85, i plan to have it removed at 60 as my Grandad also died the same way and age.

Hmmm I wouldn't. You're right that you are in a high risk group because of your family history but if you don't have the disease, the consequences of removal can be very difficult to live with. There is a very high chance of impotence and urinary issues.

 

If you are found to already have the disease - and many have it without ever knowing, removal always poses the risk of cells spreading around the body.  Get checked regularly and if you are found to have it at some stage, you are most likely to have the 'slow growing' variety - you will probably die with it rather than of it.

 

If you still decide on removal, make sure the hospital the carries the procedure out has cryo facilities - they can freeze the gland before removal to lessen the risk of cancer cells escaping. Prostate cancer can occur anywhere in your body once it metastasizes and the most common areas can be even harder to treat.

[Coorupt country]

I have had Prostata cancer, I still live, I still have sex with my gf

He never took his own life, all normal people know  that  

People with less money then him have be killed i this country

He was killed 

I tell all people  never go to country like Thailand , unless you like to have a dangerous life 

[TumblinDice]

11 hours ago, lucjoker said:

if your life is over, dont kill yourself immediately .

In the short time you still have , do something real good.

Wipe out some real bad guy( e.g.Hitler, Pol Pot,.......) , you will be remembered for it. 

POTUS DJT perhaps ????

[Damrongsak]

Years ago when I was a salesman, I had a potential client I would see at trade shows and seminars.  I liked the guy.  Friendly, unassuming and all that. Some time later, after I hadn't seen him around, I asked about him.  He was diagnosed with terminal cancer.  Went out in his back yard and shot himself with a shotgun. 

 

A former boss of mine had a similar experience.  He got to following up on a fellow who wasn't responding to calls or emails.  Turned out, the guy's son got killed in Iraq, so one day he jumped in front of a freight train. 

 

But anyway, the story sounds a bit odd.  There are quick and easier ways to go.

[PhilAtUbon]

16 hours ago, Old Croc said:

Hard to understand why he didn't just jump.

I removed this myself because it was insensitive

Edited November 15, 2018 by PhilAtUbon

[rosst]

13 hours ago, connda said:

I wonder if it would have made a difference if he had the same access to palliative medicines and hospice care as do Western nations?  Given that pathetic lack of end-of-life resources, access to palliative medicine in the amounts needed to adequately alleviate severe pain, given the seeming total lack of compassion or assistance for those at the end of their lives here in Thailand by the government, the doctors or the medical community - short of dying in agony, the only other option is checking out via suicide.  With the aging expat community, suicide to end suffering will probably become more and more commonplace. 

Yes and given the Buddhist ethos, I am surprised that the medical system doesn't have an assisted euthanasia with medical oversight. 

[richard_smith237]

5 hours ago, connda said:

Westerners have a completely different concept of death than Thais.  I'd say most Thai kids I know see dead bodies on a regular basis.  Village funerals can be literally a weekly affair where I live.  Westerners on the other hand shun death. hide it, consider it morbid, don't wish to deal with it, shield their children from the natural states that are unavoidable, and generally fear it. 
Those of you who keep referring to shielding the children are really just expressing your own cultural biases as well as your Western non-acceptance of death being an integral part of living right to the point of missing the significance of the pain of suffering surrounding this man's death.  The 'children' will handle it fine.  This is not the West.

Having lived here for a number of years, I call total bo!!ox on this response... 

 

Because...  if you are correct, you should have no issue with your kids seeing a dead man hanging by the neck from a building....  Your 'children will handle it fine'... I, on the other hand, consider this unacceptable... 

 

Within this context 'culture' is only ever used to explain unacceptable and absurdly flawed behavior many of whom from the host 'culture' themselves are also unable to healthily explain. 

 

This is not 'Western non-acceptance'... it's the just an example of the macabre carelessness an immature society has yet developed the tools to handle with grace. 

 

The only reason it is assumed Thai's handle death differently is as you correctly wrote, that it is unavoidable in its openness, which really means its handled with a degree of 'innocent' clumsiness .

 

All of which does not make it any less intolerable for kids to be exposed to those issues we as intelligent and mature adults deem safe and acceptable for young and developing minds. 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Hummin]

13 hours ago, connda said:

I wonder if it would have made a difference if he had the same access to palliative medicines and hospice care as do Western nations?  Given that pathetic lack of end-of-life resources, access to palliative medicine in the amounts needed to adequately alleviate severe pain, given the seeming total lack of compassion or assistance for those at the end of their lives here in Thailand by the government, the doctors or the medical community - short of dying in agony, the only other option is checking out via suicide.  With the aging expat community, suicide to end suffering will probably become more and more commonplace. 

God sake, he is a Norwegian, he could just have gone home for free treatment! 

[Hummin]

12 hours ago, lucjoker said:

if your life is over, dont kill yourself immediately .

In the short time you still have , do something real good.

Wipe out some real bad guy( e.g.Hitler, Pol Pot,.......) , you will be remembered for it. 

Some see bad in good people, just remember, that good and bad often walk hand in hand ???? Some see Obama as the devil, other see it in Trump! Pick your choice visely. 

[kannot]

3 hours ago, KhaoYai said:

Hmmm I wouldn't. You're right that you are in a high risk group because of your family history but if you don't have the disease, the consequences of removal can be very difficult to live with. There is a very high chance of impotence and urinary issues.

 

If you are found to already have the disease - and many have it without ever knowing, removal always poses the risk of cells spreading around the body.  Get checked regularly and if you are found to have it at some stage, you are most likely to have the 'slow growing' variety - you will probably die with it rather than of it.

 

If you still decide on removal, make sure the hospital the carries the procedure out has cryo facilities - they can freeze the gland before removal to lessen the risk of cancer cells escaping. Prostate cancer can occur anywhere in your body once it metastasizes and the most common areas can be even harder to treat.

Ive read up some on it and I thought  new techniques cut those risks by quite a lot, I will however not jump into it but investigate thoroughly before (if ) I get to that stage, currently I have not got any problem still a  bit too  young.

Yes in both cases it was  slow growing  and he had no problems until the last 12  months of  life.

Those last 12  months however  were not good, catheterized and in excruciating pain every 2-3  minutes, I almost felt if I could I would have shot him myself to help end his  suffering, its really hard to see someone you love go through it and be unable to help.

Ill also look at using a  service such as Dignitas which I think should be available to ALL worldwide.

[soalbundy]

16 hours ago, connda said:

I wonder if it would have made a difference if he had the same access to palliative medicines and hospice care as do Western nations?  Given that pathetic lack of end-of-life resources, access to palliative medicine in the amounts needed to adequately alleviate severe pain, given the seeming total lack of compassion or assistance for those at the end of their lives here in Thailand by the government, the doctors or the medical community - short of dying in agony, the only other option is checking out via suicide.  With the aging expat community, suicide to end suffering will probably become more and more commonplace. 

I agree but I read an article showing that they have just started getting into palliative care which is hopeful. Very sad that there is no easy way out when in great pain even though the drugs are available.

[Old Croc]

15 hours ago, ttrd said:

https://www.cambridge.org/core/journals/the-british-journal-of-psychiatry/article/factors-influencing-the-decision-to-use-hanging-as-a-method-of-suicide-qualitative-study/EB259F432B70A1B4C71E1B842CC13347

From your link:

Results

Hanging was adopted or contemplated for two main reasons: the anticipated nature of a death from hanging; and accessibility. Those favouring hanging anticipated a certain, rapid and painless death with little awareness of dying and believed it was a ‘clean’ method that would not damage the body or leave harrowing images for others. Materials for hanging were easily accessed and respondents considered it ‘simple’ to perform without the need for planning or technical knowledge. Hanging was thus seen as the ‘quickest’ and ‘easiest’ method with few barriers to completion and sometimes adopted despite not being a first choice

 

So many of these reasons do not apply to this guy's actions.

Have you a study that can explain why he went to great pains to dangle himself from one of the tallest buildings in the city instead of just using the nearest tree or cupboard door, or jump?

 

[WM1]

When you die due to health or suicide in Thailand your body putrefies very quickly.  If he wasn't found quickly or he had jumped it would have been much more unsightly.  I can never know why he did it this way but as horrible as the sight of him hanging was, it was easier for all involved to prepare his body for a funeral.  The discussion of how he did it is a natural response from us members but hopefully our compassion for this deceased man overrides all that noise.

 

[georgegeorgia]

18 hours ago, connda said:

I wonder if it would have made a difference if he had the same access to palliative medicines and hospice care as do Western nations?  Given that pathetic lack of end-of-life resources, access to palliative medicine in the amounts needed to adequately alleviate severe pain, given the seeming total lack of compassion or assistance for those at the end of their lives here in Thailand by the government, the doctors or the medical community - short of dying in agony, the only other option is checking out via suicide.  With the aging expat community, suicide to end suffering will probably become more and more commonplace. 

you mean the palliative care where they stop all fluids and let you dehydrate, where they let you choke to death...no thanks!!!

 

I watched my parents die of cancer in these so called western palliative care units where patients were skin and bones, no thanks 

[bristolgeoff]

we know the reason why he did it now,he knew his days were numbered RIP  now

[pastprime]

The guy wanted to make a statement...'look at me'  easier suicides,less noticeable  ,hose up to his car exhaust,...well we all looked and saw

[freebyrd]

On 11/15/2018 at 10:41 AM, Old Croc said:

Hard to understand why he didn't just jump.

I suppose this way at least he didn't kill anyone walking by. Very sad way to go. As we've become a 'civilized' world, there should be a pill available for a peaceful, painless and quiet exit.

[Areboona]

I am a 3 years now a prostate cancer survivor. I had a baccytherapy operation then to effectively kill the cancer in my prostate. If anything positive can be gleaned from this mans suicide it is this :- I urge all men over 60 to have an annual PSA blood test. It was this test result slowly increasing over 2 years that sent the alarm bells ringing. My consultant said it was only the fact that they caught it early that I am a survivor. Left another year it would have been another story. So if you do not get the annual PSA test already, get your backside to a clinic for PSA check NOW !!! So many men are either afraid, embarrassed or idle to consider their health important. My father died of prostate cancer, in the prostate its not good, but in fathers case, he was old school ,not wanting to get regular check ups, the cancer spread to his kidneys, bladder and other organs. Too late ,he died screaming in agony despite great care from Macmillan nurses. So I repeat, get your self annually checked!!!!!!!!! RIP Norwegian guy.

[champers]

Sorry to see Samaritans contact details missing from this thread, and the original on this topic. 

Could they be pinned in a prominent place?

[balo]

2 hours ago, Areboona said:

I urge all men over 60 to have an annual PSA blood test.

I would say all men over 50.  

Regular checkups are important and they are not expensive here in Thailand. 

 

 

[Hummin]

26 minutes ago, balo said:

I would say all men over 50.  

Regular checkups are important and they are not expensive here in Thailand. 

 

 

Every men should check their gland regulary, by their gf, wife or doctor, not only blood test, 

[Just Weird]

On ‎11‎/‎15‎/‎2018 at 3:43 PM, Mossman said:

Didn’t Thailand just legalize medicinal marijuana? Cannabis oil saved my mums life, could have possibly saved his too.

Cannabis oil is a cure for cancer?

[Just Weird]

On ‎11‎/‎15‎/‎2018 at 3:47 PM, Diskme said:

I don't know about this theory. When I see zip ties, it's a dead ringer for foul play.

It doesn't appear to be a theory but what do you know about it that the police do not have access to in order for you to dispute the report?

[Just Weird]

On ‎11‎/‎15‎/‎2018 at 3:58 PM, lucjoker said:

if your life is over, dont kill yourself immediately .

In the short time you still have , do something real good.

Wipe out some real bad guy( e.g.Hitler, Pol Pot,.......) , you will be remembered for it. 

What?

[Just Weird]

17 hours ago, Foexie said:

 

So how could he still have the strenght to climb up there and bring all the stuff up to the roof.

It looks impossible to do all that in 1 time. So with his condition?!

 

 

So how could he still have the strenght to climb up there and bring all the stuff up to the roof.

It looks impossible to do all that in 1 time. So with his condition?!

 

Ever hear about that new concept called elevators?